210 réponses à ce sujet

[jmd4]

Uthenera wrote...

jmd4 wrote...
Also, if Sandal's father was an Aeducan and Bhelen sat the throne and knew of his existence, think what would happen! Bhelen would stop at nothing to find Sandal, I think, as another dangerous heir to the throne. That would be some grist for the story mill.

An intriguing thought, but why would Bhelen consider Sandal as a threat to his throne? Some tradition was brought down by him, but probably not all, so why would the Assembly choose a surfacer, who seems to be even simpleminded to be the next king of Orzammar? Of course Sandal's behaviour could be a part of a clever act, and probably because of his seemingly simplicity of his the Assembly can decide, that it would be nice to have someone on the throne, who could be controlled easily.

Sorry for the belated reply! I would think Bhelen's mercenary tendencies would make him want to seek out and remove any possible threats to his reign. Admitedly, there are some Aeducan cousins in Orzammar (and the vaguely mentioned Kenalden Aeducans, about which I am VERY curious) that he lets be, but still...Sandal, while simple, is a powerful dwarf...maybe even a mage of some sort. A savant, ceratinly, and useful in that way. Bhelen doesn't hesitate to take out the competition.

[jmd4]

I feel the "kill all dwarves" notion is partly just trolling but also maybe comes from some sense that dwarves, as a traditional fantasy race, are dull and less special than, say, qunari. Also, there's this running theme of dwarves being extinct or nearly extinct in a lot of fantasy settings. That's what makes DA special, though--dwarves actually exist and are interesting.

I just don't want dwarves in future games reduced to greedy merchants or idiot ninja carta thugs, as has been mentioned above. We had too much of that in DA2 and the stereotyping really flew in the face of the richness of dwarven culture we got in DAO.

[Tpiom]

jmd4 wrote...

I feel the "kill all dwarves" notion is partly just trolling but also maybe comes from some sense that dwarves, as a traditional fantasy race, are dull and less special than, say, qunari. Also, there's this running theme of dwarves being extinct or nearly extinct in a lot of fantasy settings. That's what makes DA special, though--dwarves actually exist and are interesting.

I just don't want dwarves in future games reduced to greedy merchants or idiot ninja carta thugs, as has been mentioned above. We had too much of that in DA2 and the stereotyping really flew in the face of the richness of dwarven culture we got in DAO.

But it makes sense too. The Dwarven empire has been crumbling for quite some time - Thaig after Thaig is lost... and then Kal-Sharok (assuming you didn't recover it in Awakening... and if I'm not mistaken Orzammar only sent a recon group). Having Orzammar fall too would complete the puzzle. It endured a civil war during Origins after all. How much more can it take?

Of course, not all should be killed - but the majoirty. Ony a few should survive such as Varric and the ones we know. The future Dragon Age game could lay a new future for the Dwarves.


At the moment, I feel that Orzammar is in no position to change the way the Dwarves act or behave. Outcasts are rare and we have already seen the place (and therefore how they are in the city). They have no future!

Modifié par Tpiom, 27 mars 2012 - 12:51 .

[Uthenera]

sjpelkessjpeler wrote...

esper wrote...

Tpiom wrote...

My wish is that they are skipped. We already know them well enough. There's, countless, species and races that we haven't encountered yet... I hope?

They should kill them off. All dwarves are exterminated - now that would be something!

Actually there are only the Fex.

Red about the Fex in another thread. Going of the subject here but who/what are they?

The natives of Par Vollen

[Uthenera]

sjpelkessjpeler wrote...

Thanx for the info .

Happy to help. Nothing much is known about them, you can't meet them outside Par Vollen, From Par Vollen they write this "The humans who once lived there were more primitive than elsewhere in Thedas, building pyramids in their jungle cities and generally being isolated from other cultures further south." but i'm not sure that theese aforementioned humans are the same peole as the Fex.  Maybe if they are the same are they like the ****** sapien sapiens and the ****** sapiens neanderthalensis? It just me, dut i couldn't call primitive someone, who can build pyramids.

[Uthenera]

ev76 wrote...

I comepletely forgot about zerlinda. Thanks for refreshing the old noggin, and I believe her name was dagna. That would be cool if the setting gave enough time for either zerlinda's baby or for that matter oghren's kid to get a mention. Or maybe a side quest.

They are probably at the age to have a bigger role, or even became companion, Well its just wishful thinking. We don't know the exact age of Zerlinda's son in 9:30 DA, when the Fifth Blight happens, he's a small child  from a baby till a toddler he could be of  any age old, Varric get's captured in 9:40, and we don't know when DA 3 will begin, right after that or some years later, Oghren's kid was born probably in 9:31 DA when the events of the Awakenings happen. 

[WardenWade]

Tpiom wrote...

jmd4 wrote...

I feel the "kill all dwarves" notion is partly just trolling but also maybe comes from some sense that dwarves, as a traditional fantasy race, are dull and less special than, say, qunari. Also, there's this running theme of dwarves being extinct or nearly extinct in a lot of fantasy settings. That's what makes DA special, though--dwarves actually exist and are interesting.

I just don't want dwarves in future games reduced to greedy merchants or idiot ninja carta thugs, as has been mentioned above. We had too much of that in DA2 and the stereotyping really flew in the face of the richness of dwarven culture we got in DAO.

But it makes sense too. The Dwarven empire has been crumbling for quite some time - Thaig after Thaig is lost... and then Kal-Sharok (assuming you didn't recover it in Awakening... and if I'm not mistaken Orzammar only sent a recon group). Having Orzammar fall too would complete the puzzle. It endured a civil war during Origins after all. How much more can it take?

Of course, not all should be killed - but the majoirty. Ony a few should survive such as Varric and the ones we know. The future Dragon Age game could lay a new future for the Dwarves.


At the moment, I feel that Orzammar is in no position to change the way the Dwarves act or behave. Outcasts are rare and we have already seen the place (and therefore how they are in the city). They have no future!

I believe it was Kal Hirol in Awakening, Tpiom.  As far as we know, Kal Sharok still stands.

For my part I feel a part of the appeal of the dwarves and why they're important are just these sorts of things you mention.  The dwarves are indeed close to the edge, both as a people (their low birth rate) and as regards their remaining thaigs.  But they hold on and keep fighting, sometimes literally as the lone guard at the gate.  It would be a devastating blow for the world if all or even most of the dwarves of Orzammar disappeared, IMO...the darkspawn would emerge unchecked.

And as you mention, a thaig is indeed reclaimed in Awakening.  It takes great effort to do so, but it seems to me to be a hopeful sign for the possibility of retaking areas thought lost for good and expanding the kingdom.

Modifié par WardenWade, 27 mars 2012 - 05:18 .

[unbentbuzzkill]

Maybe in da3 the dwarves should splinter off into factions, such as one sect might side with templers and one sides with the mages

[Das Tentakel]

sjpelkessjpeler wrote...

Really going of the subject here but to reply to what you stated:
Its mostly the ignorance of the persons who write about other persons/races who decide if a race/civilasation is primitive. Often it has to do with religion, technical advancement and the such. Primitive has nothing to do with intelligence.

That's what struck me in DA2; one way or the other dwarves' role wasn't as deep as it could have been. They were mercenairies, traders or thieves as far as I can recall. Oh, forgot there was a male dwarve in the brothel.

Let's put it this way:

Pyramids: Check
Jungles: Check

Ergo: Fantasy Mayas, thus primitive (from a modern Western perspective).
I am not sure it would make sense for Thedans to consider a people clever enough to establish cities in harsh tropical conditions 'primitive', especially if they themselves are basically at a vaguely late medieval/pre-gunpowder stage of civilisation.
Foreign, odd and 'barbarian' perhaps, but primitive?<_<



Yo man, I'm primitive, but your Fur...fer...frell...whatever smell of dog. And we eat fried dog with chili peppers. We call them hot dogs...

One thing that slightly bothered me about the Dwarves in Kirkwall was that I couldn't fathom their political and social status in the city.
Were they an autonomous community within the city with specified military and economic obligations? Or just 'dwarves' who happened to be traders and criminals? How did they co-exist with the human majority?
A population group composed of traders and criminals won't be very popular with the citizenry at large...

Modifié par Das Tentakel, 27 mars 2012 - 05:39 .

[Tpiom]

jmd4 wrote...

It would be a devastating blow for the world if all or even most of the dwarves of Orzammar disappeared, IMO...the darkspawn would emerge unchecked..

That would be interesting indeed... Although, aren't they too disorganized when there's not a blight? And since the last one just ended and there have only been five in total through the ages.

Another blight would be crazy... so soon after. Thedas is doomed (well, especially Ferelden). Make it happen, Bioware!

sjpelkessjpeler wrote...

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Not to mention; if there were no more dwarves who would mine and refine the lyrium Thedas depends on?

Good question... The templars would be powerless to stop the mages (in the current conflict) without lyrium!

Modifié par Tpiom, 27 mars 2012 - 06:33 .

[Uthenera]

Well if the dwarves wouldn't pin down the darkspawns into the Deep Roads probably there would be more raid on the surface,for supply, for females i think the alphas could command something like a raid, without much trouble, and they numbers would grow in a faster rate, so probably the Blight would came in a quicker pace

[ImperatorMortis]

Exterminated, so I won't have to look at their ugly pudgy faces again. Unless they're supporting mages, then they can live.

And I swear to God.. If they bring Sandal back again, they had better give me an option to kill him. 

Modifié par ImperatorMortis, 27 mars 2012 - 08:14 .

[Das Tentakel]

Uthenera wrote...

Well if the dwarves wouldn't pin down the darkspawns into the Deep Roads probably there would be more raid on the surface,for supply, for females i think the alphas could command something like a raid, without much trouble, and they numbers would grow in a faster rate, so probably the Blight would came in a quicker pace

Whence the idea the dwarves pin down the darkspawn? That´s what some Dwarves say, but the Deep Roads are vast, and the Dwarves only hold on to a small part of it. With the possible exception of the immediate vicinity of the two remaining Dwarven cities, it seems to me the Darkspawn can pretty much do underground what they want. 
The main factor keeping them down appears to be lack of organization - hence the importance of an Archdemon, welding them into armies capable of taking on the forces of organized states, whether human or Dwarven.
Presumably under normal circumstances merely local forces, perhaps backed up by some Grey Wardens, suffice to keep them in check.

[ev76]

Well uthenera it would be interesting if they started dragon age 3 where oghren's or zerlinda's child could be a recruitible member. And I think that although dagna is Casteless, the fact that she is a member of the circle would be significant for dwarven support of the mages. I really could see two factions forming among the dwarfs each supporting either side like it has been mentioned before in this thread. Making this a stronger possibility could be decided on who you helped out in da:o and da2. Remember if you chose bhelen as king in origins you have an opportunity to help harrowmonts cousin.

There is no doubt in my mind that the dwarves are as sjpelkessjpeler put it, the binding factor of thedas. The more I read this thread the more sense it makes that bioware wil make the dwarves a serious plot point in the Mage/ Templar war.

[ev76]

Thanks sjpelkessjpeler, the dwarfs if done right can be part of the resolution to the war or can be what sends the war into more turmoil. How do you think they can or will incorporate dwarven power to sway the war?

[WardenWade]

sjpelkessjpeler wrote...

That's true Uthenera. The more darkspawn created the more of them will look for an old god.

The dwarves have a significant rol above and underground. I dare say that they are the binding factor of Thedas.

Very true!  There's also the disciples now, that I imagine would be able to pull the darkspawn together even in the absence of a full Blight, or lead them with greater purpose to seek the last two archdemons.

I totally agree with that last statement, sjpelkessjpeler.  IMO all the races of Thedas are yoked together in one ultimate destiny, whatever that may be.  Dwarves are extremely important no matter where you come from and their resolve serves to protect the surface races on a daily basis.