124 réponses à ce sujet

[II Relics II]

The Angry One wrote...

Just why are RPGs automatically worse because you get strong enough to beat dragons.
Oh no! Dragons! Get off your dragon-worship. You know what dragons are? Big lizards with halitosis. Screw 'em.

Quote of the day right there!

[BanditGR]

We don't have to hope for DA2. I'm willing to bet, it's already on its early stages, considering the relatively positive responses on DA so far. I think it was stated anyway, that Bioware intends to escalate this into a new series.

[Chragen]

mrjazzman wrote...

Brothers and sisters can't we all just get along and hope for DA2 as well as BG3? :innocent:

I'm still clinging on to hope that DA2 will be like from BG1 to BG2. BG1 was great, but BG2 was legendary.
They already got the engine so bit more polish and hopefully they can just focus on the story and content.

But guess we will see.

And as far as Baldurs Gate 3. That will most likely never happen. At least not from Bioware seeing as they don't have the rights to the DnD license anymore which is a real shame.

[Bibdy]

Chragen wrote...




And as far as Baldurs Gate 3. That will most likely never happen. At least not from Bioware seeing as they don't have the rights to the DnD license anymore which is a real shame.

All the better for it. The BG story is over, the D&D combat system horribly flawed and convoluted (at least the edition used in BG 1 and 2) and the D&D setting old news.

This game world, their own creation from the ground up, gives them a lot more freedom to do whatever the heck it is THEY want to do. Not what borders some license compels them to stay between.

[XOGHunter246]

It's quit obvious there will be a number 2 but remember don't expect it to be out soon as theres like a lot of dlc for this one

[Vormaerin]

The question really is: What was legendary about BG2?



1) There was a storyline with an initial railroad leading to an open ended area followed by a narrowing to the finish.

2) It had many companions to choose from, with dialogue and some degree of character development.

3) It had romances.

4) It had quasi real time combat where you could control your party members.

5) It had a lot of content, and good replayability.



Which of these elements is not in DA: O? The fact that you like the bhaalspawn storyline more than the save the world storyline doesn't mean the games aren't spiritual successors. Unless "its all about me" is a key factor in BG2, which I've never heard anyone suggest before..

[Bibdy]

Planescape: Torment was an 'all about me' game. Practically everything you come across has some significance to you in some way. That was an amazing story.

[Krigwin]

Vormaerin wrote...

The question really is: What was legendary about BG2?

1) There was a storyline with an initial railroad leading to an open ended area followed by a narrowing to the finish.
2) It had many companions to choose from, with dialogue and some degree of character development.
3) It had romances.
4) It had quasi real time combat where you could control your party members.
5) It had a lot of content, and good replayability.

Which of these elements is not in DA: O? The fact that you like the bhaalspawn storyline more than the save the world storyline doesn't mean the games aren't spiritual successors. Unless "its all about me" is a key factor in BG2, which I've never heard anyone suggest before..

Please don't compare DA:O to BG2. BG2 was in a completely different league of storytelling and adventuring that no modern game has even come close to emulating. They copied the formula of BG2 for DA:O but that doesn't make it the same game, especially as so many of the key elements were watered down excessively to make it more accessible to gamers with no previous RPG experience.

[dontreallycareabouthis]

Double post

Modifié par dontreallycareabouthis, 02 décembre 2009 - 01:46 .

[Varenus Luckmann]

I do not think DAO is a "spiritual successor" to Baldur's Gate, but this man does not speak for me.

[Vormaerin]

Krigwin wrote...
Please don't compare DA:O to BG2. BG2 was in a completely different league of storytelling and adventuring that no modern game has even come close to emulating. They copied the formula of BG2 for DA:O but that doesn't make it the same game, especially as so many of the key elements were watered down excessively to make it more accessible to gamers with no previous RPG experience.

Why?  What was better about BG2?  This is a discussion thread.   Posts saying  "Don't discuss this because I'm right and that's all that matters" aren't contributions.

If you can spell out what is better about BG2, there's be something to discuss.   Combat in BG2 was a lot more varied and interesting.    The cost of art assets these days seems to severely limit the range of foes one can fight in a single game.

But what makes BG2's story and RP better than DA; O?

[dontreallycareabouthis]

The story in BG2 was boring and predictable. And the Dweebs and Dice system was fine for the 70's(when I played). But beyond 2nd edition is just terrible.

I'll admit that this is a more streamlined system but it has more variety then the 3rd edition plus rules. Many of the builds in it were not viable.



I'm yet to find one that doesn't work in DA. This story I have enjoyed as well instead of "Oh god more filler text to wade through". And though I have found a few minor design issues I have to stand up and give Bioware a much deserved ovation! Bravo!



Sir,can I please have some more?

[Rhys Cordelle]

I had the exact opposite reaction. When I play DA:O I can see some of the best elements of baldurs gate and neverwinter nights combined with a fascinating, original setting that has an astounding amount of lore given that this is only the first game set in Thedas (the name of the world by the way).



BG and NWN have been my all time favourite games, but Bioware was stunted by having to conform to WotCs wishes. Now with their own unique setting they can do whatever they wish, and I'm glad for it.



Rock on Bioware. Rock on.

[Vormaerin]

Bibdy wrote...

Planescape: Torment was an 'all about me' game. Practically everything you come across has some significance to you in some way. That was an amazing story.

Yes, and did it much better than BG2 did.    I wasn't disparaging "all about me" storylines.  I was saying that I've never heard anyone suggest that the great thing about BG2 was that its got an "all about me" orientation for its storyline.

[Malkut]

lorderon99999 wrote...

............................................................

I hate everything that has ever existed.

[Suron]

lorderon99999 wrote...

I did not what another BG but I wanted a game based on the same formula of BG...this one wasen't...and that ghost is evil

so you claim you didn't want another BG..but ALL YOUR COMPLAINTS are about elements of DA:O that AREN'T LIKE BG......

.....wut

there's one or two things I agree with however.

1. No fear of death short of a full wipe.  Recovery is too easy in the game and costs you virtually NOTHING.

2. The party limitations.  4? really? So our quest is to go and raise an ARMY from several different factions....we even have 10 people that join us total (at a time at least...including the PC) and we're up against a very large horde of Darkspawn hell-bent on destroying the world as we know it.  We have an entire army up against us from the very people we're trying to save......But I can only take 3 others with me??? are you serious?  The party limitation is stupid.  If they join..they should be in the field with us...not this "sorry guys only 3 of you can come with me...yes yes I know..impossible task..Darkspawn Horde...Dragons and all that but...seriously we only need 4 of us."  It's stupid. (and yes I know engine limitations...nightmare of balancing combat with that many party members etc..but..regardless it's a stupid mechanic)

otherwise though...like I said..you make no sense with your "I didn't want another BG" when all your points are how DA:O ISN'T like BG....and that's what you say you wanted.

So in essence...by all your points and your very post...you DID want another BG.

[Suron]

radioactivewiz wrote...

SheffSteel wrote...

I think that when they said "spiritual successor" they did not mean "it's a sequel with a different name name" but more "I am the ghost of rolepaying games past... woooooo".

This is something they explained later. Quite simple really. BG simply won't exist ever again because console gamers and other idiots allow for games to be released with not even half the content that BG had. Like how some reviews said COD MW2 had a good single player campaign....

well in all fairness (I'm one to hate the dumbing down console games has brought also) I guess you have no concept of the cost of development now with today's technology...used to be someone could create a game on their own in their garage..or only a handful of people...try that today and see how well you do.

The lack of content from games past is due to this...it's too lengthy and costly a project...they simply can't do it in a reasonable amount of time..Hell look how long DA:O took to finish...and it doesn't have half the content BG2 had.....yet, even taking into account inflation, I'm willing to bet it took more people and 10x the money to create.

It's also why companies stick to guarentee'd sellers..like sequels upon sequels upon sequels...why there are so many FPS's out now...and why you can't walk into a store and have COUNTLESS TOTALLY DIFFERENT KINDS OF GAMES to choose from.....I miss Wing Commander....X-Wing vs Tie-Fighter type games....turn-based RPG's...X-COM type games....ETC ETC ETC....the potential for failure is too great.

so, in the end, use a little more intelligence before you decide to blame consoles...as they are a VERY minor factor as to why games don't have the content in days past and why we don't have more variety in game types/genre's

[perry2]

I don't consider DA O to be superior to BG2/TOB and certainly a successor only because of who made it. The departure from D & D isn't some revelaton, although new character types are a nice change. It seems like the interractions and dialogues are too forced in DA O and the world is somehow smaller. As an intro game I like it, and I guess I see some similarites to BG in the simple railroad type of plotting(yes you have choices but the wrong ones involve lots of dying).

I am enjoying it immensely in spite of the bugs and slow loading, and I suspect the next episode will be as much of a jump as BG2 was from the early BG engine games. I am quite excited about where this is going, and I suspect the next DA game will make most of us let go of the BG series. As a PC only gamer, the more I play this the more I like it.

[Niten Ryu]

Skellimancer wrote...

The ability to slaughter any NPC would result in a broken game when i have finished killing.

I don't know about that. To kill archdemon you need Gray Warden. If you'd be able to kill Duncan before you become Gray Warden, then game would be broken. Otherwise there wouldn't be any problems. Just a long trail of the dead...

[Boeresmurf]

so OP says he hates the mmo idea of needing tank/healer/ lockpicker etc.



its not a pure mmo thing.....every rpg game has these class combinations... and if i recall right i never let my evil mage in bg2 walk in front, but minsc on other hand was never in the back.



or do u think that being in dungeon with 4 archers.. all small corners/ magical traps and a power hungry ogre is a smart idea.

balance party is no mmo stuff its just smart.



and u dont need a tank in here.. ya can always run in cicles with ur mage

[Walina]

lorderon99999 wrote...

I did not what another BG but I wanted a game based on the same formula of BG...this one wasen't...and that ghost is evil

I agree expect maybe for the gameplay, there're things I dislike from BG but I really was looking for a BG story. Thanks to the relationship system of DAO that I felt involved otherwise I wil not have played the game through the end. <_<

[Ponce de Leon]

Volourn wrote...

DA is vastly superior to BG2. It is deeper, more complex, and simply awesome.

All I gots to say is DA Ogre > BG Ogre

'Nough said.

But remember that BG ogres said "Me will smash your face!" or ogre magi "Mwahahahahah" and when they attack "Iiiaaah!" and when they die "IIIIIIIIIIIAAAAAH!" That's superior

Secondly, Gaxkang is much inferior to the full power of Kangaxx. Dragon Age characters don't even have means to protect from his spells!

But more on topic, they are two games apart. I cannot call DA:O the spiritual successor of BG, at least, not in every aspect, but that's what makes DA:O good. We don't want copies of older games. If we'd want them, then we're ruined already.

[Malkut]

lorderon99999 wrote...

I can't kill anything I want...and for me that is taking the RPG backwards...What if I want to be a psycho with and be wanted in all towns?

I'd rather the developers concentrate on making a better core game, than waste time and money programming in new ways for the player to be a jackass.  Go back to Oblivion . . . OH WAIT, EVEN BETHSOFT DROPPED THIS IDEA LIKE A HOT POTATO COVERED IN RICH CREAMY AIDS SAUCE.

in DA:O youR'e dudes can fall as many times as they want and just come back up and you use one of the multiples first aid kit.......super funnnn...

The old style deaths were pretty meaningless.  It was easier just to reloaded/rest after every fight.  This way just simplifies that process.

5- Characters: Jon Irenicus...that it

Loghain is the same revenge-crazed, bombastic-speech-delivering villain-type-guy trope as Irenicus, written by the same guy, fulfilling the same role in a story in the same genre,

You're just in love with Jon Irenicus' sexy voice.  Admit it.

"You will suffa!  You whill ALL suffaaaaa!"
Dreamy!

6- Party of 4: THis buzz me a lot....you are stuck (if playing on harder diff) to use a mage, healer, tank....I hate this whole MMO formula....

Why, you're absolutely right!  I'm going to go play a real game, like Baldur's Gate 2.

But I'll need to decide on a party. Letsee, I'm going to take Viconia as my healer, Edwin as my mage, Korgan as my tank . . . .

P.S: Sorry for my english it my third language I know it not perfect

So....does your native language have ellipses instead of punctuation.....and if so....who can I punch in the face.....to make them change it......?

[Haladra]

" Jon Irenicus" got a good point there, no one can match the awesomeness of Jon!