2054 réponses à ce sujet

[Seifer006]

Seifer006 wrote...



To Ray and the rest of the team at Bioware:






I first want to thank Bioware for the extravagant work
they've done with the whole ME Trilogy. It is the Star Wars of this generation.
The Mass Effect Universe is so deeply-rich and monumental. I love reading Mass
Effect Wiki and gaining a wealth of knowledge from "the krogan rebellions
to the first contact war"






You have created Characters, all with interesting and
creative backgrounds that we've grown attached to, and seeing this Epic
Conclusion has brought tears in my eyes, for I'm such a fan of the series.
There's NOT a whole lot of games out there that is on "par" with the
ME series. Mario and Zelda aren't what they used to be, so ME has really grown
attached to.






With all that said, I now give you my criticism






1. The first thing I've noticed Dr.
Muzyka, that ME:3 was "rushed" I recognized this very
quickly.

• For Example: The Script Writing. I was bored with
  Shepard's conversations. Shepard words really aren't all that elaborate.
• I remember the scene(s) with Miranda, Miranda was
  great. Well script dialogue, yet........Shepard's words and responses was
  boring. Not the VA, that's fine, but the writing itself was boring.

2. The Character Development:

• Samara: I felt that
  Bioware didn't put any effort in her in ME:3. I reember in ME:2 she was
  much more creative. She would talk about her past of the Jusicar's and
  their Codes. She would reveal her daughters and how she needed to go after
  "Mornith" and that was the real reason she became a Justicar. But
  in ME:3,  she was dry and boring. Uncreative and she was only in
  the game for like 5 minutes at the most. In fact, the end of the game,
  where you can communicate with her one last time, she has nothing to say.
• Zaeed Massani:
  When Bioware introduced Zaeed Massani
  (ME:2) ,  I  used him in almost all my missions. I was so happy
  they gave us a FREE DLC character of Robin Sach's: Zaeed the
  Ruthless
  Merc. I found him to be hilarious and fun to bring as a squadmate.
  But in ME:3 he wasn't even recruitable and he only had like two lines in
  the entire game...big disappoinment when he was a DLC from ME:2 and
  then a nobody in ME:3.
• Wrex: I first want to thank Bioware for Wrex/Wreav and Grunt. The creativity Bioware put in the krogans is ingenious. But, what happen to having a krogan squad-mate? We had Wrex in ME:1 and Grunt in ME:2 yet NONE in ME:3.
  In fact Wrex/Wreav wasn't even in the game that long. Did Bioware not
  consider this? I felt this is due that the game was "rushed" and that this could have been avoided.
  BTW
  - I want to thank Bioware for WREAV!!!!!    The script-writng was
  magnificent and well done for Wrex/Wreav and Jim Cumming's delivered
  very well in his performance as Wreav. I was very pleased. I wish he
  could have been a recruitable squadmate.
• ***HARBINGER***** -  I
  believe I'm not alone on this...... I really wish Harbinger was in ME:3
  and not sure why Bioware didn't give a large role, since he made things
  very personal in ME:2 not to mention the last scene of ME:2 where he LEADS  the other Reapers towards the Milky Way Galaxy. Being
  in the game at the very end for 10secs kinda makes me wonder if this
  too could have been avoided if the game wasn't "rushed"
• I do want to say this Bioware:
  remember Bioware, the reason why I and so many others give these
  critical feedbacks is because the ME series is so great. You've created
  an entire Universe that we all grown attached too, this shows how well
  you've done in producing the ME Universe.

Ending:
Honestly, I don't understand it. It's very poorly done. The "starchild"
is terrible. I really wish you hadn't went that direction with using
him as a catylist. You should've used Harbinger. He really is the better
choice.

• Most of the fans don't want a DLC. I repeat, Most of the fans don't want a DLC. Even if it's free.I'm not sure if the Indoctrination Theory or Hallucination is actually correct. If it is, then keep it.
  
  I hope this wasn't meant to be an attacked but a well- reasonable contructive feedback

I also would like to point out: I was hoping for a better battle in the end. I cummulative of all the war assets i.e. Elcor, Aria's Reinforcements, quarians and krogans ETC......... I didn't seem them at all in helping during the "Take Back Earth"

again all this could have been avoided if the game wasn't "rushed"

[SpideyKnight]

 Well said.  From the boss man himself, no less, impressive.  The blog assuages my immediate concerns.  Thank you.

To all trying to read too deeply into it, try to regain some composure.  I know tensions are high at the moment.  It basically says to wait patiently and see what's up.  That I can do, I appreciate it.  Some feedback from me would be that I'd like to see as much closure to Shep's story as possible.  I truly care for the character and commend you for creating him.  I think he truly deserves a fitting and righteous end to his story.  I understand you want to maintain artistic integrity, and I respect that, just please don't let that get in the way of giving Shepard the conclusion he/she so richly deserves.

Also if I could have that house with Tali?   Ok, ok, just kidding, sorry I had to try.

Thanks again.

To all holding the line, please be respectful, they have been extremely fair here.  Do what you feel is right, but do so respectfully and honorably.  If there can be a victor here it will be all of us.  Let's see this through with the utmost of conviction and virtue.  Thanks.

[durasteel]

The entire motivating force behind Commander Shepard in Mass Effect 3 is his fight to save the galaxy, and its people, civilization, and culture. While conflict between synthetic and organic intelligence was one of the elements of the story in Mass Effect 1, that is resolved in the Legion and EDI story lines, and by the time we reach the end of the game it is a non-issue. As I have said before, Shepard wouldn't be fighting any less ferociously if the Reapers were giant psychic hive-mind space cockroaches.

I cannot see any way in which an ending that discards saving the galaxy in favor of returning to the organic v. synthetic issue and compels a choice among unappealing "solutions" will ever be satisfactory. You simply cannot clarify and explain away the fact that by that point in the game, that conflict has already been resolved. You cannot clarify and explain how failing to save the galaxy is an acceptable outcome.

No matter who among thecharacters lives or dies, if the basic civilization, society, and culture of the galaxy is saved, Shepard wins. If those things are destroyed--which is an inevitable outcome of demolishing the galactic  infrastructure--Shepard fails. We've come too far with Shepard to quietly accept his failure.

Modifié par durasteel, 21 mars 2012 - 08:22 .

[Naughty Bear]

L00p wrote...

Naughty Bear wrote...

L00p wrote...

llandwynwyn wrote...

People are being too trusting, really, he made no promise of a fix for the endings.

Bioware is walking on thin ice here, so I hope it is, but I wouldn't be surprised if we get news of Aria's dlc in April.

They are not doing any walking on ice, or any other action.

It's like they're sitting on an expensive office chair on the ice, doing nothing but sprouting an occasional sound of jibberish, while the ice is cracking dangerously beneath them.

Your comment reminded me of those aliens from Mars Attacks when they speak.

Thank you, I'll take that as a compliment.

It was, made me laugh

I can picture Casey Hudson with the rest of the team just talking like those aliens. That strange jibberish speech they have.

[Errationatus]

Curiouser and curiouser.

The ending fiasco, IMO, stems from a number of surprisingly mundane factors.  I offer my conjecture.  I could be wrong, I'm open to being proven so:

1.  Fan expectations. Humans have about 13 basic story types they like.  These stories all have endings particular to them and, as a rule, the vast majority of folks will accept nothing but the endings they expect.  Anything that deviates from these expected endings gets rejected.  It is not a matter of "bad" endings to a particular type of story.  It's that we want the ending we expect.  The majority of people simply prefer their stories to be utterly predictable.  Not the process.  The characters can be quirky, but they must conform to basic archetypes.  We must be able to relate.  That real life often writes bad endings to our personal stories is not pertinent.  Our fiction must end well within their genres and as we expect, or we will reject them.  It's basically human nature.  It's reflected in the vast majority of media, especially American media, where pretty much everything is spelled out for an audience, usually through visual and audio clues (certain colours, audio cues and musical "stings").  This is a combination both of Hollywood's general belief in that the public is composed primarily of sensation-seeking idiots, and the public's general apathy and laziness over what they're offered.  We don't watch movies or television to think, ya nerds.  We have books for that.  D'uh.  

The structure is simple and straightforward.  Most "first worlders" prefer their entertainment to be simple, expected and easy.  Anything we have to think about is "boring" or "bad".  Patience from a viewer in entertainment is no longer a virtue, and hasn't been for quite some time.

2.  Subtlety.  This is lost on most of the people in point one.  One of the strengths in art is not just in what it says, but also what it isn't saying, so to speak.  Americans do not appreciate subtlety in their entertainment.  Simply look at the current crop of most popular television series.  Look at the last crop  ...and the ones before that.  As I said, the general trend is that the preference is simple and spelled out.  

For example, in ME3 the majority of the game - unlike the other two - has odd corners.  The majority of the game looks like its in "vignette".  This is something done in dream sequences and flashbacks.  To help a bit:  this vignette is not in the endings. Curious, no?

3.  Credit Where Due.  There's an old saying that "no one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public".  I am beginning to believe that Bioware and ME3's creators made a mistake in overestimating the average intelligence of their fanbase.  I'm not saying Bioware fans are stupid, by any means.  It is simply a matter of both expectations and perception.  Bioware has practically invented this kind of gameplay, and their way of doing it is still relatively new.

The simple fact is that the vast majority of gamers do not play games for either story or nuance. This isn't a criticism of the fans or even of game companies.  No one is going to play "My Dinner With Andre: The Game".  Games are meant to dazzle and excite us, not make us contemplate lofty ideas or reexamine our ways of thinking.  That some do attempt this - even superficially - is to the credit of game creators.  The popularity and zeal of Bioware's fans is a tribute to the market for this sort of thing, and it is growing, as the popularity of games like L.A. Noire and Heavy Rain testify. 

It is a telling comment, however, that because so many people prefer what they expected and thought they rather arrogantly should have got that they ignored - and they must have - things pretty much in their faces the entire time.  Forest for the trees and all that.  Now, because of this, Bioware is forced, very likely, to prempt plans and create filler to "explain things".

I would like to point out that no one is at any particular "fault".  I think ME3 was an attempt at different form of narrative in games.   Bioware tried to be subtle, to layer the experience and counted on their fans to "get it" - and it failed because gamers simply don't expect subtle, or layers.  There's very little about a firefight that's subtle.  Only Mythbusters gets away with Knowledge Through Splosions.

The biggest "problem" with all of this is that it's been handled poorly by both sides.  Bioware is following the corporate model of PR and releases and the machine rolls on without noticing the angry fists in the air.  Those angry fists belong to fans that have forgotten that patience is a virtue and want what they want when they want and it had damn well better be what they expected.  The anger stems from Bioware not living up to what the fans had created themselves for themselves in the interval between ME2 and 3.  This is also the reason for the "outrage" over DA2.  It's human nature to prefer one thing and expect more of the same in the next iteration.  It's why romance novels - which are consistently among the highest-selling "literature" ever - are all basically one story, told over and over with a doctor in this one and a cowboy in this one and a spy in the next.  

A great many people all over are going to feel rather stupid when this is all said and done.  My only hope is that it doesn't end up discouraging game producers from pursuing story and character-driven games.  That'd be a shame.

Modifié par JakeMacDon, 21 mars 2012 - 08:29 .

[SeventyOne]

A clever comment about art was made by a Gamespot commenter:
"DannyC_pt: Art doesn't end with an advertisement to buy more DLC."

That is the end of the artistic discussion...

[SCK barman]

A very good responce and pleasure to hear. I'm aware this fixes wont come over night and look forward to the new content to pass the time, i'll just stop before the point of no return

[Siven80]

Loved the game up until the last 10 mins or so.

From there its rather confusing and doesnt make sense unless its a dream or something.

All i want is for endings to make sense. Even cliffhangers i prefer to nonsensical endings.

[Seleya_LL]

Dear BioWare,

with the exception of the last 10 minutes of the game, I'd agree with the statement that Mass Effect "is the best game BioWare has yet crafted". But then I think of my Bhaalspawns, who got his or her "happily-ever-afters", of my Revans with his or her medals, of my Wardens who usually got to live and tell the tales of their adventures. And while my nameless zombies may not have reached a "happy" ending, they got an acceptable end. At least in my opinion.

I have seen Mass Effect 3 as some kind of a fairy tale. Okay, we are in space, and we have certainly no unicorns (and I am very, very glad about this...) or white horses. What we have is a hero who can be sarcastic or outright mean if (s)he wants to, but who can also a peacemaker-hero-saint-kind of guy. We have wonderful characters around, fascinating cultures, and, all in all, a story which tells us that anything can be achieved if the right choices are made and if Shepard does not give up. Curing a century-old plague? Making peace between mortal enemies, not just once, but twice? Coming back from the dead? Surviving a suicide mission? If the right choices are made, these things are not impossible for Commander Shepard.

And this is why the ending hurts so much. Where is the choice? Where is the impact of my decisions? Where is a sarcastic renegade-style answer to the Catalyst-spaceghost-child? Why has the fairy tale suddenly and forcefully turned into a nightmare? Right now it seems that regardless of Shepard's decision, all his/her allies are condemned to starve on / around Earth, as there is no way for the partly-harvested planet to support the survivors, even if the Reapers took a heavy toll on the different fleets.

I wish to believe that you care about the feedback you are receiving. I already believe that you are listening. But how am I supposed to tell my friends that the game itself is exceptional in total? Don't get me wrong, it is not only exceptional, it is wonderful - if and only if I ignore the ending. But telling somebody "Here, the game is great, just ignore the ending" simply does not work. And telling sombebody "Here, the game is great, you'll just need a bag of tissues and then some hours of therapy afterwards" does not really work, either.

[thunderhawk862002]

I want to know who exactly wrote the ending. Was it a group collaboration or was it the result of one person?

[Mixon]

Dear Bioware, it's very nice that you've been paying attention to us.
Please understand us and our reaction. Mass Effect became a classic for us, like Star Wars. It is a Universe, which will never be forgotten. And how it ends is important to us. We do not want to guess what will happen next. We just want to see it. During the game (since 2007) we are very attached to characters. And of course we would like to see them on completion of the game, not as a silhouette effect. Even a happy ending may be sentimental to the soul. We just want to feel the tears of happiness. You will not believe, but for me was the most sentimental moment when Shepard got out of the wreckage in the end of ME1 and also, when I saw my whole team in the end of ME2. Please, give us happiness.

Thank you Dr. Ray Muzyka

P.s. I apologize, English is not my native language.

[durasteel]

JakeMacDon wrote...

... A great many people all over are going to feel rather stupid when this is all said and done.  My only hope is that it doesn't end up discouraging game producers from pursuing story and character-driven games.  That'd be a shame.

It will probably encourage a few to make sure they have a robust peer review process, and might even lead to an occasional focus group.

Your post implies that you think many of us simply lacked the sohistication to "get" the ending. I assure you, I got it. I understand it perfectly. It was bad.

[MarcosPesic]

QUOTE: As artists, we care about our fans deeply and we appreciate your support.

If you do appreciate us, HEAR US and make a DLC with a decent ending !
Mass Effect 1, 2 and 3 are awesome games... but the ending destroied the entire series... Sorry to say... it´s the WORST ending I have saw in a game...

And DO NOT LIE in the future ! We have been promised 16 endings... And we got "3" almost identical and with no meaning.

A tue artist don´t delivery a incomplete art just to hit a launch date... 

Modifié par MarcosPesic, 21 mars 2012 - 08:34 .

[bobito64]

In an interview three weeks ago Dr Muzyka said the following:

“Pretty much everything that people want to see wrapped up, or to be given answers, will be.”

“The team has been planning for this for years, since the beginning of the Mass Effect franchise. Largely the same team, most of the same leads have worked on this for years and years. They’ve thought about [the ending] for years and years. It’s not something they’ve had to solve in a week or a month even, but over the course of five or ten years.”

“I just finished an end to end playthrough, for me the ending was the most satisfying of any game I’ve ever played… the decisions you make in this game are epic.”

Since these comments do not appear match the ending that we have seen so far or the creation described in Geoff Keighley's e book (the ending scribbled on a notepad by Mac Waters in November of last year), I am left wondering whether it was PR speak or whether Bioware have had something planned all along.

The indoctrination theory remains the only explanation that explains the contradictions and plot holes in the game but also the only one that leaves the producers of this game with their integrity in tact.

I really want it to be true for both reasions at this stage.

Modifié par bobito64, 21 mars 2012 - 08:33 .

[chester013]

Naughty Bear wrote...

chester013 wrote...

Ghost Warrior wrote...

Kavadas wrote...

Honestly, until they admit how ****ing stupid their Star Child ending is and how meaningless our choices were I don't what Casey, Ray, or anyone from Electronic Arts has to say.

The ending needs be simply rewritten from the point where Shepard passes out onboard the crucible and it Electronic Arts need to patch it in completely free.

Anything else is unacceptable.

"Keep dreaming T'Soni"

Well I don't think there's any need to be so belligerent, but as it stands the current end doesn't befit the quality of the preceeding games. I firmly beleive after watching the ending numerous times and pouring over the clues throughout the game that the indoctrination theory holds water, providing an easy out.

Unless of course, this is was the intention and BW pulled the biggest mind **** since the usual suspects.

Ghost Warriors response also applies to what i just bolded.

Probably but I guess we'll have to wait and see. I certainly won't be holding my breath for a re-write.

[tackle70]

Yayyyyyyyyyyyyy! Thank you BioWare. I don't even care that I'll likely have to pay for the better endings - totally worth it considering how good the first two games were. I've been sooooooo bummed that the original endings killed my desire to replay the whole trilogy - I can't wait to replay the whole thing start to finish with an ending that reflects my playthrough (hopefully), is coherent within established canon (hopefully) and which provides emotional closure (hopefully).

Just hope it's not extra color options for exploding Mass Relays

[Getorex]

tackle70 wrote...

Yayyyyyyyyyyyyy! Thank you BioWare. I don't even care that I'll likely have to pay for the better endings - totally worth it considering how good the first two games were. I've been sooooooo bummed that the original endings killed my desire to replay the whole trilogy - I can't wait to replay the whole thing start to finish with an ending that reflects my playthrough (hopefully), is coherent within established canon (hopefully) and which provides emotional closure (hopefully).

Just hope it's not extra color options for exploding Mass Relays

Oh what now?  You got a problem with the color teal?  I LIKE teal.  Don't rag on teal, bub.  

[omegasama]

SeventyOne wrote...

A clever comment about art was made by a Gamespot commenter:
"DannyC_pt: Art doesn't end with an advertisement to buy more DLC."

That is the end of the artistic discussion...

This.

[TheCinC]

Yay!

Reading this I can at least be cautiously optimistic that the ending will be revised, in one way or another. I for one am convinced that the ending we got was the intended ending. Why else would it be in the game? I am also convinced someone decided to make it a cliffhanger, with the intention to create DLC that would give us the resolution of the story. Some have said that the brief scene of someone with N7 tags taking a breath means nothing. However, that very brief scene has to be there for a reason and the indoctrination theory makes much more sense than taking the final moments of ME3 at face value. DLC to provide us with an ending, however, goes contrary to the promises which were made and the expectations that I and so many of us had. It would make ME3 only 99% of a full game and I think we deserve to have a full ending. Additional games, DLC, are only interesting to me if this game receives a proper ending. Otherwise, I'd worry each time about a recurrence of this type of ending.

In ME1 and ME2 it was at least clear you had won and that Shepard was still alive. There was a final battle, a Reaper was destroyed and you knew there would be more of them, but for now, you had won. This time around, so much is unclear, so much is unknown and for the end of a trilogy, that is just plain weird. Therefore I also can't imagine Bioware not having done the research and not having tested the ending with a focus group of hardcore fans. Heck, I imagine the developers themselves are fans and that even they must have been scratching their heads about this.

It is good to see that our response is being taken seriously, even if we're still being marginalised as "some of our most loyal players," despite the fact that a poll of almost 60,000 players shows that only a handful thinks the ending is good as it is. With this, we have a promise: "Exec Producer Casey Hudson and the team are hard at work on a number of game content initiatives that will help answer the questions, providing more clarity for those seeking further closure to their journey. You’ll hear more on this in April." It is almost April, so I'm very eager to see what they will come up with.

I'll gladly admit that ME3, up until the very end, is at least on a par, if not better, with ME1 and ME2. Considering I was blown away by ME1 when I first played it, causing me to immediately buy ME2 and that I've played both games several times over, something I have never done with this kind of game, I think that may be taken as a huge compliment, it is certainly intended that way. In that respect, ME3 is a huge success, imho. It is very satisfying to see all the choices I made earlier play out and for me at least it turned out I made all the choices that seem to have paid off, even if some of them came at a (heavy) price. Bioware and its developers may indeed take heart in that and be proud of their accomplishment. However, unfortunately, as it stands I can't actually recommend the game, no matter how much I like most of the game. The people that I know who play this game or who might like to, would probably have the same reaction as I had. The final moments of the game are at best confusing and really a huge let-down after the huge build-up spanning 2.99 epic games. Hopefully, the 'game content initiatives' will in fact amount to a patch, not to paid DLC. If it is a patch and it is good, I'll be happy. If it is paid DLC, I will probably buy it, however reluctantly, but only because I'm too invested in this story and I want to know what happened to my Shepard and whether there will be blue babies or not. But if Bioware decides to go the road of paid DLC, I'll have to decide against buying any further games or DLC, Mass Effect related or otherwise and then I will not recommend the game. If it is delivered free and it lives up to my original expectations, then I will gladly encourage everyone I know who might be interested to buy ME3 and ME1 and ME2 if applicable.

So, in conclusion, I'd like to urge Bioware to make it clear to us which road they intend to take as that would probably stifle most of the criticism, perhaps even how we arrived here in the first place. What went wrong? They might learn a lot from taking a good look at that as well, because it seems clear to me that no company wants this kind of response to their product.

Modifié par TheCinC, 21 mars 2012 - 08:46 .

[MaleQuariansFTW]

SeventyOne wrote...

A clever comment about art was made by a Gamespot commenter:
"DannyC_pt: Art doesn't end with an advertisement to buy more DLC."

That is the end of the artistic discussion...

http://www.forbes.co...veryones-heads/

In this article, there was a comment by a user named This Hurts You saying "Art that fails to communicate it’s intent is bad art."

I completely agree with this.