226 réponses à ce sujet

[ThatGuy39]

Brightside8 wrote...

The simple fact is that Bioware is at the end of it's creative life span.

The original passion and fire for art and artistic integrity can't last forever, and it's fading from Bioware. It shows.
So as painful as it is, this is goodbye, Bioware.

I'm not being fatalistic, but a wonderful, passionate, artistic studio can only exist for so long before it burns itself out. We've had two decades of *incredible* games, for which I thank you, but you've all burned yourselves out on creativity, and now it's just a job.

Thanks for the Baldur's Gate series.
Thanks for Never Winter Nights.
Thanks for Knights of the Old Republic
Thanks for Mass Effect 1
Thanks for Dragon Age: Origins
Thanks for Mass Effect 2

You've stocked my shelves with memorable games for two decades, games I will replay for years. I will watch the credits roll by again and thank every name there.

So goodbye, and goodluck in your careers.

P.S. I know he's not with Bioware anymore, but a very, very special thanks and lots of fan love to Drew Karpshyn, one of the best writers the industry has ever seen, and responsible for the moving stories and characters behind four of my favorite games of all time. Thank you Drew, I'll be watching for your new novels, and hope you get the time to write something original.

Edit for clarification:
I doubt Bioware will cease to exist as a label, but they have hit the end of their creative lifespan, or so it seems. Most of the original staff is gone, including their best writers, and they've been tethered to a larger corporate entity with deadlines and a bottom line. There's nothing bad or good about that. They'll probably keep making decent but not great games for a while.

Well, here's to looking for the next Bioware
Cheers, folks.

 

Yep, EA has ruined another franchise. Like they did with Origin Systems (I still think it's insulting that they call their service Origin, what a slap in the face), Westwood, others (those two being the most notable). When I saw that EA had acquired Bioware, my first thought was "that's it for Bioware" and I was hoping I was wrong, and when Mass Effect 2 came out, I was impressed, and was starting to think "okay, this may not be a bad thing". never played DA 2, so no opinion on that, and then ME3 came out, and the ending looks rushed, and I keep having this feeling that EA forced them into meeting their deadline, and would not let them push it back again, and I keep thinking back to the end of Origin Systems, and the tension between Garriot and EA, and I have to agree with you. This is it for Bioware. However, I do have that shred of hope that EA hasn't completely sucked the soul of Bioware, since they are making Generals 2.

[heathxxx]

-REDACTED- wrote...

than why not make the action as polished as possible like they did with the combat in Dragon Age 2

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha...

*pauses*

*takes a deep breath*

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...

[Iwillbeback]

There is still hope, without hope we got nothing.

[Brightside8]

Hsuzy1987 wrote...

Luc0s wrote...


I never said that old talent making way for new talent is a bad thing. I actually approve. BioWare has given us some of the best story-telling RPGs ever in the past, but it seems they has lost their touch. The CD Projekt seems to become the new source of amazing story-telling RPGs.

CDPR (The CD Projekt Red) has proven to be quite capable of producing epic, hardcore story-telling RPGs that stay true to the RPG francise, no "streamlining", just hardcore RPG gameplay with an epic story, that's what CDPR has achieved with The Witcher so far. I can't way to see what the future has in story for us. I except that we're going to hear a lot more from CDPR in the future.

Yep I think they've lost that magic spark too. Their games aren't *bad* per se, they just don't seem to quite reach the heights of what they've done before. As Mordin would say: 'Unfortunate'.

I'm still wondering, however, if we can pinpoint exactly where it all started unravelling. Would be interesting if it could be quantified or at least identified. At least that will constitute proper feedback.

Anyway, I don't think I've played any game from CDPR though, any recommendations?

The Witcher is good
The Witcher 2 is goddamn ****ing brilliant. The game is actually split in half, because at a very early stage, you choose which side you want to join. It's essentialy split down the middle into two entirely unique plots. The truest form of Divergent gameplay.

[ThatGuy39]

Archereon wrote...

Brightside8 wrote...

gmboy902 wrote...
-snip-

For example, KOTOR. First one was great. Second one had gameplay improvements, but the story just kind of flatlined. They dropped that series, until the MMO came out which I've heard is half-decent. Can't comment too much on this, though.

-snip-

Kotor II wasn't Bioware, just tossing that in there.
It was handed off to Black Isle because Bioware wanted to move onto original titles. Black Isle just cobbled a game together to sell based on the name. If I recall correctly, they weren't allowed to play KOTOR while writing the first draft of the script, and it was, as one writer put it "really terrible".

So yeah.

Black Isles was one of the most respected RPG devs back in the day. Lucas Arts gave them a positively retarded deadline, and we ended up with a half-finished product.

 
(sorry double post) 
  
I think that happened here with ME3. I think EA would not budge on the deadline, and Bioware just had to make due. 

[BWGungan]

Yeah, if they don't fix this properly.  I'm done. 

I can't bear another catastrophic failure like this one.

[-REDACTED-]

heathxxx wrote...

-REDACTED- wrote...

than why not make the action as polished as possible like they did with the combat in Dragon Age 2

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha...

*pauses*

*takes a deep breath*

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...

Even if you didn't like the story, the combat was way better than it was in Dragon Age Origins. Much more responsive, much more visceral. Everything felt like it had a real weight to it, unlike in DA:O where it was just a bunch of numbers above an enemy's head...

[bkp360]

M12311 wrote...

I think we are not there yet. ME3 was still pretty far from the blatant money grab type sequal status.

Ummmm after that horrid ending didn't you notice the chance to continue with DLC message.

That's a blatant money grab sir.

[Hydralysk]

AntiDave wrote...

Rest in Peace Bioware.
Rise Eidos Montreal, the hope of Canada.

Haha, I can get behind this statement. Montreal needs something to hold up with the Habs doing so pooly this season, and say what you will about DE:HR's boss battles and endings but it was still one of the top 3 games of 2011 for me.

[Costin_Razvan]

The time of Bioware has ended, the time of CDPR and Eidos Montreal has come at last.

They either will get their stuff together or they will lose more and more customers. Look at TW2: It sold just slightly less then DA2 when DA2 was on Xbox, Playstation AND PC whereas TW2 is still only for PCs atm...with high system requirements.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 25 mars 2012 - 04:40 .

[ThatGuy39]

MercenaryNo wrote...

Atleast I can still look forward to Bethesda.

 

I dunno, Brink kinda sucked....

[cameronnadal]

Man, people overreact so much. 'I didn't like the ending to this game that they are changing, obviously they can never, ever, ever make anything worthwhile again!'

Too bad your all gonna buy their next title.

[Sesshaku]

Brownfinger wrote...

Sesshaku wrote...

Drama aside, then drama?

Yeah, that made me laugh.
All of these tearful "goodbye Bioware" posts are like people who weren't even invited to a party announcing their departure from it. No one cares how invested you were and how hurt you now are from some imaginary slight, dude. Just go. If you flake out over seemingly nothing in the big picture, then you really weren't much of a fan to begin with.

World keeps on spinnin'.

I wonder where the rest of my post go in that quote....oh, i know .

Anyway, English it's not my native language, but i'm pretty sure you didn't read the whole post. 

Hsuzy1987 wrote...

Sesshaku wrote...

Drama aside, then drama?

Why do you hate that irony? It's art! It's like Reaper's logic...don't you get it? Entitled Fools

Nearly, so nearly blasted the post when I saw 'entitled fools'. Then I reread the post, and lol-ed. 

Good one sir.

He did.

[Costin_Razvan]

cameronnadal wrote...

Man, people overreact so much. 'I didn't like the ending to this game that they are changing, obviously they can never, ever, ever make anything worthwhile again!'

Too bad your all gonna buy their next title.

Mass Effect 3 has a lot more issues then the endings: Like the massive plotholes in the entirity of the game.

But hell it's not even about Mass Effect here. Dragon Age 2 failed a lot harder then Mass Effect 3 did, and yes that does matter to Bioware as a hell. The fact of the matter is the next Bioware game will be Dragon Age 3. How many do you think will actually pre-order that game? Very few I tell you.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 25 mars 2012 - 04:45 .

[Hendrik.III]

cameronnadal wrote...

Man, people overreact so much. 'I didn't like the ending to this game that they are changing, obviously they can never, ever, ever make anything worthwhile again!'

Too bad your all gonna buy their next title.

Like hell I am, it's not just about the ending being crap - It's them not caring enough to deliver proper quality, not doing as they promised and marketed. It's doing day 1 DLC and lying about it ever being part of the game, and suggesting to buy MORE DLC after that pathetic "ending"of theirs. NO respect, NO quality. I'm not just a derping consumer with a fat wallet. 

Trying to make games accessible to everyone to maximize profit is ruining the game itself. They should have stuck to the intended path.

Modifié par Hendrik.III, 25 mars 2012 - 04:47 .

[poundoffleshaa]

I think Bioware are done as being the top RPG developers in the market because they don't seem to care about the rpg crowd any-more that doesn't mean they won't be successful as makers of FPS's and adventure games (less narrative based) in future.

Modifié par poundoffleshaa, 25 mars 2012 - 04:51 .

[Baronesa]

Does anyone remember how long it took for Bioware to produce NWN?

Sure, the OC was not that great, and I still don't like the lack of a party group... but was a good game... and the biggest strength? All the fan made modules. That game is a classic, a jewel!

[ThatGuy39]

Denethar wrote...

To be honest, EA makes some pretty amazing sports games. Other than that it is usually very average.

I get what the TC is saying and I agree to a point. DA 2 was average, SWTOR is average beyond belief. ME 3 is good, but 1 and 2 were better. Nothing wrong with making average games, but Bioware used to make great games.

 

They also make some great racing games... unless you consider racing a sport .

[Mastone]

ThatGuy39 wrote...

Brightside8 wrote...

The simple fact is that Bioware is at the end of it's creative life span.

The original passion and fire for art and artistic integrity can't last forever, and it's fading from Bioware. It shows.
So as painful as it is, this is goodbye, Bioware.

I'm not being fatalistic, but a wonderful, passionate, artistic studio can only exist for so long before it burns itself out. We've had two decades of *incredible* games, for which I thank you, but you've all burned yourselves out on creativity, and now it's just a job.

Thanks for the Baldur's Gate series.
Thanks for Never Winter Nights.
Thanks for Knights of the Old Republic
Thanks for Mass Effect 1
Thanks for Dragon Age: Origins
Thanks for Mass Effect 2

You've stocked my shelves with memorable games for two decades, games I will replay for years. I will watch the credits roll by again and thank every name there.

So goodbye, and goodluck in your careers.

P.S. I know he's not with Bioware anymore, but a very, very special thanks and lots of fan love to Drew Karpshyn, one of the best writers the industry has ever seen, and responsible for the moving stories and characters behind four of my favorite games of all time. Thank you Drew, I'll be watching for your new novels, and hope you get the time to write something original.

Edit for clarification:
I doubt Bioware will cease to exist as a label, but they have hit the end of their creative lifespan, or so it seems. Most of the original staff is gone, including their best writers, and they've been tethered to a larger corporate entity with deadlines and a bottom line. There's nothing bad or good about that. They'll probably keep making decent but not great games for a while.

Well, here's to looking for the next Bioware
Cheers, folks.

 

Yep, EA has ruined another franchise. Like they did with Origin Systems (I still think it's insulting that they call their service Origin, what a slap in the face), Westwood, others (those two being the most notable). When I saw that EA had acquired Bioware, my first thought was "that's it for Bioware" and I was hoping I was wrong, and when Mass Effect 2 came out, I was impressed, and was starting to think "okay, this may not be a bad thing". never played DA 2, so no opinion on that, and then ME3 came out, and the ending looks rushed, and I keep having this feeling that EA forced them into meeting their deadline, and would not let them push it back again, and I keep thinking back to the end of Origin Systems, and the tension between Garriot and EA, and I have to agree with you. This is it for Bioware. However, I do have that shred of hope that EA hasn't completely sucked the soul of Bioware, since they are making Generals 2.

If EA is a company on the stock exchange ( which I believe they are) and they anounce a title for a certain date stockholders hold them to it it  is also in the rule book that it  then should be released on that day

But blaming it on the fact they got taken over or sold themselves to a large coorperation is lame both on our side as well as on the developers side.
The  fact remains that they are gamescreators and we expect more from them, ME 1 was great even the gameplay ( it is the first generation so small mistakes are forgiveable), but right through ME2 and ME3  I saw that they leeched on ME1 story but  focussed on action and actually dumbed down the games , I really enjoyed the fluent gameplay in ME3, but there was no story , I only felt a bit of urgency in the beginning then it was same old same old again ..... they tried doing a plottwist like ME 1 but failed ...miserably , so yes if things stand as they do now I think the franchise will die out, then in a few months from now when everyone realizes that the KOTOR MMO isn't really that different then existing mmo's and Guildwars and blizzard comes with their MMO'S  people will gradually leave that as well, dragon age is tainted ( no pun intended).
I personally feel that now is a crucial turning point  will Bioware shrug off the coorporate humbug and start focussing more on the gamemaking aspect again or will it all be about salesforecasting and al that bull**** ( I am talking about the whle of the company not the individuals who are in crunch time tweaking a texture here and there) 


Bioware if you want my advice:

With regards to ME3: Fix the ending to something acceptable where choices matter , this is my suggestion of fixing it:
social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/9992961/407#10560783
But if you have your own please apply it, I could even accept the indoctrination theory.
Also make it for free , it should have been in the orginal game for starters, I garantuee you guys that people will restore faith in you and will buy DLC in greater numbers

With regards to KOTOR,; just make a regular single player with next gen stuff in it a lot of peple don't care for MMO's I personally find them pointless games

With regards to dragon age, just look at the witcher the quality and the gameplay  it has a lot more depth, make the amount of races you can pick from more limited, but make the differences between the gameplay experience more profound. and characters( NPC's) more memorable, add humor and a true dynamic world

[wright1978]

The worry i have is that they are starting to look across into next door's garden and thinking their grass is greener over there and not tending to their own lawn as they should.

[NekOoNinja]

-REDACTED- wrote...

heathxxx wrote...

-REDACTED- wrote...

than why not make the action as polished as possible like they did with the combat in Dragon Age 2

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha...

*pauses*

*takes a deep breath*

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...

Even if you didn't like the story, the combat was way better than it was in Dragon Age Origins. Much more responsive, much more visceral. Everything felt like it had a real weight to it, unlike in DA:O where it was just a bunch of numbers above an enemy's head...

There are people who like this kind of "numbers above head" gameplay you know...

...I'm getting a sudden urge to install NWN 1 again.

cameronnadal wrote...

Man, people overreact so much. 'I
didn't like the ending to this game that they are changing, obviously
they can never, ever, ever make anything worthwhile again!'

Too bad your all gonna buy their next title.

Not me. Without the nostalgia glasses, I don't see why I should purchase another BW/EA title anymore. Times of NFS 3 HP and BG 2 are long time past. <_<

Modifié par NekOoNinja, 25 mars 2012 - 04:57 .

[Costin_Razvan]

Bioware is not making Generals 2. Bioware Victory is made up of the people who created the previous Command and Conquer games.

As for the combat of DA2 being better then DA:O...that's like saying drinking a bottle of ****** is better then eating a pile of dung.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 25 mars 2012 - 04:58 .

[poundoffleshaa]

I liked DAO combat as long as you played a mage everything was just fine (on the pc with the time pauses etc).

[ThatGuy39]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Bioware is not making Generals 2. Bioware Victory is made up of the people who created the previous Command and Conquer games.

As for the combat of DA2 being better then DA:O...that's like saying drinking a bottle of ****** is better then eating a pile of dung.

 

Even better. Some of those guys also worked on the Star Wars Empire at War series, so I will definitely be picking it up.

[mattynutz]

I think this is pretty much the case. I don't want it to be. BW used to fill me with giddiness and excitement at the mere thought of what they may be working on. It was nice to know that in a world saturated by hollow facades, somebody was doing something of quality. It's too bad that what BW has become is what their staffers are forced to defend.

I'd much rather it be otherwise.