114 réponses à ce sujet

[Vaktathi]

robertm2 wrote...

Skirata129 wrote...

robertm2 wrote...
you cannot censor or change art just because you dont like it.

about that...
www.siracd.com/work_h_death.shtml
answers.yahoo.com/question/index

well those are the same people who molest little boys and cover it up so dont expect them to follow any sort of rules unless its the rules they make.

It is odd  how you evaded posting on every reponse to your assertion and simply posted about child molestation in response.


Odd thought process, doesn't seem to help your initial "art" argument much.

[Spectre-00N7]

Opsrbest wrote...
People weren't supporting it to be generous and give to the charity for the sake of giving to a charity they were donating to make it use a point and trying to force a change.

Speculations from everyone.  I can at least say for myself that I still support this charity, [sarcasm]even if it isn't being used to force change[/sarcasm]. 

[BWGungan]

IronSabbath88 wrote...

Still, the charity was used as an outlet to change the ending... just... that strikes me as wrong on so many levels.

Like when corps regularly make donations to charities to make the public aware of their products right?  That doesn't happen all the time right?

[Mad-Max90]

Wait...people were requesting refunds???? From a charity?!?WTF?!?

[mrderp27]

robertm2 wrote...

Skirata129 wrote...

robertm2 wrote...
you cannot censor or change art just because you dont like it.

about that...
www.siracd.com/work_h_death.shtml
answers.yahoo.com/question/index

well those are the same people who molest little boys and cover it up so dont expect them to follow any sort of rules unless its the rules they make.

well, that changes everything! /s

[Thornne]

Given that PA's coverage of this has been pretty Bioware-friendly, it could very well be a factor. But it is their charity, and they can decide to take or not take money from whoever they want.

[Mad-Max90]

Also I'd like to add, corporations use charities for tax reasons...I know my grandfather's company does

[xeNNN]

Unit-Alpha wrote...

Lankist wrote...

Perhaps they wanted to distance themselves from us because we're attacking everyone who looks at us the wrong way, including the charity itself?

Just a thought.

It more likely has to do with the fact that Penny Arcade attacked the Retake movement and couldn't bring themselves to be bigger hypocrites.

this ^

the fact they already had a conflict of interest only further proves the point that they didnt want to be assosicated with us in the first place and that forcibly ending the donation drive and making us look bad in the process only furthers the fact that they dont like our movement and never want to be near it. 

[Varus Praetor]

IronSabbath88 wrote...

Still, the charity was used as an outlet to change the ending... just... that strikes me as wrong on so many levels.

More wrong than saying "no thanks, we don't want to give your money to needy children because we disagree with you"...?

Your priorities are jacked.  Maybe if this was NAMBLA or something, but Retake was as benign as you can get.  "Powder-keg cause"....hyperbole much?

[xeNNN]

Thornne wrote...

Given that PA's coverage of this has been pretty Bioware-friendly, it could very well be a factor. But it is their charity, and they can decide to take or not take money from whoever they want.

tbh i agree but i dont think thats the point of the conversation, the clear conflict of interest clearly proves PA's biased attitude. 

[FemmeShep]

Stevens_Rock wrote...

So Child's Play was able to see that what started out as a good idea could cause major problems if in the future and took steps to fix it. They should probably be giving advice to the BioWare writing team.

You mean..Casey and Mac 

[Kargsure]

A Charity by it's very nature needs to remain apolitical - it can't be seen to be taking side in any situation unrelated to it's own goals & aims.

Unfortunately, in this case, despite what was a good intention by the person who set this up, and by the majority (I presume anyways) of those that donated, the Charity was being used as a weapon by both sides. I read a number of reports that basically boiled down to "look at us we deserve a new ending because we donated to a good cause", likewise I read others that used the "now they are using a charity to hide behind" type arguements. There were also the neutral reports that simply stated that the movement was taking the oportunity to raise funds for a good cause along the way, but those often got lost in the crowd.

The sad part is, no matter which side of the ending debate you fall on, the losers with regards to this whole situation is that while $80k (less any refunds made to people who obviously couldn't read the details on the page set up to accept these donations) was donated, (which people should agree is a good thing), I have no doubts an even greater amount would have been raised had the donation drive been able to run it's full course (again not blaming the charity here I can see thier point of view entirely).

ETA:
In the end the charity directors acted in what it felt was the best interest of the charity (as is their job), and while I am not privy to any discussions that took place - my impression is (and I could be wrong), that they didn't outright ask for the charity drive to be ended, rather that it was ended by mutual agreement as a result of those discussions.

Modifié par Kargsure, 26 mars 2012 - 05:29 .

[Kanner]

* Casey & Mac won't be causing anyone any problems in the future. =)

* While Penny Arcade are very fond of Bioware, and the associated EA adverstising monies, the use of a charity to protest an unassociated issue is potentially dangerous going forward. Charities have ONLY their reputations to rely on. If people don't trust them, or lose faith due to negative associations, that's it for the charity. Game over, man.

[Jayce]

Opsrbest wrote...

http://penny-arcade.com/2012/03/21
She’s been asked what the goal is, and how much they need to raise in
order to get the ending produced. We’ve also been contacted by PayPal
due to a high number of people asking for their donations back.  This is
in addition to readers who simply couldn’t understand how this was
connected to Child’s Play’s mission.

RTM isn't corporate sponsorship of a charity inline with a product. The two concepts are not mutally exlusive. Charity drives for the salvation army, food banks, welfare clothing, homeless shelter, drug abuse, anything child related, supporting local police officer charities and even the retarded save the environment causes all have a set mission statement that works with the charity. RTM didn't and doesn't other then an attempt to show force. So while most charities do engage in some form of sponsorship to raise awareness the basis isn't embeded in ________.

You can pick your own word to fill the line. None of mine are nice enough to say on the forums. And yes lets hope that it is actually a small, as in less then 2% of the donators, that were as misguided and utterly retarded as to think they were actually paying for an alternative ending.

And so when we are clear of this since you can bet your bum's EA and activision are more then aware of what is happeneing and when we as gamers get exploited from the repricussions of this it's people like RTM that are to blame for it.

How utterly quaint and generous of you to presume to know my reasons for donating to a children's charity.  <_<

It's assinine assumptions and claims like yours that lead to the donation drive being cancelled, so kindly blame yourself.

[The_Crazy_Hand]

 It's not surprising, but the truth is, going after CP or PA over this won't do us any good, even if this is true.

[Vaerkone]

Skirata129 wrote...

according to this article by cinema blend, both quoting and analyzing responses from Jamie Dillon regarding questions posed about the ending of the Child's Play charity drive, the drive was not actually ended due to a large number of mentally disabled gamers thinking they were contributing to a fund intended to buy ending DLC from Bioware, but instead due to corporate politics, namely Penny Arcade wanting to distance themselves from the Retake Mass Effect movement.

The fact that a charity intended to help sick children was cut short, despite being enormously successful, in order for a game reviewer to remove any perceived association between themselves and a movement protesting an Industry giant's current installment in a major franchise speaks volumes more than I could ever hope to point out.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you saying that it is wrong of Penny Arcade (game reviewers) to distance themselves from Retake, a (obviously) biased movement for a change to the ending of a game.

And then Retakers call IGN names because they are biased against the changing of a game? So it's all fine as long as someone sides with Retake, everyone else are stupid, is that right?

[FemmeShep]

Faridarsabra wrote...

Skirata129 wrote...

according to this article by cinema blend, both quoting and analyzing responses from Jamie Dillon regarding questions posed about the ending of the Child's Play charity drive, the drive was not actually ended due to a large number of mentally disabled gamers thinking they were contributing to a fund intended to buy ending DLC from Bioware, but instead due to corporate politics, namely Penny Arcade wanting to distance themselves from the Retake Mass Effect movement.

The fact that a charity intended to help sick children was cut short, despite being enormously successful, in order for a game reviewer to remove any perceived association between themselves and a movement protesting an Industry giant's current installment in a major franchise speaks volumes more than I could ever hope to point out.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you saying that it is wrong of Penny Arcade (game reviewers) to distance themselves from Retake, a (obviously) biased movement for a change to the ending of a game.

And then Retakers call IGN names because they are biased against the changing of a game? So it's all fine as long as someone sides with Retake, everyone else are stupid, is that right?

Are you actually defending IGN? lool All this drama aside, IGN has always been awful. People been saying that for yeaaaars.

"Can't spell Ignorant without IGN" has been a phrases used for years. 

[Vaerkone]

FemmeShep wrote...

Faridarsabra wrote...

Skirata129 wrote...

according to this article by cinema blend, both quoting and analyzing responses from Jamie Dillon regarding questions posed about the ending of the Child's Play charity drive, the drive was not actually ended due to a large number of mentally disabled gamers thinking they were contributing to a fund intended to buy ending DLC from Bioware, but instead due to corporate politics, namely Penny Arcade wanting to distance themselves from the Retake Mass Effect movement.

The fact that a charity intended to help sick children was cut short, despite being enormously successful, in order for a game reviewer to remove any perceived association between themselves and a movement protesting an Industry giant's current installment in a major franchise speaks volumes more than I could ever hope to point out.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you saying that it is wrong of Penny Arcade (game reviewers) to distance themselves from Retake, a (obviously) biased movement for a change to the ending of a game.

And then Retakers call IGN names because they are biased against the changing of a game? So it's all fine as long as someone sides with Retake, everyone else are stupid, is that right?

Are you actually defending IGN? lool All this drama aside, IGN has always been awful. People been saying that for yeaaaars.

"Can't spell Ignorant without IGN" has been a phrases used for years. 

I'm not defending anyone, I just think it's funny that people get upset when game reviewers side with the Industry, saying that they should be unbiased, but when a game reviewer decide not to side with the players (and thus, stay unbiased), the players get upset.

It's the same with FOX News, ME fans hated them for their controversial reporting about sex in Mass Effect, but I remember a week or two ago someone posted an article FOX News had done about Retake that was semi-pro, and all of a sudden many players here on the forum praised them.

Talk about hypocrites.

If you want IGN to be neutral and not take side with the Industry, then players should think it is good of PA for wanting to be neutral and not side with the players.

[Hanabii]

Lankist wrote...

Unit-Alpha wrote...

Lankist wrote...

Perhaps they wanted to distance themselves from us because we're attacking everyone who looks at us the wrong way, including the charity itself?

Just a thought.

It more likely has to do with the fact that Penny Arcade attacked the Retake movement and couldn't bring themselves to be bigger hypocrites.

You are currently demonstrating precisely why they do not want to be associated with us.

You donated to a charity. Do not complain about the charity. You can still donate to them directly, there is absolutely nothing stopping you. The drive ended amicably, there is no conspiracy.

She's not complaining about the Charity, or donating to it. She's complaining about Penny Arcade putting it's ego before the people they are supposedly championing.

[tenojitsu]

I see their point in that they dont want to get attached to the organization that is doing the charity drive. I mean, what if a bunch of NRA members decided to do a "Protect the 2nd Amendment" movement by donating to a charity. Obviously the charity wouldnt want to take sides with such an issue, so coming from a corporate environment I can see why they would create policy to stop this.

That being said, the Retake movement isnt hurting anyone and they should be able to see the difference between that and a more politcally charged issue.

[xsdob]

How about it's against their rules to let people use their charity to advocate whatever they want instead of what the charities actual purpose is.

Like me using the susan g komen foundation to advocate bringing back the mcrib permanently.
I don't think they'd be cool with me having that as the cause instead of breast cancer awareness.

[MOIST N FLUFFY]

Someone should just start another one. Can't stop Shepard.

[Iakus]

Faridarsabra wrote...
It's the same with FOX News, ME fans hated them for their controversial reporting about sex in Mass Effect, but I remember a week or two ago someone posted an article FOX News had done about Retake that was semi-pro, and all of a sudden many players here on the forum praised them.

Talk about hypocrites.

"Praise" is really stretching it in that case.

Those posts were commenting on how fair the reporting was, followed up by lines like "I feel dirty saying that"  Poeple were suprised, not delighted..  They did indeed remember the ME1 controversey

[Clayless]

Funny how the Retake movement is making threads to attack the co-founders.

[xsdob]

Modifié par xsdob, 26 mars 2012 - 05:58 .