I feel like this belongs here because dialogue is all about character interaction, even though it's not about a specific character. Anyhow, here's my feedback on the game so far:
So far I'm loving Mass Effect 3 just as much as I did Mass Effect 1 and 2. There are many features I miss from the older games, and many new ones I love. Everyone complains about the ending, but I haven't got to it yet, so I have no comment.
The thing bugging me right now, is the lack of conversation choice. In Mass Effect 1, the conversations would not continue without requiring user input every sentence. In Mass Effect 2, a conversation choice may decide a segment of a conversation but it would still require a lot of user input. In Mass Effect 3, I'm LUCKY if I get even ONE choice in ENTIRE conversations. I get to make some big choices, and that's IT. I get it, you streamlined the process by cutting off all the fat on the conversation and making non-critical dialogue just neutral BS that in the previous games where you would've chosen what you would have said just would have ended up with the same dialogue but the point was the CHOICE in the first place. It seems like you assume if I'm paragon I'm going to say a certain something, but what if it comes to a moment that I won't?
This is proven by the fact that you can choose to not make any dialogue choices at all, and it is so easy to do so because there are so FEW choices to begin with there wasn't much work to it. There is also a big lack in Charm/Intimate options. The only good thing about this change is that the dialogue is less confused, as in when Shepard answered another character his wording was weird because you can't predict everything a Shepard will say and in which order BUT fixing that was not worth the sacrifice of one of the most important game mechanics.
Obviously this isn't some that can't change now, but PLEASE put the control of the game back into the player's hand in your DLC and in your future games. The fact that we get +Reputation way more than +Paragon or +Renegade shows that most options automatically take a neutral path. I've literally got so bored of the conversations and tuned out a few times because there is no choices to make and it breaks the immersion between me and the game. Now it is Shepard talking, not my Shepard, if it weren't for the new skill system that gives me fond memories of Mass Effect 1, I truly would not feel like I'm playing an RPG.
The other content is very rich, but there was no reason to sacrifice one of the most central mechanics of the game.
P.S.: Fix the Donnelly and Daniels glitch! Content bugs are the worst, because people play RPG games for the content and you may not think it yet but the small storylines between crew characters are a major importance to the immersion of the game! I heard there is sort of a low chance of getting it fixed, but I shouldn't be punished just because I choice Kaiden over Ashley, that is ridiculous! Though, I only saved him because he is Carth. I hate walking into engineering and it being just so boring and speechless.
Lack of Dialogue Control
Débuté par
Sen4lifE
, mars 26 2012 03:43
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#2
Posté 26 mars 2012 - 06:38
TJX2045
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I have realized they kind of went the DA2 route where the reactions are automatic based on your reputation or your usual choices (If you choose a lot of aggressive options, the game automatically makes the protagonist speak aggressively. If you choose a lot of friendly options, the game automatically makes you speak friendly.)
It's kind of a bummer but not that much of a bother for me since most of the important choices are still there.
The only thing I'm a bit disappointed in is the lack of Paragon/Renegade Dialogue options. They were pretty rare this time around and I was shocked when I finally got to one after it felt like forever and I assumed they were gone, replaced by interrupts and top = "good" and bottom = "bad" logic.
In ME2, even talking to store clerks had Paragon/Renegade left side of the wheel options. In ME3, you're lucky to even have it with your squadmates in a main mission.
Not to mention that even my 90% Paragon and 10% Renegade character was able to use a renegade option that seemed like it would be higher ranking (around 50% Renegade or more). In ME2, sometimes I wanted to reload and replay sections and do some extra side questing in order to get a higher paragon level, especially when it came to the more dialogue centric quests like Samara's loyalty mission where your reputation meant everything. It could be the difference between breaking a trance or being completely hypnotized and screwed. It made you focus on getting a higher reputation and showed you that it could have dire consequences if you didn't.
It's kind of a bummer but not that much of a bother for me since most of the important choices are still there.
The only thing I'm a bit disappointed in is the lack of Paragon/Renegade Dialogue options. They were pretty rare this time around and I was shocked when I finally got to one after it felt like forever and I assumed they were gone, replaced by interrupts and top = "good" and bottom = "bad" logic.
In ME2, even talking to store clerks had Paragon/Renegade left side of the wheel options. In ME3, you're lucky to even have it with your squadmates in a main mission.
Not to mention that even my 90% Paragon and 10% Renegade character was able to use a renegade option that seemed like it would be higher ranking (around 50% Renegade or more). In ME2, sometimes I wanted to reload and replay sections and do some extra side questing in order to get a higher paragon level, especially when it came to the more dialogue centric quests like Samara's loyalty mission where your reputation meant everything. It could be the difference between breaking a trance or being completely hypnotized and screwed. It made you focus on getting a higher reputation and showed you that it could have dire consequences if you didn't.
Modifié par TJX2045, 26 mars 2012 - 06:41 .
#3
Posté 26 mars 2012 - 06:42
staindgrey
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TJX2045 wrote...
I have realized they kind of went the DA2 route where the reactions are automatic based on your reputation or your usual choices (If you choose a lot of aggressive options, the game automatically makes the protagonist speak aggressively. If you choose a lot of friendly options, the game automatically makes you speak friendly.)
This is pretty much the only time I can say this, so I really want to say it...
DAII got it right. ME3 dumbs down the system to the point that you barely feel in control of your own character. DAII's style of automatic dialogue I actually really, really liked. My Hawkes really did become entirely different people depending upon how I played them, both in cinematic dialogue sequences and in party banter. With my Sheps, I really haven't noticed big differences, and honestly, being a renegade in ME3 hardly feels rewarding. Shep just comes off as a total military lunatic.
#4
Posté 26 mars 2012 - 06:46
TJX2045
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@staindgrey, I agree with you. I liked that the auto dialogue reflected how you played your character. If you were a Joker, he'd throw in a few punch lines and one liners. I think that was my favorite thing about replaying the game. I didn't know what my Hawke was going to say next as a joker. I feel like ME3 might not be attempting that, but I can't speak from experience as I haven't played my Renegade yet.
#5
Posté 26 mars 2012 - 07:22
coldwetn0se
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The lack of dialogue choice was one of my top criticizms in this game. It went beyond merely "manuevering" my Shepard in ME3, to these Shepards who said and did things I would have NEVER chosen them to say. I usually played a Paragade (not a huge amount of renegade, but I always let them "cut lose" when the mood suited them). But most dialogue seemed forced, and at times, lacking in emotion so as NOT to reflect the actual voice you RPed for your Sheps.
Just my .02
Just my .02
Modifié par coldwetn0se, 26 mars 2012 - 07:23 .
#6
Posté 26 mars 2012 - 07:24
spirosz
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staindgrey wrote...
This is pretty much the only time I can say this, so I really want to say it...
DAII got it right. ME3 dumbs down the system to the point that you barely feel in control of your own character. DAII's style of automatic dialogue I actually really, really liked. My Hawkes really did become entirely different people depending upon how I played them, both in cinematic dialogue sequences and in party banter. With my Sheps, I really haven't noticed big differences, and honestly, being a renegade in ME3 hardly feels rewarding. Shep just comes off as a total military lunatic.
I agree, though in certain situations the dialogue flows better, but at the great cost of "uniqueness" for certain Sheps.
#7
Posté 26 mars 2012 - 08:41
breyant
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It bugged me at first but then I got over it. The game has even more dialogue, you just don't get to choose every sentence, which is ok with me.
I'm also surprisingly ok with the Zaeed style conversations because they change after every mission instead of repeating the same lines over and over like Zaeed and Kasumi.
I'm also surprisingly ok with the Zaeed style conversations because they change after every mission instead of repeating the same lines over and over like Zaeed and Kasumi.
#9
Posté 26 mars 2012 - 09:16
Demonhoopa
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TJX2045 wrote...
I have realized they kind of went the DA2 route where the reactions are automatic based on your reputation or your usual choices (If you choose a lot of aggressive options, the game automatically makes the protagonist speak aggressively. If you choose a lot of friendly options, the game automatically makes you speak friendly.)
.
While your reputation does affect the tone of the automatic responses in DA2, I just wanted to do the unfashionable thing and defend DA2 by pointing out that the automatic responses were few and far between. There were tons of dialogue trees with all of them giving you THREE choices on the right side as opposed to only two now in ME3.
Really enjoyed ME3 but I was disappointed to see the shrunken dialogue trees and the infrequency of their appearance.
EDIT:
Okay this. staindgrey did a much better job of saying what I was thinking.
staindgrey wrote...
TJX2045 wrote...
I have realized they kind of went the DA2 route where the reactions are automatic based on your reputation or your usual choices (If you choose a lot of aggressive options, the game automatically makes the protagonist speak aggressively. If you choose a lot of friendly options, the game automatically makes you speak friendly.)
This is pretty much the only time I can say this, so I really want to say it...
DAII got it right. ME3 dumbs down the system to the point that you barely feel in control of your own character. DAII's style of automatic dialogue I actually really, really liked. My Hawkes really did become entirely different people depending upon how I played them, both in cinematic dialogue sequences and in party banter. With my Sheps, I really haven't noticed big differences, and honestly, being a renegade in ME3 hardly feels rewarding. Shep just comes off as a total military lunatic.
Modifié par Demonhoopa, 26 mars 2012 - 09:18 .
#10
Posté 26 mars 2012 - 10:04
Kaija
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I also felt that the lack of control in the dialogue choices. There is a distinct lack of variation when you do get a choice. Instead of it feeling like you were moving through dialogue trees with many options for a unique experience it felt like there was only one path with slight variations. There may possibly be comparable amounts of dialogue but there is definitely a lack of choices. Most of the time it felt like the dialogue was not appropriate to the situation, it felt off.
