103 réponses à ce sujet

[LPPrince]

Who cares what war is REALLY like?

This is a video game. If I wanted real war, I'd join the military.

I'm playing a game and investing my time and money into it to be left HAPPY at the end, not to feel like I got stabbed in the gut.

[JohnLena]

Tali can die too......

[xeNNN]

Toalhinha wrote...

tempAE0F wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

People still don't understand that you cannot have a happy ending when billions and billions of people are dead.

How is this so hard to understand?

Did World War II have a happy ending because some people made it out alive?

NO.

Uh, actually it did.

The war was horrible and what happened was bad, but those people who survived and moved on certainly had a happy ending.

And last I checked, billions dying in a war doesn't mean that Shepard has to die under all circumstances. What kind of logic is that?

Man, the wars didn't have a happy ending, there's nothing happy about wars. People suffer PTDs, loses family members, homes, identities, even sense of right and wrong, and live with the memories of war for their whole lives. That's not a happy ending, that's a better ending than dying, and it doesn't stop you from being happy AFTER , but the ending itself isnt happy. There are people who overcome, and people who don't.

the difference here is it isnt real life, yeah maybe a sense of realism is needed in terms of war driven games "in terms of mass effect 3 anyway" , but the fact remains that you've always had a choice, where as you cant minipulate real life to have a "happy" ending, the fact is in games you can and thats what we've had for 2 games up until mass effect 3, considering the endings are no different there is no reason to really play paragon or renegade anymore.

there was a distinct difference in the previous games but there isnt here, again i understand they have to impliment a certain sense of realism or the game would be boring and emotionless however doesnt lack from the fact we didnt have a choice in the matter like we always had, they still could of finished shepards story with mass effect 3 even with a happy "ponies and rainbows happening" or atleast one where he lived, i dont think the franchise should of sarcrificed core game mechanics just to end a protangonists story.

[Felene]

http://hellstern.dev...ended-290288819


I just want to see Shepard with her friends again, drinking, have fun, laughing.

Modifié par Felene, 25 mars 2012 - 03:23 .

[LPPrince]

Felene wrote...

http://hellstern.dev...ended-290288819


I just want to see Shepard with her friends again, drinking, have fun, laughing.

That would've worked wonderfully.

[Pee Jae]

Felene wrote...

http://hellstern.dev...ended-290288819


I just want to see Shepard with her friends again, drinking, have fun, laughing.

I want this as one of my endings. Hey, if they can photoshop a stock pic for Tali's face....

[ThatDancingTurian]

Excellent point, OP. I agree 100% and I think it's really rude of people to think wanting the series to end on a high note means we're asking for something as unrealistic as godchild!spacemagic.

LPPrince wrote...

Who cares what war is REALLY like?

This is a video game. If I wanted real war, I'd join the military.

I'm playing a game and investing my time and money into it to be left HAPPY at the end, not to feel like I got stabbed in the gut.

This, a thousand times this. We've all got problems in real life, there's a reason for this kind of escapism. Mass Effect always billed itself like a Star Wars-esque epic, not some gritty, dystopian war game. If it had, I would never have gotten into it in the first place.

[TanithAeyrs]

CGramn wrote...

Well, judging from what Bioware's been saying in interviews and their Final Hours statements, The Lord of The Rings is apparently a story that fails to survive modern storytelling because (SPOILER ALERT?) Frodo doesn't jump into the fires of Mount Doom with the ring, and doesn't send the civilizations of Middle Earth into the stone ages.

The fact that they honestly believed there was only one single way the story of Shepard could end, and the ridiculousness of how they ultimately decided it should end, paints them as deeply cynical towards conventional storytelling, as well as the themes they'd established throughout the previous games.

I've said this in other posts, but the amount of sacrifices Shepard and everyone else in the Galaxy as a whole has made, depending somewhat on your decisions, should be enough to warrant a positive ending as an alternative.

Wanting a positive ending based on the choices we've made throughout 3 games is not a childish notion, the notion that everything has to end in destruction and despair because someone thinks it's "edgy" or contemporary is.

LOL, this may be a bit off for this thread but LOTR was not a "happy" ending.   The ring had changed Frodo to the point where he didn't fit in his beloved Shire anymore - he went to the Grey Havens with the elves (who all left middle earth).  Arwen chose mortality and then regretted it when Aragorn died.  We are left to assume that the Ents were doomed to extinction.  The Shire was devastated (although it was rebuilt).  I think the only really happy endings were given to Sam, Merry and Pippin. 

I was expecting a sad ending to ME3 - it seemed fitting for Shepard's story.  It was the implementation of the ending that broke my immersion.

[mikelope]

TanithAeyrs wrote...

CGramn wrote...

LOL, this may be a bit off for this thread but LOTR was not a "happy" ending.   .

I think this is exactly the problem with this debate. What exactly is a 'happy' ending if the LOTR ending isn't enough?


edit: added a punctuation.

Modifié par mikelope, 25 mars 2012 - 03:36 .

[mikelope]

double post

Modifié par mikelope, 25 mars 2012 - 03:36 .

[Pee Jae]

Well, at the end of LotR I wasn't left feeling "Wtf?" Peter Jackson got "bittersweet" right.

[CGramn]

TanithAeyrs wrote...

CGramn wrote...

Well, judging from what Bioware's been saying in interviews and their Final Hours statements, The Lord of The Rings is apparently a story that fails to survive modern storytelling because (SPOILER ALERT?) Frodo doesn't jump into the fires of Mount Doom with the ring, and doesn't send the civilizations of Middle Earth into the stone ages.

The fact that they honestly believed there was only one single way the story of Shepard could end, and the ridiculousness of how they ultimately decided it should end, paints them as deeply cynical towards conventional storytelling, as well as the themes they'd established throughout the previous games.

I've said this in other posts, but the amount of sacrifices Shepard and everyone else in the Galaxy as a whole has made, depending somewhat on your decisions, should be enough to warrant a positive ending as an alternative.

Wanting a positive ending based on the choices we've made throughout 3 games is not a childish notion, the notion that everything has to end in destruction and despair because someone thinks it's "edgy" or contemporary is.

LOL, this may be a bit off for this thread but LOTR was not a "happy" ending.   The ring had changed Frodo to the point where he didn't fit in his beloved Shire anymore - he went to the Grey Havens with the elves (who all left middle earth).  Arwen chose mortality and then regretted it when Aragorn died.  We are left to assume that the Ents were doomed to extinction.  The Shire was devastated (although it was rebuilt).  I think the only really happy endings were given to Sam, Merry and Pippin. 

I was expecting a sad ending to ME3 - it seemed fitting for Shepard's story.  It was the implementation of the ending that broke my immersion.

That was part of the point I was trying to make. LOTR's ending is by no means a strictly happy ending where everything works out. It's an example of a "bittersweet" ending done well. Where the consequences of the war, the losses, and the choices made by the protagonist continues to haunt him, and the people around him until their "deaths."

What I was trying to get across was that an ending in the style of LOTR was not enough for Bioware's vision of bittersweet. That by calling their near-apocalyptic ending bittersweet, they turn what would otherwise be considered a bittersweet ending into rainbows and ponies, which we are then ridiculed for wanting to see.

Modifié par CGramn, 25 mars 2012 - 03:45 .

[Ogre9432]

Most of us are not looking for the big party or VJ Day moment but the underlying theme for the previous game has been hope. If I was looking for a dark and gritty war setting I would Play Gears of War........oh wait Gears of War had a more hopeful ending than this game.......

Modifié par Ogre9432, 25 mars 2012 - 03:50 .

[ObserverStatus]

Hashbeth wrote...

Because art is cut and dry! Rainbows and Ponies or Violence and death.
Duh OP. ^ww^

exactly why do those things have to be mutually exclusive?

[Ares14916]

Grasich wrote...

Reptilian Rob wrote...

Ares14916 wrote...

* initiate sarcastic straw-man mode *

TRUE ART IS ANGSTY!!!!!!!!

And if you don't agree you are a ***ing philistine who doesn't know how reality REALLY AND SHOULD work!!!!

*end straw man mode*

Seriously though...the above...any modicum of happiness/positive emotion from the outcome somehow renders things == disney in the eyes of the modern hipster artistic nihilist. Apparently this IS a thing nowadays. See famous sci-fi writer complaint:

http://www.smithsoni...essimistic.html 

QFT.

So true. Mass Effect is(*Cough* "was") one of the few series that looked at the future with hope.

Now, I can understand that most of ME3 was really dark, in fact I liked that simply because it would have added to the feeling of triumph at the end. Except... wait... the ending was even darker and more apocalyptic...


yay...?

Yeah I don't see how people can't tell the difference between a dark CONTEXT and a dark THEME in a story. ME has a dark theme of the mecha-space-cthulus coming to wipe out all life. HOWEVER, if you actually, you know, look at the first 2.95 games in the series, there is almost ALWAYS an option to "earn your happy ending." ME1 ends on an overall triumphant note, ME2's "suicide mission" can end with everyone alive and well if you play your cards right! You can get the Krogans and Turians friendly and even most of the Salarians (save councilor) if you make the right choices, along with uniting the Geth and Quarians.

All of those happy resolutions earned!

Yet somehow people think that earning anything but a nihilistic downer ending at the very end of the trilogy is keeping with the "theme and tone" of the ME trilogy? I call bull****. 

[nicksmi56]

Cause people are into stupid cliches and generally subscribe to a mob mentality that dark = good

[Grasich]

Ares14916 wrote...


Yeah I don't see how people can't tell the difference between a dark CONTEXT and a dark THEME in a story. ME has a dark theme of the mecha-space-cthulus coming to wipe out all life. HOWEVER, if you actually, you know, look at the first 2.95 games in the series, there is almost ALWAYS an option to "earn your happy ending." ME1 ends on an overall triumphant note, ME2's "suicide mission" can end with everyone alive and well if you play your cards right! You can get the Krogans and Turians friendly and even most of the Salarians (save councilor) if you make the right choices, along with uniting the Geth and Quarians.

All of those happy resolutions earned!

Yet somehow people think that earning anything but a nihilistic downer ending at the very end of the trilogy is keeping with the "theme and tone" of the ME trilogy? I call bull****. 

100% agreed.

[TheBlackBaron]

This is the only instance of rainbows and ponies I want to see in Mass Effect.

[TheHoneyRuns]

I support this thread for its title and content.

But mostly for the title.

[mikelope]

Ares14916 wrote...

Yet somehow people think that earning anything but a nihilistic downer ending at the very end of the trilogy is keeping with the "theme and tone" of the ME trilogy? I call bull****. 

Who exactly are these people?

If you want pure escapism, I can respect that. But am I emo, pretentious, or grimdark if I want something more, something that doesn't stretch plausibility. It depends on your opinion on this thread. 
http://social.biowar...ndex/10578640/9. If your answer is most definitely, then a very happy ending seems right. If not, isn't it logical for a good few more people - it doesn't have to be shepard, it doesn't have to the LI, it doesn't have to be the whole crew - to die near the end. of course, we could go back to space magic again and let everyone live.

I thought the ending of Serenity is a good example.

[s.nebulous]

The planet the Normandy crashes on I’m sure has rainbows now and then.
And it so happens that unicorns are an indigenous species on that planet.

So we just need Shepard to magically warp to the Normandy before the crash as well.

In all seriousness, I also believe a happy ending would option would be consistent with the series.

[alx119]

Needs about 20% more Rainbow Dash though.

But yeah, agree OP. A sad depressing ending was a bit unfitting. Bittersweet is a good word to describe an ending in which, after winning, you also realize that there's been a lot of sacrifices and loses in a galaxy scale war. That's the bitter part, the sweet part is the fact that you live to see another day and come out victorious.

[LPPrince]

TheBlackBaron wrote...



This is the only instance of rainbows and ponies I want to see in Mass Effect.

You rang?

[Grasich]

mikelope wrote...

Ares14916 wrote...

Yet somehow people think that earning anything but a nihilistic downer ending at the very end of the trilogy is keeping with the "theme and tone" of the ME trilogy? I call bull****. 

Who exactly are these people?

If you want pure escapism, I can respect that. But am I emo, pretentious, or grimdark if I want something more, something that doesn't stretch plausibility. It depends on your opinion on this thread. 
http://social.biowar...ndex/10578640/9. If your answer is most definitely, then a very happy ending seems right. If not, isn't it logical for a good few more people - it doesn't have to be shepard, it doesn't have to the LI, it doesn't have to be the whole crew - to die near the end. of course, we could go back to space magic again and let everyone live.

I thought the ending of Serenity is a good example.

Remember, though, that this is a choice based video game. It is completely possible to make multiple endings to satisfy everyone whether you want a "happy" ending, a tragic ending, a grim-dark ending, or even a loss.

Just because I want a "happy" end, and you want a darker ending doesn't mean we couldn't have both gotten what we wanted.

[TheBlackBaron]

LPPrince wrote...

TheBlackBaron wrote...



This is the only instance of rainbows and ponies I want to see in Mass Effect.

You rang?

Not good enough, Prince. I won't rest until Bioware alters the endings to have Shepard on the Normandy when it crashes on Equestria, and Joker gets the coordinates for it because Rainbow Dash is a romanceable squad mate.