326 réponses à ce sujet

[Jacks-Up]

Valmy wrote...

It is a bit of a plot hole that you can use Blood Magic but I think it comes down to it because you are the Grey Warden and a Blight is going on people overlook it.

It is even more of a plot hole you can have Wynne learn it though.

I agree some specializations should be locked to certain characters Wynne should not be able to become a blood mage and Alistair should not be able to become a Rever.

[elijah_kaine]

Jacks-Up wrote...

Valmy wrote...

It is a bit of a plot hole that you can use Blood Magic but I think it comes down to it because you are the Grey Warden and a Blight is going on people overlook it.

It is even more of a plot hole you can have Wynne learn it though.

I agree some specializations should be locked to certain characters Wynne should not be able to become a blood mage and Alistair should not be able to become a Rever.

I think it would be far more intresting if you brought up the spec screen for Wynee, hit Blood Mage and then the book shuts and it shows a dialog between you and Wynne "You want me to study what? I'm not going to go to those lengths, how could you ask it of me?"

Maybe even have the option of aruging with Alistiar about having become a Revear, or even maybe manipulating him into it?

[Lotion Soronarr]

Mavkiel wrote...
Dales, circle, templars hunting down apostates? Apostates being simply
people who don't share the Chantrys view, not users of blood magic.

Justified. Mages are extreemly dangerous even when they are locked in a tower. Not to mention that most apostates get captured.

Dales -- Remember when elves used to have their own lands? And not living behind walls and locked gates as second class citzins? Oh yes, a little thing called an exhalted march brought an end to that

The exact reasons for hte march are left vauge.

Circle -- Created and controlled by the chantry. If your born a mage you are taken from your parents and put under lock and key, forever. Unless you manage to get some "circle" business that requires you to leave your home *cough* Prison *cough*. And oh yes, if they decide the circle is corrupt enough, they(The chantry) can get an annulment to slaughter everyone, innocent or not.

Necessary. Even most mages agree.

[Alex Savchovsky]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Circle -- Created and controlled by the chantry. If your born a mage you are taken from your parents and put under lock and key, forever. Unless you manage to get some "circle" business that requires you to leave your home *cough* Prison *cough*. And oh yes, if they decide the circle is corrupt enough, they(The chantry) can get an annulment to slaughter everyone, innocent or not.

Necessary. Even most mages agree.

And where did that lead? Fighting factions inside the Circle and a rebellion. Great.

[Original182]

Alex Savchovsky wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Circle -- Created and controlled by the chantry. If your born a mage you are taken from your parents and put under lock and key, forever. Unless you manage to get some "circle" business that requires you to leave your home *cough* Prison *cough*. And oh yes, if they decide the circle is corrupt enough, they(The chantry) can get an annulment to slaughter everyone, innocent or not.

Necessary. Even most mages agree.

And where did that lead? Fighting factions inside the Circle and a rebellion. Great.

His point is that why do you ONLY attack the Chantry for the Rite of Annulment, when even mages themselves agree there is no choice. How come mages are exempt from your judgement?
All that argument does is show that you have an intolerance for the Chantry.

As for the numerous fighting factions, I thought they are already there simply because different people are different. Political factions have existed even outside the Mages Circle. And once again, you want to pin the blame on the Chantry, which is completely baseless. You must be responsible for your own actions.

You blame the Chantry for everything bad that has happened in Ferelden, but don't want to give credit to the Chantry for the good that they have done. So I question this biased view.

[Alex Savchovsky]

Original182 wrote...

His point is that why do you ONLY attack the Chantry for the Rite of Annulment, when even mages themselves agree there is no choice. How come mages are exempt from your judgement? 
All that argument does is show that you have an intolerance for the Chantry.

Well, is it not the Chantry that says "ok guys, you're dangerous so we're taking control here with those guys with the shiny heavy armor and the big swords"? Who is to blame then? It's their responsibility of course, their attitude pretty much provoked the mages rebellion. And it was not hard to see that it is going that way, it's basic psychology.

[Fishy]

Just like many other thing .. Age , appearance and specialization have no impact on your game.

You can look like an old decrepit old hag with your nose 10 feet tall and with white bald hair and a huge stinky beard(girl with a beard) while practicing blood magic and you're still seen has a 23 years old ELF Babe that practice magery.



Lot of content..Lot of dialogue ... But for the roleplay aspect of your character.Sadly outside of your origins don't expect much or expect nothing.

[Jacks-Up]

elijah_kaine wrote...

Jacks-Up wrote...

Valmy wrote...

It is a bit of a plot hole that you can use Blood Magic but I think it comes down to it because you are the Grey Warden and a Blight is going on people overlook it.

It is even more of a plot hole you can have Wynne learn it though.

I agree some specializations should be locked to certain characters Wynne should not be able to become a blood mage and Alistair should not be able to become a Rever.

I think it would be far more intresting if you brought up the spec screen for Wynee, hit Blood Mage and then the book shuts and it shows a dialog between you and Wynne "You want me to study what? I'm not going to go to those lengths, how could you ask it of me?"

Maybe even have the option of aruging with Alistiar about having become a Revear, or even maybe manipulating him into it?

I think they should just attack you or at lest Wynne.

[Jacks-Up]

Alex Savchovsky wrote...

Original182 wrote...

His point is that why do you ONLY attack the Chantry for the Rite of Annulment, when even mages themselves agree there is no choice. How come mages are exempt from your judgement? 
All that argument does is show that you have an intolerance for the Chantry.

Well, is it not the Chantry that says "ok guys, you're dangerous so we're taking control here with those guys with the shiny heavy armor and the big swords"? Who is to blame then? It's their responsibility of course, their attitude pretty much provoked the mages rebellion. And it was not hard to see that it is going that way, it's basic psychology.

Except the Chantry are not the only ones that consider Blood Magic evil just about everybody does even other mages.

Once again pl pay more attention to the game you're playing.

[Malanthor]

LOL.



Take a look at our history, you will find that societies have believed pretty much everything from birds to men with beards to be evil at some point or another. That dont make it evil.

So what where it comes from. If a bad man gives me a gun is that gun evil? Its a god damm tool!

Do blood magic have a personality? Does it do bad things on its own? If the answer is no then its not evil. The people using it hovewer can well be evil.

Sure it may involve some unsavory elements, but what abouth raise dead?? Or draining someones life to heal yourself, or cursing them. Not evil?

Blood magic is just evil because it has been labeled that way by society. it has no inherent corrupting influence that we are aware off. If many blood mages act in a bad way its because they are beeing hunted/killed/alienated by pretty much the entire rest of the world. You know what that tends to do to you? It pretty much makes you into an angry man with a grudge. So stove your stupid ideas that blood magic is evil, it makes you sound like a crazy religious fanatic with your head on fire.

[Jacks-Up]

Self Controll wrote...

LOL.

Take a look at our history, you will find that societies have believed pretty much everything from birds to men with beards to be evil at some point or another. That dont make it evil.
So what where it comes from. If a bad man gives me a gun is that gun evil? Its a god damm tool!
.

A tool that has one outcome Evil.... thus if you trun to blood magic and and continue with it you are indeed evil because that is what the magic you're using is causing.

Modifié par Jacks-Up, 04 décembre 2009 - 04:15 .

[Herr Uhl]

Jacks-Up wrote...
A tool that has one outcome Evil.... thus if you trun to blood magic and and continue with it you are indeed evil because that is what the magic you're using is causing.

How is the only outcome Evil (capitalized for effect)? The bad thing with it is that you can control people, which goes against the chant.

People control can be put to good use.

[Jacks-Up]

Herr Uhl wrote...

Jacks-Up wrote...
A tool that has one outcome Evil.... thus if you trun to blood magic and and continue with it you are indeed evil because that is what the magic you're using is causing.

How is the only outcome Evil (capitalized for effect)? The bad thing with it is that you can control people, which goes against the chant.

People control can be put to good use.

Well for starters when in the game does Blood Magic ever lead to anything good?  It comes from demons remember they don't create things to help people.

[Metallisika]

So, I read the whole thread. It seems to me that Jacks-up is a troll who ignores arguments and repeats himself over and over. Blood Magic to a virus is a bad comparison. A virus is an organism whose only purpose is to replicate itself at the cost of the host. It is a parasite. Blood magic, on the other hand, is not a disease. It can be used to fuel spells that, in turn, can be used to do good. That alone makes it not evil. Even controlling minds can be good: let's say that you take control of a murderer to prevent him killing a hostage. How is that bad?

Jacks-Up wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

Jacks-Up wrote...
A tool that has one outcome Evil.... thus if you trun to blood magic and and continue with it you are indeed evil because that is what the magic you're using is causing.

How is the only outcome Evil (capitalized for effect)? The bad thing with it is that you can control people, which goes against the chant.

People control can be put to good use.

Well for starters when in the game does Blood Magic ever lead to anything good?  It comes from demons remember they don't create things to help people.

Alright. Let's say a VERY (caps for emphasis) evil man first designed a spoon as a torture device. Torturing usually is considered quite evil. Now, this same man gives you a spoon, and you use it for eating. Eating is rarely considered evil, right? Is the spoon evil?

You asked when in the game does Blood Magic lead to good? Easy. My mage ran out of mana, so I turned on blood magic, healed the tank, who didn't die and I won the battle, and thus ultimately stopping the blight. Ferelden was saved by blood magic!

It all boils down to the fact that power is not either good or evil. Tools are not good or evil, they just exist. It's the tool's user that decides how to use it.

[The Capital Gaultier]

Jacks-Up wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

Jacks-Up wrote...
A tool that has one outcome Evil.... thus if you trun to blood magic and and continue with it you are indeed evil because that is what the magic you're using is causing.

How is the only outcome Evil (capitalized for effect)? The bad thing with it is that you can control people, which goes against the chant.

People control can be put to good use.

Well for starters when in the game does Blood Magic ever lead to anything good?  It comes from demons remember they don't create things to help people.

It helps you kill the Archdemon.  That's arguably good.

[Jacks-Up]

The Capital Gaultier wrote...

Jacks-Up wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

Jacks-Up wrote...
A tool that has one outcome Evil.... thus if you trun to blood magic and and continue with it you are indeed evil because that is what the magic you're using is causing.

How is the only outcome Evil (capitalized for effect)? The bad thing with it is that you can control people, which goes against the chant.

People control can be put to good use.

Well for starters when in the game does Blood Magic ever lead to anything good?  It comes from demons remember they don't create things to help people.

It helps you kill the Archdemon.  That's arguably good.

But it is not Necessary. You're basically turning to evil to stop evil.

[Metallisika]

Jacks-Up wrote...

The Capital Gaultier wrote...

Jacks-Up wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

Jacks-Up wrote...
A tool that has one outcome Evil.... thus if you trun to blood magic and and continue with it you are indeed evil because that is what the magic you're using is causing.

How is the only outcome Evil (capitalized for effect)? The bad thing with it is that you can control people, which goes against the chant.

People control can be put to good use.

Well for starters when in the game does Blood Magic ever lead to anything good?  It comes from demons remember they don't create things to help people.

It helps you kill the Archdemon.  That's arguably good.

But it is not Necessary. You're basically turning to evil to stop evil.

I like how you ignored my post. Stop trolling.

[Jacks-Up]

Metallisika wrote...


I like how you ignored my post. Stop trolling.

LOL mad because I didn't take your troll bait?  Follow your own advise and stop trolling

[Alex Savchovsky]

Metallisika wrote...
I like how you ignored my post. Stop trolling.

Just ignore him. He's not going to listen, no matter what you say.

[Jacks-Up]

Alex Savchovsky wrote...

Metallisika wrote...
I like how you ignored my post. Stop trolling.

Just ignore him. He's not going to listen, no matter what you say.

Kettle black

[The Capital Gaultier]

Jacks-Up wrote...

The Capital Gaultier wrote...

Jacks-Up wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

Jacks-Up wrote...
A tool that has one outcome Evil.... thus if you trun to blood magic and and continue with it you are indeed evil because that is what the magic you're using is causing.

How is the only outcome Evil (capitalized for effect)? The bad thing with it is that you can control people, which goes against the chant.

People control can be put to good use.

Well for starters when in the game does Blood Magic ever lead to anything good?  It comes from demons remember they don't create things to help people.

It helps you kill the Archdemon.  That's arguably good.

But it is not Necessary. You're basically turning to evil to stop evil.

Pardon?  There is nothing evil about Blood Magic.  The evil comes from its application.  Since it is supposed to be so powerful (and it really is), why not use the finest magic available to beat the Archdemon?  It's not like your characters know how difficult the war is going to be.  As far as many are concerned, you have little chance of succeeding against the Blight.

[menasure]

Jacks-Up wrote...

Valmy wrote...

It is a bit of a plot hole that you can use Blood Magic but I think it comes down to it because you are the Grey Warden and a Blight is going on people overlook it.

It is even more of a plot hole you can have Wynne learn it though.

I agree some specializations should be locked to certain characters Wynne should not be able to become a blood mage and Alistair should not be able to become a Rever.

aw that would spoil my fun as evil character ... there are just not enough bad guys so what else can you do than to make some good guys bad?

anyway ok there should be more impact ... but only if it turns out that you are a blood mage. the chantry and their lackeys do not mess around with that's for sure but it is also a hidden specialization ... kinda like stealing: it's ok as long as you do not get caught :innocent:

Modifié par menasure, 05 décembre 2009 - 09:28 .

[Jacks-Up]

[quote]

[/quote]
Pardon?  There is nothing evil about Blood Magic.  The evil comes from its application.  Since it is supposed to be so powerful (and it really is), why not use the finest magic available to beat the Archdemon?  It's not like your characters know how difficult the war is going to be.  As far as many are concerned, you have little chance of succeeding against the Blight.

[/quote]

There are 2 types of people on this thread those who "Read the Description" of Blood Magic before choosing it and those who didn't.  I think you know what category you fall into.

"Every mage can feel the dark lure of blood magic" 

First sentence in the description reading is a wonderful thing.

[Alex Savchovsky]

Jacks-Up wrote...

There are 2 types of people on this thread those who "Read the Description" of Blood Magic before choosing it and those who didn't.  I think you know what category you fall into.

"Every mage can feel the dark lure of blood magic" 

First sentence in the description reading is a wonderful thing.

I know there's no point in that, but still:

There are two types of people in this topic - those who read descriptions and those who think themselves.

[The Capital Gaultier]

Jacks-Up wrote...

There are 2 types of people on this thread those who "Read the Description" of Blood Magic before choosing it and those who didn't.  I think you know what category you fall into.

"Every mage can feel the dark lure of blood magic" 

First sentence in the description reading is a wonderful thing.

The "bad" image of Blood Magic specifically comes from the Chantry and the Circle of Magi, probably because the Tevinter used (and still do use) slaves to fuel their Blood Magic.  The player character uses his or her own life force to channel Blood Magic.

So yeah, there are two types of people: those who read without thinking and passively absorb information and those who read while analyzing and actively digest information.

Modifié par The Capital Gaultier, 05 décembre 2009 - 10:21 .