418 réponses à ce sujet

[Legendaryred]

Plus bringing the argument of what happened with Jennifer that's a whole different issue. She stated many things that go against what playing a game is. She pretty much said she doesn't enjoy the medium she works on and as a result people got a crappy DA2 since she was senior writing i believe.

[HenchxNarf]

Alpha revan wrote...

What people fail to realize... Is there are people NOT with the group who LIKE the ending making death threats and harassing the people who want the ending changed... There are fanatics and ****s no matter where you look,

I have never seen a death threat coming from someone that was pro-ending. But there are some bad ones on both sides, yes.

[Erield]

HenchxNarf wrote...

Oakenshield1 wrote...

I have no guilt whatsoever bashing individual BioWare staff. If they were directly responsible for the ending and personally advertised about the ending, they deserved to be called out as individuals.

Great way to represent humanity there, dude.

[Name Removed] specifically saying that there would be no A,B,C ending, and then there being a literal A,B,C ending deserves to be called out.  If I were to say, "Here, try this drink, it's definitely not urine," and then you drank it only to find out it was urine--would you be like, "Oh man, great job!"

Issuing threats, reading any more into it than what he said and what happened, etc. is going to far--but for that specific action/reaction?  Yes.

[izmirtheastarach]

HenchxNarf wrote...

Um. No.

You donated to prove a point, not because of the charity itself.

I donate several hundred dollars to Child's Play every year. Seemed like it made sense to do so now. I certainly would not have donated a random charity, but I think most of us were already aware of Child's Play.

In the end though, what you think is not all that important. The charity gets a boost, and that's all that matters, really.

Modifié par izmirtheastarach, 22 mars 2012 - 02:43 .

[Gowienczyk]

HenchxNarf wrote...

Desteron wrote...

Frankly I don't think this community sucks especially the people who put in the money for the child's play charity. If anything this speaks to our integrity.

Um. No.

You donated to prove a point, not because of the charity itself.

As a form of peaceful protest.

[Oakenshield1]

defenestrated wrote...

Oakenshield1 wrote...

I have no guilt whatsoever bashing individual BioWare staff. If they were directly responsible for the ending and personally advertised about the ending, they deserved to be called out as individuals.

Bash the content, not the person.

There's a way to do both. "Hey, Casey. Your endin sucks." Casey falsely advertised the ending and had direct control over it. He deserves the flak. Taking it too far would be, "Hey Casey your ending sucks. Why don't you just chop off your fingers since you're not going to be typing any good stories with them any way?" That's too far.

[Alpha revan]

HenchxNarf wrote...

Alpha revan wrote...

What people fail to realize... Is there are people NOT with the group who LIKE the ending making death threats and harassing the people who want the ending changed... There are fanatics and ****s no matter where you look,

I have never seen a death threat coming from someone that was pro-ending. But there are some bad ones on both sides, yes.

A few people have come by the demand facebook saying we all need to be shot, and so on. Like i said, there are ****s no matter where you look.

[Killermonkey007]

Am I the only one who read the first post, a few following ones and wondered how this thread was allowed to not be locked/deleted? I mean a person creates a thread, insulting a significant amount of the people who frequent the forum, and is basically inviting a fight. Not sure where the mods are on this, but I can promise you that nothing good will come from this thread if it is allowed to continue to go on for much longer.

[shirobuta]

Aweus wrote...

You are both right and wrong. Right about the fact that there are trolls here and some of their actions are disgusting. Wrong about making them equal with entire community or RME. There are rotten apples on both sides. I agree that whoever is making personal attacks on Bioware employes should just get banned. I would ban them myself. But presence of those trolls is not invalidating the entire RME movement. Same as presence of trolls attacking RME does not invalidate opinion of people who liked the ending.

yep

[izmirtheastarach]

I'm still not sure what the issue is here. I've not seen one single threat, and aside from a few trolls making ridiculous statements, the discourse has been as civil as can be expected. What people say on twitter is another thing entirely, but there has been no need for mass banning on the BSN, which I'd expect to see if things were as bad as some people seem to be claiming.

[HenchxNarf]

Alpha revan wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...

Alpha revan wrote...

What people fail to realize... Is there are people NOT with the group who LIKE the ending making death threats and harassing the people who want the ending changed... There are fanatics and ****s no matter where you look,

I have never seen a death threat coming from someone that was pro-ending. But there are some bad ones on both sides, yes.

A few people have come by the demand facebook saying we all need to be shot, and so on. Like i said, there are ****s no matter where you look.

Ah, well. I don't have facebook so I didn't know that.

That's messed up.

[Neural73]

shirobuta wrote...

Aweus wrote...

You are both right and wrong. Right about the fact that there are trolls here and some of their actions are disgusting. Wrong about making them equal with entire community or RME. There are rotten apples on both sides. I agree that whoever is making personal attacks on Bioware employes should just get banned. I would ban them myself. But presence of those trolls is not invalidating the entire RME movement. Same as presence of trolls attacking RME does not invalidate opinion of people who liked the ending.

yep

Exactly

[avmf8]

I have said they should own up to it and said they were liars. But I would never actually threaten them. I would not say they should hurt or kill them something that is going to far. Calling them liars is not too far its true.

They said no A B C ending and that is exactly what it was. So based on the definition of the world liar they fit under it.

[izmirtheastarach]

Dark DJ wrote...

Never understood the death threats crap. Really where does it get anyone besides looking like a pompous a**?

 

Jail, maybe?

Modifié par izmirtheastarach, 22 mars 2012 - 02:49 .

[Byrdman]

DemGeth wrote...

Byrdman wrote...

Unfortunately, any movement which is not organized from the beginning and lacks central leadership suffers from not being able to control the actions of its members. This is equally concerning when membership in a group/movement is based on one just claiming they are a part of it, and not say a registered member. While my signature makes it obvious I'm of the ending hating flavor, I have a few points about this whole debacle (both sides).

1. A couple of bad apples make everyone look bad. This applies to both sides. Some Re-Takers are really pushing the limits of even trolling, and are making the movement look awful. This is partially because there's no way to keep them in line or control what they say, since this isn't something you join by applying. One of Re-take (and other ... occupying..... ) movements strengths is anyone can say they're apart of it and voice their opinion. Its also one of its weaknesses. Personal attacks against the mods and Bioware staff need to stop. We wont get anywhere with it. I don't mean to let up on the pressure, but telling them to kill themselves is not ok. Disparaging remarks wont get them or anyone else on our side. We have to say civil and respectful. I know its hard, emotions are running high, and we've got everyone from forum trolls to IGN reviewers I've never heard of or cared about calling us out, trying to get us to lose our cool, and if we give them what they want we'll crash and burn. Don't be the guy/gal that stands up in the middle of a peaceful sit in and throws the Molotov cocktail.

However, this doesn't mean this is only one sided. In every thread I read, the pro-ending folks have about the same ratio of of crazy, hateful speech spewing people as well. Both sides have personal attacks, condescension, and a lack of civility. This isn't a one way street, and both sides need to chill the frak out with respect to each other. I partially think its just trolls on both sides, but I'm not so optimistic. I get it, you guys like the ending. We don't. You can keep your ending, please let us have ours. I promise we can have ice cream later (I wont, cause I'm lactose intolerant, but I'll let you enjoy yours).

2. The current press releases that have been fed to us over the last couple of days tend to come off with a bit of condescension. Now granted I think its just because its PR speak and they have to cover themselves, and constantly reminding us that the game got all the perfect reviews during each one makes it seem as though they're not really intended for the fans, but more the press watching, which makes it feel as though we ultimately aren't important. You have to remember Bioware, we were your "best friends" 16 days ago, and I want nothing more to once again have a friend in you. I'd love to reup my SWTOR subscription and buy tons of DLC (not ending changing dlc, that imo should be free) for ME3 and the ones I missed for ME2 and play through them. I'd even go back to looking forward to DA3 again. But each time I'm told that I'm part of a vocal minority and you got a bunch of perfect scores it seems belittling. Please don't do that, I want to like you and give you all my video game money again (I'm not being sarcastic here, I even told friends to join SWTOR because it was your game, and you could always be trusted). I get that you need to be upbeat about your game because, well, you have to sell it and make money. But your strongest allies ever are us. We're your core. We pre-ordered your games, stayed up late on a work night (I had to get up at 4am the next day for work, still managed to play 3 hours of ME3 after the midnight release).

3. Hold the line. With the current press release, a lot of threads have been saying that "Well, we won." We haven't, but we are putting cracks in the wall. Each new statement is a little more ground gained, but until we have a statement with a timeline, actual information about a plan, or some other concrete news, we can't ease up. Pressure isn't the same as assault. We have to keep it civil and push for what we want. If we can just keep it civil, they wont be able to ignore us. Our call to action is Hold the Line, because we can't falter, we can't back down, we can't be dishonorable.

Thats just my thoughts.

Actually I suggested several times that re-takers mobilize outside of Bio forums.  that'd be an enviornemnt you could control.  Than you could employ a directed, impactful message.

Ofcourse that got turned into you want us to leave blah blah.  

Thats a good idea, and I'd support that myself.  However, being that its still unorganized in the broad sense, even if we got most of the hardcore retakers to join you on that site, people claiming to be apart of the movement could still troll here.  Its unfortunate side effect of not having card carrying members, but I'd support your idea if you did it.  PM if you do set it up, and I'll be glad to join up.

[Alpha revan]

Dark DJ wrote...

Never understood the death threats crap. Really where does it get anyone besides looking like a pompous a**?

They get to stroke their E-peen and make someone else misserable, or invoke a fight. Yes some Anti-ending people get too worked up and act insane, being ****s, etc... But the Pro-ending bunch is no better, some of them have been harassing us on the demand fb since the issue went viral...

Modifié par Alpha revan, 22 mars 2012 - 02:52 .

[jvara]

You know it gets me sick the way people are just more oftenly getting the notion that big companies own their products in an uncontestable way, and I cannot ever in my ****ing entire life witnessed such ****ing bull****. Property both private or intelectual should have, ALWAYS, a social importance and protection, one person, be him the owner of whatever property it is, shoulg not be allowed to destroy it or use it in a way that harms a larger goup of his own society or others around him. This may sound stupid to some, but it protects other peoples, customers, tenants, whatever you may call them, from their rights being harmed but those with more power or money than theirs, it protects everyones right to a proper house by not allowing it's owner to demolish it without a proper reason or waste its usage, it SHOULD and in many countries does, protects everyones free access to culture by allowing the right to private copy, to quotation, etc ... Bioware's rights over their intelectual property ends where our right to recieve a proper product starts, if you people can't see this simple truth, then you're as good as ****ing puppets to those with more money or more power than you and sickens the **** out of me. People with this kind of ideas aren't worth the breath it ****ing takes to get them straight.

[defenestrated]

Oakenshield1 wrote...

defenestrated wrote...

Oakenshield1 wrote...

I have no guilt whatsoever bashing individual BioWare staff. If they were directly responsible for the ending and personally advertised about the ending, they deserved to be called out as individuals.

Bash the content, not the person.

There's a way to do both. "Hey, Casey. Your endin sucks." Casey falsely advertised the ending and had direct control over it. He deserves the flak. Taking it too far would be, "Hey Casey your ending sucks. Why don't you just chop off your fingers since you're not going to be typing any good stories with them any way?" That's too far.

By "content" I meant both game content and public statements. Attack the inconsistencies but don't go ad hominem.

[Ultra Prism]

If you work for company that tell lies to customer what to expect and doesn't live to promise, I feel cheated, i spent my hard earned money on a game that went to straight hell in last 10 minutes, I believe I have the right to be angry about it.

This may explain why Christina Norman left ...

[ShepardTheHopeful]

Despite everything they're more than likely to make some move. This was a big game for them and a lot of the important feedback is good. At the end of the day though all that matters is Bioware, EA, and the finished project. There's nothing else we can really do of course we should voice our opinions I just don't see what threats and lawsuits have to do with it. People are trying way too hard. At the end of the day the threat of losing a large fan base which also means a large income is much more powerful than any angry reaction could have. They will more than likely change it and I'd rather have my head up high when they do it rather than feel like a jerk about it.

[iamthedave3]

HenchxNarf wrote...

Alpha revan wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...

Alpha revan wrote...

What people fail to realize... Is there are people NOT with the group who LIKE the ending making death threats and harassing the people who want the ending changed... There are fanatics and ****s no matter where you look,

I have never seen a death threat coming from someone that was pro-ending. But there are some bad ones on both sides, yes.

A few people have come by the demand facebook saying we all need to be shot, and so on. Like i said, there are ****s no matter where you look.

Ah, well. I don't have facebook so I didn't know that.

That's messed up.

In other words, dere be fools on both sides.

Maybe we should all start parading who is sending death threats against who? We're pretty much at the 'NO U' stage anyway.

[Lexagg]

Justin2k wrote...

Hate reading comments like "this community has been fantastic" and "yay we retook mass effect".

I didn't like the ending at all.  I didn't like the auto-dialogue.  I didn't like the multiplayer maps ruining the sidequests and i didn't like the new gay characters taking up more screen time than Ashley.

But I have never come on here and reduced Bioware staff to the point where they are visibly upset and refusing to come on the forums.  I have never tried to insist it is right for Bioware to give money to charity (which i'm sure they do).  I have never sworn at people who are just doing a job.

The crazy thing is, ME3 is a great game.  And you so called "fans" enjoyed 99.9% of 3 whole games.  It's just a video game, there are more important things in life.  What you've done to Jessica Merizan is wrong and you cannot call yourself a great community.  You are nothing more than trolls and spoilt gamers.  It's disgusting some of what you people have said to people who are bending over backwards to appease you and who in the end owe you absolutely nothing.  Get over it.

Here's what OP said, in 2 words: Generalizing bull****.

[HenchxNarf]

Dark DJ wrote...

Alpha revan wrote...

Dark DJ wrote...

Never understood the death threats crap. Really where does it get anyone besides looking like a pompous a**?

They get to stroke their E-peen and make someone else misserable, or invoke a fight. Yes some Anti-ending people get too worked up and act insane, being ****s, etc... But the Pro-ending bunch is no better, some of them have been harassing us on the demand fb since the issue went viral...

Ya you got a point there. I'm anti-ending, but I have yet to bash on anyone or harrass them. Have better things to do than argue, threaten, or harrass people over the internet. Have had a few constructive discussions though. 

Constructive discussions are fun.