Precisely. The wounded archdemon wants to find a host and reshape the latter into a new body. It doesn't want to share.
Share what the soul?
The transfer is automatic which mean that is not the Archdemon decision to jump into an host is simply the taint which is channeling his soul.
I once argued that gameplay wise if the player dress Loghain with the same armor and helmet of the warden nobody will know who killed the Archdemon between the two especially after that chaotic explosion.It seems you are trying push some kind of your own personal RP or headcanon for being objective history. Sorry to say it but the Warden protagonist in DAO is kind of a cookie cutter ''Chosen One'' story, whether you like it or not.
Loghain's is recognized as traitor and disgrace, doesn't matter which ending you choose. His Legacy can be salvaged a bit by last hiting the AD,for those players that think he deserve it. I think he does.
The random gossip npcs and inn keepers are all the same in the game and location doesn't matter, afaik.
Share what the soul?
The transfer is automatic which mean that is not the Archdemon decision to jump into an host is simply the taint which is channeling his soul.
How is OG Kieran's possession meant to be understood? Is it like a Justice/Anders thing?
You mean the taint has self-preservation instincts? How odd.
I'm more inclined to think of it in terms of natural laws. Everything in the world automatically follows the path of least resistance. Why not the Taint?
You mean the taint has self-preservation instincts? How odd.
I'm more inclined to think of it in terms of natural laws. Everything in the world automatically follows the path of least resistance. Why not the Taint?
The Bioware writers were probably inspired by the symbiotes of the Marvel universe for the taint because it resemble them in every way.
The path of least resistance could be the air or the cracks on the ground.
Not quite. And what I meant was that assuming that the Taint isn't actually intelligent, it has to follow whatever physical laws enable it, and souls for that matter, to exist in Thedas the first place, and both energy and matter simply going where it's easiest for them to go according to their respective mechanics is one of the most fundamental principles of real world physics. Doesn't mean that I would expect it to act exactly like, say, electricity.
This why I don't believe anyone but a non-mage Warden specializing in Spirit magic could be justified arguing with Morrigan about the mechanics of the Dark Ritual, for the same reason that people going "couldn't the sun explode if you shot it with lasers?" wouldn't be taken seriously. The actual principles behind any physical phenomenon is a damn sight more complicated than they seem, and you just can't predict them in any but the most general scenarios without knowing them properly. And I'd bet the mechanics behind the transfer of a god-soul aren't simple even by scientific standards.
but not what you're doing to an innocent child.
''Innocent'' is not nearly as important as the child being your own.
Unless the Warden is a mage, hence fascinated about such things i don't think he would like the idea of his own child being a host of an old god, or in other words the product of a magic experiment or a ritual.
My Rogue/Warrior Wardens want their children to be ''organic''. Hell, even my mage Wardens want that.
''Innocent'' is not nearly as important as the child being your own.
Unless the Warden is a mage, hence fascinated about such things i don't think he would like the idea of his own child being a host of an old god, or in other words the product of a magic experiment or a ritual.
My Rogue/Warrior Wardens want their children to be ''organic''. Hell, even my mage Wardens want that.
There's also that it isn't actually being done to a child. The day after conception it isn't even a fetus. It's just a few cells that wouldn't have existed without the agreement to do the Ritual in the first place, busily preparing to grow into something real. Enhancing it with the god soul at that stage is more appropriately thought of as part of the extended conception of a child with a god soul than a child with an existing soul having it replaced by something unnatural.
And the Warden not being happy about conceiving a child who is to play host to a god isn't the same thing as the Warden being so repulsed by the idea that they'd literally rather die. Dwarven Wardens are no strangers to the concept of children being born to benefit their parents and then thrown to the wolves if they disappoint. And who's to say that a manwhore Cousland doesn't have two or three unachknowledged by-blows already? Definitely not unheard of.
And for a city elf, the thought of a child of theirs being born with guaranteed power and freedom and security, destined for greatness might not seem so horrible after all.
The weirdest, most inconsistent about Kieran is that he did in fact develop a sense of identity of his own separate from Urthemiel. I mean that's not the way it works for anyone else...even if they start with their own sense of identity...which fetus-boy didn't and which was essential to the entire theory of how Urthemiel survived in him.
But is Kieran still his own person even if he is, well... sharing space? How much power does he have in this relationship?
The way Morrigan explains it, it's always sounded to me like the child would just be born with one very special soul, not unlike the Dragonborn from Elder Scrolls. I haven't seen enough of Kieran in Inquisition to make a call myself. What's he actually like if the Ritual was performed?
Except for not being actually alive.
Anyway, I really would like to talk about Kieran.
Morality debates regarding the DR always revolve around what it means to be a true Grey Warden or whether it is a careless decision, but not what you're doing to an innocent child.
How much of Kieran's identity remains? When he speaks, is it Urthemiel that we hear or the boy? What sort of psychological damage can we expect now that Flemeth removed the OGS?
And of course, OG Kieran probably hasn't experienced a good childhood.
Not quite. And what I meant was that assuming that the Taint isn't actually intelligent, it has to follow whatever physical laws enable it, and souls for that matter, to exist in Thedas the first place, and both energy and matter simply going where it's easiest for them to go according to their respective mechanics is one of the most fundamental principles of real world physics. Doesn't mean that I would expect it to act exactly like, say, electricity.
And for a city elf, the thought of a child of theirs being born with quaranteed power and freedom and security, destined for greatness might not seem so horrible after all.
who's to say that a manwhore Cousland doesn't have two or three unachknowledged by-blows already? Definitely not unheard of.
That's obviously a generalization that disregard all the branches of statistics, thermochemistry and thermodynamics if you truly think that matter simply works that way by taking the "easiest route" which doesn't mean anything in science.Destined for greatness according to your own perspective(and Also Morrigan huge mistake) because to me he was only destined to be hunted by Flemeth and i was right.Also it takes more than a week to complete the ritual before the merging and the fact that the warden is unaware of him having double soul give me a significant pause.I Don't Care About Others in the case of my noble warden i only care of his morality code.
You're going to have to give an example of nature somehow deliberately making things difficult for itself for me to take that first part seriously.
It was my impression that the thread is about discussing how different characters might think of the choice differently. If all we've been talking about all along is how you and your "noble Warden" see things then it's no wonder you take it so personally, and have such a problem with people proposing alternate views. And no, in that case I don't give a damn about you either. I am, however, interested in the general range of roleplaying options.
Writing mistake or not, what's explicitly in the game is explicitly in the game. The Ritual takes place on the night before the great battle, and the army travels as quickly as physically possible from Redcliffe to Denerim over the next day. Which makes sense, as the capital is under attack. One day is a little impropable, but a week is way too long. There couldn't possibly have been anything left of Denerim if that timeline was correct, as the army have several times farther to travel than the darkspawn.
See it for yourself.
It includes both versions.
Thank you for the effort, but I'm currently gearing up for my next Inquisition playthrough and don't want to spoil myself by watching in-game cutscenes. Just a quick, general idea of his behaviour would be nice if it isn't too much trouble. How does Urthemiel manifest in his regular personality, if at all?
Urthemiel doesn't manifest in the way Justice does when he takes over Anders. It's just Kieran that changes on a basic level.
Wouldn't that suggest Urthemiel being an integral part of his nature rather than a seperate one? Maybe OGB!Kieran's soul is a true fusion of the two instead of one replacing the other or a struggle between them. That could be interesting in all kinds of ways, if anything even more dangerous and unpredictable than the vanilla old god soul.
Indeed, but now it's gone and he will never feel whole.
Meh, kids adjust quickly. He'll walk it off.
I Don't Care About Others in the case of my noble warden i only care of his morality code and no Cousland before him conceived a child with blood magic and damn for sure he will not.in all fairness i think that most people don't conceive childs with blood magic njd yes i'm one of those who has a huge problem with blood magic.
Which has what to do with the Dark Ritual?
Imo Kieran being OGB is similar to having schizophrenia or something of the sort. He feels ''lonely'' after Flemeth takes the soul because he can no longer hear voices inside his head or another's pressence deep inside
Imo Kieran being OGB is similar to having schizophrenia or something of the sort. He feels ''lonely'' after Flemeth takes the soul because he can no longer hear voices inside his head or another's pressence deep inside
Yes and no, really, The whole point of schizophrenia is that the voices and the presence aren't actually there. Everybody gets lonely after having been used to someone's company for years.
Wouldn't that suggest Urthemiel being an integral part of his nature rather than a seperate one? Maybe OGB!Kieran's soul is a true fusion of the two instead of one replacing the other or a struggle between them. That could be interesting in all kinds of ways, if anything even more dangerous and unpredictable than the vanilla old god soul.
It's almost certainly not a true fusion. That would have really screwed Kieran up when it was removed. It seems to have been sort of like a roommate relationship, only the room is the few cubic inches inside Kieran's skull.
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