226 réponses à ce sujet

[joiushdfoubsndpovn]

Oh sweet, is this the cute pics thread of heard about?

So cute!

[Unit-Alpha]

din626 wrote...

Annie_Dear wrote...

tAlOsS wrote...

loungeshep wrote...

Wrex.

Shepard.

Wrex.

 SHEPARD!

Wrex.

Shepard.

[kalasaurus]

azereus2 wrote...

arthurhallam wrote...

Paragon Auducan wrote...

They missold a piece of interactive media by lieing to our faces.

no, they didn't. you built up a vision of what you were getting & it didn't meet your expectations. big deal.

if i tell you for an entire year that if you invest on me i will give you something and THEN i give you a complete different thing, isnt that lieing? and scamming?. There are cosumer rights for a reason, to not let this type of things happen.

 *There will be NO ABC ending like most games*
Mass effect ending A B or C.

 *WHat you choose in the game actually matters to the gazilion endings we have for you!*
No matter what you do or what civilizations you kill, even if you have a readiness of 0 you will reach the A B C ending .

Thats scamming sir.

If your readiness is 0 you will only get a C ending, which is surprisingly the only one that makes any small amount of sense.

Curse it all!

[admcmei]

arthurhallam wrote...

okay, so, many of the retakers are contiously talking about how they're not entitled,  & i don't want to generalise a very large group of people.

but if people keep talking about their rights as consumers (as many of you do) & about the so-called lies of the company, you really do come across as entitled little brats. maybe it's my leftist political outlook, but i can't help but think of you as the exact sort of people who'd vote for ron paul. 

I'm guessing you're american. Yeah. You guys have a very strange definition of left wing.

[beccathelion]

in soviet russia, company complains at you!


dude, seriously? don't ever return anything you ever buy because it's broken or not what you expected it to be then.

[kalasaurus]

admcmei wrote...

arthurhallam wrote...

okay, so, many of the retakers are contiously talking about how they're not entitled,  & i don't want to generalise a very large group of people.

but if people keep talking about their rights as consumers (as many of you do) & about the so-called lies of the company, you really do come across as entitled little brats. maybe it's my leftist political outlook, but i can't help but think of you as the exact sort of people who'd vote for ron paul. 

I'm guessing you're american. Yeah. You guys have a very strange definition of left wing.

I'm American and I sadly agree with this.

[antony.daley]

OP - There is a massive massive difference between "Entitlement" and "consumer rights".

As a consumer who purchases a product I expect a few things which are protected by law - Most importantly being in this case a description of the product, and the product meeting these expectations.

These expecations to an everyman were not met. As such stores are accepting returns of the game opened or not - Outside of the usual rights to return.

This is not a feeling of "entitlement". Those who are using the argument of consumer rights are in effect fair and right to do so. We have a right to return the game and ask for a full refund because the expcations of the item were not the same as those implied at point of sale. -There are numerous threads pointing out the many many "lies" told about how hte game would playout that didn't match the ending.

However for alot of us fans we are not returning the game we are pointing these issues out to Bioware and asking for ammends to be made.

If you want a comparison then you only need to look at the latest book that wasp ublished jsut prioer to ME3 being launched. It was filled with many errors in cannon and as such future versions of the book will be changed/editited so tehse massive plot flaws are corrected. The book in future will be different from the original.

There is no different between that and this.

It is not entitlement. It is a reasonable expecation of a product that in this case wasn't met.

[admcmei]

GlassElephant wrote...

admcmei wrote...

arthurhallam wrote...

okay, so, many of the retakers are contiously talking about how they're not entitled,  & i don't want to generalise a very large group of people.

but if people keep talking about their rights as consumers (as many of you do) & about the so-called lies of the company, you really do come across as entitled little brats. maybe it's my leftist political outlook, but i can't help but think of you as the exact sort of people who'd vote for ron paul. 

I'm guessing you're american. Yeah. You guys have a very strange definition of left wing.

I'm American and I sadly agree with this.

Didn't mean to generalise, just a joke, I mean, I'm italian, here we have the most messed up political balance in the whole of Europe, I just meant to observe how peculiar it is to think of cosumer rights as "right wing", which then would make business interests "left wing". I know perfectly well it doesn't really work like that in America, I follow enough american politics to know tha the GOP basically IS the party of business interests.

[Everwarden]

Don't feed the troll, people. 


Though you know that if he wasn't a Bioware fanboy his ass would be permabanned for this, and as-is he's unlikely to get so much as a slap on the wrist and a firm "No, no!" 

Modifié par Everwarden, 22 mars 2012 - 04:05 .

[saeval912]

admcmei wrote...

arthurhallam wrote...

okay, so, many of the retakers are contiously talking about how they're not entitled,  & i don't want to generalise a very large group of people.

but if people keep talking about their rights as consumers (as many of you do) & about the so-called lies of the company, you really do come across as entitled little brats. maybe it's my leftist political outlook, but i can't help but think of you as the exact sort of people who'd vote for ron paul. 

I'm guessing you're american. Yeah. You guys have a very strange definition of left wing.

Im American, and I'd say i moderately lean towards the right... and that statement confused me completely as well. I don't think he knows where he stands politically.

[billyzero]

arthurhallam wrote...

ima bump this just so it reaches the attention of the consumer rights goons

I actually read this before the main post and figured that's all I really needed to read.

OP, some friendly advice:  You should work on your communications skills if you ever really want to get your thoughts across to people instead of just argue.

Modifié par billyzero, 22 mars 2012 - 04:10 .

[Legendaryred]

Only has ME3 registered and joined march 15, not sure how anybody took you for serious.

[Oakenshield1]

I thought consumer rights were established back in the early 1900s. Who are video games to go against 90 years of established standards in business?

[azereus2]

Oakenshield1 wrote...

I thought consumer rights were established back in the early 1900s. Who are video games to go against 90 years of established standards in business?

This!

and what about common sense? how long that has been on the table?..

[tanuki]

arthurhallam wrote...

imagine a brattish kid gets promised something for christmas & doesn't get what they want— do they threaten to sue their parents? no, they throw out all the toys from their cots. which is exactly what many of you are doing. it's unbecoming of adults to behave in this way.

Wonderful comparison is wonderful.

[ZodiEmish]

I was going to take the time to point out how your wrong about consumer rights, or how your don't understand how the markets work, but it is honestly to early in the morning for me to get into economics, and the free market.  

So I will just leave this right here.

Modifié par ZodiEmish, 22 mars 2012 - 04:27 .

[The Angry One]

It's amazing how insulting and trollish the white knights have become since Dr. Muzyka's announcement.
Says it all really.

[ahandsomeshark]

admcmei wrote...

arthurhallam wrote...

okay, so, many of the retakers are contiously talking about how they're not entitled,  & i don't want to generalise a very large group of people.

but if people keep talking about their rights as consumers (as many of you do) & about the so-called lies of the company, you really do come across as entitled little brats. maybe it's my leftist political outlook, but i can't help but think of you as the exact sort of people who'd vote for ron paul. 

I'm guessing you're american. Yeah. You guys have a very strange definition of left wing.

I'm American, and left wing and I have no idea what this guys talking about. I don't understand how anything about his politicial stance would affect how he feels about consumer rights.

[Asnine112]

How is this thread still not locked?

Good job Mr. Woo

[Mastone]

GlassElephant wrote...

The more and more I see threads like this pop up, the more I see "Hold the Line" as being futile.

I hated the ending, but if the majority of people see us as entitled whiners, do you really think that Bioware has any incentive to "cave" and change this monstrosity of an ending they gave us? They wanted the game to appeal to the casual gamer and the devoted fan.

They threw in a little fanservice here and there (Tali's "picture") to shut people like us up. I don't know what kind of drugs they were smoking when they thought of the ending, but I guess it wasn't supposed to matter because it was vague and we could imagine what happens after the CGI of stuff exploding.

Maybe the bleak ending itself has just left me a little more cynical...

Regarding the bold statement ( pun intended), I think you are wrong the majority of the people are the whiners and we are entitled I read a post here somewhere where somebody listed  a bunch of promises quoted from what developers said very explicitly  will be in the game and they did the very opposite on most occasions .
This will probably lead to the fact that publishers will assign a spokesperson for a tripleA title who will neither confirm nor deny any statements made blabla. So they either lie in your face or don't tell you anything.

I also  dislike the fact that this whole thing is ( being) turned around making the consumer the scapegoat  in this case and banking it on artistic liberty and all that bull**** , it's basically down to this:
Dev makes gaME1, people like, people trust,  people buy
Dev makes gaME2, people trust, people buy
Dev makes gaME3, people buy
Guess which one will be left out for the majority of people when gaME4 comes out, if it stands like this.

Imagine a movie like the godfather ending in a gay marriage between Al pacino and Andy garcia it doesn't fit the environment nor  the story.
The same goes for Mass effect  with its gay colored explosion.
It's pathetic storytelling at best .
I accepted the dumbing down of Mass Effect with each release I even accepted that in ME2 none of my decisions had any effect, the story was lousy ( I did like the illusive man btw) lacked the depth ME 1 had, but I still trusted that they would make a blast of a game with ME3, I actually thought they rushed ME2 so they had more time on ME3 at that time, maybe don't work on a multiplayer until you playtested the game, was the game playtested by the way, by a group with an average IQ higher than 60 I mean.
When ME3 came out  I did what I haven't done ever in my life, I bought the collectors edition ( I am a 3d artist and wanted to model some stuff based on artwork) on the day of European release and started playing. the gameplay was intense, best gameplay moment was the level of tutchanka,, with the shells hitting all around you, to bad the exploration didn't extend into a prothean ruin ( which gave a single reaper reason for being at that spot, what do they care if the genophage is cured or not they are about to wipe out all organic life...I mean harvest them)with some more difficult puzzles or something , I did notice that the storypart wasn't very well developed  during the game and none of my previous made decisions did made any difference, if jack died during ME2 there would probably be another Biotic same goes for all the other NPC's, wrex wreave , original Rachni queen, another Rachni queen....I could live with all these broken promises, the game was intense characters were fun ( albeit being of the dumb shallow variation) right up until teh starchild and the gay confeti explosions came banging at the door, making the house of Mass Effect crash through it's very foundation....choice...

In a few months from now we will hear about a drop on subscriptions on KOTOR ( not because of this) and I ask quite plainly what is left  then (if that will happen)?
Dragonage was a disappointment to a lot of people, Mass Effect clearly is at least for the ending.

 I always placed Bioware along with lookingglass, old Eidos, old square, high on my list having passion, gameplay and the gamer on spot 1 and the idea money will come from that, which is the best bussines model, deliver something people want get paid...done deal.

Please Bioware restore your honor don't fall on that sword you have sticking out of the ground in front of you thinking it's artistic freedom at last....

[The Angry One]

The majority of people do not see us as whiners.
The loudest people do, and they discredit themselves with every insult they throw out.

[beccathelion]

Annie_Dear wrote...

Sparse wrote...

Kittens make me violent.

Don't worry. Have some baby Shepards:

NEW DESKTOP BACKGROUND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! trolololol

[ChurchOfZod]

This dude doesn't really know what left wing means if he is on the side of Bioware. Lefty = victory of the people against corporations like EA. in this case the retakeME3 crowd looks just like the occupy movement to me. A group of ordinary citizens who banded together for a common cause. Don't get much more grassroots or leftist than that.

Modifié par ChurchOfZod, 22 mars 2012 - 04:42 .

[Drak41n]

The idea that business should be held to a higher standard isn't really coming from the right....

[Aiyie]

rorako wrote...

I read about a paragraph of OP's post before wanting to vomit (see: vote for Ron Paul).

Anyway, as customers, we fund Bioware. Without us, there would be no them. If there are enough of us complaining to effect profit margin, then, yes, we have every right to be "entitled" to a product we were promised.

If customers don't have a right to complain about something they purchase, then citizens shouldn't have a right to complain about corrupt politicians they elect, right?

Oh look, something that both Democracy and Capitalism have in common.

we've got the right to complain, absolutely... thats a right we're all exercising by voicing our opinions right now.

lets be very clear though... the right to complain and advocate for change is very different from the right to actually have a change be effected.  i think this is where the entitlement thing comes from... too many people who feel that just because they're protesting, they automatically deserve to be victorious. 

unfortunately, as much as we all like to think we're absolutely right, these forums are a perfect example of how there is more to this than simply "because i'm right, you are automatically wrong."  there are quite a few differing opinions, and given the information we have at the moment, no one opinion is more valid than the other.

we can protest all we like, but we need to be prepared for the worst case, where our protests aren't acted on.  that's where the free market (a separate entity from democracy), comes in and dictates that the company ignoring its customers will suffer. 

Modifié par Aiyie, 22 mars 2012 - 04:47 .