358 réponses à ce sujet

[Billabong2011]

greywardencommander wrote...

Don't know if anyone's seen it but in another thread it points out the Relays 'exploding' represent the brain either succumbing to or overcoming indoctrination for two reasons:
1) the one-relay fires to two relays - fires to two more relays etc is like the neurons firing
2) it starts in the viper nebula which has only one relay, the Alpha Relay and that is destroyed by Shepard in Arrival. Why does the relay explosion start there then? It's because that's where the indoctrination attempt started - with exposure to the Reaper Artifact Object Rho.

Again, brilliant.
I just doubt Bioware is this intelligent...  I really think luck's been on their side this entire time, and if they were smart, they would just start confirming all of these theories to avoid further conflict.

[greywardencommander]

Billabong2011 wrote...

greywardencommander wrote...

Don't know if anyone's seen it but in another thread it points out the Relays 'exploding' represent the brain either succumbing to or overcoming indoctrination for two reasons:
1) the one-relay fires to two relays - fires to two more relays etc is like the neurons firing
2) it starts in the viper nebula which has only one relay, the Alpha Relay and that is destroyed by Shepard in Arrival. Why does the relay explosion start there then? It's because that's where the indoctrination attempt started - with exposure to the Reaper Artifact Object Rho.

Again, brilliant.
I just doubt Bioware is this intelligent...  I really think luck's been on their side this entire time, and if they were smart, they would just start confirming all of these theories to avoid further conflict.

Maybe if the endings are what they are it's a dig at the rEApers? The illusion of choice where in actual fact Bioware have none (see MP)

[Mnementh2230]

Great read, good reasoning.

**IF** this is true, then it is brilliant.

Otherwise, it's a huge dick move.

[Stigweird85]

I think that the theory is starting to take hold with more people as it can answer many of the questions that people have.

My understanding of it(I have mentioned this elsewhere) the final confrontation is an illusion. It is the final effects of indoctrination where even paragon and renegade colours have been flipped. The citadel is made up of a combination of memories, collector base, shadow broker ship and regualr citadel.

Anderson represents humanity, TIM is there as part of the indoctrination trying to convice you. If you accept this then it means that the crucible never fired and the war still rages on. The finale is yet to happen. If you get the good ending Shep survives and can continue the fight either control or symbosis is giving in to indoctrination.

[greywardencommander]

bigstig wrote...

I think that the theory is starting to take hold with more people as it can answer many of the questions that people have.

My understanding of it(I have mentioned this elsewhere) the final confrontation is an illusion. It is the final effects of indoctrination where even paragon and renegade colours have been flipped. The citadel is made up of a combination of memories, collector base, shadow broker ship and regualr citadel.

Anderson represents humanity, TIM is there as part of the indoctrination trying to convice you. If you accept this then it means that the crucible never fired and the war still rages on. The finale is yet to happen. If you get the good ending Shep survives and can continue the fight either control or symbosis is giving in to indoctrination.

In my idea even if you give in you can still be Shep in the dlc and you're given a 'last chance' at the end if you have high enough EMS etc to throw it off and do a Saren to fight Harbinger/Reapers and/or save the galaxy with your decision but you still die due to the toll it took on your mind and body.
http://social.biowar.../index/10350970 

[Shabuetie]

Let’s just say that all this is true. That Bioware indoctrinated its fans, and will be releasing a DLC that is the actually ending. The truth of the matter is….we bought an incomplete game. DLC is all about furthing or adding on the game, not completing the game. How is this genius? That would simply be telling other developers that it’s ok to sell an incomplete game…just as long as you sell the ending at a later time.

Now if this DLC does arrive…what about all the people who don’t have internet connections and can’t download the DLC? What…are the just **** out of luck? Or will Bioware print and distribute disc’s that contain the actually ending and mail it to every person who doesn’t have a means to download it? Where is the financial gain in that?

[Gedgehog]

This indoctrination theory can't be true, because it makes little sense to destroy brand loyalty through risky creative experiments. More than likely, the ending was rushed and it was assumed people would enjoy it. If indoc was true, it would have been confirmed by now. I hate to be Mr Cynical, but the lack of confirmation on Biowares part, is kinda testament to this.

[greywardencommander]

Shabuetie wrote...

Let’s just say that all this is true. That Bioware indoctrinated its fans, and will be releasing a DLC that is the actually ending. The truth of the matter is….we bought an incomplete game. DLC is all about furthing or adding on the game, not completing the game. How is this genius? That would simply be telling other developers that it’s ok to sell an incomplete game…just as long as you sell the ending at a later time.

Now if this DLC does arrive…what about all the people who don’t have internet connections and can’t download the DLC? What…are the just **** out of luck? Or will Bioware print and distribute disc’s that contain the actually ending and mail it to every person who doesn’t have a means to download it? Where is the financial gain in that?

It wouldn't set a precedent, I can't think of any other franchise that would be able to pull it off as not actually happening in the last 10 mins and a 'social experiment of indoctrination' so I don't think anyone needs to fear every other developer and publisher for every story following suit.

[greywardencommander]

Gedgehog wrote...

This indoctrination theory can't be true, because it makes little sense to destroy brand loyalty through risky creative experiments. More than likely, the ending was rushed and it was assumed people would enjoy it. If indoc was true, it would have been confirmed by now. I hate to be Mr Cynical, but the lack of confirmation on Biowares part, is kinda testament to this.

and I can live with that, if it is as we have it I would just want them to come out and explain the ending, why they thought it was good, how it doesn't mean the complete end of the ME franchise etc.

[Gedgehog]

Also it was a terrible business decision, because Amazon and EA themselves have been giving full refunds. They wouldve annouinced something sooner to stop their loss of revenue

[Gedgehog]

I can't explain Biowares lack of response, possibly because this debacle has sent the company into a full blown panic? Or because their existing contracts have been signed with EA and don't include an ending, without breaking that contract? Perhaps they are seeing if this will die down? I don't know. If I was them, I'd make an announcement fairly soon, because profits are going to suffer.

[Shabuetie]

greywardencommander wrote...

Shabuetie wrote...

Let’s just say that all this is true. That Bioware indoctrinated its fans, and will be releasing a DLC that is the actually ending. The truth of the matter is….we bought an incomplete game. DLC is all about furthing or adding on the game, not completing the game. How is this genius? That would simply be telling other developers that it’s ok to sell an incomplete game…just as long as you sell the ending at a later time.

Now if this DLC does arrive…what about all the people who don’t have internet connections and can’t download the DLC? What…are the just **** out of luck? Or will Bioware print and distribute disc’s that contain the actually ending and mail it to every person who doesn’t have a means to download it? Where is the financial gain in that?

It wouldn't set a precedent, I can't think of any other franchise that would be able to pull it off as not actually happening in the last 10 mins and a 'social experiment of indoctrination' so I don't think anyone needs to fear every other developer and publisher for every story following suit.

All it takes is one company. I never thought I would have to pay for things there were shipped on the disc. I also never thought I would  have to pay for multiplayer either.

Modifié par Shabuetie, 21 mars 2012 - 01:50 .

[LadyWench]

Sexy, indeed! At this point, I don't know how much of this was deliberate by Bioware or not, but if they want to hop on board and use any of these ideas, I will willingly go along with it and be happy to say I believed it the whole time (I mean, I DO support the idea, but I also accept the possibilities that it is not intentional or that they have another explanation or DLC they're sitting on).

[Gedgehog]

I just accept that this was a massive business blunder, hey it happens to big creative companies too!

[Brawne]

EA doesnt have a quad to pull something like this off. What they have is plenty of experience how to rush things and sell recycled crap to their customers.

[STEEEEVE]

GBGriffin wrote...

They launched the endings as they intended with no plans for post-game DLC, which is the idea that appeals to so many followers.

This, people.  Bioware screwed up on the endings, they didn't plan indoctrination theory.  Wish you people could get past denial.

[Baelyn]

Shabuetie wrote...

Let’s just say that all this is true. That Bioware indoctrinated its fans, and will be releasing a DLC that is the actually ending. The truth of the matter is….we bought an incomplete game. DLC is all about furthing or adding on the game, not completing the game. How is this genius? That would simply be telling other developers that it’s ok to sell an incomplete game…just as long as you sell the ending at a later time.

Now if this DLC does arrive…what about all the people who don’t have internet connections and can’t download the DLC? What…are the just **** out of luck? Or will Bioware print and distribute disc’s that contain the actually ending and mail it to every person who doesn’t have a means to download it? Where is the financial gain in that?

What defines a "complete" game then? You could extend this argument to any kind of DLC. 

Also I am pretty sure an internet connection is listed in the requirements of the game. So if people have no internet and disregarded that statement and bought the game anyways, thats not really on Bioware.

[greywardencommander]

STEEEEVE wrote...

GBGriffin wrote...

They launched the endings as they intended with no plans for post-game DLC, which is the idea that appeals to so many followers.

This, people.  Bioware screwed up on the endings, they didn't plan indoctrination theory.  Wish you people could get past denial.

I don't care if the endings are as intended I just want them to come out and admit they f****d up no matter what this will be my head canon because so much of the theory makes sense (they even said they wanted indoctrination but gameplay mechanic made it too difficult) so it could be that all the stuff we see and want to point to it is what was meant to point to it and was left in but the endings are still the end.

Throw in the fact DLC is technically the game, so technically is the complete game thus DLC can technically be the ending. If you think about it ME2 Arrival happened in game, that was DLC and should have been optional BUT HAPPENED even in games of people who never played it, thus you can argue it's the end of ME2 because it's SUPPOSED to be played after ME2 (they even said so)

Modifié par greywardencommander, 21 mars 2012 - 02:10 .

[Stigweird85]

STEEEEVE wrote...

GBGriffin wrote...

They launched the endings as they intended with no plans for post-game DLC, which is the idea that appeals to so many followers.

This, people.  Bioware screwed up on the endings, they didn't plan indoctrination theory.  Wish you people could get past denial.

If Bioware had any sense they would take the indoctrination scenario and run with it, it's plausible and doesn't require major rewrites or any rewrites for that matter. The current endings could stand with an additional mission as detailed here

[greywardencommander]

bigstig wrote...

STEEEEVE wrote...

GBGriffin wrote...

They launched the endings as they intended with no plans for post-game DLC, which is the idea that appeals to so many followers.

This, people.  Bioware screwed up on the endings, they didn't plan indoctrination theory.  Wish you people could get past denial.

If Bioware had any sense they would take the indoctrination scenario and run with it, it's plausible and doesn't require major rewrites or any rewrites for that matter. The current endings could stand with an additional mission as detailed here

wow my first repost, I'm touched lol, as I say in that thread, it can give everyone an ending they want without losing any face (admitting their endings failed majorly) because nothing is changed about the current end

Modifié par greywardencommander, 21 mars 2012 - 02:21 .

[Stigweird85]

greywardencommander wrote...

STEEEEVE wrote...

GBGriffin wrote...

They launched the endings as they intended with no plans for post-game DLC, which is the idea that appeals to so many followers.

This, people.  Bioware screwed up on the endings, they didn't plan indoctrination theory.  Wish you people could get past denial.

I don't care if the endings are as intended I just want them to come out and admit they f****d up no matter what this will be my head canon because so much of the theory makes sense (they even said they wanted indoctrination but gameplay mechanic made it too difficult) so it could be that all the stuff we see and want to point to it is what was meant to point to it and was left in but the endings are still the end.

Throw in the fact DLC is technically the game, so technically is the complete game thus DLC can technically be the ending. If you think about it ME2 Arrival happened in game, that was DLC and should have been optional BUT HAPPENED even in games of people who never played it, thus you can argue it's the end of ME2 because it's SUPPOSED to be played after ME2 (they even said so)

Perhaps it was a **** up, perhaps it was time constraints, but Bioware have a unique chance to set it right. As Shep as a reaper was part of an original design there are clues to this throughout the game.

Now that Bioware have time perhaps they can start to iron out the reaper aspect, to play nice they could release it free but they could also charge for it(They aren't going to work for free afterall)

[Shabuetie]

Baelyn wrote...

Shabuetie wrote...

Let’s just say that all this is true. That Bioware indoctrinated its fans, and will be releasing a DLC that is the actually ending. The truth of the matter is….we bought an incomplete game. DLC is all about furthing or adding on the game, not completing the game. How is this genius? That would simply be telling other developers that it’s ok to sell an incomplete game…just as long as you sell the ending at a later time.

Now if this DLC does arrive…what about all the people who don’t have internet connections and can’t download the DLC? What…are the just **** out of luck? Or will Bioware print and distribute disc’s that contain the actually ending and mail it to every person who doesn’t have a means to download it? Where is the financial gain in that?

What defines a "complete" game then? You could extend this argument to any kind of DLC. 

Also I am pretty sure an internet connection is listed in the requirements of the game. So if people have no internet and disregarded that statement and bought the game anyways, thats not really on Bioware.

A beginning a middle and an end. Mass Effect 3 is missing one of those components.

Since when is an internet connection a requirment to play a game? Maybe for the online multiplayer aspect of the game...but not to play the singleplayer.

[Paragon Auducan]

Shabuetie wrote...

Baelyn wrote...

Shabuetie wrote...

Let’s just say that all this is true. That Bioware indoctrinated its fans, and will be releasing a DLC that is the actually ending. The truth of the matter is….we bought an incomplete game. DLC is all about furthing or adding on the game, not completing the game. How is this genius? That would simply be telling other developers that it’s ok to sell an incomplete game…just as long as you sell the ending at a later time.

Now if this DLC does arrive…what about all the people who don’t have internet connections and can’t download the DLC? What…are the just **** out of luck? Or will Bioware print and distribute disc’s that contain the actually ending and mail it to every person who doesn’t have a means to download it? Where is the financial gain in that?

What defines a "complete" game then? You could extend this argument to any kind of DLC. 

Also I am pretty sure an internet connection is listed in the requirements of the game. So if people have no internet and disregarded that statement and bought the game anyways, thats not really on Bioware.

A beginning a middle and an end. Mass Effect 3 is missing one of those components.

Since when is an internet connection a requirment to play a game? Maybe for the online multiplayer aspect of the game...but not to play the singleplayer.

Vanilla Skyrim is unplayable. Patches fixed it.

[greywardencommander]

Shabuetie wrote...

Baelyn wrote...

Shabuetie wrote...

Let’s just say that all this is true. That Bioware indoctrinated its fans, and will be releasing a DLC that is the actually ending. The truth of the matter is….we bought an incomplete game. DLC is all about furthing or adding on the game, not completing the game. How is this genius? That would simply be telling other developers that it’s ok to sell an incomplete game…just as long as you sell the ending at a later time.

Now if this DLC does arrive…what about all the people who don’t have internet connections and can’t download the DLC? What…are the just **** out of luck? Or will Bioware print and distribute disc’s that contain the actually ending and mail it to every person who doesn’t have a means to download it? Where is the financial gain in that?

What defines a "complete" game then? You could extend this argument to any kind of DLC. 

Also I am pretty sure an internet connection is listed in the requirements of the game. So if people have no internet and disregarded that statement and bought the game anyways, thats not really on Bioware.

A beginning a middle and an end. Mass Effect 3 is missing one of those components.

Since when is an internet connection a requirment to play a game? Maybe for the online multiplayer aspect of the game...but not to play the singleplayer.

Some PC games require an internet connection to at the very least register the game and be able to play it

[Shabuetie]

greywardencommander wrote...

Shabuetie wrote...

Baelyn wrote...

Shabuetie wrote...

Let’s just say that all this is true. That Bioware indoctrinated its fans, and will be releasing a DLC that is the actually ending. The truth of the matter is….we bought an incomplete game. DLC is all about furthing or adding on the game, not completing the game. How is this genius? That would simply be telling other developers that it’s ok to sell an incomplete game…just as long as you sell the ending at a later time.

Now if this DLC does arrive…what about all the people who don’t have internet connections and can’t download the DLC? What…are the just **** out of luck? Or will Bioware print and distribute disc’s that contain the actually ending and mail it to every person who doesn’t have a means to download it? Where is the financial gain in that?

What defines a "complete" game then? You could extend this argument to any kind of DLC. 

Also I am pretty sure an internet connection is listed in the requirements of the game. So if people have no internet and disregarded that statement and bought the game anyways, thats not really on Bioware.

A beginning a middle and an end. Mass Effect 3 is missing one of those components.

Since when is an internet connection a requirment to play a game? Maybe for the online multiplayer aspect of the game...but not to play the singleplayer.

Some PC games require an internet connection to at the very least register the game and be able to play it

Oops. I'm a console gamer. Sometimes I forget about the plight of PC gamers.