575 réponses à ce sujet

[HenchxNarf]

lokiarchetype wrote...

I can see how, in the heat of the moment, it is easy to think "Oh yeah, you don't want my money? Then give it back!"

But don't forget who this is actually hurting, the beneficiaries of the charity.

CP is already doing them a disservice by refusing the donations. Be the better person, do not compound this by asking for a refund.

CP is not to blame here, so you need to rethink what you said. Tehy don't want to get involved in this because "CP should be the cause" and it wasn't. The cause was guilting BW into changing their ending.

[Computron2000]

golyoscsapagy wrote...

Computron2000 wrote...
Here, let me answer you with a post

MaximusRex wrote...
From someone who worked in the payment processing business, high amount doesn't really mean that much in terms of volume. If you normally get 1 chargeback a year then you get 5 in a week, that is a high amount. Charities are considered low risk of chargeback, though taking fund online is higher risk, most people don't steal credit cards to give the money away. It would take very little activity to raise alarms, so to speak, from a payment processing kind of term.

As i noted prior, the absolute number of transactions can be easily definied as high even if the percentage is low.

You are strawmanning.
Debate my statement - 'There are apparently more idiots in the retake movement than in the general public'. You add nothing either pro or contra to my argument.

Ah, you failed to use logic in your sentence structure there. 
 
Your statement was 
"This also means that apparently there are much more ****tards in the retake movement than in the general population (as if it was the same the refund ratio would be normal)."

No there are less ****tards in the retake movement than in the general population. Reason? Simply because the absolute population number is lower.
Would you like to try again?

Oh after you reframe your sentence correctly, here's the answer "The answer is unknown unless the general public experiences an event on the same level as what happened here, allowing the variables to be reflected fairly or you are comparing apples to oranges".

[Kulthar Drax]

Dridengx wrote...

Kulthar Drax wrote...

But I still stand by the fact everyone should be proud of the money raised to help kids

Except for the fact that the money wasn't raised FOR the kids but for ME3's new ending you wanted. AND you can't take pride in a movement that is asking for it's money back. You personally can be proud, but the rest of the world is not going to see it that way

Firstly, i'm pretty sure the money WASN'T raised for a new Mass Effect 3 ending. At least, the vast majority of people who donated I am pretty sure DID NOT do it for this reason. You also can't say that just because a few people (there are no hard numbers being discussed so it really does have to be assumed to be a very definite minority of people, perhaps even plants as a smear campaign? Who knows? I wouldn't entirely put it past some people to use such tactics. Unlikely but you can't rule it out 100%) are demanding money back. If you do, you yourself are doing what could be considered to be enacting a smear campaign against the group by tarring the entire group with the actions of a few. It is better to consider anyone doing such disgusting actions as to not be part of the group at all, regardless of what these individuals may express.

But regardless, I am proud of helping out and I will continue being proud of doing something to help kids charities etc. Whether we get a new ending or not, I don't care. I am just happy I did something to help out.

Modifié par Kulthar Drax, 23 mars 2012 - 01:21 .

[Dridengx]

thesmallearth wrote...


IMHO opinion the charity collection was used as a means to highlight a grievance BUT in doing so made a huge amount of money for a worhwhile charity, that may not have received the 80K otherwise.

I have respect for the 'movement' since the sought an outlet that would benefit others, its just a real pity that a bad bunch of apples can contaminate the whole barrel.

The underlying purpose is to help Bioware create the best product possible and any 'bodies' of people will always attract this type of 'extremists' and the best way to deal with these type of individuals is to create as much distance from this type of behaviour as possible.

Always be civil, polite, stick to the facts for a balanced discussion, and everyone wins.

So you admit Bioware's ending is what caused the movement to the charity, and you admit there is an underlying incentive behind the charity to 'help' Bioware create more product and in this case the ending you desire, correct? How is that not using the children then?

So you all banded together for the kids, not because of the ending? I saw a lot of threads here bragging about the charity and using it as a tool to prove they were not a minority. I'm not saying your RME group didn't have good intentions but bad leadership destroyed RME's image imo to the outsider.

[ScotGaymer]

@Driden

You are taking the fact that many of us were donating out of a desire to have a positive outlet for our negativity over the endings and twisting it to us using the charity for insidious means. Not true.

You are taking the apparent fact that SOME very stupid stupid people got the wrong idea about the movement because of some very stupid articles, and thus demanded their money back and twisting it to make it seem like ALL of us are like that. Again NOT TRUE.

And because you don't like im refuting you you fall back on the "well i wasn't even talking to you!"

You are being patently ridiculous.

Now I know you can be reasonable; i've I agreed with you a time or two in posts you have made because you were being reasonable and I reckoned you were right.
I don't know why it is, but there is something about the RetakeMassEffect movement that rubs you the wrong way and makes you come off incredibly hostile and seemingly makes you descend into incoherency. And you don't see that you are doing it, and wonder why people say you are a troll.

Your issues are your issues man. I just want you to quit making wide sweeping statements and insinuations about people that are completely not true. If I did the same thing then i would be going around telling everyone that all the Pro-Enders are irritating idiot douchebags like Colin Moriarity; but I don't because I don't believe that is the case.

EDIT:
Also the assertion that giving to charity is always and must always be this entirely altruistic thing is also ridiculous. No one ever gives to charity without reason (no matter what that reason is); so everyone who has ever given to charity must be selfish and their money tainted. By your logic.

As I said for most of us who were giving to the Child's Play charity. It was to have a positive outlet for our frustration and negativity. There is NOTHING wrong with that.

Again just because a small minded fools did the wrong thing, and acted for the wrong reasons, does not mean ALL of us are like that.

Modifié par FitScotGaymer, 23 mars 2012 - 01:26 .

[gmdinmd]

Child’s Play cannot be a tool to draw attention to a cause. Child’s Play must be the Cause.


Truer words were never said. I can understand not getting the ending to ME3... if you can't understand this simple statement then you have issues going beyond the disappointment in a video game.

[Tazzmission]

gmdinmd wrote...

Child’s Play cannot be a tool to draw attention to a cause. Child’s Play must be the Cause.


Truer words were never said. I can understand not getting the ending to ME3... if you can't understand this simple statement then you have issues going beyond the disappointment in a video game.

agreed. id love to touch on that more but it would be labeled bashing sadly

Modifié par Tazzmission, 23 mars 2012 - 01:23 .

[HenchxNarf]

gmdinmd wrote...

Child’s Play cannot be a tool to draw attention to a cause. Child’s Play must be the Cause.


Truer words were never said. I can understand not getting the ending to ME3... if you can't understand this simple statement then you have issues going beyond the disappointment in a video game.

Agreed.

[alex13abc]

If this is true, the people who did this should be truly ashamed. If it's a rumor that some are spreading in order to destroy retake, you'l be exposed soon enough.

[CasbynessPC]

Tazzmission wrote...

oviously you missed the conversation smart guy

i was talking about pc not bioware

heres the link wise guy

http://social.biowar...x/10496260&lf=8

read the thread before you start saying im making stuff up kid

You forgot to add a token insult to the second line

Sheesh. Can someone close this thread already? It's daft. It should be a wikipedia citation for how online arguments can be completely unproductive. If you keep this up someone will inevitably mention Hitler and crash the thread due to reaching the Online Conversation Singularity.

[The Night Mammoth]

Dridengx wrote...

Kulthar Drax wrote...

But I still stand by the fact everyone should be proud of the money raised to help kids

Except for the fact that the money wasn't raised FOR the kids but for ME3's new ending you wanted. AND you can't take pride in a movement that is asking for it's money back. You personally can be proud, but the rest of the world is not going to see it that way

Wonderful. Do you exist on this forum to make generalizations and declarative statements?

WHO CARES what the motivation was? This sort of thing happens all the time! Corporations, buisnesses, companies, they ALL support charities because they have a motive. Whether it's about improving their public image or promoting some sort of project, or about encouraging investors, it's for selfish reasons, mostly for the purpose of obtaining more money down the line. How is this any worse? The money goes to the children, we get something in return, that's how Charities continue to exist! They rely on this sort of thing. 

Even individuals do it for self gratification most of the time, not about whether they actually care. Charities make a lot of money from the spur of the moment guilt trips people have. They don't necessarily care about the children in Ethiopia who now have another brick to build a well, it's mostly about feeling good about oneself because you've done a good deed.

And frankly, why SHOULD people care that much? More often than not, the charity's cause is so far and removed from daily life that's there's little reason to spend too much time on it. Child's Play is gaming relevant, it was started by gamers, and it's supported by gamers. It's a cause much more worthy in the eyes of many people.

At least this means some sick kids reap the benefits of what many see is an bunch of entitled whiners. How can you argue against that? If the Retake movement gets what it wants, then everyone, not just the kids, reaps the benefits! It's an incredibly effective and peaceful form of protest, no one loses, everyone benefits. This could even set a precedant for the future. Feel like protesting? Donate to charity, don't review bomb or send hateful messages. Let a worthy cause reap the benefits of your displeasure.


Now, that rant over with, I do not condone asking for refunds from a charity drive. It's stupid, ignorant, arrogant, insane, and insulting to pretty much everyone, regardless of opinion on the movement. 
It cheapens the effect this has had, and it's especially insulting to people who support Retake. 

[Quietness]

Great, this discussion again with the same trolls from late last night who were using it as a means of furthering their own twisted views. The last 2 were locked for a reason...

[kleindropper]

Who is demanding money back and how dumb are they? Do they not know what a charitable contribution is?

[HenchxNarf]

Quietness wrote...

Great, this discussion again with the same trolls from late last night who were using it as a means of furthering their own twisted views. The last 2 were locked for a reason...

Just because they don't agree with you, does not make them trolls.

[Tazzmission]

CasbynessPC wrote...

Tazzmission wrote...

oviously you missed the conversation smart guy

i was talking about pc not bioware

heres the link wise guy

http://social.biowar...x/10496260&lf=8

read the thread before you start saying im making stuff up kid

You forgot to add a token insult to the second line

Sheesh. Can someone close this thread already? It's daft. It should be a wikipedia citation for how online arguments can be completely unproductive. If you keep this up someone will inevitably mention Hitler and crash the thread due to reaching the Online Conversation Singularity.

not sure how i shall respond

dont know if your agreeing or not

[golyoscsapagy]

Computron2000 wrote...

golyoscsapagy wrote...

Computron2000 wrote...
Here, let me answer you with a post

MaximusRex wrote...
From someone who worked in the payment processing business, high amount doesn't really mean that much in terms of volume. If you normally get 1 chargeback a year then you get 5 in a week, that is a high amount. Charities are considered low risk of chargeback, though taking fund online is higher risk, most people don't steal credit cards to give the money away. It would take very little activity to raise alarms, so to speak, from a payment processing kind of term.

As i noted prior, the absolute number of transactions can be easily definied as high even if the percentage is low.

You are strawmanning.
Debate my statement - 'There are apparently more idiots in the retake movement than in the general public'. You add nothing either pro or contra to my argument.

Ah, you failed to use logic in your sentence structure there. 
 
Your statement was 
"This also means that apparently there are much more ****tards in the retake movement than in the general population (as if it was the same the refund ratio would be normal)."

No there are less ****tards in the retake movement than in the general population. Reason? Simply because the absolute population number is lower.
Would you like to try again?

Oh after you reframe your sentence correctly, here's the answer "The answer is unknown unless the general public experiences an event on the same level as what happened here, allowing the variables to be reflected fairly or you are comparing apples to oranges".

Really, don't try anything that involves maths/statistics in your future, it will be a service to everyone.

For a guy who wrote tons of lines about ratios and variances you really try hard to substitute them however it serves your needs (and trying much harder to disregard words from sentences).

But probably that bolding magic will work on you:
"This also means that apparently there are much more ****tards in the retake movement than in the general population (as if it was the same the refund ratio would be normal)."  <- See what I did there? talking about ratios all the time. Not variances. Ratios.

'There are apparently more idiots in the retake movement than in the general public'.  And still talking about ratios. Again. There's no use to talk about variances when you don't know any numbers - not the one you are comparing not the other you are comparing to.

And no, while the quantity of idiots in the general population is probably higher, the ratio of idiots in the retake movement is more.  Otherwise they wouldn't achieve an out of the ordinary refund ratio. A further logical conclusion would be that everything that the retake movement stands for is more attractive to people who feel it perfectly normal that their charity donations should be refunded. That's not something I would be proud of.

Modifié par golyoscsapagy, 23 mars 2012 - 01:30 .

[Vaktathi]

gmdinmd wrote...

Child’s Play cannot be a tool to draw attention to a cause. Child’s Play must be the Cause.


Truer words were never said. I can understand not getting the ending to ME3... if you can't understand this simple statement then you have issues going beyond the disappointment in a video game.

Most people thankfully do. It didn't help yesterday though when the Chipin page went down for a while though and left some people in the dark as to what was happening.

[Tazzmission]

kleindropper wrote...

Who is demanding money back and how dumb are they? Do they not know what a charitable contribution is?

oviously not since being a consumer is more important apparenly

[jdgjordan]

dude no one is demanding there money back don't make an issue that is not there you just want to see people argue
and to the people that are believing him........ wow your idiots

Modifié par jdgjordan, 23 mars 2012 - 01:28 .

[ZLurps]

Hey Tazzmission.

I'm still waiting for a link for conversation where someone is actually asking their money back.

[Quietness]

HenchxNarf wrote...

Quietness wrote...

Great, this discussion again with the same trolls from late last night who were using it as a means of furthering their own twisted views. The last 2 were locked for a reason...

Just because they don't agree with you, does not make them trolls.

No you are a troll, you twist things to fit your little perception, and attempt to lump an incredibly small % of either idiots or just plain heartless bastards into a single group. You also refuse to do any research into anything without posting your small minded little views and claim them as fact.

edit: I also love how you prove your guilty conscience by hoping on my post and defending yourself within moments of me posting rather than ignoring it

Modifié par Quietness, 23 mars 2012 - 01:29 .

[HenchxNarf]

jdgjordan wrote...

dude no one is demanding there money back don't make an issue that is not there you just want to see people arguee and to the people that are believing him........ wow your idiots

When the founder of Child's Play states that there have been refund requests.. Who else are you supposed to believe?

[shadey]

like 70-80%+ of donations to charities get chewed up by administration fees anyway

people are acting like someone canceling a donation means a child is going to die or something

it's not

[Tazzmission]

ZLurps wrote...

Hey Tazzmission.

I'm still waiting for a link for conversation where someone is actually asking their money back.

expect it later on tonight

im trying to stay awake here and its already like 20 to 9 am where im at