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[sevtron]

Mr Massakka wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

Mr Massakka wrote...

What' the fuss about? Hasn't he confirmed with this that an ending-change is in progress? It's very vague...

It's not vague, they're directly addressing the ending. He says "Building on their research, Exec Producer Casey Hudson and the team are hard at work on a number of game content initiatives that will help answer the questions, providing more clarity for those seeking further closure to their journey. You’ll hear more on this in April.  We’re working hard to maintain the right balance between the artistic integrity of the original story while addressing the fan feedback we’ve received."

Folks - WE are their research, let's give them plenty to look at so our feedback matters. Insults and derision are maybe cathartic emotionally to some of you, but in the end it's not something that Bioware can do something about. What they CAN do something about are specific things that you ask for. So ASK. GIVE THEM IDEAS. There's, like, three threads at the top of this forum to do so, I suggest we use them.

That's exactly what I was reading out of it, too.
I'm just very surprised that there is such a huge discussion going on in this thread... I mean, we finally get the ending-change we all wanted, what's the problem here?

The problem I see is the tone he takes in here. Marginalizing those who are unhappy with the ending, by continually refering to us in minimalistic terms, and countering our arguments with phrases meant to call into question our perspective - as "in the heat of passion", while continuously mentioning the fact that professional reviewers have been giving them unprecedented praise (which, is unto itself disingenuous. Every game comes out with a slew of "look at our 9/10, 10/10!" piecemealed reviews.)

Their response to fan critique is to say that people who are insiders of the gaming industry love it, so we should too? 

I could go on, but the fact is simply this: Our problem My problem with this is not so much the content (or vague/lackness thereof) of the message, but the overall tone, and the message to simplify and marginalize the views of those who do not see eye to eye with the company line.

A polite message can still convey a rude underlying theme.

[Tragick Flaw]

You know, after reading the letter, I thought that the Retake movement would at least be hopeful. I was very, very wrong.

[Capeo]

Mr Massakka wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

Mr Massakka wrote...

What' the fuss about? Hasn't he confirmed with this that an ending-change is in progress? It's very vague...

It's not vague, they're directly addressing the ending. He says "Building on their research, Exec Producer Casey Hudson and the team are hard at work on a number of game content initiatives that will help answer the questions, providing more clarity for those seeking further closure to their journey. You’ll hear more on this in April.  We’re working hard to maintain the right balance between the artistic integrity of the original story while addressing the fan feedback we’ve received."

Folks - WE are their research, let's give them plenty to look at so our feedback matters. Insults and derision are maybe cathartic emotionally to some of you, but in the end it's not something that Bioware can do something about. What they CAN do something about are specific things that you ask for. So ASK. GIVE THEM IDEAS. There's, like, three threads at the top of this forum to do so, I suggest we use them.

That's exactly what I was reading out of it, too.
I'm just very surprised that there is such a huge discussion going on in this thread... I mean, we finally get the ending-change we all wanted, what's the problem here?

They aren't changing the endings or adding any.  How would you possibly get that from that statement?  Clarify and add closure means we'll probably get some epilogues.  Maybe an additional cutscene here or there.  They're basically going to "explain" the endings to us.

[Blue Liara]

Great article here on forbes.com that explains why the 'indoctrination theory' would be a cop out from bioware and would not really address the problems that we have with the ending.

www.forbes.com/sites/davidthier/2012/03/21/mass-effect-3-ending-the-indoctrination-theory-is-the-easy-way-out/ 

Modifié par Blue Liara, 21 mars 2012 - 08:59 .

[kramerfan86]

At this point at absolute best we might get an improved epilogue that explains what happens, but based on his statement Im not getting a "we are fixing/changing" it vibe at all.

[Chumasaurus]

Tragick Flaw wrote...

You know, after reading the letter, I thought that the Retake movement would at least be hopeful. I was very, very wrong.

I think a lot of people are excited that we have gained the highest level of attention. But, I think we are still waiting for some real answers/dialogue. We still have yet to be spoken with on an even playing field.

[Tragick Flaw]

Chumasaurus wrote...

Tragick Flaw wrote...

You know, after reading the letter, I thought that the Retake movement would at least be hopeful. I was very, very wrong.

I think a lot of people are excited that we have gained the highest level of attention. But, I think we are still waiting for some real answers/dialogue. We still have yet to be spoken with on an even playing field.

Evening play field? That'll probably be PAX. I think I should avoid the forums for a bit. Being reading way too many threads from the worst and most bitter of the Retake side.

Modifié par Tragick Flaw, 21 mars 2012 - 09:03 .

[Blue Liara]

Great article here from forbes.com that explains why the 'indoctrination theory' would be a bad way for Bioware to explain the ending and would essentially not address the complaints that fans have had but simply make things worse. 

www.forbes.com/sites/davidthier/2012/03/21/mass-effect-3-ending-the-indoctrination-theory-is-the-easy-way-out/

[Ishiken]

"If you are a Mass Effect fan and have input for the team – we respect your opinion and want to hear it. We’re committed to address your constructive feedback as best we can. In return, I’d ask that you help us do that by supporting what I truly believe is the best game BioWare has yet crafted. I urge you to do your own research: play the game, finish it and tell us what you think. Tell your friends if you feel it’s a good game as a whole. Trust that we are doing our damndest, as always, to address your feedback. As artists, we care about our fans deeply and we appreciate your support."

This is my favorite quote from the entire article. Please tell your friends to buy the game even though the ending was a HUGE disappointment. Please buy the game and play it and don't listen to all the negative fan feedback on Amazon and all of the gaming sites. So basically the ending is exactly going to stay as it is. I will hold on to my own artistic integrity and boycott every Bioware game from now on and will only buy the game once the entire saga is complete and buy all future games when it's 75% off.

Modifié par Ishiken, 21 mars 2012 - 09:07 .

[kramerfan86]

Blue Liara wrote...

Great article here from forbes.com that explains why the 'indoctrination theory' would be a bad way for Bioware to explain the ending and would essentially not address the complaints that fans have had but simply make things worse. 

www.forbes.com/sites/davidthier/2012/03/21/mass-effect-3-ending-the-indoctrination-theory-is-the-easy-way-out/

How would it make things worse if a DLC followed the indoctrination theory, had to break out of it, then promptly gave us an ending that reflected our choices?  Indoctrination theory is about the ONLY way the current ending can remain in game and at the same time give us an ending that satisfies the complaints.

[kramerfan86]

Also, anyone else catching the fact he is partly writing off the complaints as a vocal minority with terms like "fraction" and referring to the good reviews?

[Veregan]

Loving how they're trying to play it off by saying "the critics gave us good reviews!". The critics are not your fans. They get paid to review products. That's what they see mass effect as. A product. The fans see it as much more than that so we should be the ones you actually listen to.

I remain hopeful that this will turn out to be something worthwhile. We'll see what happens.

[Laughing_Penguin]

ThePanzer99 wrote...

Interesting, the most interesting blurb for me is:

"Casey Hudson and the team are hard at work on a number of game content initiatives that will help answer the questions, providing more clarity for those seeking further closure to their journey."

That does not sound like an "alternate ending" xpac, or a new ending. Sounds like they're going to try and stick with the galactic dark age as the results of all your actions.

How do others read it? Go read the whole thing at the link.

My thoughts exactly. I wish they'd change the ending but it seems naive to think they would. Given his comments about protecting the artistic integrity of the creators and balancing this with fan reaction, I don't think they'll change anything about how the story ends. It would take too much time, too much money and would be too complicated.

It seems more likely they'll simply provide some sort of epilogue. Maybe attempt to clarify what they tried to accomplish with the ending they created. And if we're lucky, they could try to plug the numerous plot holes that resulted (admittedly a very tall order).  

[I can Hackett]

This is actually good news its definitely a good start we shall learn more in April

[Dragoni89]

To the article posted by the OP. Don't know wether to laugh or cry. Kind of pissed off after reading the post. The article is a joke. Just look at how mass effect 3 is selling ATM and the price drop with in the first 2 weeks we have the game selling at 40-45 bucks. Bet you did not see that one coming. Notice how he says more pasionate people don't like endings lmao. It ****ing universally accepted the ending was garbage in some way or form even in bioware a own words. A majority that bought the game were not pleased with the ending. critics that you bought out gave it a 10 or 9 out of 10, but look at user scores and Amazon have 2 star rating that's probably the worst bioware has ever done on any game. Not going to give us an A,B,C ending but a blue green red one is okay huh? Seariously stop adding fuel to the fire with your stupid articles that ignores what is wrong. Just. admit you chocked at the end. IF THIS HOW BIOWARE rewards their fans and people who buy their games than they can go **** themselves cause your sales are going to drop period and I am defiantly one of those that will not buy another one of your games.

and to the poster that told entitled people to shut up. well bioware made promises about the endings in their comments leading up to the final release. I think I am at least entitled to what I was promised since I preordered the game based on those comments. which turned out to be lies. You can call it being childish but no one buys a bad product to consider ME3 a bad product is an understatement since it destroyed the experience of ME1 and ME2 if you played those in the past. If not don't talk. Once you lose people's trust it's gonna be pretty hard to get it back.

Note Dragon Age II failed and now the failing Mass Effect 3. 3 strikes and your out.

Hold the Line.There is only Hope in April.

Modifié par Dragoni89, 21 mars 2012 - 09:17 .

[Faithwhisper]

Ok so, if we go with some speculations, that the game hasn't really ended, but will continue somehow in some DLC/'s, how is that fair to those, that don't want to pay for DLCs?

I mean, if I buy a game, then I expect to be able to play it through and get an ending/endings - I shouldn't be forced to buy/download to get the real ending, right?

I guess we'll have to wait and see in april.
I hope they can come up with an explanation, that satisfies us all.

[Leem_0001]

I did start another thread about this but a moderator (quite rightly) asked us to use this thread to discuss the topic. I will respect that as lots of different threads can get out of hand and, if Bioware are listening, then it's easier if everything is in one place.

I want to draw attention to the very end of the statement:

'If you are a Mass Effect fan and have input for the team – we respect your opinion and want to hear it. We’re committed to address your constructive feedback as best we can. In return, I’d ask that you help us do that by supporting what I truly believe is the best game BioWare has yet crafted. I urge you to do your own research: play the game, finish it and tell us what you think. Tell your friends if you feel it’s a good game as a whole. Trust that we are doing our damndest, as always, to address your feedback. As artists, we care about our fans deeply and we appreciate your support.
Thank you for your feedback – we are listening.'


Specifically the bit about - 'In return, I’d ask that you help us do that by supporting what I truly believe is the best game BioWare has yet crafted. I urge you to do your own research: play the game, finish it and tell us what you think. Tell your friends if you feel it’s a good game as a whole.'

Would you tell your friends about it?

[Vox77]

Despite the fact that the Indoctrination theory will likely be dismissed, I would seize that concept for Mass Effect 4. Since when do all epic stories have to be trilogies?

The battle with the Reapers seems far to epic to simply be wrapped up so quickly. A race that has existed hundreds of thousands of years and somehow this cycle manages to defeat them by simply shooting a conduit on the Citadel?

There is so much to work with in the ME universe. I could even stomach the current ending (assuming indoctrination) if it meant Shepard and the alliances got to get out there and really wage a war against the Reapers in another game. So many possibilities

Holding the line

Modifié par Vox77, 21 mars 2012 - 09:23 .

[PrimarchGarrus]

Whybother wrote...

"Some of the criticism that has been delivered in the heat of passion by our most ardent fans, even if founded on valid principles, such as seeking more clarity to questions or looking for more closure, for example – has unfortunately become destructive rather than constructive. We listen and will respond to constructive criticism, but much as we will not tolerate individual attacks on our team members, we will not support or respond to destructive commentary."

Painting people who don't like the ending as bad guys, like atghunter said.

No its implying that people who threaten demand and complain about the conclusion are acting a bit inappropriately, and I agree. Its just disrespectful to a company who has poured so much effort and work into a product and then recieving a "loyal" fanbase that wails and screams about how the ending isn't what they deserve. Its about civility, not about demands and anger.

[Ishiken]

Leem_0001 wrote...

I did start another thread about this but a moderator (quite rightly) asked us to use this thread to discuss the topic. I will respect that as lots of different threads can get out of hand and, if Bioware are listening, then it's easier if everything is in one place.

I want to draw attention to the very end of the statement:

'If you are a Mass Effect fan and have input for the team – we respect your opinion and want to hear it. We’re committed to address your constructive feedback as best we can. In return, I’d ask that you help us do that by supporting what I truly believe is the best game BioWare has yet crafted. I urge you to do your own research: play the game, finish it and tell us what you think. Tell your friends if you feel it’s a good game as a whole. Trust that we are doing our damndest, as always, to address your feedback. As artists, we care about our fans deeply and we appreciate your support.
Thank you for your feedback – we are listening.'


Specifically the bit about - 'In return, I’d ask that you help us do that by supporting what I truly believe is the best game BioWare has yet crafted. I urge you to do your own research: play the game, finish it and tell us what you think. Tell your friends if you feel it’s a good game as a whole.'

Would you tell your friends about it?

I tell my friends that the gameplay is good but the ending is horrible and invalidates everything that you have done. And all of my friends have passed on the game and bought another game that boosted both good gameplay and conclusion.

[Ishiken]

Vox77 wrote...

Despite the fact that the Indoctrination theory will likely be dismissed, I would seize that concept for Mass Effect 4. Since when do all epic stories have to be trilogies?

The battle with the Reapers seems far to epic to simply be wrapped up so quickly. A race that has existed hundreds of thousands of years and somehow this cycle manages to defeat them by simply shooting a conduit on the Citadel?

There is so much to work with in the ME universe. I could even stomach the current ending (assuming indoctrination) if it meant Shepard and the alliances got to get out there and really wage a war against the Reapers in another game. So many possibilities

Holding the line

Personally I thought the way to end the game was to defeat the Reaper fleet on Earth with the Crucible and the Reapers in the rest of the galaxy retreats after feeling the death of their leader aka Harbinger on earth.

[blah64]

count_4 wrote...

So we're pretty much f*cked. As is the indoc theory. Great.

The amount of hope bleeding out of me after I read this PR garbage could drown a small litter of kittens right about now.

[Reptilian Rob]

blah64 wrote...

count_4 wrote...

So we're pretty much f*cked. As is the indoc theory. Great.

The amount of hope bleeding out of me after I read this PR garbage could drown a small litter of kittens right about now.

"Oh god I have no idea what I'm doing Rick! Send help, NOW!" - Ray

[Glitch007]

Seems promising... We'll see come April.

[totalrecall87]

http://www.forbes.co...ending-sort-of/