807 réponses à ce sujet

[Filby08]

This is hardly a precedent.

For the record, if you like the ending, I dont want it taken away from you. But I am not satisfied and it's my right as a consumer to voice this.

[Militarized]

Maybe they should have learned how to write an actual artistic ending instead of a contrived, cliche ridden one that ruins the entire story that had laid out before hand?

If you want to talk about ruining a story, talk to the writer who penned that ending.

[Quietness]

HenchxNarf wrote...

I agree with you, OP.

And i will ignore any and every piece of information that will counter the point and just agree with you blindly.... im sorry but what?

[Rune-Chan]

If an artist is commissioned to draw something, and tells the commissioner that they are going to draw a landscape picture of New York, and when the drawing is handed over and the money is exchanged the picture is not of New York, but a picture of the moon, are you telling me that it would be wrong for the person who paid for the picture to expect what they were told they were going to be getting?

Is their artistic integrity ruined because they have been asked to do what they said they were going to do in the first place?

The answer is no.

If I created a painting and you asked me to change it because you didn't like it, I'd tell you to f**k off as it's my art and my decision.

If you paid me to create a painting and it turned out to be very different from what I repeatedly stated it would be, then you'd have every right to ask me to fix it.

Modifié par Machines Are Us, 22 mars 2012 - 08:51 .

[zenoxis]

SandTrout wrote...

zenoxis wrote...

We gave them our money based on promises they made to us. We have every right to demand a better ending. Also see Star Wars (original trilogy) for changes made to a product that has already been released for more information on why this kind of thing has happened already and isn't going to destroy society as we know it.

You're welcome. 
/thread

Star Wars and the changes that Lucas made to the original Trilogy (against the will of the fans) are actaully a fine example of 'artistic integrity' run amok.

Just because it's run amok once doesn't mean it will again. I have far greater faith in Bioware than I do with Lucas. I only listed Star Wars because it shows the potential to change something even after it's been released and even after so much time has passed.

[Mad-Max90]

Not only that but we were fed lies by the devs about what to expect FROM the ENDING, they didn't warn us that what they previously stated no longer held true to the ending and that no choice prior to the last one made an impact on the story

[Citizen Q]

Darknessfalls23 wrote...

I am confuse the ending hasn't even been changed yet, besides all we are doing is pointing out the glaring potholes, the nonsensical reasoning for the Reapers and three Identical choices, that doesn't make you feel like yay Shepard ended his life heroically. Audience job is react to "art".

You and your logically sound arguments are not welcome here!

You just don't understand True Aaaaaaaahhhhhrt.

[lordnarvinye]

Hogwash. They'd already moved beyond the stale definition of artist provided content, and created something entirely new.

[GigaTheToast]

Isn't "conventional storytelling" widely considered to be something holding games back? Look at "Shadow of the Colossus" that certainly as hell wasn't conventional.

[Roguekad]

TheRisenStar wrote...

That Charles Dickens, what a sellout he was. He endangered conventional storytelling forever!

I know! How dare he let Pip have a happish ending! Don't get me started on that sellout Doyle. Really bowing to his fans and bringing back Sherlock. It's not like he was a landmark character or inspired modern fiction.

[Dreogan]

I think this thread qualifies as "blitzkrieg destruction of the because art" argument.

[Lugaidster]

To the OP. As much as I believe in artistic integrity, I also believe in humble artists. Willingness to improve on feedback should not be looked down upon. The worst part is, it is you, the guys that defend "artistic integrity" the ones that will later look down as if you're somehow superior for being proud of your work.

Being humble is not bad sometimes. The final decision rests in Bioware hands, and if they do change the ending, it won't be me pointing fingers and calling names.

Modifié par Lugaidster, 22 mars 2012 - 08:54 .

[Dreogan]

Lugaidster wrote...

To the OP. As much as I believe in artistic integrity, I also believe in humble artists. Willingness to improve on feedback should not be looked down upon. The worst part is, it is you, the guys that defend "artistic integrity" the ones that will later look down as if you're somehow superior for being proud of your work.

Being humble is not bad sometimes. The final decision rests in Bioware hands, and if they do change the ending, it won't be me pointing fingers.

This one's playing the good cop.

[SandTrout]

zenoxis wrote...

SandTrout wrote...

zenoxis wrote...

We gave them our money based on promises they made to us. We have every right to demand a better ending. Also see Star Wars (original trilogy) for changes made to a product that has already been released for more information on why this kind of thing has happened already and isn't going to destroy society as we know it.

You're welcome. 
/thread

Star Wars and the changes that Lucas made to the original Trilogy (against the will of the fans) are actaully a fine example of 'artistic integrity' run amok.

Just because it's run amok once doesn't mean it will again. I have far greater faith in Bioware than I do with Lucas. I only listed Star Wars because it shows the potential to change something even after it's been released and even after so much time has passed.

I think I misunderstood your position because it's late and I'm tired. I think we are in agreement here.

[Wowlock]

If you think this ending was ''conventional'' ... I hate to say, I feel sorry for you. If we won't call people on their mistakes ...they won't be able to improve themselves..... just look at the series like CoD.... you see any improvement ? It is basicly the same game with 1-2 new weapons and we do not hear any complaints....THAT is the sad thing...not us who voice our opinions to make this series MEMORIABLE. To give it an ending it DESERVES....

[HenchxNarf]

Quietness wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...

I agree with you, OP.

And i will ignore any and every piece of information that will counter the point and just agree with you blindly.... im sorry but what?

You have your opinion and I have mine. Get over it. I wasn't even talking to you.

[SpiderFan1217]

If we're lucky Bioware is just going to put in an epilough and not actually change the ending. It's still pretty sad though.

[Citizen Q]

I; think; I'm; going; to start putt;ing semi;col;ons randomly; throug;hout all m;y tho;ughts;

[halbert986]

It's not like a group of disgruntled 17 year olds has taken bioware headquarters hostage and are popping someone in the back of the head for every mistake unless they fix it. If they don't want to change it that's their right, but I'm guessing they'd rather not lose a very very large portion of their fanbase.

[Primalrose]

It's an art medium, but video games are also a product to be consumed. People also have the right to critique your art, especially if you put commercial value on it. In a happy sunshine and rainbows world, everybody in the known universe will love your art and sing praises. But people pay money and when you promise your piece of art will deliver this and that, people expect to get their money's worth and expect what is promised. It's simple, really. 

Modifié par Primalrose, 22 mars 2012 - 08:54 .

[Roguekad]

zenoxis wrote...

SandTrout wrote...

zenoxis wrote...

We gave them our money based on promises they made to us. We have every right to demand a better ending. Also see Star Wars (original trilogy) for changes made to a product that has already been released for more information on why this kind of thing has happened already and isn't going to destroy society as we know it.

You're welcome. 
/thread

Star Wars and the changes that Lucas made to the original Trilogy (against the will of the fans) are actaully a fine example of 'artistic integrity' run amok.

Just because it's run amok once doesn't mean it will again. I have far greater faith in Bioware than I do with Lucas. I only listed Star Wars because it shows the potential to change something even after it's been released and even after so much time has passed.

And to be fair we all know Lucas has no idea when to quit or what should or shouldn't be changed. I mean reallly, we just HAD to have that shot of whatever the crap was eating that bug thing outside Jabba's palace in Return?

[Reptilian Rob]

Citizen Q wrote...

I; think; I'm; going; to start putt;ing semi;col;ons randomly; throug;hout all m;y tho;ughts;

Is that you William Shattner?

[KingKhan03]

lol whut. There was so much artistic integrity in that day one DLC! 10 bucks worth of it!!

[alex13abc]

So let me get this straight:

-Casting a Maxim model/game journalist as a sex kitten/ love interest.
-Using stock pictures for Tali and the backdrop of the ending
-Selling a tie in book fraught with gross errors clearly made by someone who know nothing of the universe
-Tying up one of the greatest video game franchises ever with an ending full of potholes and disrespecting off the entire lore that was developed until then

= Art ?

This is not art, it is a product made by a corporation to make money. It was hyped up by making arguably false promises and people who bought the product and found out that they were deceived are exercising their customer rights.

[SandTrout]

Dreogan wrote...

I think this thread qualifies as "blitzkrieg destruction of the because art" argument.

Hell, we might perfect this rhetorical strategy with the frequency that this hollow defense comes up.