http://www.ibtimes.c...est-boycott.htm
"Mass Effect 3" Ending: Did Fan Protests Cause EA Stock Price To Drop?
To Mass Effect 3 players, from Dr. Ray Muzyka, co-founder of BioWare
Débuté par
Chris Priestly
, mars 21 2012 03:08
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#1977
Posté 03 avril 2012 - 06:46
Artemis_Entrari
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But I thought only a vocal minority hated the ending? Why would such a small group of people who hated it (as opposed to apparently the vast majority who loved it) have any impact on EA's stock?
#1978
Posté 03 avril 2012 - 07:18
PaxtonFetel
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Artemis_Entrari wrote...
But I thought only a vocal minority hated the ending? Why would such a small group of people who hated it (as opposed to apparently the vast majority who loved it) have any impact on EA's stock?
On what basis do you think so? A minority of those who liked the ending, Humble has finally.
#1979
Posté 03 avril 2012 - 07:43
venom56321489
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just to show again why endings suck. this video sums it up
jeremy jahns video
jeremy jahns video
#1980
Posté 03 avril 2012 - 07:46
venom56321489
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Still no word on ending! All I hear from Bioware is Crickets.
#1981
Posté 03 avril 2012 - 07:54
MageTarot
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venom56321489 wrote...
Still no word on ending! All I hear from Bioware is Crickets.
Don't expect any sort of comment from BioWare until PAX this weekend...maybe.
#1982
Posté 03 avril 2012 - 08:36
Nl55
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Indoctrination of players and fans complete. We are not N7, most of us, really.
Thanks for this Game. For this Story. This is It. Hold the Line. You are right.
Do not follow indoctrinated forces. Resist them, give them hell.
All people wait for "one more story" after the breath ... Not in dreams, we hopes.
Thanks for this Game. For this Story. This is It. Hold the Line. You are right.
Do not follow indoctrinated forces. Resist them, give them hell.
All people wait for "one more story" after the breath ... Not in dreams, we hopes.
#1983
Posté 03 avril 2012 - 08:43
venom56321489
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http://adage.com/art...-ending/233848/
'Mass Effect 3' Struggles With Social-Media Furor Over Ending
"According to DFC Intelligence analyst Jeremy Miller, the good news for the marketer is that while a lesser brand might have been hurt, "Mass Effect" is solid enough to withstand the storm -- and reap the benefits that downloadable-content sales may have down the line. "
This article thinks mass effect can take this negative feedback and basically like a storm let it blow over and they will be fine. I say do not underestimate the fans. If we feel like we were just blown off I expect to see sales of movies, games, novels, and comic books to plummet.
'Mass Effect 3' Struggles With Social-Media Furor Over Ending
"According to DFC Intelligence analyst Jeremy Miller, the good news for the marketer is that while a lesser brand might have been hurt, "Mass Effect" is solid enough to withstand the storm -- and reap the benefits that downloadable-content sales may have down the line. "
This article thinks mass effect can take this negative feedback and basically like a storm let it blow over and they will be fine. I say do not underestimate the fans. If we feel like we were just blown off I expect to see sales of movies, games, novels, and comic books to plummet.
#1984
Posté 03 avril 2012 - 09:21
lunamoondragon
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Thank the Maker for closure. We can only hope that Bioware handles this well, because there is a vast majority of the fandom crossing their fingers for a satisfying conclusion.
The only reason I'm particularly cross about the ending is because it doesn't take into account your choices in the game. Sure, you got different war assets based on what you did, but I really wanted to see what happened to all of those places and people in the end as a result of your choices. Even if it was in an Origins-type epilogue, it would have made me much more satisfied with the games as a whole, and I'd want to replay them many a time to see what different outcomes could be reached with different combinations.
Keep up the good work, and thank you for listening to the fans. This game means so much to us all.
The only reason I'm particularly cross about the ending is because it doesn't take into account your choices in the game. Sure, you got different war assets based on what you did, but I really wanted to see what happened to all of those places and people in the end as a result of your choices. Even if it was in an Origins-type epilogue, it would have made me much more satisfied with the games as a whole, and I'd want to replay them many a time to see what different outcomes could be reached with different combinations.
Keep up the good work, and thank you for listening to the fans. This game means so much to us all.
#1985
Guest_TheseAreMyToys_*
Posté 03 avril 2012 - 09:24
Guest_TheseAreMyToys_*
Guest_TheseAreMyToys_*
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Hahahaha! Uh-oh EA! It looks like your corporate profits ARE being affected! Its time to do something about this!
#1986
Posté 03 avril 2012 - 10:50
ile_1979
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Nl55 wrote...
Indoctrination of players and fans complete. We are not N7, most of us, really.
Thanks for this Game. For this Story. This is It. Hold the Line. You are right.
Do not follow indoctrinated forces. Resist them, give them hell.
All people wait for "one more story" after the breath ... Not in dreams, we hopes.
Like the man himself said, "we fight or we die" we don't make compromises with self apointed gods
#1987
Posté 04 avril 2012 - 12:06
DirgeSinger
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It was suggested I put the link to a blog post I wrote on my take on the endings here as well, to help it be seen, so here it is: http://www.roc-games.com/blog/?p=72
#1988
Posté 04 avril 2012 - 12:13
HoldTheLine
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I have to admit, I really liked the synthesis ending, initially. Seeing Joker and EDI together made me cry tears of joy,but then it left me wondering what the heck happened and very sad. What will happen to the galaxy now that the mass relays are gone? (Seriously,the mass relays exploding was probably sadder to me than Shepard's death.) In what ways were all of the people of the galaxy altered? How did synthesis change the Reapers themselves? What happened to Shepard's crew? Did the explosion of the relays really wipe out entire systems? Is the indoctrination theory true? After thinking about it more, I felt very hollow inside. Mass Effect 3 is still, hands-down, the best game I ever played, even if the ending left me full of angst. All I want is clarification, something that gives me a better understanding of what happened afterwards, something that makes Shepard's death feel worth it. Please, Bioware, if you're listening, make it happen!!!
#1989
Posté 04 avril 2012 - 01:08
ziggie97
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I dont appreciate your staff calling mass effect fans basement dwelling nerds. Thats the last straw.
https://mobile.twitter.com/RealStanleyWoo
https://mobile.twitter.com/RealStanleyWoo
#1990
Posté 04 avril 2012 - 01:33
OhManTFE
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So... it's April? When are we getting news on the endings?
Or was it just another April Fools?
Or was it just another April Fools?
#1991
Posté 04 avril 2012 - 03:46
animadpig
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It has been two weeks, and no reply from Bioware/EA. We even not sure they are listening the feedback from the fans. Someone said that Bioware will release message on PAX. But, this is nothing to do with PAX. Bioware/EA are testing patient of the fans, and most of the fans are running out of patient. If Bioware/EA are listening, just reply the fans "Yes" or "No".
#1992
Posté 04 avril 2012 - 03:50
venom56321489
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Like I said before bioware is silent only crickets heard.
#1993
Posté 04 avril 2012 - 06:45
PaxtonFetel
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Respect for the player's choice, rather than turning the game into a movie.
#1994
Posté 04 avril 2012 - 10:18
ArthurBDD
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This came up in another thread, but I want to post my thoughts here because I think it points to a key issue which is getting lost a lot in the crosstalk and I'm not sure which threads the devs are paying attention to.
Basically, maddlarkin (whose whole OP in the thread in question you really should read) has made the excellent point that there's a conflict here between the natural desire for resolution and the developer's desire to provoke speculation. As it currently stands, the ending certainly ticks the latter box but at the cost of muddying the former box. True, you could argue that the stuff preceding the ending was meant to be the resolution, but as many people have pointed out that isn't really how the psychology of storytelling works - resolution doesn't feel like resolution unless it takes place in the falling action following the climax of a conflict, and that simply isn't how it works in ME3.
My thoughts on maddlarkin's point are below:
If you want a story which provokes lots and lots of audience speculation and provides a lot of interprative space, there's ways you can do it, but you really need to have been working towards it from the start. David Lynch's works like Lost Highway, Mulholland Drive or Inland Empire are famous for being puzzleboxes from beginning to end - things are off-kilter and strange from the word go, and the whole point is to create this mysterious web of allusions for viewers to interpret and pick their way through and infer a story from.
In an SF context, whilst the end of 2001 was weird, it had been clearly established in the earlier acts that unusual stuff does happen whenever humans (or proto-humans) encounter one of the Monoliths. In fact, the Monoliths are the one recurring feature which appears in every single acts of the story - in prehistory, on the Moon, at Jupiter and "beyond the infinite". The final Monolith which transforms Dave into the Starchild isn't a new character or feature abruptly shoehorned into the narrative, it's an old friend which in hyper-accelerating and guiding Dave's development is doing something directly related to what the first Monolith which uplifts the proto-humans did.
Now, whilst the ME trilogy has had its mysteries, these are pitched in a very different way from the mysteries in 2001 or David Lynch's stuff. In both ME1 and ME2, you start off encountering some mysteries: for ME1 it was "What did that strange vision mean, and why has Saren gone rogue?", and for ME2 it was "Why are human colonies disappearing, and what is TIM's secret agenda?" And in both cases, by the end you had fairly clear answers for all of that. Sure, there were a few mysteries left to leave the door open for the next part of the series, but you were never left with the impression that these were insoluble unknowables - particularly considering that you'd found the answers to much stickier problems along the way.
I guess part of the reason people find the ME3 ending so jarring is that it breaks with the precedent established by the first two games quite decisively. Rather than ending with a resolution where most of the questions raised by the game are solved, it blurts out a heap of new questions in the last gasp rather than providing resolution for the story. And since this was the end of Shepard's story, nobody can really be blamed for expecting significantly more resolution than the endings of ME1 and ME2 offered, rather than significantly less. (In particular, the end of Shepard's story should really provide a resolution for the stuff Shepard cared about - and that includes any NPCs who don't have a livespan long enough to survive the gap in the timeline until the next game.)
Basically, maddlarkin (whose whole OP in the thread in question you really should read) has made the excellent point that there's a conflict here between the natural desire for resolution and the developer's desire to provoke speculation. As it currently stands, the ending certainly ticks the latter box but at the cost of muddying the former box. True, you could argue that the stuff preceding the ending was meant to be the resolution, but as many people have pointed out that isn't really how the psychology of storytelling works - resolution doesn't feel like resolution unless it takes place in the falling action following the climax of a conflict, and that simply isn't how it works in ME3.
My thoughts on maddlarkin's point are below:
Pretty much this. In conventional storytelling endings are about providing resolution, and whilst it's cool to have some unanswered questions or to provide a way to leave the door open for a sequel, you never make the ending solely about gunning for speculation.maddlarkin wrote...
Simply if Bioware honestly sought to create ‘speculation’ at the end of their trilogy it was for a reason other than concluding it. Resolution is one of the most basic mechanisms for ending a narrative and no writer could miss that.
If you want a story which provokes lots and lots of audience speculation and provides a lot of interprative space, there's ways you can do it, but you really need to have been working towards it from the start. David Lynch's works like Lost Highway, Mulholland Drive or Inland Empire are famous for being puzzleboxes from beginning to end - things are off-kilter and strange from the word go, and the whole point is to create this mysterious web of allusions for viewers to interpret and pick their way through and infer a story from.
In an SF context, whilst the end of 2001 was weird, it had been clearly established in the earlier acts that unusual stuff does happen whenever humans (or proto-humans) encounter one of the Monoliths. In fact, the Monoliths are the one recurring feature which appears in every single acts of the story - in prehistory, on the Moon, at Jupiter and "beyond the infinite". The final Monolith which transforms Dave into the Starchild isn't a new character or feature abruptly shoehorned into the narrative, it's an old friend which in hyper-accelerating and guiding Dave's development is doing something directly related to what the first Monolith which uplifts the proto-humans did.
Now, whilst the ME trilogy has had its mysteries, these are pitched in a very different way from the mysteries in 2001 or David Lynch's stuff. In both ME1 and ME2, you start off encountering some mysteries: for ME1 it was "What did that strange vision mean, and why has Saren gone rogue?", and for ME2 it was "Why are human colonies disappearing, and what is TIM's secret agenda?" And in both cases, by the end you had fairly clear answers for all of that. Sure, there were a few mysteries left to leave the door open for the next part of the series, but you were never left with the impression that these were insoluble unknowables - particularly considering that you'd found the answers to much stickier problems along the way.
I guess part of the reason people find the ME3 ending so jarring is that it breaks with the precedent established by the first two games quite decisively. Rather than ending with a resolution where most of the questions raised by the game are solved, it blurts out a heap of new questions in the last gasp rather than providing resolution for the story. And since this was the end of Shepard's story, nobody can really be blamed for expecting significantly more resolution than the endings of ME1 and ME2 offered, rather than significantly less. (In particular, the end of Shepard's story should really provide a resolution for the stuff Shepard cared about - and that includes any NPCs who don't have a livespan long enough to survive the gap in the timeline until the next game.)
#1995
Posté 04 avril 2012 - 11:01
nikki191
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venom56321489 wrote...
http://adage.com/art...-ending/233848/
'Mass Effect 3' Struggles With Social-Media Furor Over Ending
"According to DFC Intelligence analyst Jeremy Miller, the good news for the marketer is that while a lesser brand might have been hurt, "Mass Effect" is solid enough to withstand the storm -- and reap the benefits that downloadable-content sales may have down the line. "
This article thinks mass effect can take this negative feedback and basically like a storm let it blow over and they will be fine. I say do not underestimate the fans. If we feel like we were just blown off I expect to see sales of movies, games, novels, and comic books to plummet.
the problem with that is they are assuming its like ever other crisis in the industry thats happened in the past. the crisis with mass effect is unprecedented, this isnt blowing over and hardcore fans have gone from angry and confusion to contempt and regarding bioware as a joke they cant trust.
#1996
Posté 04 avril 2012 - 11:15
Getorex
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nikki191 wrote...
venom56321489 wrote...
http://adage.com/art...-ending/233848/
'Mass Effect 3' Struggles With Social-Media Furor Over Ending
"According to DFC Intelligence analyst Jeremy Miller, the good news for the marketer is that while a lesser brand might have been hurt, "Mass Effect" is solid enough to withstand the storm -- and reap the benefits that downloadable-content sales may have down the line. "
This article thinks mass effect can take this negative feedback and basically like a storm let it blow over and they will be fine. I say do not underestimate the fans. If we feel like we were just blown off I expect to see sales of movies, games, novels, and comic books to plummet.
the problem with that is they are assuming its like ever other crisis in the industry thats happened in the past. the crisis with mass effect is unprecedented, this isnt blowing over and hardcore fans have gone from angry and confusion to contempt and regarding bioware as a joke they cant trust.
The ME3 thing is just the last turd on a huge stinking pile of turds (DA2 and the like) and it has over-filled the toilet. You cannot just flush it - all you'll get is turd all over the floor.
#1997
Posté 04 avril 2012 - 11:21
Getorex
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The REAL intended ending is way superior to the pile of crap they put in the game (revealed by the MAIN writer): http://www.strategyi...ffect-3-endings
#1998
Posté 04 avril 2012 - 11:24
Oradal
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Is it just me or does Dr. Ray Muzyka bear an uncanny resemblance to a young TIM?
Be afraid poeople, be very afraid
Be afraid poeople, be very afraid
#1999
Posté 04 avril 2012 - 11:35
ArthurBDD
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Oh, another point I'd like to raise:
Whilst I respect the devs' desire for artistic integrity, let's face it: ME3, as a AAA game, is the videogame equivalent of a Hollywood blockbuster, not an arthouse film. And whilst sometimes you can do artful things in a blockbuster context, ultimately they're all about finding something which appeals to the broadest audience the premise can accommodate.
If you want to have the artistic freedom to make brave, controversial decisions which stand a risk of alienating your audience, you want to be working in artsy indie games, not in AAA releases.
Whilst I respect the devs' desire for artistic integrity, let's face it: ME3, as a AAA game, is the videogame equivalent of a Hollywood blockbuster, not an arthouse film. And whilst sometimes you can do artful things in a blockbuster context, ultimately they're all about finding something which appeals to the broadest audience the premise can accommodate.
If you want to have the artistic freedom to make brave, controversial decisions which stand a risk of alienating your audience, you want to be working in artsy indie games, not in AAA releases.
#2000
Posté 04 avril 2012 - 12:00
CaribbeanCLANK
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SalsaDMA wrote...
CaribbeanCLANK wrote...
Sorry Dr. Ray Muzyka...but the ME team needs to admitt they screwed up.
I think the problem isn't that the team "screwed up", but rather that they most likely did precisely what they were told to do.
Maybe you are right...and if this is the case then this "Art" arguement is complete garbage. Why let outside influences (EA) change your artistic vision?
