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Rot in the Black City Alistair!!!!


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#51
Lotion Soronarr

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Recidiva wrote...
No, he doesn't mind sleeping with you.  But asking other people to be polite to you?  Or say...making a law about because he's...say...KING?  Too much to ask.  Not willing to fight for you in any way.  


In Ferelden a king doesn't have a bsolute power. Actualyl nowhere in history IIRC.
Rebellions have been waged against kings and the Landsmeet is a clear iundication that Allistair can't just order any law he wants. He has to have enough support from the nobility. It's politics.

And you're mad because you can't have the perfectest ending ofhtem all?

#52
Riona45

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Recidiva wrote...
You can call it brattiness and tantrum.  I consider it passion and the result of being betrayed in such an unexpected and unanticipated manner.  The unwillingness to accept the loss of true love or seeing that the love you thought was true was only a convenient happenstance, to be discarded when no longer convenient.  The complete unwillingness to accept that outcome, no matter how pragmatic or "reasonable."  Because love isn't reasonable and that character loved Alistair without reservation.


But again...don't you kind of bring that on yourself when you insist on making Alistair king when he repeatedly tells you he doesn't want it?  In that situation, it kinda was you who wronged him first by not respecting his wishes.  I understand *not* wanting Anora to be queen, but is your *not* wanting her to be queen stronger than your desire for Alistair to be happy and not be forced to breakup with the woman he loves?  If you convince Alistair that being king is his DUTY, he's not going to do it halfway.

#53
Lianaar

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Recidiva wrote...
Roleplay construction of a character is a different thing, and in order to make an INTERESTING character that's going to respond differently to game situations, I think you need to make it interesting, have weaknesses and flaws.  The makers of the game got this when they constructed every party member available have a fatal flaw and an irrevocable purpose and a crisis point or two.

Totally agree here.

#54
Taleroth

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Malaia wrote...

 So first play through I was an elf, totally enamored of Alistair. I twinkled down to my little toes every time he kissed me. I marveled at his rose, I got goosebumps during our romantic ---ahem---night. I giggled at his talks with everyone.. and made him king and he DUMPED ME!!!

The racist jerk DUMPED ME!!!


So I made a human noble, romanced him again, romanced zevran, DUMPED AListair, slept with Zev, did the deed with him like 80 times in one night, right next to Alistair! (secretly hoping his disapproval went down with every roll in the hay). Then I went to Denerim, recruited Loghain, made Anora queen, gave the finger to Alistair as he threw his tantrum and ran off, giggled in delight while I ran off with Zevran to live happily ever after.

Take that you prig!:devil:

There there.  There there.  Alistair shouldn't have treated you that way.

I'm here for you.

#55
Recidiva

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In Ferelden a king doesn't have a bsolute power. Actualyl nowhere in history IIRC.
Rebellions have been waged against kings and the Landsmeet is a clear iundication that Allistair can't just order any law he wants. He has to have enough support from the nobility. It's politics.

And you're mad because you can't have the perfectest ending ofhtem all?


I'm not mad in the least.  I'm playing an awesome game that lets me create different stories according to my whim.

I find it funny that people are irritated that I'm not saving Ferelden enough for their tastes.  Y'all DO know it's not real, right? 

#56
Bali_of_Terenas

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And to think Wynne saw it all coming (I assume she has the "love vs duty" speech when you romance Alistar)

#57
Lotion Soronarr

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Recidiva wrote...

Right.  So my character gets that.  She doesn't have to accept it just to get to the end of that game.  All motivation for killing darkspawn is gone and she's now willing and happy to watch Denerim burn, and every single candidate to the monarchy with it.  Scorched ground is now fine with me.


So your character gets reality, but doesn't accept it? I fail to see your point.

If your character at any point hoped to be queen, she was deluding herself BIG TIME. Allistair is not to blame here.

But then again, if you're playing a psycho character, then any reaction is pretty much justified.

#58
Recidiva

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But again...don't you kind of bring that on yourself when you insist on making Alistair king when he repeatedly tells you he doesn't want it?  In that situation, it kinda was you who wronged him first by not respecting his wishes.  I understand *not* wanting Anora to be queen, but is your *not* wanting her to be queen stronger than your desire for Alistair to be happy and not be forced to breakup with the woman he loves?  If you convince Alistair that being king is his DUTY, he's not going to do it halfway.


Of COURSE I bring it on myself.  That's the entire point of playing a game.  Volunteering for fictional conflict.

#59
Recidiva

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Bali_of_Terenas wrote...

And to think Wynne saw it all coming (I assume she has the "love vs duty" speech when you romance Alistar)


If there's a disaster, Wynne knows it's coming.   Who the hell DIDN'T know everything was going to be a disaster?

Isn't that why I ignore all the text options that say any variation of asking any NPC "Is it dangerous?" or "Are we in danger?"

And every NPC gives their version of rolleyes and DUH.

Of course you're in danger, you moron.  Of course there's risk and death and horror and betrayal and...geeez.

#60
Bhatair

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Recidiva wrote...

In Ferelden a king doesn't have a bsolute power. Actualyl nowhere in history IIRC.
Rebellions have been waged against kings and the Landsmeet is a clear iundication that Allistair can't just order any law he wants. He has to have enough support from the nobility. It's politics.

And you're mad because you can't have the perfectest ending ofhtem all?


I'm not mad in the least.  I'm playing an awesome game that lets me create different stories according to my whim.

I find it funny that people are irritated that I'm not saving Ferelden enough for their tastes.  Y'all DO know it's not real, right? 


I thought we were just having a spirited roleplay discussion :P

#61
Lianaar

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After many threads that has mixed OOC and IG feelings it was not clear at first that you are talking as a character in your initial post and not as a player. It does read differently after that clarification :)

I didn't try the city elf origin yet, I expect that to be the most emotionally engaging and thus I left it for the last.

My human noble is filled with rage, certainly. She wants blood and on her hand. Howe's first only to be sprinkled with Loghain's and if any offspring of Loghain happens to pass in the way, all the batter. Not to mention Howe's son and other family members as well as any living relatives, no matter how distant. Making Anora a king is out of question. Not only is she but a creepy commoner that got to be queen by lying with the king, thus no better then a **** in my char's eyes, but she is blood relative of the traitor who caused the PC's kings and families death.

Not to mention that being a noble means for her too that blood relation is very important. Thus Alistair must be king, even if it means parting for ever. No way will she allow Morrigan to carry that blood in her dirty body. Not to mention that the goal is to kill the soul from that blood and let an ex-archdemon possess!!! that body. That is like stealing a kingdom!

#62
Recidiva

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Bhatair wrote...

I thought we were just having a spirited roleplay discussion :P


Damn, missed my chance to argue some more.  Losing my touch.

Volunteering for fictional conflict again, send me in, coach!

#63
Bali_of_Terenas

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I do find it funny that your character basically did exactly what Alistar himself does if you pardon Logain. "Won't go my way on this? Fine, have fun fighting the Blight without me"

#64
Taleroth

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Recidiva wrote...

Volunteering for fictional conflict again, send me in, coach!

Alistair is a whimp.

#65
Xeyska

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Eh, don't leave him "soft" the next time. :P

Modifié par Xeyska, 30 novembre 2009 - 06:41 .


#66
Taleroth

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Xeyska wrote...

Eh, don't leave him "soft" the next time. :P

Dangit, you editted before I could make a point.

#67
Recidiva

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Lianaar wrote...

After many threads that has mixed OOC and IG feelings it was not clear at first that you are talking as a character in your initial post and not as a player. It does read differently after that clarification :)
I didn't try the city elf origin yet, I expect that to be the most emotionally engaging and thus I left it for the last.
My human noble is filled with rage, certainly. She wants blood and on her hand. Howe's first only to be sprinkled with Loghain's and if any offspring of Loghain happens to pass in the way, all the batter. Not to mention Howe's son and other family members as well as any living relatives, no matter how distant. Making Anora a king is out of question. Not only is she but a creepy commoner that got to be queen by lying with the king, thus no better then a **** in my char's eyes, but she is blood relative of the traitor who caused the PC's kings and families death.
Not to mention that being a noble means for her too that blood relation is very important. Thus Alistair must be king, even if it means parting for ever. No way will she allow Morrigan to carry that blood in her dirty body. Not to mention that the goal is to kill the soul from that blood and let an ex-archdemon possess!!! that body. That is like stealing a kingdom!


Oooooh.  Well, that makes sense.  Try the city elf opener as a female and then get back to me.  It does make a difference.

And I'm sorry for the pronoun difficulty, if you need to clarify I or me or my PC or whatever.  Don't take that as an inability for me to separate the things in my head, they're very separate.  I don't confuse the two and I don't want to disappear into Ferelden with Alistair or get revenge.  This is purely a fiction conceit and I sort of move back and forth between "thinking" like the character and "thinking" like myself and both use the pronoun "I" to describe themselves.

The ONLY thing I (as a player) want is for Alistair to be on the roof, in love with me, and for me to punch him once so he lets me take the final blow.  Breaks my heart every time he refuses to let me die.  But my husband approves.  He says he wouldn't let me die either and that's romantic and wonderful, but I have YET to get the eulogy yet because I can't get Alistair to let me because he loves me too much.  So creating other problems to solve is a hobby.  Yes, I've done the ritual.  I've been the queen, I've been the elven Chancellor, I've survived and all that.  But I have YET to get the stupid tin can to listen to me on the roof.  So there you have it.  Since I'm convinced I can't now, it just means I do another play through as a human female noble rogue (my favorite, i've finished the game twice with that setup and I enjoy it the most) and leave him at the gates because he won't listen to reason.

I have a tough time accepting that I can't sacrifice myself because Alistair loves me.  A tough time.  Several replays through of very tough time.  Come to find out my husband wouldn't let me do it either, that just brings up all sorta questions about the nature of love and what you can and cannot do when people are that much in love.  I'm sorta stuck on why I can't die just 'cause I'm a girl.  All the men find it manly to not let his woman fall in battle and I find it womanly to not let my man fall in battle, particulary if Anora's the one who lives after that and I want to scratch her obnoxious eyes out.

The ultimate issue that comes down to it is - why is that true because I'm a girl?  Why can only men be martyrs?  Why not women?  It's either a deep truth about the nature of love or a sexist conceit and I'm not sure which and probably both and I'm still thinking about it.  But I'm also convinced my own husband would do the same and that in itself is disturbing, because then I'd be alone and angry.  Romantically tragic apparently suits me, but I'd prefer to be the one leaving a good looking corpse.  It's not that I don't appreciate the gesture, it's just that I appreciate it so much I want to do it myself.

Even in the mage starting game, Cullen has a crush on my female mage, confesses his infatuation in the tower and then in the epilogue if you don't side with the templars, snaps and goes on a homicidal rampage in the tower and gets himself killed.  Oh come on, I'm the death of Cullen, too?  

But every time I go through the game, I'm trying to keep my mate whole and alive.  And it makes me sad as a player that I can't do that at least once by good means by some dint of gameplaying genius or high cunning.  But that's the way it goes and it's just something I'm chewing on as a person and as a player and when I've figured it all out, I'll go do something else.

I have yet to decide if that's a sexist or racist or whatever real vibe or a veiled jab at the nature of men or women or love or what it is.  I have yet to decide lots of things and multiple replays let me determine which bits of the story are misleading, badly written, beautifully written, bull or gold.

#68
Malaia

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Ohh don't you stick up for that racist self righteous prig of a man. I don't care how sexy his accent is or how smoothe that rose-giving was!

He said he loved me despite my being an elf! He didn't have to make me queen but he certainly didn't have to break up with me, or make me his dalliance!

And before anyone brings up the fact that two grey wardens can't have children, he sure overlooks that fact with the HUMAN NOBLE.

That is what makes him a racist!

And I had to choose him as king, I had no idea at the time he was a racist prig, I thought I was choosing the right king who would change things! He could have damn well made me noble, I freakin earned it btw!

Well no matter. I'm starting a petition for the expansion pack to have the "moment in tavern" scene where I get to sanctimoniously fire random shots of lightening at his boots, set his hair on fire and stab him with large dull sticks (they go in harder!).



For now I'm going to watch that ending and plot what I'll do to Anora after she thwarted the elves in the Alienage. I'm thinking my little elf lifemate or my super bff Leliana can do some assasinating!



*fume*

#69
Recidiva

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Bali_of_Terenas wrote...

I do find it funny that your character basically did exactly what Alistar himself does if you pardon Logain. "Won't go my way on this? Fine, have fun fighting the Blight without me"


Hah!  See how you like it.  I can be an uncompromisingly constructed character too.  Neener neener neeeeener.

The irony is not lost on me in the least.

#70
Taleroth

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You can cry on my shoulder if you'd like.

#71
Recidiva

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Taleroth wrote...

Alistair is a whimp.


Alistair is a bottom looking for a top.  Who then picks several moments in the game to go whackadoo.

I'm agreeing with you.  Blew it again!

#72
ReubenLiew

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Your tears of anguish consoles my elf hating heart.

There is indeed good in this world.

You go, Alistair my man, you the man.

#73
Malkut

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Malaia wrote...

 So first play through I was an elf, totally enamored of Alistair. I twinkled down to my little toes every time he kissed me. I marveled at his rose, I got goosebumps during our romantic ---ahem---night. I giggled at his talks with everyone.. and made him king and he DUMPED ME!!!

The racist jerk DUMPED ME!!!


Good.  That'll teach you to use somebody in a cynical attempt to grasp personal power for yourself.

He should do this to human nobles in most cases. too.

#74
Taleroth

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Recidiva wrote...

Taleroth wrote...

Alistair is a whimp.


Alistair is a bottom looking for a top.  Who then picks several moments in the game to go whackadoo.

I'm agreeing with you.  Blew it again!

Apparently you're too weak for conflict.  You should probably give up.  Save yourself some hassle.

#75
Recidiva

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Taleroth wrote...

Apparently you're too weak for conflict.  You should probably give up.  Save yourself some hassle.


Yes, that's always been my problem.  So soft hearted and vulnerable.  An easy mark.  Soooo easy.  People just let their guard down around me because they just don't need it.  Little old me, how could I be a threat.  I wouldn't even know how.