523 réponses à ce sujet

[Neizd]

well...they did create great trillogy...even if they failed with the ending they still can do something about it. They are (or were) the best RPG game developers, so maybe they will think of something.

[Johanna]

Heliosas wrote...

Even if Bioware came onto these boards and agreed with us that they had messed up the ending they still wouldn't change it. They feel they can't. They feel bound by their own 'art'. We will not get what we want. Period.

Deep down, I fear you are correct, but I won't give up hope that they will see reason (and act on it).

I am an artist.  If someone paying me for my work was dissatisfied with what I had come up with, I would change it.  I've been lucky so far and haven't had to do that, but if it was requested of me by the person paying me for my work, I would change it.  That is what you do if you want to be paid.  This is a reality artists have to face.

Modifié par pants witch, 24 mars 2012 - 12:30 .

[kbct]

Draconis6666 wrote...

kbct wrote...

ZombifiedJake wrote...

I just completed the game about 5 minutes ago. How could they possibly continue from that finale? Who would want to continue from it?

Might as well just erase the last 10 minutes and go with something else entirely.

Agreed. I guarantee a ton of people will feel the same way. The tragic thing is the news sites are making it sound like there will be real changes. They will be surprised when the ending is basically the same but with more clarity.

Unfortunately, the window to return the game will be closed.

There is no possible way to add clarity to this ending without creating even larger plot holes, the fact that Bioware thinks there is, is the exact reason we have this terrible ending to begin with. The person who wrote the ending and decided it was a good ending should not be writing anything at all let alone the ending to a series, its poorly done, amature, and has next to nothign to do with the rest of the 3 games throwing out all of the Major plots of those games in favor of new ones created in the last 10 minutes of the game. It attempts to use symbolism to convey some sort of message that is completely lost, and if people have to ask what a symbol symbolizes then it doesnt, the writing is just plain bad and no amount of clarification is going to fix it properly. They shot themselves in the foot with this ending pure and simple, they cannot clarify it proerly without further destroying the series. This is what happens when you change the plot of your series halfway through and allow people with only average writing skills to be your new lead writer.

Agreed. A good number of people don't want a character introduced in the eleventh hour of the game wielding space magic.

[RocketManSR2]

pants witch wrote...

Heliosas wrote...

Even if Bioware came onto these boards and agreed with us that they had messed up the ending they still wouldn't change it. They feel they can't. They feel bound by their own 'art'. We will not get what we want. Period.

Deep down, I fear you are correct, but I won't give up hope that they will see reason (and act on it).

I am an artist.  If someone paying me for my work was dissatisfied with what I had come up with, I would change it.  I've been lucky so far and haven't had to do that, but if it was requested of me by the person paying me for my work, I would change it.  That is what you do if you want to be paid.  This is a reality artists have to face.

We have to be willing to accept a compromise and meet BioWare halfway. 

[Squallypo]

BootyBamBoo wrote...

Ah, some of us most of miss read this. People read it carefully till you get it. "Add more content" Which may mean add more endings to satisfy the player.

This by far... its what i still hope for, since the momment casey hudson said that we would get 16 diff endings plus the obvious part, IMPACT IN YOUR CHOICES, choices...choices..Choices..

[Draconis6666]

pants witch wrote...

Heliosas wrote...

Even if Bioware came onto these boards and agreed with us that they had messed up the ending they still wouldn't change it. They feel they can't. They feel bound by their own 'art'. We will not get what we want. Period.

Deep down, I fear you are correct, but I won't give up hope that they will see reason (and act on it).

I am an artist.  If someone paying me for my work was dissatisfied with what I had come up with, I would change it.  I've been lucky so far and haven't had to do that, but if it was requested of me by the person paying me for my work, I would change it.  That is what you do if you want to be paid.  This is a reality artists have to face.

I'm sure their 'Art' didnt stop them from changing things because EA said it was too expensive or would take too long though, corporate developers do not have any ground to stand on their Art as a reason to not change things. They compromised their vision of the product before it even released. What they are actualy saying is "we stand by our artistic vision against the people who we intend to buy our product. but allow it to be altered by the people who give us money" its a hypocracy from the beginning and a rediculous point to stand on that just makes you look foolish and does nothign to increase your reputability as a company but if anything further damages it.

[BiancoAngelo7]

kbct wrote...

BiancoAngelo7 wrote...

Lets try and keep our minds open. There's always time for despair. Let's at least wait until there's no chance that Bioware will make it right, no? (as in after they release the April DLC)

They should "clarify" their remarks then. Because right now it sounds like the colors and god-child are still in the game.

I understand what you mean, believe me, I love Mass Effect as much as the next guy and Im suffering right now just like the next guy.

But we gotta also put ourselves in their shoes. If they did just flat out say "we will release expansion dlc that wil continue your gameplay and provide the endings we promised" then it would pretty much take all the mystery out of what they will do, and whether the indoctrination theory is correct.

Now don't get me wrong, although I applaud Bioware for the ingenious IT theory (if correct) I DISAGREE with how long they are waiting to announce that we will have the "expansion DLC" as I called it a second ago.

If I were their lead marketing guy I would say: "Look guys, we were artistic, or forced, or not enough time, whatever. But now the time has come to tell our fans that the ending they got is "not the end".

Saying that simple line: "the ending in the game is not the final ending" would in my opinion, keep the mystery alive (considering many people don't even accept the possibility of the IT theory much less agree) as well as give hope in a general sense to anyone and everyone that is waiting and hoping for a better conclusion to the trilogy.

However, unfortunately I don't work for them and they are the only ones who know exactly how much this is hurting them and when they will concretely say exactly WHAT they are doing.

Long story short, I feel your pain brah, but all we can do is hope that we are right in our assumptions in that this was all planned, and also hope they release some solid info soon.

At least that's how I see it. 

[Johanna]

RocketManSR2 wrote...

pants witch wrote...

Heliosas wrote...

Even if Bioware came onto these boards and agreed with us that they had messed up the ending they still wouldn't change it. They feel they can't. They feel bound by their own 'art'. We will not get what we want. Period.

Deep down, I fear you are correct, but I won't give up hope that they will see reason (and act on it).

I am an artist.  If someone paying me for my work was dissatisfied with what I had come up with, I would change it.  I've been lucky so far and haven't had to do that, but if it was requested of me by the person paying me for my work, I would change it.  That is what you do if you want to be paid.  This is a reality artists have to face.

We have to be willing to accept a compromise and meet BioWare halfway. 

Compromise, or "compromise"?  The former sounds great.
Your comment is too vague, I am unable to see your entire position or how it contradicts my own.

[Darkeus]

In other news, EA/Bioware says they can exist without customers and money.

I would hope that they show a bit more intelligence. I personally think that trying to clarify the bad writing and plot holes would be more work than making new endings!

Not to mention that lazy deus ex machina....

[Haristo]

exactly what I wanted, it should fix execution issues generated by the rush and let this ending goes to its full potential.

[joejoe099]

if anything, this adds to them making indoct theory instead of changing all of it. "not change, but add more to clarify and add closure" means won't change full ending, just add after it.

[BitBasher]

I doubt BW would ever change the ending we saw. But what did we actually see? Lots of theories for sure.

What if the DLC continues the story between "what we saw" and the very end cutscene with the Normany? Are we 100% sure that is Shepard in the 2-sec extra cutscene? Shepard is not the only N7 soldier, and those with femsheps say the 2-sec cutscene seems male.

If any DLC does continue the story a bit to fill in the gaps, then we really didn't end the game in ME3. If the DLC was free I suspect most of us would be reasonably happy (perhaps they had a ship deadline and just ran out of time). If the DLC is $$$, then I predict more rage.

And on the other hand, if the DLC is set BEFORE then final part of the game, I'm going to wonder myself, "why bother".

[HairyMadDog1010]

At this point i would be happy if they just told us the the normady planet is only a few days/weeks away from earth

[RocketManSR2]

pants witch wrote..

Compromise, or "compromise"?  The former sounds great.
Your comment is too vague, I am unable to see your entire position or how it contradicts my own.

A lot of people want BioWare to completely change the endings and are disappointed that they aren't. They shouldn't have to. With that said, some additional ones or extending what's already there is a better alternative. Both sides get something they want. 

[Miekkas]

"We are creating new content to clarify and add closure as per the request of many loyal fans! That's all."

No, the majority of the requests by many fans was to scrap the existence of the Catalyst as an AI entirely as well as remove pretty much everything that happened after Anderson's death because that is where everything in the ending really began to fall apart horrifically. If Bioware really thinks they were listening to the fans, they did not read a single post in the ending feedback thread they made. If they do not fix the endings as the players have demanded in thousands of posts whether it be utilizing the indoctrination theory or removing everything that happened after Anderson's death, I will be simply taking my money elsewhere without a second thought for them not only insulting the fans once, but then twice. If they are too prideful to actually listen to the fans, then I cannot be bothered to waste my money, and I won't continue participating in this nonsense with them. I'll take my business solely to Bethesda who not only openly admits what the players want and admits fault all the way from the head aka Todd Howard himself, but also releases content to rectify the issue with a positive and receptive attitude.

[catofnine]

RocketManSR2 wrote...

So true. It would mean the real ending was planned as DLC all along, which is a no-no even to me. I support a lot of the DLC, even day 1 if it's good, but to make the "real" ending of any game DLC? That's a dangerous place to go. 

They could say technically the ending was shipped with the game since getting rid of the reapers one way or another was "the end," and anything prior to that was fair game for DLC.  But yeah, I think whether they do a cursory patch job in terms of text box epilogues or they flesh out this ending with additional content it's going to reflect badly on them as a company.  

[T-Bone101]

thank GOD!! just fill in plot holes with closure and I'm happy thank you bioware

[Draconis6666]

RocketManSR2 wrote...

pants witch wrote..

Compromise, or "compromise"?  The former sounds great.
Your comment is too vague, I am unable to see your entire position or how it contradicts my own.

A lot of people want BioWare to completely change the endings and are disappointed that they aren't. They shouldn't have to. With that said, some additional ones or extending what's already there is a better alternative. Both sides get something they want. 

No they shouldnt have to, but based on how badly done the ending we have been given is in its current form Its questionable if it can even be explained properly without taking far more time and effor than simply rewriting the ending, likely not. it has so many plot holes to fill that go so far as to completely invalidate the entire plot of the first game. If they actualy take the time and money to fill these holes properly so that everything comes together with the endings that exist then fine thats great, but I think alot of people feel they will haflass the clarification the same way they did the ending itself and just ignore the plot holes they have created or create new possibly even larger ones to fix them.

The key point here is that Bioware NEEDS to do something to fix their writing because their writing is the only selling point they have for their games as a company. They dont make spectacular graphics, or awesome gameplay everything besides the riding is simply average or even poorly done. Not properly reinforcing their ending or creating new ones will just "prove" to many people that they have lost touch with reality and lost their ability to create plots that people want to pay for which will just be another nail in their coffin as a developer. 

Modifié par Draconis6666, 24 mars 2012 - 12:52 .

[kbct]

BiancoAngelo7 wrote...

I understand what you mean, believe me, I love Mass Effect as much as the next guy and Im suffering right now just like the next guy.

Well, I hope BioWare knows what they are doing. I would really like to see them succeed with the new ending. Unfortunately, I think it will be difficult to change the minds of fans by clarifying the ending and adding closure. If they're gonna actually do something to the ending based off the dismal fan response, it would seem prudent to at least ask the fans what would make the most fans happy.

Modifié par kbct, 24 mars 2012 - 12:50 .

[Johanna]

RocketManSR2 wrote...

pants witch wrote..

Compromise, or "compromise"?  The former sounds great.
Your comment is too vague, I am unable to see your entire position or how it contradicts my own.

A lot of people want BioWare to completely change the endings and are disappointed that they aren't. They shouldn't have to. With that said, some additional ones or extending what's already there is a better alternative. Both sides get something they want. 

Hmm. From what I've seen, most people would be happy with new endings in addition to what is already there, so that the users who enjoyed the current endings are not robbed of their experience.  This is my position, so it seems we are in agreement.  Cheers to that! 

Modifié par pants witch, 24 mars 2012 - 12:50 .

[weltraumhamster89]

:wizard: bIndoc -->

cmj428 wrote...
I really think and hope this is actually what's gonna happen.
For them to just start new content after the release and backlash, april is just too quick for anything substancial unless they where already working on it.

I don't think they were working on anything post-ending... ;( It really is to quick to release something substantial in April, so either they release a "video" of some sort showing us how our Shep dies, the crew kills itself on the jungle-planet and the alien races slowly starve in the diff. star systems OR they give us info in April about a bigger DLC coming up this year.

Either way, also this:

Draconis6666 wrote...
There is no possible way to add clarity to this ending without creating even larger plot holes, the fact that Bioware thinks there is, is the exact reason we have this terrible ending to begin with. The person who wrote the ending and decided it was a good ending should not be writing anything at all let alone the ending to a series, its poorly done, amature, and has next to nothign to do with the rest of the 3 games throwing out all of the Major plots of those games in favor of new ones created in the last 10 minutes of the game. It attempts to use symbolism to convey some sort of message that is completely lost, and if people have to ask what a symbol symbolizes then it doesnt, the writing is just plain bad and no amount of clarification is going to fix it properly. They shot themselves in the foot with this ending pure and simple, they cannot clarify it proerly without further destroying the series. This is what happens when you change the plot of your series halfway through and allow people with only average writing skills to be your new lead writer.

Even beyond that simply clarifying the terrible ending that exists will not solve the issue, because it does NOTHING to change the fact that Bioware outright lied to its customers about what the endings would be like well AFTER the game had gone gold. Clarifying what exists will not change the fact that they lied about the endings. Bioware is draging itself down defending this terrible ending sadly and I would not be suprised if they are non-existant as a company in several years. They have lost touch with reality of what makes people want to play games, and have replaced it with poorly written plots that are not worthy of their earlier work in the name of making money which is almost always a sign of death or stagnation for developers. They may continue to make games in the future and linger around but its unlikely that their products will have anywhere near the impact they once did or anywhere near the number of fans. Bioware frankly is not a good enough developer to sell games based on anything but their story, they are terrible at creating games that are not full of bugs, bad animation, poor mechanics, etc. If people no longer trust that their games stories will be worth playing the game for then their games are not likely to sell well.

So, I hope it's really not "Bye bye, Bioware". Because If they only will "clarify" this steaming pile of s***, I will turn my back on this company for good - DA2 was the first strike, now ME3 was just too much for me to tolerate.
I guess making money by selling hasty-made games and DLCs etc. is more important than loyal fans..

:bandit:by 

[Draconis6666]

weltraumhamster89 wrote...



So, I hope it's really not "Bye bye, Bioware". Because If they only will "clarify" this steaming pile of s***, I will turn my back on this company for good - DA2 was the first strike, now ME3 was just too much for me to tolerate.
I guess making money by selling hasty-made games and DLCs etc. is more important than loyal fans..

:bandit:by 

That sums up what the gaming indsustry has become exactly, and its also why development studios have lifespans of years now instead of decades. Its a common theme of corporate greed, where coporations destroy long term profitability in the name of greater short term gains. It happens all the time in corporate business and its starting to happen to the gaming industry as well. Corporations are so concerned with making as much money as they can RIGHT NOW that they drive themselves into financial hardship a few years down the road.

[UrgentArchengel]

Sigh...

[The Fan]

No new endings? Just clarification to mop up the crap? You have got to be kidding me.

[Draconis6666]

The real problem is they wrote themselves into a position where they have no ideal way out of it, but I feel that supporting their badly written and thought out ending is the worst possible choice. If its not done properly it will totally undermine the faith people have in their ability as writers which is the cornerstone of their business. So In some ways I respect them for taking the clarity route as it is the most difficult and risky for them to salvage the situation with, but that will depend on how they do it. If its done properly it will restore my faith in them much more than a new ending would, but if its done poorly it will make alot of people write them off as a developer completely I'm afraid.