287 réponses à ce sujet

[Sylvianus]

What is this nonsense ? Why Ashley need to be bi because Kaidan is ? Why everybody needs to turn bi ?

She has got her own tastes and personality, she hasn't to be the same as Kaidan.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 25 mars 2012 - 09:16 .

[sistersafetypin]

BatmanPWNS wrote...

sistersafetypin wrote...

BatmanPWNS wrote...

FemShep got Liara, Samantha and Aller. 3 lesbians is enough.

Liara & Aller aren't Lesbians

They can still be romanced by FemShep.

Quite frankly, gay men have a more right to complain since they only have 2 romances compare to straight men who have 4.

Your first sentence misses the point. They are bi, not lesbians. And yes I agree gay men have more of a right to complain then any group. My point was, Straight female players aren't the bottom of the totem pole some seem to think they are. 

They've had options since game one

Modifié par sistersafetypin, 25 mars 2012 - 11:52 .

[Malevolence65]

I heard that Garrus was supposed to be an option for Maleshep in ME3, but they were having a hard time with the flags so they left him out. Typical Bioware, eh? I also heard that Wrex was supposed to be a romance option for Femshep in ME3, but it didn't fit so they took it out. Not sure if either of those are true. The last one sounds fake to me.

[DarkSpiral]

Malevolence65 wrote...

I heard that Garrus was supposed to be an option for Maleshep in ME3, but they were having a hard time with the flags so they left him out. Typical Bioware, eh? I also heard that Wrex was supposed to be a romance option for Femshep in ME3, but it didn't fit so they took it out. Not sure if either of those are true. The last one sounds fake to me.

They're both bull.  Check the facts before you blame to devs for cutting soemthign that was never there in the first place.

[Malevolence65]

DarkSpiral wrote...

Malevolence65 wrote...

I heard that Garrus was supposed to be an option for Maleshep in ME3, but they were having a hard time with the flags so they left him out. Typical Bioware, eh? I also heard that Wrex was supposed to be a romance option for Femshep in ME3, but it didn't fit so they took it out. Not sure if either of those are true. The last one sounds fake to me.

They're both bull.  Check the facts before you blame to devs for cutting soemthign that was never there in the first place.

Hey, I said they were most likely fake. How 'bout you read posts before you reply to them?

[DarkSpiral]

Malevolence65 wrote...

Hey, I said they were most likely fake. How 'bout you read posts before you reply to them?

Oh, sorry.  Did I misread the part where yous aid "typicla Bioware, eh?"  Or perhaps it was the part where you said you thought the LAST ONE was fake?  DId I misread that one, and you actually said that you thought they were both fake?

Wait, lets check....why no!  No, that isn't what you wrote down.  I guess I did read your post then.  If you DID think they were both fake, you forgot to mention it.

Modifié par DarkSpiral, 25 mars 2012 - 09:52 .

[MadRabbit999]

kkr wrote...

MadRabbit999 wrote...

You know what the best part is?

Lesbian romances are mostly implemented to keep the male population happy... oh the irony...

I absolutely agree. There were so many negative posts on places such as YouTube regarding the romance of both Kaiden and Steve as a male Shepard. Unfortunately it indicates that it is great for women to have sex with other women and wrong for a man to even be able to kiss another man. It goes to show that the human race is still sexist and has a lot of maturing to do.

A lot of maturing? That is the understatement of the year...

Humans are still at a fetal stage, when it comes to  maturity.... 

[Malevolence65]

DarkSpiral wrote...
Oh, sorry.  Did I misread the part where yous aid "typicla Bioware, eh?"

Bioware loves to cut stuff out of their games.

 Or perhaps it was the part where you said you thought the LAST ONE was fake?

I meant to type that I was sure the Wrex one was fake, but not sure about Garrus.

[CRISIS1717]

Do not wish for this, only the Dragon Age team thought it was a good idea to make everyone bisexual.

I think Traynor is pretty hot but my maleShep can't romance her, if I can accept that then accept that Ashley won't suddenly become bi at the drop of a hat.

[bchesson]

A big reason why alot of people are upset about Ash and Kaiden are they were intended to be romanced by either sex since ME1. They even recorded the dialogue but cut it at the last minute because they wanted to play it safe at the time.

As far as people who say that certain characters shouldn't be gay, lesbian or bi I say this. What does it matter? If you don't want a lesbian Ash or gay Kaiden or bi-curious Garrus then don't chose the option. If a gay player wants to romace Kaiden or a lesbian wants to romanc Ash I say more power to them. I do it now by editing save files anyway and I'd like to have the proper voices with it. How does that hurt your story or anyone elses?

[CRISIS1717]

bchesson wrote...

A big reason why alot of people are upset about Ash and Kaiden are they were intended to be romanced by either sex since ME1. They even recorded the dialogue but cut it at the last minute because they wanted to play it safe at the time.

As far as people who say that certain characters shouldn't be gay, lesbian or bi I say this. What does it matter? If you don't want a lesbian Ash or gay Kaiden or bi-curious Garrus then don't chose the option. If a gay player wants to romace Kaiden or a lesbian wants to romanc Ash I say more power to them. I do it now by editing save files anyway and I'd like to have the proper voices with it. How does that hurt your story or anyone elses?

No, Dragon age 2 proved it shouldn't be done. If you make characters everything to everyone it leads to weak characterisation.

Give people choices, give people a few characters out of the squad that are bi but don't make everyone the same. 

Modifié par CRISIS1717, 25 mars 2012 - 10:32 .

[bchesson]

CRISIS1717 wrote...

bchesson wrote...

A big reason why alot of people are upset about Ash and Kaiden are they were intended to be romanced by either sex since ME1. They even recorded the dialogue but cut it at the last minute because they wanted to play it safe at the time.

As far as people who say that certain characters shouldn't be gay, lesbian or bi I say this. What does it matter? If you don't want a lesbian Ash or gay Kaiden or bi-curious Garrus then don't chose the option. If a gay player wants to romace Kaiden or a lesbian wants to romanc Ash I say more power to them. I do it now by editing save files anyway and I'd like to have the proper voices with it. How does that hurt your story or anyone elses?

No, Dragon age 2 proved it shouldn't be done. If you make characters everything to everyone it leads to weak characterisation.

Give people choices, give people a few characters out of the squad that are bi but don't make everyone the same. 

I have zero problem with how Dragon Age 2 handled it and none of my friends had a problem with it either. In my game I want to be able to do what I want to have a satisfying story for me. I also respect your right to have whatever you feel is a satisfying story for you. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree here.

[LegendaryBlade]

CRISIS1717 wrote...

bchesson wrote...

A big reason why alot of people are upset about Ash and Kaiden are they were intended to be romanced by either sex since ME1. They even recorded the dialogue but cut it at the last minute because they wanted to play it safe at the time.

As far as people who say that certain characters shouldn't be gay, lesbian or bi I say this. What does it matter? If you don't want a lesbian Ash or gay Kaiden or bi-curious Garrus then don't chose the option. If a gay player wants to romace Kaiden or a lesbian wants to romanc Ash I say more power to them. I do it now by editing save files anyway and I'd like to have the proper voices with it. How does that hurt your story or anyone elses?

No, Dragon age 2 proved it shouldn't be done. If you make characters everything to everyone it leads to weak characterisation.

Give people choices, give people a few characters out of the squad that are bi but don't make everyone the same. 

I agree with this, it feels like the characters are just less...real, when you remove an entire level of depth like that. Characters really need to have their own personality, be their own people, otherwise they lose that special something every writer strives for.

[Joolazoo]

DarkSpiral wrote...

Joolazoo wrote...
In short..it's still racism. You're saying it's different, but it's still racism. No, I wouldn't treat them the same, but you're also ignoring the fact that ashley has lived nearly her entire life with the knowledge that aliens exist.

She's also lived her entire life with the Stigma of being General WIlliams granddaughter.  Also, the proper term is specism.  Racism only applies if you are referring to your own species.  An example would be the attitude toward asari with no alien partent.  The pureblood term is a racist term when sued by one asari to another.

It is obviously shown in the ME universe that this xenophobia/racism is a negative trait that most good people don't seem to have.

Source?  I can name a few otherwise good people that exhibited some pretty specist traits.  Presely was one.  The asari on Illium (ME2) that was in charge of the Zhu's Hope colony contract was another.  You can change her mind about the situation by appealing to her better nature.  Furthermore, you can actually get Ash to consider another point of view by the end of ME1, if you take those dialogue choics that argue for better relations with other species.

not to mention it is racism...as everyone in the ME universe says it is. They don't call it xenophobia because racism makes more sense in terms of aliens and humans than it does between whites and blacks if you actually look at it.

Again, please source.  Ashley is the only one I can recall ever using the term.  She is hardly "everyone."
----------------------

Back on topic!  I was rather glad Ashley didn't end up beign Bi.  I wasn't really fond of the tactic they took in DA2 where all love interests (except Sebastian) were available to all players.  I prefer NPCs that have preferences that make sense within their established characters, as we did in ME3.  That is largely a matter of taste, of course.  I'm not trying to suggest there is anything actually BAD about the idea that all LIs are available to any character.  I suppose it breaks immersion for me.

Source is I played the game. Think for yourself for a second please...you are asking sources from me, but then say things yourself with no sources what so ever. You sighting an asari on Illium who you talk to for a minute and pressly proves you have no real paragon characters who are racist, specist, or xenophobic.


Ashley=Still racist.

here's an example in game. Turian say "You humans are all racist". You can either say that the writers were mentally taking a dump during this or you could acknowledge the fact that racism is used to refer to different species in this game since there is no racism between humans in the ME lore. Not to mention having one of the main characters like ashley refer to it as racism should be all you need to know...please stop arguing for the sake of arguing.

Modifié par Joolazoo, 25 mars 2012 - 11:48 .

[Jaron Oberyn]

The reason is because Ashley was implied to be a Christian, or at least religious, in ME1.
If they made her gay it wouldn't be consistent, and quite honestly I'm glad they didn't. There's already liara.


-Polite

[sistersafetypin]

PoliteAssasin wrote...

The reason is because Ashley was implied to be a Christian, or at least religious, in ME1.
If they made her gay it wouldn't be consistent, and quite honestly I'm glad they didn't. There's already liara.


-Polite

This makes the assumption that one cannot be both gay and a Christian.

So.... Lesbians should have been satisfied with just Liara? Don't get me wrong, I absolutely adored her character. But I'm starting to get the feeling that most would have been happier if there was: 1 Lesbian, 1 Gay, and multiple straight options.

Which is frankly bs

Modifié par sistersafetypin, 26 mars 2012 - 12:02 .

[Fubarman]

Wait Kaiden's supposed to be straight? I never would have thought. Wait people let Kaiden live?

[sistersafetypin]

Fubarman wrote...

Wait Kaiden's supposed to be straight? I never would have thought. Wait people let Kaiden live?

lol, I sure didn't 

[Kawamura]

PoliteAssasin wrote...

The reason is because Ashley was implied to be a Christian, or at least religious, in ME1.
If they made her gay it wouldn't be consistent, and quite honestly I'm glad they didn't. There's already liara.


-Polite

As pointed out, there are gay Christians and gay religious people. 

The request is for her to be both, not gay. Which I was sad about, really. I thought it a nice touch to be able to romance the Virmire survivor, no matter the sex. 

[fredward55]

Sparatus wrote...

AntiDave wrote...


Liara is not a lesbian option, she is monogendered.

And that gender is...

WOMAN.

IT IS A S/S RELATIONSHIP! SHUTUP! 

Bioware says otherwise

[Jaron Oberyn]

sistersafetypin wrote...

PoliteAssasin wrote...

The reason is because Ashley was implied to be a Christian, or at least religious, in ME1.
If they made her gay it wouldn't be consistent, and quite honestly I'm glad they didn't. There's already liara.

-Polite

This makes the assumption that one cannot be both gay and a Christian.

So.... Lesbians should have been satisfied with just Liara? Don't get me wrong, I absolutely adored her character. But I'm starting to get the feeling that most would have been happier if there was: 1 Lesbian, 1 Gay, and multiple straight options.

Which is frankly bs

Not do get into a religious discussion, but Christianity rejects same sex relationships. If you consider yourself gay and a christian, more power to you. But you won't be a genuine Christian according to their beliefs. 

Again, I'm sure this was due to her being a Christian.

-Polite

[Qutayba]

To be honest, I kind of liked the way they did it. Making everyone bi (like the Sims) would seem kind of like a cop-out. They actually allowed for the inclusion of characters (Cortez, Traynor) that are exclusively S/S attracted, which is a HUGE step forward, when you think about it. You get a full spectrum represented rather than making everyone essentially the same. It's not hetero-normative. ******-normative, or bi-normative.

On the other hand, I think they could have included other features of attraction: paragon/renegade, hair color, etc.

[Qutayba]

PoliteAssasin wrote...

Not do get into a religious discussion, but Christianity rejects same sex relationships. If you consider yourself gay and a christian, more power to you. But you won't be a genuine Christian according to their beliefs. 

Again, I'm sure this was due to her being a Christian.

-Polite

Agreeing that I don't really want to start/continue a religious argument.  Yes, some Christian interpretations would say this, but there are a vast array of Christian theologies (as in any religion), and there is no consensus on this point among all people who call themselves Christian - just as there is no consensus on the use of alcohol.

[sistersafetypin]

PoliteAssasin wrote...

sistersafetypin wrote...

PoliteAssasin wrote...

The reason is because Ashley was implied to be a Christian, or at least religious, in ME1.
If they made her gay it wouldn't be consistent, and quite honestly I'm glad they didn't. There's already liara.

-Polite

This makes the assumption that one cannot be both gay and a Christian.

So.... Lesbians should have been satisfied with just Liara? Don't get me wrong, I absolutely adored her character. But I'm starting to get the feeling that most would have been happier if there was: 1 Lesbian, 1 Gay, and multiple straight options.

Which is frankly bs

Not do get into a religious discussion, but Christianity rejects same sex relationships. If you consider yourself gay and a christian, more power to you. But you won't be a genuine Christian according to their beliefs. 

Again, I'm sure this was due to her being a Christian.

-Polite

I don't consider myself gay and a Christian. But again, not the point. Many people do, and to suggest otherwise is to impose your own beliefs on others. 

The way I see it... If Ash is bi and you're playing a mShep, you would literally never no this. And if you're playing a fShep and you're straight... You turn her down. That wouldn't have been hard to implement at all

I'll let this drop. But I wanted to say that first

Modifié par sistersafetypin, 26 mars 2012 - 12:45 .