2054 réponses à ce sujet

[Squallypo]

chris fenton wrote...

llandwynwyn wrote...

People are being too trusting, really, he made no promise of a fix for the endings.

Bioware is walking on thin ice here, so I hope it is, but I wouldn't be surprised if we get news of Aria's dlc in April.

Ha. I won't be buying it, if that's the case. 

thats why i was assuming that you havent read up the article yet.

[chris fenton]

Squallypo wrote...

chris fenton wrote...

llandwynwyn wrote...

People are being too trusting, really, he made no promise of a fix for the endings.

Bioware is walking on thin ice here, so I hope it is, but I wouldn't be surprised if we get news of Aria's dlc in April.

Ha. I won't be buying it, if that's the case. 

thats why i was assuming that you havent read up the article yet.

I won't lie, I haven't. But this is getting overwhelming. I'm holding unto hope, I'll be the first to admit it. If it's just some mid game DLC, I won't be purchasing.
But at least it's something.

[Wildhide]

I would point out to Mr. Muzyka that IGN, the most visited gaming website in the world, received exclusive early access to the game. Their review page was unlike any other review they have ever done, adorned with fancy graphics and links to buy the game over at Gamestop’s online store. Moreover, one of IGN’s employees is featured in the game in likeness and voice, and that same employee presented a prominent preview of the game.

Why should we take the game reviewers as unbiased. This is just the worst example of how they are not, and are in fact quite biased.

The lack of actually addressing the issues in yet another statement is quite disappointing and merely reaffirms their efforts to ignore their error. Games can be art, but art is NEVER immune to criticism, in fact constructive pat on the back criticism does very little for the artist. You need to know what you did wrong to improve what you're doing.

[Ronin1325]

cmj428 wrote...

catofnine wrote...

Dear Dr. Muzyka,

Thank you for your measured and well articulated response.

However, I don't recommend cloaking the game behind professional reviewers.  It only gives us rabies.  They're not your customers, we are.

I'm showing a partial quote of what catofnine wrote but this part was very funny and yet so true.

I'll repost that post! It's very appropriate! (and funny too:happy:)

[The Ole Ultra Violence]

I am very grateful to Dr. Muzyka for his statement, and would like it to be known that I agree with him.

Mass Effect 3 was one of the most poignant, emotional, thought provoking and profound experiences I've ever had with any work of art, not just in games, not just in science fiction, not just in visual mediums, ever.

And that is why it was so painful for it to end the way it did. I KNOW BioWare can do better than that. I hope that the artistic integrity of the team can remain as uncompressed as possible when deciding what to do.

I urge you to change the ending still, but I recognize that though our cries are heard, we ultimately cannot force the talented artists behind this game to surrender their vision. I hold out hope that there can be a way for us to overcome this issue that will work for both our interests.

I have the utmost for this company, that hasn't changed.

[G00N3R7883]

I'm pleased by this statement.

Bioware have acknowledged the fans disappointment, and are working to find a solution. This is good news for fans.

Although it isn't specifically stated, I believe the tone of the statement indicates that the indoctrination theory is false. It sounds like Bioware hadn't planned to do anything else, and therefore I appreciate that it will take some time to figure out and implement a solution. We fans should have some patience now, because the last thing we want is for Bioware to do a rush job that doesn't fix anything.

[Squallypo]

chris fenton wrote...

Squallypo wrote...

chris fenton wrote...

llandwynwyn wrote...

People are being too trusting, really, he made no promise of a fix for the endings.

Bioware is walking on thin ice here, so I hope it is, but I wouldn't be surprised if we get news of Aria's dlc in April.

Ha. I won't be buying it, if that's the case. 

thats why i was assuming that you havent read up the article yet.

I won't lie, I haven't. But this is getting overwhelming. I'm holding unto hope, I'll be the first to admit it. If it's just some mid game DLC, I won't be purchasing.
But at least it's something.

well its never too late 
http://www.forbes.co...ending-sort-of/ 

read up if your interested   ^ 

[nrcrane]

While I am glad to see a response from Bioware, I have to admit it is a far cry from what people are hoping for. After reading the article, if I am understanding it right, Bioware is just considering to include an explanation for the current ending.

An explanation may satisfy some, but as for me and I believe many others, what is expected, is multiple endings that take into consideration the choices that were made through out the game if not the series.

Adding in multiple endings allows for everyone to be happy I think. Fans who enjoy the current ending get to keep it, people who are not satisfied with the current ending get other options, and Bioware gets to not only keep "artistic integrity," by keeping the current ending but they get to expand on it by creating more and delivering what they said they would.

[SmellyMetal]

Yes Ray, your "artistic" integrity brought us the Tali stock picture. But you're right, you guys are artists...the art of taking our money and delivering BULL****.

[Gnoster]

A great response from Bioware and greatly appreciated, so thank you for that.

Personally I do worry where the line goes between providing players the needed closure and holding to your artistic freedom. I am all for art, and I do believe computer games can become a form of art (I do not think they are there yet), but I seriously doubt, what the playerbase is looking for is an explanation of the art that is the current ending. If I look at a painting by Picasso and don't understand the deeper meaning with it, it will very seldom help my appreciation of it as a painting if I'm told, the weird paintstrokes are meant to be a selfportrait or a duck or whatever :-).

Personally I am looking for a total remake of the last 5 minutes where the choices made throughout the three games determine how the final fight against the reapers go. I can easily accept three endings as opposed to the current 16 (or 1 ending with 2% variance 16 times). Here the three endings should follow the framework of Mass Effect 2:
1) Total failure; The Sword Fleet and Hammer Groundforces are both destroyed, Shepard dies, his/her friends die, and the Reapers take over the universe. End of Story, cut scene to some future civilization finding the Mass Relays for the first time, thus beginning the next cycle.
2) Total success; If all the right choices are made, all alliances successfull, then the Galatic forces should prevail. Shepard should be allowed to live with his/her friends and LI alive. Give them a future. Yes, it's cheesy, but sometimes cheese is good, and the Mass effect series stands great on it own with the morale of the series as "when you come together no matter race, religion, sexual orientation, or whatever, you can overcome any odds stacked against you"
3) Middle ground; here the reapers are defeated but at even greater cost not only to the Galatic forces but to Shepards and his/her friends as well. Several of Shepards friends, and possibly even his/her LI or himself/herself should die.
Now both number 2 and 3 should finish off with a Dragon Age: Origins based epilogue, where the continued life of Shepard, his/her LI, and friends as well as the races of the universe are told. And this doesn't have to be perfect. I remember feeling sad (but in a good way) about DAO epilogue when it stated that the Chantry was considering an Exalted March against the dwarven kingdom.

Realising my preference for the above requires a total rewrite of the game's last 5 minutes, and that you (read: Bioware) due to holding to artistic freedom wont delete the God/AI child along with the other stuff containing Joker fleeing the battle and the out of place grandfather and child dreaming of going into space one day, I may have to accept that such stuff is probably in there for good for the simple reason of it being "art" no matter how little sense it makes. In such a case I would still propose that you try and do something in the line of the above, because that massive buildup is what most are looking forward to in such a great game.

As a conclusion I can say that after playing ME3 and being immensely dissappointed not only over the ending, but how the feel of the series felt destroyed by said ending, I chose to start a new character in Mass Effect 1 and try and go through the whole series. Now my Kayla Shepard has destroyed Sovereign and brought down the collectors in Mass Effect 2, and though the ending was always present in my thought, I really enjoyed playing through the first two games and I'm find myself looking forward to starting ME3 with her. However I also know that if I do not shut down the game immediately upon being hit by Harbinger's beam, that great experience will once again be ruined. I guess, what I'm saying is; this is such a great series (all 3 games), and it is not too late to save it.

Modifié par Gnoster, 21 mars 2012 - 06:04 .

[chris fenton]

Squallypo wrote...

chris fenton wrote...

Squallypo wrote...

chris fenton wrote...

llandwynwyn wrote...

People are being too trusting, really, he made no promise of a fix for the endings.

Bioware is walking on thin ice here, so I hope it is, but I wouldn't be surprised if we get news of Aria's dlc in April.

Ha. I won't be buying it, if that's the case. 

thats why i was assuming that you havent read up the article yet.

I won't lie, I haven't. But this is getting overwhelming. I'm holding unto hope, I'll be the first to admit it. If it's just some mid game DLC, I won't be purchasing.
But at least it's something.

well its never too late 
http://www.forbes.co...ending-sort-of/ 

read up if your interested   ^ 

I will when I get some free time. Thank you.

[Mozts]

Thank you. Maybe my sickness will get better now...

[Brownfinger]

"Rage until you get your way". Ah, that old chestnut. It used to work for me, when I was nine.
I feel badly, seeing them hammered to the point of submission. Well, as badly as one can feel for people who make assloads of cash.

But hey, if it brings a more thoughtful ending, then maybe it's justified. I think I'm in the minority in that I didn't completely hate the ending, but I would welcome something slightly less metaphysical and weird.

I respect the need to tow the company line, but surely there were a few Bioware employees who cocked an eyebrow at the ending to their game.

Modifié par Brownfinger, 21 mars 2012 - 06:04 .

[BuddhaGeek]

I can't help but feel as if you're missing the point. For me, this isn't about "happy endings" or "clarification". It's about getting the choices we were promised. It's about being told one thing and presented another.

I feel like I was put in a room with over a dozen doors that would potentially lead to over a dozen different places. Behind all but three of the doors, however, was a wall of concrete. The illusion of choice was there and I believed it, but it was just that. An illusion

[BCMakoto]

First of all: Thank you for taking time to write us this summary or letter, what you want to call it is up to you.

While I think that it is in fact a good thing to hear from you, there are some points in your letter which I want to point out:

"However, most folks appear to agree that
the game as a whole is exceptional, with more than 75 critics giving it a
perfect review score and a review average in the mid-90s. Net, I’m
proud of the team, but we can and must always strive to do better."

Indeed, the game is exceptionally good. From the beginning at Earth until the Reaper beam hits you, it is a good game, and until the Reaper beam I would consider it one of my "Most favorite of all time", taking a seat directly besides Final Fantasy X (For beeing a timeless classic PS2 game) and Skyrim. However, the end, everything that happens after the Reaper beam, is nearly killing the game, no, the trilogy itself. I see the point you are comming from, by posting the reviews, but sadly: Those reviews will NOT buy further DLC in a number that could even close bring a good income. WE, the dedicated Bioware fans and gamers, are the people buying DLC. And as many said: At the current ending, which is so massiv full of plot-holes and gives not even a single bit of clarification and/or satisfaction, I see no point in buying a pre-Earth attack DLC.

"...has unfortunately become destructive rather than constructive. "

That is, as in the context of "Flaming" and/or harrasing, not true. The #RetakeMassEffect movement has always been very clear about our motives, and we do not flame or harras your employess at any time.There are more then a thousand good examples on how the game could end.

"Exec Producer Casey Hudson and the team
are hard at work on a number of game content initiatives that will help
answer the questions, providing more clarity for those seeking further
closure to their journey".

It is not so much about "We want to know why my LI is now on the Normandy!". It is about having what we were promised to get: 16 vastly different endings, based on the choices we have made. While we have to admit that the current endings are Indeed "different", as in "Not exactly the same.", there is no real distinction between them. Someone sums it up:

"(Destroy/Synth/Control), (Red,Green,Blue) colored explosions, Shepard dies, Mass Relays blow up, Normandy crashes.".

While the cutscene still slightly varies in the first ~30 seconds, it is the EXACT same cutscene after the beam reaches the relay. Excuse me, but in what way are those: "16 different endings, which will play out vastly different". If you advertise with it, make them vastly different. Yes, blow up the relays, Crash the Normandy, kill Shepard, but Reapers destroyed. Let that be the "Semi-bad" ending. Make a happy ending where everything is sunny and rainbow, make a bad ending where the Reapers win.

"At the same time, I also believe in and support the artistic choices made by the development team"

I can also fully understand where you are coming from, and I said in my e-mail that no one has to tell you by law what you must do. But, considering that so many fans are upset, don't you think it is time to sit down and say: "MAYBE we made some slight mistakes here and there.". We have in no way the right to demand anything, but don't you want to see your customers happy after playing your product, saying: "This was worth the time and money! 100% epic." rather then: "It was 99% good. Then, the ending killed the trilogy.". Do you want, considering it's current state, to let Mass Effect be remembered as: "The game which ending killed hundreds of hours and scared away a fanbase!".

"some of our loyal fans are passionately expressing their displeasure about how their game concluded".

Excuse me to be rude here, but: It is certainly not only the "Minority of the loyal fan base.". I know people who have never even played a Bioware game before who tell me now: "You know, when you told me about Mass Effect in januar, I was excited...now...I am disappointed.". It is not the minority of fans, it is the majority of people who have played the game. If you think that we (As in people who dislike the ending) are few, you are wrong. We are many, in fact: "We are Legion". There are already people in local media stores telling people before they pay for the copy: "You have heard about the ending controversy...are you sure to buy this? No refund to opened copies.". In fact, everyone I ask in our vocational schools says the same: "Mass Effect 3 endings are bad."

Now an appeal from me:
Bioware, you have created an awesome piece of art. Since my first hour in Mass Effect 1 I was so fascinated, like so many other people. You created the very first Sci fi setting besides Star Wars that I love, in fact, Mass Effect tops star wars, as I can create my own story.

Bioware, make it count. You are two steps away, one Patch, one fix, to make the trilogy that will always be remembered as "Epic.". Do not let us down. Not just consider "To answer questions.", but to give us back the trilogy.

The Reapers have become a childs toy, no living Nightmare, their reason of existance fading away for beeing "Unreasonable" and "stupid". Give us back the Nightmare. Make the catalyst different, and I do not care who or what it will be. But not some VI like this. I respect your writers...but this can't be everything, can it?

Modifié par LPKerberos, 21 mars 2012 - 06:03 .

[Getorex]

Alamandorious wrote...

I think, honestly, that Mr. Muzyka missed the point of all of this.  First, he keeps insinuating that the people that want either the ending changed, or expanded upon are the minority.  He also says that '75 critics' gave this game perfect or near perfect reviews.

Well, first of all, the people that want things to change are not the minority.  It's the majority.

Secondly, those critics often didn't finish the game before jumping on the 'entitled' fans.

Thirdly, those particular critics work for the big review companies which, honestly, have a vested interest in maintaining the status quo...note how they come down on games that come from companies that don't offer them 'incentives', while they love games from companies that do.  The independant reviewers and those outside the game industry, such as Forbes, are much better indicators because they're much more honest.

He then goes on about 'artistic integrity'...when we have two clear instances of work being snatched from somewhere else (the end sequence with the old man and the young boy...the background for that is 'Space Winter'...it already existed prior to the game).  So, really, he can't use that argument.

Now, I've already sent a message off to him with my idea for expanding the game ending (this was before I iknew about this thread)  and in his post he asks for constructive opinion...thus, I shall re-iterate here.

I support the indoctrination theory as both making the most sense compared to what we have, and as the easiest way for Bioware to solve this issue.

How, you might ask?

By expanding on the endings.  It's really very simple:

SNIPAROO

I'm sorta Ok with your ideas except it is clearly based 100% on indoctrination in which Blue and Green are both equally bad.  The way it plays out now the Green is clearly GOOD (Shep dies but not a single synthetic OR organic does...they go about their lives, loves, etc, but with glowing eyes, Reapers no longer big meanies).

Also...a wheelchair?  Really?  in the year 2150 or some such?  There wont be wheelchairs (not likely) in a mere 50-75 years, let alone 120 or so).  No wheelchairs in the 21xx's, no way.  Other than that...good effort.

[Lookout1390]

Ever since I beat all of ME2's content and what it had to offer, I was ready for ME3, it was a long gruesome wait but I understood they needed time to create and they would put an end to all my questions.

Well you guys left me with even more questions in the end, and I just don't feel like playing any Post-ending dlc because in the back of my head I see how it all ends.

[Squallypo]

BuddhaGeek wrote...

I can't help but feel as if you're missing the point. For me, this isn't about "happy endings" or "clarification". It's about getting the choices we were promised. It's about being told one thing and presented another.

I feel like I was put in a room with over a dozen doors that would potentially lead to over a dozen different places. Behind all but three of the doors, however, was a wall of concrete. The illusion of choice was there and I believed it, but it was just that. An illusion

yes exactly, and for what he says hes simply ignoring this. 

[Sylvianus]

I liked what I read. We'll see.

[AntAras11]

loungeshep wrote...

Timeless-Strife wrote...

For me it all balls down to this: Mass Effect 3 up until the Reaper beam (you know what I'm referring to if you beat the game) was in my opinion awesome. Everything else after the Reaper beam was...how do I say this lightly....BS and should not have gone down the tubes the way it did. I can't wait to see how they are going to handle this.

Agreed though for me it'd be after Starchild.  

Funny how these things go. I stand between the two of you, after the Anderson dialogue scene.

[Ravellion]

Although I appreciate the well spoken and heartfelt reply, that that does seem to imply genuine concern for the community, I am somewhat alarmed by the undertone that the endings will stay the same, and the game will only be expanded upon.

With the relays destroyed, a massive fleet hovering over earth, and earth shattered because of war, I don't see what any kind of DLC will do for me. Adding anything before the ending would just make me think "why bother" and anything after just seems highly unlikely to change the situation. What are we going to get? "Earth, the century of interspecies warfare?"

That said, I wouldn't mind the bleakness so much if the outcome was in any way dependent on how I played the game. But saving the rachni in part 1 is basically nothing more than +75 war assets. Exactly the same as promoting a single MP character into your war assets. That's what really bothers me. I made some really bad decisions in ME3, and it hardly mattered, I still got enough war assets for the "shepard breathes" ending. The point for me is "my choices didn't matter". There was no need to import or replay with my or any character, as all endings are open to each character, regardless of the choices they made.

[Zalbik]

Ronin1325 wrote...

cmj428 wrote...

catofnine wrote...

Dear Dr. Muzyka,

Thank you for your measured and well articulated response.

However, I don't recommend cloaking the game behind professional reviewers.  It only gives us rabies.  They're not your customers, we are.

I'm showing a partial quote of what catofnine wrote but this part was very funny and yet so true.

I'll repost that post! It's very appropriate! (and funny too:happy:)

Love it

Modifié par Zalbik, 21 mars 2012 - 06:06 .

[Timeless-Strife]

Also what Ray said IMO was more PR fluff. I will not fall for the ole bait and switch!

[Xellith]

social.bioware.com/940125/polls/30223/

What is your take on the ME theme? This poll needs more votes and I hope it can help the dev team see where some people are coming from in this battle of artistic freedom and personal beliefs.

Modifié par Xellith, 21 mars 2012 - 06:07 .

[BloodyWereWolf]

DLC and all, its great but I would like clarification on the story, not a new ending.

Modifié par BloodyWereWolf, 21 mars 2012 - 06:07 .