418 réponses à ce sujet

[Kilshrek]

Justin2k wrote...

Lets be honest, I wouldn't blame Bioware if they turned around and said they were going to make text adventures for PC only.

And it would be you "fans" whining and crying about this. But really, would you want to make games for you lot? I don't get how you can call yourself fans with the spiteful and destructive way you go about getting what you want. You're certainly not fans of Jessica Merizan or Casey Hudson et al

Again with the generalizations. You're undermining your own credibility here.

[RedShft]

BadlyBrowned wrote...

Generalizations for everyone!!

[HenchxNarf]

Gigerstreak wrote...

People keep saying that we are using the charity as a shield. It's not like we used the money to hurt anyone. We took fan rage and made it constructive. We got a bunch of sick kids video games! The thing that makes them go hand in hand is simply... If we get them a game consol and they play and love Mass Effect 1 and 2 it will help them feel better and fight their sickness. If we don't get that ending changed then they might play Mass Effect 3 and give up.

I'm going to quote someone here, because they hit this topic on the head.

So, basically, a group of gamers who feel they're entitled to more than they're getting are exploiting a children's charity to further their own agenda? Sounds absolutely reprehensible to me. Attaching a rider to a charity drive is pretty darn low. It doesn't matter how much money is raised, the whole endeavor is sullied by the group using the charity angle to bully a company (no matter how politely the demands are worded) into acceding to their wishes. Supporters of the "Retake" agenda seem to be using their false moral high ground to shame people who disagree with them by linking it with the charity drive."You don't support us? You must HATE SICK CHILDREN!"Charity is a good thing. I've given to Child's Play in the past and I will again. But people subverting charitable generosity to push their own viewpoint is low. Regardless of where I stand on the ending of the game,
I will not support this kind of behavior.

And I believe they are completely correct.

[Tequila Man]

*head scratch* So, now I'm being told I can't make demands, I am not a fan of Jessica or Hudson, and to be a part of the community I have to not read posts completely.

ninjaNumber1, if you care, I actually enjoyed our discussion.

/Abandon thread.

[BaladasDemnevanni]

ninjaNumber1 wrote...

And the principle is inconsistent because you want to go after developers who make 1% mistakes in their games but not after those who botch up the entire game.

Pretty far from the problem.

Here's what separates the two scenarios:

1) I don't care enough about the developers who botched the entire game. I hated the Darkness 2, but I'm not petitioning for alterations. I care about Mass Effect 3 far more than the Darkness 2. Basic principle: people are more likely to complain about things they are invested in.

2) I'm far less likely to get an entire game remade than a small portion of it. Basic principle: Realism.

3) There is a substantially greater degree of collective agreement regarding the ME3 ending, increasing the likelihood of this movement succeeding. Basic Principle: Collective action influencing development.

Those are the standards I currently hold Mass Effect to. When another series meets these criteria, I will gladly jump on the bandwagon.

Modifié par BaladasDemnevanni, 22 mars 2012 - 01:56 .

[Coolfaec]

Justin2k wrote...

Lets be honest, I wouldn't blame Bioware if they turned around and said they were going to make text adventures for PC only.

And it would be you "fans" whining and crying about this. But really, would you want to make games for you lot? I don't get how you can call yourself fans with the spiteful and destructive way you go about getting what you want. You're certainly not fans of Jessica Merizan or Casey Hudson et al

So you're going to say that donating to charity is a distructive way to make a point?

[rockman0]

Correction. Some of the community has been terrible. Regardless of popular belief, one bad apple does not spoil the whole tree.

[antony1197]

Rockpopple wrote...

Justin2k wrote...

Sorry but you guys saying it's all been civil and nice haven't been reading properly.

You are blinkered. You don't like ending and want to "retake" or whatever. Someone else feels the same. You don't disagree so you don't notice. But as above, people who like the game have been told to commit suicide. Moderators have had death threats.

Even in this very thread people have said "well i wouldn't death threat, but they deserve it for spoiling the game" and you guys overlook it.

It's an awful community, where the community manager can't even come here anymore because of the abuse. You see it as persistance or holding a line, but step back and re-read, it's abuse.

If I could turn this into a signature, I would. Quoted for ****ing truth.

Look at anthony, fighting for the right to tell others to kill themselves, or give developers death threats, because he's butthurt over a game ending. ****ing pathetic.

Are you insane? Never i said it 3 times now that i am completely against threats of ANY kind to the staff, its plain wrong, but i have also stated im disatisfied with a product is that bad? Can i not be upset that they lied blatently to us? And Jessica certainly deserves NONE of the hate she has been getting, she didnt even work on the game for gods sakes.

[ninjaNumber1]

Erield wrote...

The bigger action doesn't necessarily have the bigger consequence.  What Mr. Tequila is saying is that the game was great, except for the end, and wishes Bioware would change it.  Bioware still has his money, and he's okay with that.  Company 2 made a game, and it was terrible--Tequila didn't bother throwing a fuss, or getting mad, or demanding anything other than his money back.  Company 2 does not have his money any more.

Still the damage is more.

In the first case, with 1% error, Mr. Tequilla would hound the developer and give them negative publicity over that.

But in the case of a 100% error, Mr. Tequilla would just silently decide to not give their money to them ever again and maybe go take a refund.

In the first case, the beloved developer is made to suffer. In the 2nd case, the treatment is not even comparable to that of the first.

[Gigerstreak]

Justin2k wrote...

Lets be honest, I wouldn't blame Bioware if they turned around and said they were going to make text adventures for PC only.

And it would be you "fans" whining and crying about this. But really, would you want to make games for you lot? I don't get how you can call yourself fans with the spiteful and destructive way you go about getting what you want. You're certainly not fans of Jessica Merizan or Casey Hudson et al

And it's people like yourself that trolls and gets people upset. I am a "fan" of Mass Effect AND of Jessica. Your point is invalid

[Roguekad]

Justin2k wrote...

Vhalkyrie wrote...

What happened with Jessica?

Someone threatened her with a "shepard ending" (death) and a bunch of people forced her off the forums and she won't speak on twitter about bioware/mass effect anymore.

All because she was up at 3am in her own time trying to help people.

Sorry but not defensable.

That's just out right deplorable. I can't even fathom how anyone could eveen begin to threaten anyone, especially her over this. I was wondering why she turned her twitter account private. The worst part is she didn't have to talk to any of use as much as she did and certainly not on her personal time through her own private twitter account. Catching her twitter responces was a high point of my days through most of this.

[Tequila Man]

ninjaNumber1 wrote...

Tequila Man wrote...

ninjaNumber1 wrote...

Atmospeer wrote...

We are giving them the chance to make up for, what we see as, their mistake. If the whole game was terrible, it would be given terrible reviews, fans in general would lose faith in the company. Such irrecoverable damage would severely damage the confidence of consumers in future BioWare titles, cutting into their profits.

So you see, they're not being "let off the hook", they're just suffering for their mistake in a different way.

You are not answering the question though.

Is it not a double standard or even an unfair standard to pester the one who makes a small mistake with such a lot of negative publicity and demands while the one who makes big mistakes and screws up ENTIRE games are simply left alone?

You're comparing a some crap game maker to someone we hold in higher regard. Would you not expect better work from a Ph.D student than a freshman?

Now you are brining in analogies that do not work. I am just asking in terms of what YOU actually DO.

Do you go out and ask people to redo games if they botched a sequel completely? The answer is NO, right?

So why would you go and ask someone who made a small mistake in their GAME to go and REDO the part the screwed up and give negative publicity over it?

You say you love Bioware but you are doing more harm to them than you would do those messed up Devs who give you retarded games.

Last bit:

Actually, if they make Ending DLC and rake in so much money it almost the exact % of the price of the game itself (that is, 9.99 for ending DLC) that EA doubles up on writers for the next game..... didn't my demands bring about a good thing? 

[S1at3]

Asking people to own up to their actions (i.e., personal attacks) is pointless. They're too proud or ignorant to admit they messed up.

[HenchxNarf]

Coolfaec wrote...

Justin2k wrote...

Lets be honest, I wouldn't blame Bioware if they turned around and said they were going to make text adventures for PC only.

And it would be you "fans" whining and crying about this. But really, would you want to make games for you lot? I don't get how you can call yourself fans with the spiteful and destructive way you go about getting what you want. You're certainly not fans of Jessica Merizan or Casey Hudson et al

So you're going to say that donating to charity is a distructive way to make a point?

Donating for the reason you guys donated is disgusting, tbh.

[MeatShieldGriff]

I've seen other forums where gamers were terrible. This wasn't one of them. The greater majority of us were civil and we got Bioware's attention. What's more we've donated tens of thousands to charity. What part of that makes you ashamed of the community?

[Justin2k]

Coolfaec wrote...

Justin2k wrote...

Lets be honest, I wouldn't blame Bioware if they turned around and said they were going to make text adventures for PC only.

And it would be you "fans" whining and crying about this. But really, would you want to make games for you lot? I don't get how you can call yourself fans with the spiteful and destructive way you go about getting what you want. You're certainly not fans of Jessica Merizan or Casey Hudson et al

So you're going to say that donating to charity is a distructive way to make a point?

The charity is a cheap publicity stunt.  Noone really cares about those kids.

I give to great ormond street (sick child hospice) every month.  i don't do it to get an ending redone on a video game.  I think the charity move is extremely tacky and a bid to make you look less entitled than you are.  Bioware owe you nothing, sorry but they really don't and using sick kids to get people behind you is just

Modifié par Justin2k, 22 mars 2012 - 01:59 .

[defenestrated]

Justin2k wrote...

Sorry but you guys saying it's all been civil and nice haven't been reading properly.

You are blinkered. You don't like ending and want to "retake" or whatever. Someone else feels the same. You don't disagree so you don't notice. But as above, people who like the game have been told to commit suicide. Moderators have had death threats.

Even in this very thread people have said "well i wouldn't death threat, but they deserve it for spoiling the game" and you guys overlook it.

It's an awful community, where the community manager can't even come here anymore because of the abuse. You see it as persistance or holding a line, but step back and re-read, it's abuse.

It's a fast-moving online forum. People miss things.

In a thread the other day, I brought up a tweet as being inappropriate and a fan of the endings made a blanket statement about the behavior of those who don't like the endings. When I questioned that, they told me they hadn't seen any of us ending-haters berate that kind of behavior. While I was being criticized for not speaking out against this sort of behavior, they never noticed I was the one who pointed it out in the first place.

People miss things. On both sides.

[HenchxNarf]

rockman0 wrote...

Correction. Some of the community has been terrible. Regardless of popular belief, one bad apple does not spoil the whole tree.

It most certainly can.

[Tequila Man]

HenchxNarf wrote...

Coolfaec wrote...

Justin2k wrote...

Lets be honest, I wouldn't blame Bioware if they turned around and said they were going to make text adventures for PC only.

And it would be you "fans" whining and crying about this. But really, would you want to make games for you lot? I don't get how you can call yourself fans with the spiteful and destructive way you go about getting what you want. You're certainly not fans of Jessica Merizan or Casey Hudson et al

So you're going to say that donating to charity is a distructive way to make a point?

Donating for the reason you guys donated is disgusting, tbh.

Couldn't resist.



Ask the sick kids if they care.

[ninjaNumber1]

BaladasDemnevanni wrote...

ninjaNumber1 wrote...

And the principle is inconsistent because you want to go after developers who make 1% mistakes in their games but not after those who botch up the entire game.

Pretty far from the problem.

Here's what separates the two scenarios:

1) I don't care enough about the developers who botched the entire game. I hated the Darkness 2, but I'm not petitioning for alterations. I care about Mass Effect 3 far more than the Darkness 2. Basic principle: people are more likely to complain about things they are invested in.

2) I'm far less likely to get an entire game remade than a small portion of it. Basic principle: Realism.

3) There is a substantially greater degree of collective agreement regarding the ME3 ending, increasing the likelihood of this movement succeeding. Basic Principle: Collective action influencing development.

Those are the standards I currently hold Mass Effect to. When another series meets these criteria, I will gladly jump on the bandwagon.

But what you are saying is even worse. It seems that the fault of Bioware was actually giving you a great story in previous games.

According to your logic, they should just made mediocre games so that then you won't punish them for it....

What you have to realize is that regardless of feasibility or reasons, you do use an unfair standard by penalizing the one who does most of it right and not doing much against those who do nothing right.

[ryuasiu]

Hate to break it to you but there are ALWAYS going to be jerks in every community. Take a look at the Dr. Who forums, there's a very select few being just as big dicks about the new companion announcement. trying to tear down the entire community for the actions of a select few.

[Tequila Man]

ninjaNumber1 wrote...

BaladasDemnevanni wrote...

ninjaNumber1 wrote...

And the principle is inconsistent because you want to go after developers who make 1% mistakes in their games but not after those who botch up the entire game.

Pretty far from the problem.

Here's what separates the two scenarios:

1) I don't care enough about the developers who botched the entire game. I hated the Darkness 2, but I'm not petitioning for alterations. I care about Mass Effect 3 far more than the Darkness 2. Basic principle: people are more likely to complain about things they are invested in.

2) I'm far less likely to get an entire game remade than a small portion of it. Basic principle: Realism.

3) There is a substantially greater degree of collective agreement regarding the ME3 ending, increasing the likelihood of this movement succeeding. Basic Principle: Collective action influencing development.

Those are the standards I currently hold Mass Effect to. When another series meets these criteria, I will gladly jump on the bandwagon.

But what you are saying is even worse. It seems that the fault of Bioware was actually giving you a great story in previous games.

According to your logic, they should just made mediocre games so that then you won't punish them for it....

What you have to realize is that regardless of feasibility or reasons, you do use an unfair standard by penalizing the one who does most of it right and not doing much against those who do nothing right.

Yes. If they hadn't set the bar so high, creatively, we wouldn't be here outraged.

[S1at3]

Justin2k wrote...

Coolfaec wrote...

Justin2k wrote...

Lets be honest, I wouldn't blame Bioware if they turned around and said they were going to make text adventures for PC only.

And it would be you "fans" whining and crying about this. But really, would you want to make games for you lot? I don't get how you can call yourself fans with the spiteful and destructive way you go about getting what you want. You're certainly not fans of Jessica Merizan or Casey Hudson et al

So you're going to say that donating to charity is a distructive way to make a point?

The charity is a cheap publicity stunt.  Noone really cares about those kids.

I give to great ormond street (sick child hospice) every month.  i don't do it to get an ending redone on a video game.  I think the charity move is extremely tacky and a bid to make you look less entitled than you are.  Bioware owe you nothing, sorry but they really don't.

Pretty much on the money.  Its kind of a distraction.  "Don't pay attention to the death threats, crying and inappropriate attacks, look at the money we're raising!"

[HenchxNarf]

Tequila Man wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...

Coolfaec wrote...

Justin2k wrote...

Lets be honest, I wouldn't blame Bioware if they turned around and said they were going to make text adventures for PC only.

And it would be you "fans" whining and crying about this. But really, would you want to make games for you lot? I don't get how you can call yourself fans with the spiteful and destructive way you go about getting what you want. You're certainly not fans of Jessica Merizan or Casey Hudson et al

So you're going to say that donating to charity is a distructive way to make a point?

Donating for the reason you guys donated is disgusting, tbh.

Couldn't resist.



Ask the sick kids if they care.

You're totally missing the point, but whatever.