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The developer point of view for Bioware (In their deffense) for the ending


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#1
Ironhandjustice

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First of all, say that if this is considered unapropiated, I encourage staff to delete it. Is just my experience as developer.

I thing we need the developer viewpoint. Its weird for a massive selling videogame be out on march.

I think is obvious that ME3
was intended to be out for Dec11, but went out on March12. The fact is, that was a fine job until the end -the last part done in a game-,
and is very clear that there is a cut on the ending. The marauder
shield-thing and star child.

If you look at carefully, this part
has retaken corpses from ME2, almost no dialogue, almost no... nothing.
The citadel was almost empty. Its logical to think that TIM bringed the
last soldiers with him, and have make a battle to reach the crucible.
But nothing indicates this. No Reaper minions corpses. Nor Cerberus.
Just a star kid (the same animation from the beggining child, different
textures), and ends with many things cut.

For me, Bioware ran out of time to develop the game, and had a punch on the table from persons who pay the development.

I suppose that the crappy-end comes from:

BW:"Sir, we need another month for the ending"
EA:"NO WAY! IT NEEDS TO BE SOLD NOW!!! ITS AIRDATE WAS ON DEC"
BW:"But the ending..."
EA:"Do it right now. No matter the cost"
BW:"But..."
EA:"Or this, or you can consider yourself fired"
BW: (Thinking on their family and the crysis, but painfully) "Ok sir, will be ready for 6th March launch..."

And that, kids "is show you true power", or "assuming direct control of the project.

Not just inventing it, I know three game developers, and I'm myself developer...

When the "money guy" says that must be done for tomorrow, all your "attacs are an insult".

Sad, but true

:unsure::devil::?

#2
lyleoffmyspace

lyleoffmyspace
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This is honestly what I think happened.

#3
zenoxis

zenoxis
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What is this, I don't even.

#4
dragonflight288

dragonflight288
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Thanks for the developers input.

#5
DungeonHoek

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Ironhandjustice wrote...

First of all, say that if this is considered unapropiated, I encourage staff to delete it. Is just my experience as developer.

I thing we need the developer viewpoint. Its weird for a massive selling videogame be out on march.

I think is obvious that ME3
was intended to be out for Dec11, but went out on March12. The fact is, that was a fine job until the end -the last part done in a game-,
and is very clear that there is a cut on the ending. The marauder
shield-thing and star child.

If you look at carefully, this part
has retaken corpses from ME2, almost no dialogue, almost no... nothing.
The citadel was almost empty. Its logical to think that TIM bringed the
last soldiers with him, and have make a battle to reach the crucible.
But nothing indicates this. No Reaper minions corpses. Nor Cerberus.
Just a star kid (the same animation from the beggining child, different
textures), and ends with many things cut.

For me, Bioware ran out of time to develop the game, and had a punch on the table from persons who pay the development.

I suppose that the crappy-end comes from:

BW:"Sir, we need another month for the ending"
EA:"NO WAY! IT NEEDS TO BE SOLD NOW!!! ITS AIRDATE WAS ON DEC"
BW:"But the ending..."
EA:"Do it right now. No matter the cost"
BW:"But..."
EA:"Or this, or you can consider yourself fired"
BW: (Thinking on their family and the crysis, but painfully) "Ok sir, will be ready for 6th March launch..."

And that, kids "is show you true power", or "assuming direct control of the project.

Not just inventing it, I know three game developers, and I'm myself developer...

When the "money guy" says that must be done for tomorrow, all your "attacs are an insult".

Sad, but true

:unsure::devil::?


Alright, I'll bite the bullet here. Might as well, since I doubt this will remain civil.

I'm more then willing to believe that ME3 suffered due to a pinch on funding and time constraints. EA doesn't exactly have a stellar reputation for smart desicions, especially over the last number of years. And this WOULD be one of the most logical answers out there. Provided it is in fact the truth.

Now, if you will excuse me, I have to take your claim of being a "developer" with a grain of salt. As this is the internet, and people make stuff up all the time. As you have no doubt seen around here or will given a few hours, with all the pig headedness,greed, intentional misinformation and overall disgusting behaviour on both sides. Of the arguement and its many smaller forms.

But if you are infact a developer, then please, I would like to know. How do you relate to your customers?. And given such a storm of negative PR, why does Bioware have to sit back and say next to nothing which serves to perpetuate the problem?.

I am a staunch believer that the customer is always right, because word of mouth can make or break a business or product. And if something isn't right, then it should be fixed to keep your consumer base as happy as possible. As happy customer's mean repeat business.

I also have a background in artistry and writing. And while I do value someones "artitistic integrity" infact applaud them for going out of their way to be creative. I hold to the fact that nothing is above being critiscised. Positive or negative, when you step in the art field, you have to take it. Otherwise why are you there sharing your vision's and idea's, in-fact your very soul with people?.

It defeats the purpose of art, as one who cannot take critiscism will never grow and never learn from their mistakes. Even if it hurts, a-lot. Denying the words of others to shield yourself is only preventing you from growing and achieving your true potentiol.

And for Bioware, I'm not sure what to make of them in that reguard. I like many others feel the ending they put in does not fit with the flow or nature of the Mass Effect Universe. Where science is law, and everything that should be impossible, and certainly is by real standards, has a unique fiction to make it work.

Do I believe that they were wrong to take this approach?, certainly not, as I also believe that they could do so much more with what they have in a manner that would end up appeasing nearly everyone, saving face from this nightmare. And yet stay true to their idea's all in one fell swoop.

But, I still can't peg them down. And there are so many "fact's" running around that it's hard to make heads or tails of anything. Which I repeat makes me wonder why they don't step out and talk like people about this. It paint's a very bad light on the whole situation. As if they were hiding from everyone to avoid answering the questions. And it certainly makes things worse the longer it goes on. As you see, this forum is a hotbed. And the slightest thing gets a fight going with Pro-Enders and Anti-Enders tearing into each other in a dual to the death of who can insult each other into submission.

Frankly, it leaves me jaded. And questioning if I have to not buy any more Bioware products as a result. I've done it before, with Volition and Saint's Row the 3rd. While the game was sub-parr in my opinion, the thing that really drove me away was how the Volition team dismissed everything about their consumerbase. Even the simplest request to modify the game was met with a general dismissal.

And that is where money comes in, while people have their opinion's. The truth remain's that when you create a product, art or not, those that pay for it should be heard.

I hope Bioware will do what's right for themselves and everyone. But, I can't make the judgement call on if they will or not. I don't have anything to go on. Except for the facts of everything that has happened.

#6
Ironhandjustice

Ironhandjustice
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DungeonHoek wrote...

Ironhandjustice wrote...

First of all, say that if this is considered unapropiated, I encourage staff to delete it. Is just my experience as developer.

I thing we need the developer viewpoint. Its weird for a massive selling videogame be out on march.

I think is obvious that ME3
was intended to be out for Dec11, but went out on March12. The fact is, that was a fine job until the end -the last part done in a game-,
and is very clear that there is a cut on the ending. The marauder
shield-thing and star child.

If you look at carefully, this part
has retaken corpses from ME2, almost no dialogue, almost no... nothing.
The citadel was almost empty. Its logical to think that TIM bringed the
last soldiers with him, and have make a battle to reach the crucible.
But nothing indicates this. No Reaper minions corpses. Nor Cerberus.
Just a star kid (the same animation from the beggining child, different
textures), and ends with many things cut.

For me, Bioware ran out of time to develop the game, and had a punch on the table from persons who pay the development.

I suppose that the crappy-end comes from:

BW:"Sir, we need another month for the ending"
EA:"NO WAY! IT NEEDS TO BE SOLD NOW!!! ITS AIRDATE WAS ON DEC"
BW:"But the ending..."
EA:"Do it right now. No matter the cost"
BW:"But..."
EA:"Or this, or you can consider yourself fired"
BW: (Thinking on their family and the crysis, but painfully) "Ok sir, will be ready for 6th March launch..."

And that, kids "is show you true power", or "assuming direct control of the project.

Not just inventing it, I know three game developers, and I'm myself developer...

When the "money guy" says that must be done for tomorrow, all your "attacs are an insult".

Sad, but true

:unsure::devil::?


Alright, I'll bite the bullet here. Might as well, since I doubt this will remain civil.

I'm more then willing to believe that ME3 suffered due to a pinch on funding and time constraints. EA doesn't exactly have a stellar reputation for smart desicions, especially over the last number of years. And this WOULD be one of the most logical answers out there. Provided it is in fact the truth.

Now, if you will excuse me, I have to take your claim of being a "developer" with a grain of salt. As this is the internet, and people make stuff up all the time. As you have no doubt seen around here or will given a few hours, with all the pig headedness,greed, intentional misinformation and overall disgusting behaviour on both sides. Of the arguement and its many smaller forms.

But if you are infact a developer, then please, I would like to know. How do you relate to your customers?. And given such a storm of negative PR, why does Bioware have to sit back and say next to nothing which serves to perpetuate the problem?.

I am a staunch believer that the customer is always right, because word of mouth can make or break a business or product. And if something isn't right, then it should be fixed to keep your consumer base as happy as possible. As happy customer's mean repeat business.

I also have a background in artistry and writing. And while I do value someones "artitistic integrity" infact applaud them for going out of their way to be creative. I hold to the fact that nothing is above being critiscised. Positive or negative, when you step in the art field, you have to take it. Otherwise why are you there sharing your vision's and idea's, in-fact your very soul with people?.

It defeats the purpose of art, as one who cannot take critiscism will never grow and never learn from their mistakes. Even if it hurts, a-lot. Denying the words of others to shield yourself is only preventing you from growing and achieving your true potentiol.

And for Bioware, I'm not sure what to make of them in that reguard. I like many others feel the ending they put in does not fit with the flow or nature of the Mass Effect Universe. Where science is law, and everything that should be impossible, and certainly is by real standards, has a unique fiction to make it work.

Do I believe that they were wrong to take this approach?, certainly not, as I also believe that they could do so much more with what they have in a manner that would end up appeasing nearly everyone, saving face from this nightmare. And yet stay true to their idea's all in one fell swoop.

But, I still can't peg them down. And there are so many "fact's" running around that it's hard to make heads or tails of anything. Which I repeat makes me wonder why they don't step out and talk like people about this. It paint's a very bad light on the whole situation. As if they were hiding from everyone to avoid answering the questions. And it certainly makes things worse the longer it goes on. As you see, this forum is a hotbed. And the slightest thing gets a fight going with Pro-Enders and Anti-Enders tearing into each other in a dual to the death of who can insult each other into submission.

Frankly, it leaves me jaded. And questioning if I have to not buy any more Bioware products as a result. I've done it before, with Volition and Saint's Row the 3rd. While the game was sub-parr in my opinion, the thing that really drove me away was how the Volition team dismissed everything about their consumerbase. Even the simplest request to modify the game was met with a general dismissal.

And that is where money comes in, while people have their opinion's. The truth remain's that when you create a product, art or not, those that pay for it should be heard.

I hope Bioware will do what's right for themselves and everyone. But, I can't make the judgement call on if they will or not. I don't have anything to go on. Except for the facts of everything that has happened.


I understand you scepticism. I'm not a videogame developer, so, I'm not sure what I'll do if I'll be under  this kind of pressure. I've received other kind of ****storms, but in my work, there is not "art". Only functionality and speed. Also I know two real videogame programmers, and both (without knowing each other) say the same thing.

This problem killed for example "Rebel Act Studios", the authors of "Blade, the Edge of Darkness", that was a good game a lot years ago.

My development field is bank (yea, I work for the Reapers xD), and of course if the client says "wtf", you fix it before the client can react harder against you. Or you are ****ed <_<. To be honest, I don't have enought rank to make decisions about how to react, but there is a rule whe the customer starts to complain:

"You MUST not tell anything to anybody until this master-**** error is fixed or I'll kill you with the keyboard. Seriously"

So, I agree with the most part of your opinion, I was only trying to put in perspective that the moneyman is probably the real "mass effect destroyer", and the writer and program leader were only to guys in a hurry trying to avoid to be fired.

The worst thing of this, is that when the storm reaches them, they can be fired anyway. You know "if you don't end the program in time, you are fired. And of course, if at the end is a terrible ****, you'll be fired as well".

Is the sad history of the developers.

Only to add that Bioware is reacting like any development team, closing lines, being quiet, and probably trying to fix this huge mistake while the same preoducer that threatened them in order to get the job done crappy and fast hangs the Damocles sword over their heads...

So, as I read before, they are on "damage control mode". This version I told ya is for human beings ;)

I expect to be understood, english is not my home language :pinched: