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To BioWare, your response towards Retake, and how it is clear that you are not Listening.


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#1
Stygian1

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 First off, if you haven't read this: http://blog.bioware....012/03/21/4108/   I'd recommend that you do.

So when I first saw that BioWare had officially responded to its fans, I thought "wow maybe you guys really are listening, maybe you actually want to fix this for the fans. Maybe you actually see that your ending was truely ill-planned and overall inept at bringing a close to such a gripping story." 

Then.... well then I read the response. I was disapointed to say the least. 

First, I'll point out the positives that I took from this response:

   1. BioWare, you are listening enough to be AWARE that we hate the ending. Which, to be honest, I think a deaf man in a coma would be aware of by this point.

    2. BioWare, you are willing to tie yourself to an official statement, and in that statement you make it clear that not only will you address the flaws of the ending, but you are willing to work on it.

Now, here is what I found infuriating about this response: 

    1. BioWare seems to think, or at least say, that what we are all angry about is that the ending didn't provide enough closure. Heh. 

     "Building on their research, Exec Producer Casey Hudson and the team are hard at work on a number of game content initiatives that will help answer the questions, providing more clarity for those seeking further closure to their journey."

  We don't just want closure! I mean to say the least, yeah most of us do want closure. But, one of our biggest complaints is that your ending is riddled with plot holes, ill-placed themes, deus ex machina cliche scenarios and above all that the ending takes away all choice from the players and turns their hero into a mindless drone and slave to the very beings he has fought so hard against. We don't want closure to an ending like this, we want closure to an ending we love, to an ending that after we finish we can put down the control and do a fist pump in the air (kinda like in ME1&2). We want a range of outcomes, good and bad, and above all we want our choices to matter--which in this current ending they are basically worth a morning constitutional... 

    2. BioWare seems to think that most people love this game. 

    "However, most folks appear to agree that the game as a whole is exceptional, with more than 75 critics giving it a perfect review score and a review average in the mid-90s. Net, I’m proud of the team, but we can and must always strive to do better."

     Yeah.... have you checked ANY player or consumer ratings? I mean really how more obvious could it be that the majority of people purchasing you game rate it one star! (Look on amazon fyi, or any other website that sells ME3 and you shall see my point). I will say this though, BioWare, you did a great, no a fantastic job on this game. You made me fall into this awesome universe even more. The gameplay was great, the story was superb. I couldn't set down the controler. But, that ending, the ending alone (5 minutes) is what is turning your game from a 5 star GOTY to a 1 star piece of poo. It literally sucks the life out of the entire franchise. 

I'm losing faith in your capability to address these issues BioWAre. I am aware I am only one person, but I am also aware that I have been a faithful customer for many years. I have poured every ounce of myself into this series--but I can't and won't follow you anymore if you don't respond to the outcry of not "some of our loyal fans" but almost ALL of your fans.

Listen BioWare, just see that we don't want to fight you. We just want you to see this from our perspective. What you created in the last five minutes of ME3 was a shiver of a brush stroke that ruined a well concieved portrait. That is not art, that is a mistake, a mistake that can be righted. We don't just want closure, we want an ending that is as beautiful and artistic as the rest of this magnificent series.

/end rant. 

(first thread ever, sorry if I got a little impassioned.) :?

Modifié par Stygian1, 21 mars 2012 - 04:15 .


#2
Stygian1

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single bump :P

#3
Tequila Man

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*snip*


Well said.

#4
JohnnyG

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Holding the line!

#5
Stygian1

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Tequila Man wrote...

*snip*


Well said.


Thanks, I just really needed to make this topic because I was feeling pretty irritated by their response. :unsure:

#6
nomoredruggs

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Well, to be fair, he has to defend Bioware as well...

#7
Stygian1

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nomoredruggs wrote...

Well, to be fair, he has to defend Bioware as well...



No I understand that, I just wish he would look at our complaints and address what we actually are saying. 

I do see that he is in a bad spot though. 

#8
v0rt3x22

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1. BioWare, you are listening enough to be AWARE that we hate the ending. Which, to be honest, I think a deaf man in a coma would be aware of by this point

 

:lol:

#9
Adanu

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You got a statement, and a request to be patient, and you people are still going on?

Wow. Talk about entitled.

#10
dbl219

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Very well put. I'm planning to write a response later on why the review scores don't matter.

#11
g0dhax0rz

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Stygian1 wrote...

 I will say this though, BioWare, you did a great, no a fantastic job on this game. You made me fall into this awesome universe even more. The gameplay was great, the story was superb. I couldn't set down the controler. But, that ending, the ending alone (5 minutes) is what is turning your game from a 5 star GOTY to a 1 star piece of poo. It literally sucks the life out of the entire franchise.


The game WAS that amazing. Which is what makes the ending that much more insulting. The least amount of effort was put into the most important part of the entire series. That ending was the parting note that was supposed to send us all off, and we more or less got pushed off a cliff.

#12
dbl219

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Adanu wrote...

You got a statement, and a request to be patient, and you people are still going on?

Wow. Talk about entitled.


Did you even read the original post?

The OP took issue with the fact that what Dr. Muzyka addressed in his response was only an infinitesimal fraction of the problem most players have with the ending, which creates a fear that BioWare is still fully unaware of what has made its fans so incensed.

It's a perfectly valid post.  Go troll somewhere else.

#13
Stygian1

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g0dhax0rz wrote...

The game WAS that amazing. Which is what makes the ending that much more insulting. The least amount of effort was put into the most important part of the entire series. That ending was the parting note that was supposed to send us all off, and we more or less got pushed off a cliff.


I know. It amazes me they were so surprised by this backlash as well, I mean did they have any game testers? 

#14
2484Stryker

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I understand why you take problem with what he said, but again, he can't exactly come out and admit that they royally screwed up the ending and thereby screwed up the game itself.

He has stockholders to keep happy and a company to keep afloat.

Provided that he delivers on a true fix to the ending, I'm willing to overlook what was implied & said.

#15
Baronesa

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Well said, indeed

#16
Verkir

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Adanu wrote...

You got a statement, and a request to be patient, and you people are still going on?

Wow. Talk about entitled.


We got another statement telling us paid off review sites and the minority were happy and if you are that upset don't fret! more DLC is on the way to bring "closure'


I never thought I'd see such a hideously disgused way of telling us that "lmao you are going to PAY for the end of the game!"

#17
Neuthung

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Stygian1 wrote...

 First off, if you haven't read this: http://blog.bioware....012/03/21/4108/   I'd recommend that you do.

So when I first saw that BioWare had officially responded to its fans, I thought "wow maybe you guys really are listening, maybe you actually want to fix this for the fans. Maybe you actually see that your ending was truely ill-planned and overall inept at bringing a close to such a gripping story." 

Then.... well then I read the response. I was disapointed to say the least. 

First, I'll point out the positives that I took from this response:

   1. BioWare, you are listening enough to be AWARE that we hate the ending. Which, to be honest, I think a deaf man in a coma would be aware of by this point.

    2. BioWare, you are willing to tie yourself to an official statement, and in that statement you make it clear that not only will you address the flaws of the ending, but you are willing to work on it.

Now, here is what I found infuriating about this response: 

    1. BioWare seems to think, or at least say, that what we are all angry about is that the ending didn't provide enough closure. Heh. 

     "Building on their research, Exec Producer Casey Hudson and the team are hard at work on a number of game content initiatives that will help answer the questions, providing more clarity for those seeking further closure to their journey."

  We don't just want closure! I mean to say the least, yeah most of us do want closure. But, one of our biggest complaints is that your ending is riddled with plot holes, ill-placed themes, deus ex machina cliche scenarios and above all that the ending takes away all choice from the players and turns their hero into a mindless drone and slave to the very beings he has fought so hard against. We don't want closure to an ending like this, we want closure to an ending we love, to an ending that after we finish we can put down the control and do a fist pump in the air (kinda like in ME1&2). We want a range of outcomes, good and bad, and above all we want our choices to matter--which in this current ending they are basically worth a morning constitutional... 

    2. BioWare seems to think that most people love this game. 

    "However, most folks appear to agree that the game as a whole is exceptional, with more than 75 critics giving it a perfect review score and a review average in the mid-90s. Net, I’m proud of the team, but we can and must always strive to do better."

     Yeah.... have you checked ANY player or consumer ratings? I mean really how more obvious could it be that the majority of people purchasing you game rate it one star! (Look on amazon fyi, or any other website that sells ME3 and you shall see my point). I will say this though, BioWare, you did a great, no a fantastic job on this game. You made me fall into this awesome universe even more. The gameplay was great, the story was superb. I couldn't set down the controler. But, that ending, the ending alone (5 minutes) is what is turning your game from a 5 star GOTY to a 1 star piece of poo. It literally sucks the life out of the entire franchise. 

I'm losing faith in your capability to address these issues BioWAre. I am aware I am only one person, but I am also aware that I have been a faithful customer for many years. I have poured every ounce of myself into this series--but I can't and won't follow you anymore if you don't respond to the outcry of not "some of our loyal fans" but almost ALL of your fans.

Listen BioWare, just see that we don't want to fight you. We just want you to see this from our perspective. What you created in the last five minutes of ME3 was a shiver of a brush stroke that ruined a well concieved portrait. That is not art, that is a mistake, a mistake that can be righted. We don't just want closure, we want an ending that is as beautiful and artistic as the rest of this magnificent series.

/end rant. 

(first thread ever, sorry if I got a little impassioned.) :?



I'm all for the Retake movement, and I was disatisfied with the endings. But DO NOT DARE use childish review bombing over the ending as an arguing point, that's the "destructive" behavior he was talking about. This game is far better than one ****ing star, and you damn well know it. Yes I want more options and closure in my ending, but that isn't a legitimate way to get it.

#18
Isu

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Adanu wrote...

You got a statement, and a request to be patient, and you people are still going on?

Wow. Talk about entitled.


Obvious troll is obvious.

#19
Stygian1

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2484Stryker wrote...

I understand why you take problem with what he said, but again, he can't exactly come out and admit that they royally screwed up the ending and thereby screwed up the game itself.

He has stockholders to keep happy and a company to keep afloat.

Provided that he delivers on a true fix to the ending, I'm willing to overlook what was implied & said.


This is true, I guess they can say anything they want (provided its not too insulting) as long as they actually address the problems the ending has when the time comes. 

#20
Stygian1

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Neuthung wrote...

I'm all for the Retake movement, and I was disatisfied with the endings. But DO NOT DARE use childish review bombing over the ending as an arguing point, that's the "destructive" behavior he was talking about. This game is far better than one ****ing star, and you damn well know it. Yes I want more options and closure in my ending, but that isn't a legitimate way to get it.


I see where you are coming from, but the reviews on Amazon are mostly (from what I can tell) reviews by everyday joes who loved the series yet hated the ending. I know it is sad that it is getting those kind of reviews, and for the most part the game doesn't deserve them, but the reviews do show a large demographic wasn't happy with the ending. So that was where my point lay. 

#21
Darthlawsuit

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Hold the line!

#22
scq

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Yes, most critics of the ending do want more than just closure, but I will also agree with Ray that most people do love the game. I loved the game though I did not like the ending. Up until that, it was a spectacular achievement. User ratings are full of trolls and whiney "fans" who would readily one-star anything. It's not to say that it doesn't mean anything—just that it's not a very reliable indicator of how well or poorly received a game is. You may question the validity of professional reviewers, and you may even imagine the sorts of biases they may be subject to, but customer reviews are subject to their own biases which make those assessments equally if not in many cases, more unreliable.

I agree that the official statement is more of just an elaborated repeat of the "we are listening" statement. Some people here will not ever be happy until they get the exact ending they wanted and a hand delivered apology from a tearful Casey Hudson at their doorstep begging for forgiveness, but realistically, I think we should take this as a positive sign.

#23
Adanu

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Isu wrote...

Adanu wrote...

You got a statement, and a request to be patient, and you people are still going on?

Wow. Talk about entitled.


Obvious troll is obvious.


YOu want trolling? Take a look at the last two weeks in this forum with the massive flame wars.

Me? I'm pointing out the pointless anger here. Of COURSE it's going to have some PR in it... It's half addressing, and half PR for the rest of the world. People here need a reality check.

So, In closing to you: **** off.

Modifié par Adanu, 21 mars 2012 - 04:33 .


#24
Zulufoxtrot

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They listen but they do not hear. Hold the line.

#25
Stygian1

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Adanu wrote...

YOu want trolling? Take a look at the last two weeks in this forum with the massive flame wars.

Me? I'm pointing out the pointless anger here. Of COURSE it's going to have some PR in it... It's half addressing, and half PR for the rest of the world. People here need a reality check.

So, In closing to you: **** off.


You seem angrier than anyone else here brah, maybe you should take a chill pill. :wizard: