250 réponses à ce sujet

[LinksOcarina]

All I have to say is screw you, you decided to give it to charity, deal with the write-off later.

[kbct]

lokiarchetype wrote...

Tens of thousands of dollars were donated

Some were taken back.

Do we even know how much?

Let's put this into perspective... Even if it was $10,000, which I very much doubt it was, that would only be 1/8 of the money that was raised.

But yes, clearly that automatically invalidates the rest of the donations and the drive is ruined forever and humanity is hopeless.

We don't have any information about quantities.

[Squallypo]

LinksOcarina wrote...

All I have to say is screw you, you decided to give it to charity, deal with the write-off later.

you cant be pointing over without evidence at all.. how hypocrite is that.

[Megakoresh]

*Leaves the 2-paged thread for 4 hours*
*Comes back to 9 pages*

[zigamortis]

ExpertKendal wrote...

So, this 'mishmash of gamers' that is over 50K strong who want a satisfying ending, as was promised by Bioware, 'dragged a charity' into the fight? Have you even read or understand WHY the Retake movement wanted to donate to a charity? 

Simply put, because of people like YOU

Perhaps you weren't as upset by the endings, how poorly written and executed they were. Perhaps you thought the endings were perfectly fine. That's your opinion, and if that's the case, I respectfully disagree. In order to demonstrate to the gaming media, like Penny Arcade, or IGN, or others, that this movement was not a mishmash, or a group of whiny 12 year olds who didn't get the shiny, happy, rainbow and unicorn, ending, we donated money to a cause to help sick children.

That charity, run by the same folks who happen to run Penny Arcade. Because some media outlets were portraying Child's Play as endorsing and supporting the movement, they asked we no longer make donations. (If a few cold hearted folks in the movement demand money back, that's shame on them. Whoever runs that charity, it does good work and should be applauded.) 

Now, step back a moment and look at this. You have a group of people, 50,000 strong (probably more), who are (for the most part) politely, professionally, asking that Bioware make good on their promises and provide an ending that functions as advertised. To demonstrate it is a group focused on acting in a good, polite, manner, they picked a charity related to the gaming industry and made donations. If you want to argue the politely part, go look at the posts on the boards and Facebook. Make note of the language and tone used, and also note how many different people ask that we keep it on a professional level, and applaud those that DO keep it that way. We do not want a flame war, never did, and will not tolerate it within the group. Keep in mind that the goup as a whole has said ME3 is a great game, EXCEPT FOR the final moments.

Now, you have the gaming media who have been insulting, derogatory, demeaning, and just plain belittling this group because we disagree with how the game ends, and have been vocal about it. The gaming media, and those that agree with them seem to think going the flame war route is perfectly acceptable. Since RetakeME3 doesn't agree, we're all stupid, pathetic, and so on.

Who again, is the group of whiny twelve year olds? Cause from the outside, it certainly appears to be the mainstream media going after the comparatively small group of dissatisfied gamers.

I know which side I'm on, and would remain on, simply for how they handle themselves.

Hold the line.

Well put good sir. Well put.
Hold the line.  Keelah Se'lai!

Modifié par zigamortis, 23 mars 2012 - 03:19 .

[Solmanian]

Ravax wrote...

Solmanian wrote...

GhostV9 wrote...

*sighs*

How much is going to the charity now?

According to the article, it says they stopped it. The folks at PA aren't willing to let child's play be used as a tool to advance some agenda other than that of child's play itself...

They stopped 'accepting' donations.. The money that was already raised, is still going to the charity, Do not assume things without info please..

What? I didn't say the money that was raised isn't going to charity, Just that they stopped the fundraiser. Everything I wrote is a direct quote from the PA site...

[Garathe]

I donated to the charity. I'm part of the RME. I was proud and more than willing to give my donation to Child's Play. I never once considered getting my money or thought of it as a bad thing. I don't agree with anyone who did ask for their money back and they should be ashamed for doing so. It's a legitimate charity that helps out sick children. I was one of those sick kids a long time ago and I would have loved a charity for helping out like this one does.

If someone thought that donating was a direct connection to "buying a new ending" then they obviously didn't read what was going on. It was stated that we were trying to make something positive out of something negative, that in the end, at least someone will benefit.

Since the charity ended, I had not seen anything about people wanting their money back in the group until I started seeing people posting the link for the PA site. It's all been about how disappointed we were that the charity ended but most people understood. It's going to be like anything else in the world with a group of people, everyone is going to have different opinions and ideas about what has happened. All it takes is a few people to mess things up for a group. So, to everyone, try to avoid the smearing on either side.

We don't know what happened. We don't know who was involved. We don't know that a large number of people asked for their money back. We have no idea how many actually asked.  We don't know if EA/Bioware put pressure on PA to make the charity cut ties. We don't know if this was the work of some who donated and tried withdraw their donation just to make the group look bad. We just don't know! So baseless accusations are in no way constructive and don't do anyone or the cause any good at all.

Modifié par Garathe, 23 mars 2012 - 03:21 .

[Vaktathi]

Some things everyone should keep in mind.

No hard numbers were given. "High" in this case means something greater than normal.

For Paypal to take notice, this could be as little as 2 or 3 requests in one or two days when otherwise they might get 1 every few months.

We're dealing with *thousands* of microtransactions from thousands of donors, which for the most part are an entirely different group than where Child's Play gets its normal donations (which tend to be organizations or wealthy individuals donating a lot in fewer transactions). As such, with a much higher number of transactions from a donation base that is much different than their normal donors, issues are likely to arise.

Whenever you have thousands of people doing something, there will be stupid people involved who will inevitably do stupid things.

Stop making it out like this was planned, or it was done as a group, or any other junk like that because *NOTHING* backs that up, and the majority of RME people are as upset, probably moreso, as anyone else at it.

[Solmanian]

BobSmith101 wrote...

Solmanian wrote...

hawkens982 wrote...

I think they need to post some examples of those emails supposedly sent. Of course blurb out the contact and names and just give us what is in the email. At least thats showing some proof that people are doing it, instead of just saying oh a bunch of emails were received and this is whats happening. If not, at least post the email from PayPal or something.

Why would they have a rason to sabotage their own charity? Srsly...

They don't want the charity to become a pawn in the power struggle. I can kind of see the point, a game is a fairly harmless thing, but less savoury groups could do the same thing to promote their agenda.


“It’s true that we received some negative feedback about the RTM fundraiser, but the real issue that it brought to light was our policy surrounding attaching other, unrelated causes to child’s play. What RTM was doing was very cool and an amazing show what an active community can do, but we were concerned about the slippery slope. For instance, if someone were to create a “support (insert cause X) by donating to child’s play,” you can see how this could cause issues for us.
So our discussion with the RTM folks had little to do with the specifics of their cause, but rather a policy issue we needed to address around fundraisers in general.”

Translation:They don't want the money from that source,because of possible long term effects. 

There's a big difference beween not wanting their charity being as PR to hammer in a cause, than making up lies and falsely accusing people of canceling donations...

[Walrusninja]

Shoot the lot of them as far as I'm concerned. Probably notice an instant improvement in the world.

[Arppis]

Every group has it's bad apples.

[Deadmac]

Do you know what guys and gals? After watching all the events unfold over the last few weeks, I have decided to take the side of the developer. If something this small is triggering gamer rage, I do not want to be associated with these types of players. Sure, I think game developers should be more consumer friendly; however, I am not going to burn the world down to make my point.

"Mass Affect III" is just a game.

When you wake up in the morning, the end of "Mass Affect III" should have no bearing on your life. Regardless about how unsatisfied you are with the end, the only things you should be worried about are your friends and family. Once you take advantage of an innocent charity, the message you rally behind becomes mute. "Mass Affect III" is only a small piece of entertainment, which cannot do anything physical damage to your lives. If such a small piece of entertainment is stopping you from living, I can only suggest that you should see a psychologist.

BioWare should just leave the ending as it was intended.

Child's Play does not exist, so that it can be abused in this manner.

Personally, I wonder how many people were manipulated due to these angry players, and I wonder how much damage they had on both Child's Play and BioWare. If you add in their attack on an innocent BioWare employee, the picture they paint is very disturbing and destructive.

BioWare and Child's Play should consider taking legal action.

This has gone too far.

[Eire Icon]

Just to clarify I think (my opinion only) everyone would accept that the vast majority of the "Retake" movement would never ask for their money back from a charity and are shocked and disgusted by this news

My point would be, that many "Retakers" have been taking the morale high ground on these forums over the last few weeks. All I would ask is you be consistent - denounce the actions of these few without trying to throw a veiled defence over it with "Conspiracy theories etc" - Just call it for what it is

[Squallypo]

Arppis wrote...

Every group has it's bad apples.

agreed, at the same time theres no proof of this assumptions though. 
and i cant really believe penny arcade 100%, they have been hating the group since day 1

[Solmanian]

Stonewall_Jack wrote...

Moonshadow_Dark wrote...

I'm not lumping the RME.

I just hate humanity.

What did you ever do to improve or help humanity or is your complaint here the epitome of your grand contribution? From someone who actual does charity works -

I spend the majority of my time helping people, even saving life. Every moment in my day is dedicated to trying to make what humble contribution I can to leave the world a better place than when I came to it. I work with large crowds, meeting the public face to face: There are saints and jerks. Believing that humanity is somehow inherently good is naive, and I've met more jerks than saints. Most people are just squarly in the middle, imperfect beings as expected from humans. Ten saints cant fix the damage of one jerk. I encountered people (ploral) who used kindergardeners for target practice with sniper rifles, how do u fix that?

[Squallypo]

Eire Icon wrote...

Just to clarify I think (my opinion only) everyone would accept that the vast majority of the "Retake" movement would never ask for their money back from a charity and are shocked and disgusted by this news

My point would be, that many "Retakers" have been taking the morale high ground on these forums over the last few weeks. All I would ask is you be consistent - denounce the actions of these few without trying to throw a veiled defence over it with "Conspiracy theories etc" - Just call it for what it is

you has no idea how pissed off im right now when i found out about this news of the charity issue.. but then again i has that good feeling that i got to help/donate to the charity cause it was a good cause <3

[Lord Mu Harlock]

Honestly, I donated five whole dollars knowing that it was going to Child's Play. I like the charity's cause, and I decided it was the paragon thing to show the Retake Movement as more than depressed and upset fans. And I still stand by my decision to give five dollars.

Now was the charitable arm the full amount of people in Retake. No, it wasn't. The last time I checked there were 3,656 unique donators who participated in that part of the Retake Movement. We have seen polls much higher numbers. There are videos with high viewing numbers such as the Angry Joe's "10 Ten Reasons the Mass Effect 3 Ending S***ed" and "10 Ten Reasons Why We Hate the Ending" both have over a hundred thousand views.

The question is how much is unique in all of this. I doubt many people are just rewatching the videos and clearing cache to rig the polls. There are probably a couple, but there is a large movement that seems to grow as more finish the games.

Bashing the Retake Movement for some who were confused is an easy way to try and take the higher ground, but it merely is rhetoric. There are no clear answers of the 3656 unique donators which is the last number that I remember before the site got taken down who are now demanding refunds. And to say all are demanding refunds or that 366 people are demanding their money back in inaccurate as well.

In the end, the charity portion of Retake succeeded beyond probably any expectations, and in the end, it went to a good cause even if the cause doesn't want to be associated with the group anymore. But most of the all for those who donated, we held the line.

[The Razman]

Arppis wrote...

Every group has it's bad apples.

I think its that the group doesn't seem to be addressing the bad apples behaviour which is a bit galling.

Nobody's said "that thing that a minority of you are doing ... don't do that". They're just ignoring it.

[Farbautisonn]

Deadmac wrote...
BioWare and Child's Play should consider taking legal action.

-Erm... Yes? A gaming studio suing their fans (who really?) is going to be great pr.

And a charity suing the donators? That will really put them in the grave. The legal fees alone wont be covered by the 80k. The PR backlash will ensure that donations dry up really fast. 

[Farbautisonn]

The Razman wrote...
I think its that the group doesn't seem to be addressing the bad apples behaviour which is a bit galling.

-Have you and I been following the same thread? I think its been stated here ad nauseam that the people who want their money back are fools.

[Fuzrum77]

Deadmac wrote...



Child's Play does not exist, so that it can be abused in this manner.

Personally, I wonder how many people were manipulated due to these angry players, and I wonder how much damage they had on both Child's Play and BioWare. If you add in their attack on an innocent BioWare employee, the picture they paint is very disturbing and destructive.

BioWare and Child's Play should consider taking legal action.

This has gone too far.

Absurd. And you know it. Abused? $80,000.00 raised for them. Take legal action? For us donating? Are you reading what you're typing?

No matter how much (and I doubt very much) was taken back from the charity drive, we did a lot of good here. And to totally dismiss that is absurd and uncalled for. I'm trying to remain calm, but this was too much.

[Wise Men]

"Child’s Play cannot be a tool to draw attention to a cause. Child’s Play must be the Cause. "

Nuff said.

[Solmanian]

Everwarden wrote...

citizenEXTINCT wrote...

You realize that's not EVERYONE from Retake, right?

I'm betting it's two people (of tens of thousands), and Penny Arcade just neglected to mention that.

Hell, it could be a fanboy trying to make the cause look bad.

One or two people wouldn't be a reason for alarms, you wouldn't write an article anytime someone accidently cancel something importent because he doesn't recognize the charges on his credit card. Last week my father accidently canceled our internet because he didn't understand what that charge was. And yet it didn't even merit a mention in our crappy local paper...

[Moonshadow_Dark]

Farbautisonn wrote...

Deadmac wrote...
BioWare and Child's Play should consider taking legal action.

-Erm... Yes? A gaming studio suing their fans (who really?) is going to be great pr.

And a charity suing the donators? That will really put them in the grave. The legal fees alone wont be covered by the 80k. The PR backlash will ensure that donations dry up really fast. 

When a game studio sue fans, that's bad.

When fans sue game studio, that's cool.

<_<

[Stanley Woo]

Not game related.

End of line.