526 réponses à ce sujet

[Strategyking92]

very very petty of him. It seems his ego is more important to him than the actual point of the charity.

[The_Crazy_Hand]

Guys I understand why you're upset but this outrage will only make the problem worse.

[Dragoonlordz]

charmedmeat wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

defenestrated wrote...

Cody211282 wrote...

So he is refusing money for a charity because he doesn't agree with us? WTF

He's not refusing money but the ChipIn for RetakeME3 is no more because he doesn't want Child's Play associated with any causes that aren't Child's Play.

Thats how I read it too and to be honest it is a valid reason. A charity is not one groups way to attack another group, it should not be for personal gain. A way that could avoided them no longer being linked would of been simple soultion like another person said of changing your stance and description used to drum up donations. It should of been along the lines of "give to the charity so at least some good can come from your disappointment" but that is not what was done. It was "donate to the charity in support of your cause". The latter ethically wrong, the former is completley acceptable. I am glad the charity got some money for the kids but you as a group should of gone about it in another way however because if did as I just explained he would not have had to take such action.

So then why did the PA folks use that same charity to promote PA?  Why did they use it to promote PAX?

I have not seen what PAX or PA is doing. I am talking about right way to go about it and wrong way.  A simple change of stance and description and all could of been avoided. What I just said is how he viewed it going by his statements and as others in here have also agreed with his stance. I was more disgusted by some (not many) asking for donations back.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 23 mars 2012 - 05:46 .

[CavScout]

Neow wrote...

They can stop accepting the donation from "Retake", but taking down the page simply rings "We've taken your money, but we're not crediting you for it."

There are anonymous donors, there are donors that deserve acknowledgement.

I'm not saying they should gave the money back, taking the page down is just a display of unappreciative.

If the donations were for the children, "acknowledgment" is not needed. If the donations were for a ME3 ending...

[SamFlagg]

Let this one go folks.

Money was raised for children.  It started to take a life of its own and was starting to have negative connotations that the charity never deserved.

Whether or not the negative feelings around the charity drive were reasonable is not a debate that is going to accomplish anything at this juncture.

Impuing the motives of all of those running the charity are just as misguided as impuing the motives all of those who donated.

This type of arguement is exactly what plays into the hands of the "They're entitled" crowd. Do not engage in it.

And let me make this very clear.

YOU CAN NOT FIGHT EVERY SINGLE BATTLE OVER EVERYTHING FOR EVERY SCRAP OF GROUND.

If you do that, you will lose.

[CheeseEnchilada]

KingNothing125 wrote...

OP acted like a jerk, swearing in the very first tweet? Way to start a civil conversation, holmes.

I went to PAX Prime 2011, and I actually met Tycho while standing in line to get in. They're both very cool dudes, and you guys are all acting like they're mustache twirling supervillains, "MWAHAHA, OUR BIOWARE OVERMASTERS WILL BE PLEASED!"

Give it a rest, seriously. When people complain about "Retake", all they need to do is look in this thread to reinforce their preconceived notions that you're all a bunch of entitled whiners.

You guys used the charity for your own personal gain... a bit like the guys who tried to raffle off a ME3 Space Edition, give 30% of the money to Child's Play and oh, keep 70% for themselves. Totally altruistic.

Did Child's Play send you your money back? Well show that you're good sports and give it right back to them, no strings or messages attached.

No, they did not send us our money back. The vast majority of us minus the few outliers that exist in any group don't want it back.

And yes, I used it for my own personal gain. After feeling so negative about the endings, I chose to look at the BSN, find a thread that involved giving to others and doing something positive, and I made myself feel better by helping children and putting everything in perspective. I'm an entitled whiner, all right.

[Marixus99.9]

Actinguy1 wrote...

I appreciate that support, but no.  We gain nothing by causing more problems for Child's Play.  I have no qualms about causing problems for Penny Arcade...or bringing attention to problems they're creating for themselves...and I say that as someone who owns the Penny Arcade series on DVD>  But to cause problems for the charity itself?  We'd be doing a whole lot of bad for ourselves, to say nothing of the children.

OP, can you linke Tyhcho's response? This one:

http://penny-arcade....ake-mass-effect

[Axialbloom]

You should NEVER listen to anything gabe says. Tycho is the sane one.

[Silveralen]

McScroggz24 wrote...

I read what Jamie said, and while it saddens me that it happens I have to agree with her point. Imagine this, the charity continues with ReME3, then another group starts a fund as part of a Artistic Integrity for ME3 writers. It's easy to say that both are for charity so they can coexist but the nature of what they start for are at odds with one another. Also, just the name Retake Mass Effect 3 implies, nay states that while the money is for a good cause ultimately ulterior motives are the end goal.

Actually, that would have been perfect. We could hav channeled the vitrol into a competition to raise more money.

Honestly, my opinion of it always was that it was silly, but some people will donate to it jwho normally wouldn't because it supports the retake. Which is always good. I give a annual donation anyways, but I know this probably convinced more than a few people to donate.

I guess I don't understand why he wouldn't want to milk that group for extra money. Some people normally don't, this was gettng them too. It gets more money in, so who cares? I guess he just hates the movement to much to milk it for cash? That doesn't even make sense.

Modifié par Silveralen, 23 mars 2012 - 05:48 .

[Actinguy1]

Jayce F wrote...

Vasparian wrote...

I thought this take back thing was a good idea. Now I know it's not. Bashing people that run a charity(PA in this case), selling merchandise via their facebook, and other things. It just makes me sick. I loved most of ME3, the endings are all that bugged me. I refuse to be a part of a group that acts this way. The take back people should be ashamed.

Balls. The Takeback crew were completely open that they wanted to get retake supporters to also support Childsplay. It's right there in bold print. The whole purpose was to benefit the charity as an aside. That it was good publicity for retake as well was just gravy.

Tycho's statement reeks of a convinient excuse to disassociate. He even has the audacty to imply the drive stopped because "they won", when anyone who paid attention knows it was because PA asked them to.

I think people aren't clear on this: Gabe and Tycho ("Penny Arcade") founded Child's Play.  They have since hired a woman (Jamie) to run the day-to-day side of it, but they are still very much in charge.

[Maria Caliban]

Unfortunate, but also common. Charities are very touchy about not offending the 'right' people or associating with the 'wrong' people.

[Nyila]

Xivai wrote...

This is what I think.

Thanks for the link, man, I sure needed the laugh!

[Qutayba]

The Angry One wrote...

Quietness wrote...

Actually im more pissed now at the random A**Hats who chargedback on donations.

I just don't understand the logic.
Money + charity = new ending?
Spacebrat displayed more coherent thought than this.

That wasn't the logic, though, and it's apparently what they didn't get.  It's a shame.  I had actually thought they had maintained fairly cool heads through all of this, but apparently not.

People had all different reasons to give.  People bought in-game pets in WoW for charity.  Some people bought them for the pet, some people bought them for the charity.  Win-Win.

Was it "expression" through charity?  Absolutely.  But what it expressed for me was: Hey, I don't want to have anything to do twitter-harrassers and ratings-bombers.  I want to keep things civil and keep things positive.

If they can just refuse money because of some petty squabble, it makes me wonder what kind of board has oversight over the charity.

[Dartbeast54q]

Marixus99.9 wrote...

CronoDragoon wrote...

Blackmind1 wrote...

Goose1004 wrote...

Marixus99.9 wrote...

http://penny-arcade....ake-mass-effect

Their response.

Needs to be quoted again

Very well said. As it stood, Child's Play was being used as a tool, and it was disgraceful that it got as far as it did. People were using it as an emotional weapon against Bioware so they could get their ending fixed.

If you think this was the only reason people donated, you are a fool.

The problem is that some people were doing this apparently:

They have stopped taking donations now partly because they basically won and partly because we don’t know how to feel about this use of the charity. 

As the main point of contact for Child’s Play, Jamie has been buried under mail about this situation. Apparently some of the people giving to the cause seemed to think that they were paying for a new ending to Mass Effect. She’s been asked what the goal is, and how much they need to raise in order to get the ending produced. We’ve also been contacted by PayPal due to a high number of people asking for their donations back.

People thought they were donating directly to bioware to get the endings changed... speechless.

[LegatoSkyheart]

So...he's refusing money for children? I hurt him because I find the ending of Mass Effect 3 wrong and have really good points as to why I don't like the ending and even decide to give money to Charity?

[SpiritReaver72]

We can still donate money to Child's Play without it needing to be attached to our movement. By acting this way instead of posting a link to the charity and encouraging people to donate directly we are in fact reinforcing the view that we're using the charity as a shield. If the goal is to do something good with our energy then we can still donate to Child's Play. Nothings changed except our acknowledgement. Either we choose to do use our anger constructively and use good for good's sake or we act the way people are accusing us of and use another charity to bolster our cause. I don't think donating to Child's Play the way we were was us using a shield to protect us against negative stereotypes. Emotions were too high and we were nowhere near organized enough to think in such a calculated manner. But moving away from our already picked charity and picking another one because we're not getting the recognition is calculated.

Modifié par SpiritReaver72, 23 mars 2012 - 05:50 .

[bucyrus5000]

Xandurpein wrote...

Would it be unfair to speculate that some major Game producers, like maybe EA, donate a lot of big money to this charity and that EA have now threatened to withdraw their money?

That's possible, or they are being genuine. Moot point now. Let's just find another charity, one with less scruples.

Wounded Warriors

[Ghost of a Messiah]

Shavyer wrote...

"charity" and "tool" are the same thing since Man is Man.

charity = guilty
charity = publicity
charity = altruism
charity = reputation
charity = fame

Well said

[Brawne]

EA probably just threw them million bucks and said shut them down.

[askanec]

The message of "helping the kids" get muddled when you tie that in with "change the ending". I agree with Penny Arcade. The whole focus of the charity is gone when you try to piggybag whatever cause you want to champion with the message of helping the kids. It's basically a shield: nobody would dare to criticize, because nobody wants to be seen as someone opposing a worthy charitable effort.

This whole Child's Play Retake ME thing is just a publicity stunt.

[pottypenguin]

I understand his view and I’m not diminishing the take back movement here, but is all seriousness this should not be a strong enough polarizing issue to stop taking money from the movement. It’s only conflicting in that they have strong ties to the industry. Self justification is a b**** that no one can escape. This is a 1st world problem not a politically charged controversial issue outside of gaming.

[CavScout]

Nuclear Pete wrote...

CavScout wrote...

Nuclear Pete wrote...

How is this any differant to McDonald's supporting charities?

You really see RetakeME as a corporation?

Not really the point, mate.

Those that donated only voiced dissatisfaction with a game. Nobody is profiting from this.

To turn away money like that makes no sense.

It is the point. Corporate sponsorship is not the same thing as the Retake ME branding.

[Quietness]

LegatoSkyheart wrote...

So...he's refusing money for children? I hurt him because I find the ending of Mass Effect 3 wrong and have really good points as to why I don't like the ending and even decide to give money to Charity?

Read his article... There are a lot of complete f***nuts that are CHARGING BACK donations. God damn im pissed.

[PseudoticA]

Jesus i can't believe this..
Even if you look at it on neutral ground is stupid.. for god sake..
It's ok i understand that the reason of the collect was something a little selfish ( change the end of the game, that i'm agreed on that )
But to put that the reason for shutting it down, was the message from the raise is being polluted ( aka: petition,etc ) That doesn't even enter in my mind.
Even with that taken, it's stupid.. taking care of the image by denying help for the childrens, we are not killing civilians, not torturing, not even stealing.. this is more than a political move.. **** this.

Sorry for my bad english.

[CronoDragoon]

A_Lone_Gamer wrote...

I get where they are coming from, that child's play needs to be the cause. However they have hardly been neutral in this whole affair so it's kinda hard to think that if they were on our side that they'd still be doing this.

Given Explanation:
http://penny-arcade....ake-mass-effect

Shown Opinion:
http://penny-arcade....icious-invasion
http://penny-arcade....3/14/chronoloop
http://penny-arcade....es-are-effected

Gabe has not been neutral, Tycho has been neutral-leaning-supporting-our-right-to complain. And even with Gabe, so what? He can't voice his opinion on the movement? I think it's a bit paranoid to think this was done because someone doesn't like us.