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[Erethrian]

https://twitter.com/...517553602629633

Indoctrination Theory anyone? 

Modifié par Erethrian, 21 mars 2012 - 05:35 .

[twystedspyder]

MassEffected555 wrote...

TheMerchantMan wrote...

CavScout wrote...

TheMerchantMan wrote...

Asari23 wrote...

Yes, it's true that with low ems the only option is destroy, why would the reapers just go through that whole thing just to to let shep destroy them?

Well, don't forget with low ems also, the earth and the galaxy gets disenigrated, so that renders that argument moot.

Shepard doesn't destroy the Reapers no matter which ending he chooses. Remember the crux of the Indoctrination Theory is that the fight isn't over. You don't destroy anything, indeed according to this theory, the crucible isn't even in the system yet. You have to wake up and finish the job.

That's just a built in "you can never disprove this theory because we'll say everything is fake" excuse.

No it's the crux of the Indoctrination Theory. It requires that the entire ending after being hit by a beam is an attempt by the Reapers to take control of Shepard's mind.

The notion is not that Shepard is already indoctrinated, but that the Reapers are indoctrinating him, he is resisting. The final scene is essentially an exploration of Shepard's own mind, the Reapers are actively invading his subconcious.

This is why we have the destroy option, because Shepard is fabricating this world and the Reapers are just actively invading it.

How many times do you have to be told? Look you people clearly do not know about the games lore.

You can not be half, a quarter, .0000001% or 99% indoctrinated. You can NOT block it.

No one EVER in the history of the ME world has broken it EXCEPT Shiala and that was ONLY because of the Thorium and her being liked to the rest of the colonies mind. GOOGLE SHIALA and researh.

In the books NO ONE HAS BEATED indoctrination.

You are doomed once you get indoctrinated. And if Shepard got indoctrinated THAT FAST to where he hallucinates that entire scene he 100% is brain dead.

It's been told in the games that that is how indoc works.

If you let Shepard beat it - SPACE MAGIC and we are right back at square one.

You people do NOT know the lore of the game, you are half ass fans.


I know this doesn't change your mind but it's so clear you people are nothing but fair weather fans. 

Matriarch Benezia did for a bit after what was like weeks, months even maybe years riding around inside a Reaper.

Paul Grayson was implanted with friggin Reaper Tech and he managed to resist the Reapers for a time as well.  Eventually the Reapers got pissed off and tried different tactics, but the evidence is there.

Individuals can and do resist indoctrination.  Is it ultimately a losing battle as long as the Reapers are around?  Yes, I would say so.  Does that mean that Shepard can't shrug it off long enough to get the job done.  No, of course not.  He's tougher than Grayson, that's for sure.  My Shepard fought off a Thresher Maw by himself with a broken lighter and a paperclip.  He's just that good of an Engineer.  He'll probably just fix the Citadel and the Mass Relays himself, with some tin foil and some crazy glue.  It's not my fault that your Shepard is a big ol wus.   

Theory still holds.

Until BioWare poops all over it.

And lets try to keep calm and try to have a little bit of a sense of humor here.  I'm as pissed as anyone about the endings and I don't intend to give BioWare an inch, but I also feel that we need to make sure and keep this thing in perspective.  Worst case, it is all over.  Hopefully then, some of us fans will get motivated to go out and write better stories and/or design better video games.  After hanging out on this forum for the past few weeks, I've seen evidence of some amazing creativity.  I still believe that there will be a future for the types of games we love.

[Adventuress]

This is still my favorite video explaining the Indoctrination Theory so far.

Click this link to watch the video.

[FellishBeast]

sedrikhcain wrote...

At about 4:30 in, the video from the OP's link says Shepard starts to hallucinate images of a boy after encountering the human Reaper, and/or object Rho. Not true, the hallucinations came only after he saw the boy killed by a Reaper.

Right, but Shepard seeing the boy happens at basically the next playable moment between the events, so...

[FellishBeast]

Adventuress wrote...

This is still my favorite video explaining the Indoctrination Theory so far.

Click this link to watch the video.

It's good, but I can't stand the terrible grammar.

[palacios]

Erethrian wrote...

https://twitter.com/...517553602629633

Indoctrination Theory anyone? 

This just made me very happy!  Though, I would just like for them to 'yes' or 'no' to the indoctrination theory. But this made me very happy because the last thing I want is for them to change what they're planning to do just because some people are angry at where the story is at right now when they haven't told us everything.

[Chernaya]

"No one has beaten indoctrination"

There's a first time for everything, no? And Shepard is really good at first times.

[Ricvenart]

EionaCousland wrote...

"No one has beaten indoctrination"

There's a first time for everything, no? And Shepard is really good at first times.

This. Although it'll be the 2nd time, since Shiala was unique. But wait, they kind of make a big deal out of how special and unique Shepard is.

-Able to interact with prothean technology? Check
-Able to survive were others minds would have been destroyed? Check
-Survived being clinically brain dead and managed to return as himself? Check
-Came into contact with the Thorian and gained knowlegde from it? Check
-Able to spend 3 years hanging round reaper tech without ever becoming full indoctrinated? Check
-Able to convince others to follow him and think he's right? Check

Even ignoring how special Shepard is, him resisting becoming fully indoctrinated and not being left to do one more action and  have to blow his own brains out, is to a trivial "plothole" compared to the current ending. There's even a number of ways it could be explained, including the fact there are different levels of indoctrination, the total end of the reapers meaning they can no longer exhert that force, in other cases there has always been other reapers there to keep it active, this being almost required due to the fact earth is now littered with reaper tech so it's either accept this "plothole" (because you control the lore totally and there can be no change this minor, of course the person who wrote up indoctrination magically knew every detail and possibility of it) or accept that earth will become full of thralls before long.

[sedrikhcain]

Ricvenart, Shepard doesn't really spend 3 years around Reaper tech. He was around reaper tech for hours at a time on a dozen or so occasions spread out over the course of 3 years. And don't forget, between m2 and m3, Shepard wasn't even in active duty for nearly a year. So unless there was some Reaper indoctrination device hidden on earth all that time, I think the notion that Shepard is well down the road to being indoctrinated at the beginning of ME3 fails to stand up to logic.

[cdancidhe]

This is a good explanation

[Taldek]

Just curious has bioware actually said "No its not true?" I'm currently on the fence about this myself hard to tell unless bioware has debunked it themselves.

[lookingglassmind]

blacqout wrote...

Ah, Angry Joe. Everyone's new favourite semi-literate homophobe.

hilarious.

[Ricvenart]

Taldek wrote...

Just curious has bioware actually said "No its not true?" I'm currently on the fence about this myself hard to tell unless bioware has debunked it themselves.

They never would, as they want some discussion and interpertation. Though I think they either want the "bad" PR and widespread discussion before the reveal or it simply wasn't intended. Regardless of how ill advised it may seem.

Though with that last statement I'm leaning towards to later, due to the failure to address the well documented "flaws" by fans, including the biggest one of lack of player choice and effect on the outcome, as advertised. Frankly if they wanted it to end one way specifically they should have stuck to a movie rather miss an oppurtunity to create something above the likes of Star Wars with that ability. Could have really risen the art of games to a new level but as is it's the same.

Also to reply to me, okay you address one of many things that may show how special Shepard is, even if I don't argue against the whole time he was round the tech (like arrival and inside a reaper) the widespread signal never started to weaken his resolve but didn't so makes him special, does that dismiss all others?

[zsavk1]

For the life of me I cant fathom how the Indoc theory isnt what we will be seeing next. It just fits perfectly right into the current game without a hitch.