3484 réponses à ce sujet

[Viyu]

beutelmarkus wrote...

The ending is only riddled with plot holes if you take it at face value without taking into account the obvious probability of the indoctrination theory.  If this isn't the case, then yes - it's a pretty bad ending, but that still doesn't make the whole cupcakes/charity movement for a new/revised ending any less ridiculous.

While we're at it, lets also petition Square Enix, Konami, and Nintendo to re-release a version of FF7 with Aeris alive, a version of Metal Gear Solid 2 with Snake instead of Raiden, and a version of Metroid where Samus Aran is a dude.

Maybe JK Rowling can also bring Dumbledore back to life if we send her some cupcakes in the mail.

The problem is that much of what you mentioned makes crystal clear sense to the fans. People know why Aeris died. People know why Dumbledore died. If you're going to make Shepherd indoctrinated you need to make that clear how and why that happened in the final installment of the series. We don't even know how the battle actually ended if Sheperd is in fact indoctrinated. Does that mean the reapers have won? We don't understand what is going on, and the irony is that people have so many qualms about Bioware giving into the fans, but it's like they wanted the ending to be completely speculatory to those very same fans.

I mean, I accept the fact the writers and fans are co-creators to Shepherd's story, but its like they completely destroyed the concept of player choice, after they promised to give us that choice, because we don't get to see how they actually matter.

Modifié par Viyu, 01 avril 2012 - 03:06 .

[XDogSoldier]

Aren't all these arguments kinda irrelevant at this point? I mean, they know our gripes. And people are just egging others on to explode the whole situation. We can be civil and discuss the games flaws yes. But not throw out the "Reasons" why people are mad. We all know why. So lets sit back, relax, and wait for April 6th-8th for news. Hold the Line! (but do not cross it)

(only a week to PAX)<3

Modifié par XDogSoldier, 01 avril 2012 - 03:21 .

[Suspire]

Yumi50 wrote...

But no, you refused to eat a friendly gesture and gave them to someone else.
If I want to donate things to kids, I would have. Oh wait.. I did that for child's play already.
 

Wasn't it called wrong to call attention to a cause by doing charity (child's play petition's case), so it was shut down? Isn't that what BW did here in the fans names?

Modifié par Suspire, 01 avril 2012 - 03:59 .

[Viyu]

Suspire wrote...

Yumi50 wrote...

But no, you refused to eat a friendly gesture and gave them to someone else.
If I want to donate things to kids, I would have. Oh wait.. I did that for child's play already.
 

Wasn't it called wrong to call attention to a cause by doing charity (child's play petition's case), so it was shut down? Isn't that what BW did here in the fans names?

IICR Chris Priestly said the cupcakes were given to charity because it was obvious that the fans were not giving them the cupcakes to celebrate ME3. Isn't that abusing charity in the same manner they were accusing fans of doing? Using charity to make a statement of their own?

Modifié par Viyu, 01 avril 2012 - 04:03 .

[Suspire]

Ok that's.... ****** up.

[Viyu]

Suspire wrote...

Ok that's.... ****** up.

Chris Preistly said:

Hi EveryoneToday, we received the 400 cupcakes you collectively sent us through
your donations to express your feelings about the endings of Mass Effect
3. We want you to know; we are indeed listening to all fan response and
acknowledge your feedback. We appreciate creative and thoughtful
attempts like this one.

The gesture certainly gained our attention both with its creativity
and deliciousness. However, while we do appreciate that fans were
creative in how they expressed their views, after a lot of discussion,
we decided ultimately the reason that they were sent was not done in the
context of celebrating the work or accomplishment of the Mass Effect 3
team. This is a subtle, but important aspect in determining how to pass
the feedback to the team.

BioWare regularly works with many deserving charities,  as such it
was decided that rather than passing  out the cupcakes to staff or
wasting good food, to donate them on behalf of our fans to a local
Edmonton youth shelter.

We know that for the kids that have to use this
facility, something as simple as a cupcake is a rare treat and would
definitely brighten up their day.  Thank you to the fine folks at the
local youth shelter for accepting the donation and to the fans who
donated the cupcakes.Please keep providing your feedback on Mass Effect 3, we’re still listening.

Even if you regularly give to charity, that doesn't defer from the issue, that you guys donated to charity this time because you didn't agree with the message behind what the fans were saying.

Modifié par Viyu, 01 avril 2012 - 04:22 .

[Cancer Puppet]

Wow. WOW! I'll begrudgingly give Bioware points for that media deflection! This is, in my opinion, the first smart PR move they've made since this began. Well played Bioware. Well played indeed.

That said, they did have days to consider their move.

Modifié par Cancer Puppet, 01 avril 2012 - 04:23 .

[Viyu]

Deflection? Yes. But why isn't Penny Arcade whining? What was the point in ending the last charity campaign if they essentially did the same thing? Why isn't anybody complaining about what Bioware has done, and are pointing angry fingers only at the fans. Curious, isn't it?

Modifié par Viyu, 01 avril 2012 - 04:24 .

[Suspire]

the reason that they were sent was not done in the context of celebrating the work or accomplishment of the Mass Effect 3 team. This is a subtle, but important aspect in determining how to pass the feedback to the team."

Am I reading this right? So only if people praise the game the feedback is accepted? They're saying the way to send feedback is praise? Celebration? The hellllllllllll..... this is insane. Holy ************************.
I guess I can show my art to people and tell them how to send feedback: "praise me pls"

*MIND BLOWN*
I'll be facepalming over here.

Modifié par Suspire, 01 avril 2012 - 04:27 .

[Viyu]

Does this deserve its own topic? I had mixed feelings about donating to the first charity, and I didn't have money to spend anyway. But I'm getting awfully sick of the fact that everybody's hard work got criticized while Bioware gets treated saintly for doing the exact same thing. WHY hasn't anybody brought this up? People let their hard earned money go to that charity, and Penny Arcade has nothing to say to Bioware?

Modifié par Viyu, 01 avril 2012 - 04:32 .

[Suspire]

I felt the same way, but man.... I thought since I accepted the evil of er, rEApers and had read enough bad stuff about BW and from BW, but I'm kinda impressed by this new low. Both the charity and the not so subtle message that they only accept praise.??????????????????????? My mind boggles, I need some away time now. But yes somebody needs to say something.

[XDogSoldier]

Whats with all the hate? They accept both forms of info. Good or Bad. What Chris was talking about was the Death threats and Hate e-mails. I'd get mad at those too and not want any part of em. Donating to a youth center was smart. Most of the cupcakes(90%) would have went bad if they kept em. They got the messages attached to em and did good by giving a treat to kids who have it bad.
So all in all Success! The drilling point of this message is: No hate mail, no death threats, and not to single out 1 bioware employee.
If we want to look like fans and not stalkers that is the best and civil way of doing things.
I mean how would you feel if someone started threatening you and calling you a P.O.S developer? I've played a lot of Bioware games over the years and this is the Second one that I felt a little sad about (DA:2), So not so bad if you think about terms of how many games were screwed up to how many games totally kicked ass!

[Viyu]

I think my problem is that people in the Bioware camp are going to masquerade "concern" for children, and worried about children not being the "cause" of the donations, just to kick down a movement. So when Bioware essentially sends cupcakes to charity to make a point, none of their supporters have anything to say about it.

[Suspire]

XDogSoldier wrote...

Whats with all the hate? They accept both forms of info. Good or Bad. What Chris was talking about was the Death threats and Hate e-mails

Where did you get this from? Did you not see the quote?

[Vilegrim]

John Epler wrote...

MeganHunter wrote...

@Loudent Alias/Wavefront eh? I remember when theys was separate, dagnabit! And git offa my lawn.

@John Oh I've been doing just maya...well, that and after effects. But for things I used to do character animation on, a lot of it's motion capture now. Sometimes I feel like I got a dead degree. Oh well...as long as I have time to *play* games I'm a happy camper lol.

I have a degree in English literature and Film Studies. The latter is certainly relevant, although even then, it had more to do with theories of film analysis than the specifics of how films are made. The former, though - well, if you want an analysis of Seamus Heaney poetry, I'm your man. I'd argue there's really no such thing as a 'dead' degree, though, especially not in this industry.

but doesn't the understanding of tools and structure of narrative help?

[Viyu]

Suspire wrote...

XDogSoldier wrote...

Whats with all the hate? They accept both forms of info. Good or Bad. What Chris was talking about was the Death threats and Hate e-mails

Where did you get this from? Did you not see the quote?

Apparently he did not.....OwO;;;; lets just make another cupcake drive....and let it go to charity this time. That'd be great.... it'd be nice if we could make like bake clubs and stuff on the BSN. Doing donations and stuff year round. A nice thing to have community spirit or something?

Modifié par Viyu, 01 avril 2012 - 05:35 .

[XDogSoldier]

Suspire wrote...

XDogSoldier wrote...

Whats with all the hate? They accept both forms of info. Good or Bad. What Chris was talking about was the Death threats and Hate e-mails

Where did you get this from? Did you not see the quote?

In a later post by Chris. I've been following this forum since it was 20 pages young. So I've read all dev posts. If I can find it again I'll repost it.

[Suspire]

XDogSoldier wrote...

Suspire wrote...

XDogSoldier wrote...

Whats with all the hate? They accept both forms of info. Good or Bad. What Chris was talking about was the Death threats and Hate e-mails

Where did you get this from? Did you not see the quote?

In a later post by Chris. I've been following this forum since it was 20 pages young. So I've read all dev posts. If I can find it again I'll repost it.

Does it have anything to do with the quote posted here? Because it specifically says they rejected the cupcakes because it was not celebrating the game:
"we decided ultimately the reason that they were sent was not done in the
context of celebrating the work or accomplishment of the Mass Effect 3
team. This is a subtle, but important aspect in determining how to pass
the feedback to the team."


Viyu, there goes your thread, that was funny.  I just need more time to become more jaded now and pretend BW didn't  just made fans look bad while making themselves look like they do charity.

Modifié par Suspire, 01 avril 2012 - 06:06 .

[XDogSoldier]

Chris Priestly wrote...

People are spinning this incorrectly to say we are not listening to "negative feedback" and how bad we are and etcetera.

Wrong.

We did listen. At no time did we try to stop Fuss for making the cupcakes or delivering them (this would be unfair to Fuss and to the fans who sent the cupcakes and a generally dickish thing to do). When the cupcakes reached us, we did not refuse to take them (again, unfair to the people who sent them). I, along with Fernando, Mark and Alistair went down, met with Shadow Wrought, gave him some swag for being brave enough to show up and keep us honest and took them upstairs. We took all of the included messages out of the bags and boxes so we would not lose them (again, cuz we're listening). We did not throw them away, ignore them till they got stale or not use them as what they are, food. We chose not to eat them and gave them to a needy charity.

The message REACHED us. Whether we ate the cupcakes, threw them in teh garbage or donated them to charity is secondary to us getting the message, right? If we had (somehow) frozen time, put them in a display case for all time as a reminder of the message sent by fans, this would have been the same thing.

Us actually eating the cupcakes or not should not have been the issue. The issue was fans creatively sent us a message expressing their love for Mass Effect as a franchise, but dislike over the endings. This message was delivered to us and we got it loud and clear.

 This was about page 110 or so. This message seems to get "over looked" so others can complain.

Modifié par XDogSoldier, 01 avril 2012 - 05:47 .

[XDogSoldier]

"we decided ultimately the reason that they were sent was not done in the
context of celebrating the work or accomplishment of the Mass Effect 3
team. This is a subtle, but important aspect in determining how to pass
the feedback to the team."
This was a PR approved message. Chris retracted that message and ignored PR and came out as a human. And why is this 1 line always brought up and the Human Chris message ignored? Sensationalism is the answer!

Modifié par XDogSoldier, 01 avril 2012 - 05:50 .

[Suspire]

XDogSoldier wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...

People are spinning this incorrectly to say we are not listening to "negative feedback" and how bad we are and etcetera.

Wrong.

We did listen. At no time did we try to stop Fuss for making the cupcakes or delivering them (this would be unfair to Fuss and to the fans who sent the cupcakes and a generally dickish thing to do). When the cupcakes reached us, we did not refuse to take them (again, unfair to the people who sent them). I, along with Fernando, Mark and Alistair went down, met with Shadow Wrought, gave him some swag for being brave enough to show up and keep us honest and took them upstairs. We took all of the included messages out of the bags and boxes so we would not lose them (again, cuz we're listening). We did not throw them away, ignore them till they got stale or not use them as what they are, food. We chose not to eat them and gave them to a needy charity.

The message REACHED us. Whether we ate the cupcakes, threw them in teh garbage or donated them to charity is secondary to us getting the message, right? If we had (somehow) frozen time, put them in a display case for all time as a reminder of the message sent by fans, this would have been the same thing.

Us actually eating the cupcakes or not should not have been the issue. The issue was fans creatively sent us a message expressing their love for Mass Effect as a franchise, but dislike over the endings. This message was delivered to us and we got it loud and clear.

 This was about page 110 or so. This message seems to get "over looked" so others can complain.

Thank you for that.  The guy who wrote that previous PR is probably fired, because they are completely contradicting messages. (why would PR approve of saying they only listen to praise anyway)
The issue with fans taking heat for charity while BW doesn't is still present.
(you post faster edit again:)
And no I didn't see the other message, I had no other explanation, and
saying something like that cannot be interpreted in any other way. They should just not have said that if they didn't mean it.

Modifié par Suspire, 01 avril 2012 - 05:55 .

[XDogSoldier]

Because Monetary charity: Meaning donating money to a charity using Retake Mass Effect as a launch pad takes away from the Receiving charities Goals of Focus. Food Donating: I've done my share of food prep for large crowds. Trust me. 400 cupcakes for a small group of Workers at Bioware would have gone completely bad in a short time. Them taking the messages and giving the food to a group(not really a charity in my mind) that could use it makes Sense.
I took offence to using Retake to make money for Child's Play. Child's Play wasn't being used for the good of the charity. It was being used for the good of Retake.

[XDogSoldier]

I'm just hoping cool heads prevail and this thread doesn't get locked because of reacting to old posts and reopening old wounds.

[Suspire]

Donating food is not charity? Okay, it'd also make sense for the fans to donate the food themselves, but that would be seen just as badly as child's play... you know, nevermind.

Didn't know they still close threads because of that. Just forget about it.

Modifié par Suspire, 01 avril 2012 - 06:00 .

[DayusMakhina]

Suspire wrote...

Thank you for that.  The guy who wrote that previous PR is probably fired, because they are completely contradicting messages. (why would PR approve of saying they only listen to praise anyway)
The issue with fans taking heat for charity while BW doesn't is still present.
(you post faster )

That statement was clearly in relation to accepting the cupcakes themselves rather than the criticism attached.

Also the 'issue' that you and the other guy seem to have come up with doesn't add up at all. Penny Arcade pulled the Child's Play campaign because they felt that people were donating for the wrong reasons. It was causing a lot of hassle with people asking for money back and in general others being so dense as to not be aware of the reasons behind it and thus actually expecting something from donating. That sort of thing is not good for a charity and thus Penny Arcade were right to pull it.

When it comes to Bioware giving away the cupcakes it's a completely different story, for one them giving them away serves no ulterior motive, the cupcakes were sent to Bioware as a message from the fans. Bioware got the messages but instead of eating the 400 cupcakes they didn't need they opted to simply give them to a local youth shelter to kids whom would appreciate them far more. How can anyone have any complaints about that at all?

Modifié par DayusMakhina, 01 avril 2012 - 06:04 .