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[ObserverStatus]

SpiderFan1217 wrote...

Ten years and the ME universe is back up and running. Playing ME2 and listening to Matriarch Aethyta, it can easily be infered that the species in the current cycle are clearly capable of building their own Mass Relays. Plus, even if it takes years to get to other systems they still have Com Boeys, (Is that right? How do you spell Boey?) so they can still communicate to coordinate their efferts. Looking at the Crucible, it took them, a large group of scientists and engineers, what a couple of months to build that massive thing. A whole universe could get Relays to the major systems up and running in no time. Yep, ten years and it's like the Relays were never gone. What do you guys think?

I think that if the Asari can rebuild the relays in 10 years, Shepard's reapers can do it in 10 weeks.

[JPN17]

CaptainZaysh wrote...

FatalX7.0 wrote...

Can you give definitive, actual proof that the star systems weren't obliterated? If you can't, then I'm leaving this as a possibility. I never said this was fact.

Yes - in one of the endings, Shepard is breathing.

You realize the events in that ending had Shepard on the Citadel when it exploded only to wake up under a pile of rubble on Earth right? Probably not the best proof to give as it doesn't make any sense.

The in game lore says mass relays going boom equals super nova. Bioware did not mention any exceptions to this so any assertion otherwise is nothing more than wishful thinking.

[smooshmonster]

Does the ending (the after-the-credits) epilogue, not kind of imply that there is no galaxy-hopping any more? The way the old man talks about what "could" be out there and rather what "is", kind of seems to imply this?

I don't know, it's how I interpreted it.

[Noveax]

Well from how i think of it, in one way i will admit bioware either did on purpose or a happy accident, the way the game ends (while not the most preferred way IMO) does leave some things to imagination if you can unwrap your head from some of the more "stonewalling" plots and try to think past them.

Now this is just how I think if it, mostly to try and justify how the game ends and explain it to myself to give me some satisfaction of how it impacted  and mattered to me so just bare with me;

IE, for my Shepard, he was a full on paragon and i ended it by controlling the reapers. Now this means i control the reapers and they bend to my will, my mind and, if you really want to go deeper into it, my soul, are apart of the reapers.

Since I was paragon I would control the reapers with galactic peace in mind, helping rebuild all that the recent war has done, of course while explaining to everyone that yes they're reapers but now I (shepard) am controlling them so its going to be ok.

Would even go as far as recreating a human body, since how i rationalize it: my being, mind and soul still exist, just in a different place, and since reapers had the technology to creat/change organic bodies and since for the most part a human body is carbon and water (over simplified, but again bare with me). So i would be "me" (shepard) for the most part.

And even being able to eventually reunite with the normandy crew, since how its presented the Stargazer and the starchild shown at the end, it doesnt say that the galaxy isn't how it use to be, just the old guy explaining to the child that the galaxy is huge and other stars have of worlds with life.

Theres more to it but thats just the general way how i believe Mass effect ended.

It isn't perfect but until i can find closure somewhere else, im sticking to this

[NikitaDarkstar]

smooshmonster wrote...

Does the ending (the after-the-credits) epilogue, not kind of imply that there is no galaxy-hopping any more? The way the old man talks about what "could" be out there and rather what "is", kind of seems to imply this?

I don't know, it's how I interpreted it.

I agree (well system/cluster hopping, there never was galaxy hopping.). Also the fact that they say "The Shepard" as some sort of quasi mythological figure suggests that A) a lot of time has passed since Shepard was alive and That a lot of knowledge was lost, Add to that the "Could be" wording suggests that they havn't made any contact with any other races yet, they might have started to get back to the stars, orbiting their own planet, possibly started to visit other planets in their system, but it does sound like they haven't made contact with other species yet.

As for the whole "it released it's energy before exploding!" thing about the mass relays... How would that make a difference at all? An explosion is a release of energy so it still exploded and it still released all of it's energy. And even if it's not in such a destructive way as it could there's clearly a lot of energy in light form, and msot likely a lot of UV light in there... that's not exactly a good thing. (And in the destroy ending you do see the wave destroy Big Ben..) And since it's supposed to destroy technology it's likely it has a pretty decent EMP pulse with it which could possibly take out more than just reaper tech.

[charon45]

SpiderFan1217 wrote...



3. Their ships still work.

How do you know for sure that their ships work?  The one ship we saw get caught in the blast blew up and crashed.  If everyone else was fine, what made the Normandy special that it couldn't survive the blast? 

[NormanRawn]

I respect your OP and find it very uplifting to the current situation for many fans. However

10 years seems a very long time to wait, when you realize that people are suffering and some are dying NOW.

Even over Earth, you will have hundreds or thousands(considering the fleets size) of soldiers injured or dying. They need medical supplies and provisions immediately, and the demand may outweigh the supply. Resources may run out fast, and the ability to acquire new ones, is slowed by the destruction of the Mass Relays.

As seen through the game on the Citadel and conversations with characters. You got the impression that their is need for medical supplies, food and other provisions from soldiers and refugees alike. There was a clear demand for these provisions before the Relays were destroyed. And now that they're gone, you can imagine needless deaths of injured soldiers,  and refugees, all needing provisions that will not be available to everyone.

I can imagine a situation, where some will be left to die, to ensure others will live, so that provisions don't run out within months.

I honestly think this outcome was just an unessesary path for the writers to take. Why make me or any other fan speculate on the aftermath of the Mass Relay destruction, if we are just going to end up with Mass Relays again in as you said, 10 years?

[ThaDan64]

Militarized wrote...

The storyboard in the final hours app specifically states all endings = a new galactic dark age, in plain english that means technology is thrown backwards/lost.

smooshmonster wrote...

Does the ending (the
after-the-credits) epilogue, not kind of imply that there is no
galaxy-hopping any more? The way the old man talks about what "could" be
out there and rather what "is", kind of seems to imply this?

I don't know, it's how I interpreted it.

This makes me feel like BioWare's plans for ME4 is to have you be the stargazer's grandchild, and help rebuild the galaxy. A galaxy which in 10,000 years will be completly different than what we know and love.

Modifié par ThaDan64, 26 mars 2012 - 04:37 .

[humes spork]

Comm buoys are to mass relays what routers are to the mainline. It doesn't matter how many routers you have or how good they are, without the mainline there is no communication.

And, I can tell you from firsthand experience with the telecom industry (my family used to own a small telecom business) that standardized communication comes last. You have to have infrastructure for standardized communication. You can't lay infrastructure without transportation of workers and materiel.

Modifié par humes spork, 26 mars 2012 - 04:46 .

[CaptainZaysh]

JPN17 wrote...

You realize the events in that ending had Shepard on the Citadel when it exploded only to wake up under a pile of rubble on Earth right? Probably not the best proof to give as it doesn't make any sense.

No.  I know that's one of the pillars of the indoctrination theory, but it's not as though Shepard was buried under a red phone box or anything.  To me the rubble looks to be made of the same material thrown out by that explosion.

JPN17 wrote...
The in game lore says mass relays going boom equals super nova. Bioware did not mention any exceptions to this so any assertion otherwise is nothing more than wishful thinking.

Um, not really.  You see, explosions are caused by the instantaneous release of energy.  If you compare both cut scenes you'll note that the relay in ME3 discharges its energy before exploding (the lights die) whereas the one in Aratoht doesn't (the lights stay on).

Just as blowing up a car with no fuel will cause a smaller explosion than one with a full tank of gas, smashing an asteroid into a live relay will cause a smaller explosion than command detonating an empty one.  That's not wishful thinking, it's just physics.

And, like I said, the game actually goes on to offer proof that the relays don't destroy the systems they're in because in one ending Shepard is still breathing after the Sol relay explodes.  God I hope this theory dies soon, because it's one of the single stupidest things I've ever seen.

Modifié par CaptainZaysh, 26 mars 2012 - 06:00 .

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

Militarized wrote...

The Comm Buoys require Mass Relays... that's why they position them AT the Mass Relay and not next to earth. They slingshot the data through the relay.

The storyboard in the final hours app specifically states all endings = a new galactic dark age, in plain english that means technology is thrown backwards/lost. 

So no, it won't be 10 years. 10,000 years later at the Stargazer epilogue and they still don't have space flight... so GG Mass Effect universe. 

The devs will have to retcon their own lore(again) to fix it unless they scrap these endings. 

Hmm... well I have no interest in purchasing a game about the galactic dark age.

[garf]

Quantum Entanglement allows FTL communications that without Mass Relays. That would help but for the first few years it would mean every get's the same bad news about everyonelse's crisis without being able to do much about it.

[garf]

CaptainZaysh wrote...

JPN17 wrote...

You realize the events in that ending had Shepard on the Citadel when it exploded only to wake up under a pile of rubble on Earth right? Probably not the best proof to give as it doesn't make any sense.

No.  I know that's one of the pillars of the indoctrination theory, but it's not as though Shepard was buried under a red phone box or anything.  To me the rubble looks to be made of the same material thrown out by that explosion.

JPN17 wrote...
The in game lore says mass relays going boom equals super nova. Bioware did not mention any exceptions to this so any assertion otherwise is nothing more than wishful thinking.

Um, not really.  You see, explosions are caused by the instantaneous release of energy.  If you compare both cut scenes you'll note that the relay in ME3 discharges its energy before exploding (the lights die) whereas the one in Aratoht doesn't (the lights stay on).

Just as blowing up a car with no fuel will cause a smaller explosion than one with a full tank of gas, smashing an asteroid into a live relay will cause a smaller explosion than command detonating an empty one.  That's not wishful thinking, it's just physics.

And, like I said, the game actually goes on to offer proof that the relays don't destroy the systems they're in because in one ending Shepard is still breathing after the Sol relay explodes.  God I hope this theory dies soon, because it's one of the single stupidest things I've ever seen.

I believe someone quoted a dev somewhere, that a galactic dark age is EXACTLY what comes after Mass Effect 3. Congrats shepherd you saved the galaxy ... now it's going to meltdown. Bittersweet isn't it?

[shepskisaac]

Militarized wrote...

10,000 years later at the Stargazer epilogue and they still don't have space flight...

Pure assumption. The Stargazer ending may just as well be interpereted as little boy asking when he will be old enough to travel through the galaxy and be like his hero from grandpa's story "The Shepard". The fact that "Commander Shepard became a legened blah blah" screens pops our right after that suggest to me that this was the main intention of the scene, not "10,000 years later the galaxy is still in Dark Age". I mean seriously, it would make zero sense that after 10,000 years they still haven't rebuilt. Especially since there are multiple blatant hints throughout the series that Asari already cracked the technology behind the relays.

Modifié par IsaacShep, 26 mars 2012 - 06:16 .

[NikitaDarkstar]

CaptainZaysh wrote...

JPN17 wrote...

You realize the events in that ending had Shepard on the Citadel when it exploded only to wake up under a pile of rubble on Earth right? Probably not the best proof to give as it doesn't make any sense.

No.  I know that's one of the pillars of the indoctrination theory, but it's not as though Shepard was buried under a red phone box or anything.  To me the rubble looks to be made of the same material thrown out by that explosion.

JPN17 wrote...
The in game lore says mass relays going boom equals super nova. Bioware did not mention any exceptions to this so any assertion otherwise is nothing more than wishful thinking.

Um, not really.  You see, explosions are caused by the instantaneous release of energy.  If you compare both cut scenes you'll note that the relay in ME3 discharges its energy before exploding (the lights die) whereas the one in Aratoht doesn't (the lights stay on).

Just as blowing up a car with no fuel will cause a smaller explosion than one with a full tank of gas, smashing an asteroid into a live relay will cause a smaller explosion than command detonating an empty one.  That's not wishful thinking, it's just physics.

And, like I said, the game actually goes on to offer proof that the relays don't destroy the systems they're in because in one ending Shepard is still breathing after the Sol relay explodes.  God I hope this theory dies soon, because it's one of the single stupidest things I've ever seen.

I agree it does seem to discharge it's energy before breaking up, but you still can't call it a controlled discharge. I also agree that it might not wipe out entire systems, but you can't argue that it is safe and isn't likely to do damage. (I again point to the destroy ending where it's seen to actually damage buildings.) We also know from ME1 that element zero exposure is hazardous and causes genetic mutations and defects (biotics among other things). Add to that the IR and UV exposure for those closest to each blast and you'll have quite a few cancer issues. And since it destroys reaper tech and "synthetics" (which the SC uses as a rather broad term) it seems likely that the blast also carries some sort of EMP pulse that will mess up more sensetive electronics (which could possibly explain the Normandy crashing if it's computers got messed up.). So no, it might not completely incinerate whatever system the relay was in, but assuming it's harmless and does absolutely no damage is equally stupid, just in the other direction.

[CaptainZaysh]

NikitaDarkstar wrote...

So no, it might not completely incinerate whatever system the relay was in, but assuming it's harmless and does absolutely no damage is equally stupid, just in the other direction.

Yeah, there may well be side effects of exposure to the beam.  It doesn't actually kill the soldiers or knock down the buildings we see that are exposed to it, but yeah, future writers could definitely write in side effects of beam exposure.

That's fine, though, people saying "there may be side effects of the energy pulse" I've got no problem with.  It's the "OH NOES EVERYBODY MUST OF DIED" thing that I find to be offensively, weapons grade stupid.