53 réponses à ce sujet

[Eckswhyzed]

JaegerBane wrote...

101ezylonhxeT wrote...

I prefer my N7 gear because anything with N7 on it is boss...like shepard

I dunno, I was never able to get comfortable with the N7 gear.

The Eagle is, in theory, a great heavy pistol being the only fully-auto HP, but in a game with such a host of effective submachine guns that can be made as light as feathers, and no weapon class constraints, it really doesn't do anything that you couldn't do better with an SMG.

The Hurricane has a blistering rate of fire but its recoil leaves it being largely useless outside of near point-blank range. Typically you end up wasting its rate of fire as you need to shoot in bursts to hit in the first place. That said, it makes for a reasonable replacement for a shotgun. Its the only N7 weapon I bother with.

The Crusader is just a waste of time. It's basically an incredibly heavy version of the Paladin that sits in your shotgun slot, totally useless.

For someone who hasn't unlocked the Paladin or Black Widow in MP, the Crusader is a godsend. Don't forget the lack of a scope and 100% accuracy can come in handy.

The Valiant isn't a bad Sniper Rifle and has a negligble recoil, but it kind of sits on the unhappy medium between the Mantis and Viper - it's never going to manage one-hit-kills but it's never going to keep up with the rate of fire of Viper either. It's not even that much more powerful than the Viper on a per shot basis.

I beg to differ. I think the Valkyrie is FAR BETTER than the Viper and Mantis. With the right upgrades/powers I can headshot 3 different mooks in one ARush/Cloak or concentrate on one heavy unit. The fast reload time really helps with sustaining DPS.

The Valkyrie is basically a massively heavy Vindicator with a bit more punch. Hell, it's as heavy as the vastly superior Particle Rifle.

To be honest, the N7 weapons were real disappointments, all things considered. I'm just glad there was better stuff in game and in From Ashes.

[Athenau]

I think the Saber is my new favorite weapon. Plus the sound it makes is awesome.

[The Spamming Troll]

JaegerBane wrote...

KeenBlade wrote...
My other weapon is the Cerberus Pistol, I forget the name/number, but you get it in the Coup attempt if you unlock the door and go back for it. I think it's called the Talon. Freaking shotgun in pistol form. lol

The problem is it weighs the same as a shotgun, too, hence its pointless - unless you wanted to carry two different shotguns for some reason. You might as well carry a normal shotgun.

 i know right. i thought that was really dumb. i missed it with my adept, played a vangaurd thinking this will rock for a chngeing vangaurd, but its as heavy as a normal shotgun. theres no point to it at all, unless you want 2 shotguns.

why dont the trick another gun into thinking its something else. like the scorpion or even the falcon. id LOVE carrying the talon, carnifax, and scorpion, but NOPE, they are all pistols. too bad for me and using cool guns.

[JaegerBane]

The Spamming Troll wrote...

i know right. i thought that was really dumb. i missed it with my adept, played a vangaurd thinking this will rock for a chngeing vangaurd, but its as heavy as a normal shotgun. theres no point to it at all, unless you want 2 shotguns.

why dont the trick another gun into thinking its something else. like the scorpion or even the falcon. id LOVE carrying the talon, carnifax, and scorpion, but NOPE, they are all pistols. too bad for me and using cool guns.

Somewhat. As others have pointed out the Talon may work well as an option to get a squadmate to carry a shotgun when they don't normally carry them. I'm open to experiementation as to whether Liara and EDI would benefit from this over the Hurricane/Scorpion combo I've got them on, but I'm fairly sure this will work well for Javik, being as combat orientated as he is.

I don't actually mind the devs creating guns of one type that function like another as it increases flexibility. Its annoying, however, when they give these outliers identical stats in important categories, like weight. 'Heavy' Pistols should be lightweight sidearms, regardless of what they shoot, as they're wielded in one hand.

[incinerator950]

I wouldn't mind a weight reduction on some of the pistols, but the balance in heavy weight is for a reason. I also don't mind using the Talon on the Vanguard, it has more power than the majority of shotguns.

I have my teammates using Hurricanes and PR's that I never bother to reach their side arms, they're just that powerful. Granted I use Tali for her tech abilities, I let her run around with a Graal or GPS on Insanity and in four playthroughs thus far I've not bothered to use the squad placement commands.

[Biotic Flash Kick]

I have used all the assault rifles and I cannot recommend a single one over another
I love them all
i wish we had an inventory like ME1 so I can have all my rifles at the same time

[JaegerBane]

Eckswhyzed wrote...
For someone who hasn't unlocked the Paladin or Black Widow in MP, the Crusader is a godsend. Don't forget the lack of a scope and 100% accuracy can come in handy.

I think that pretty much makes my point - its a shotgun that only has any worth if you're lacking a better heavy pistol or sniper rifle. For a weapon that crushes your cooldown and has a tiny clip, this really isn't good enough.

That said, more power to you if you like it. I will say its the best-looking shotgun of the lot.

I beg to differ. I think the Valkyrie is FAR BETTER than the Viper and Mantis. With the right upgrades/powers I can headshot 3 different mooks in one ARush/Cloak or concentrate on one heavy unit. The fast reload time really helps with sustaining DPS.

(I'm assuming you meant the Valiant here)

To be honest, with the right upgrades you can make most sniper rifles do pretty much what you want. The only real strength of the Valiant is that it has little recoil given the strength of its shots. However, on weapon class that already has slow-mo mods but lacks clip-boosting mods, this is only really an advantage if you have bother aiming to begin with.

Besides, it reloads no faster than the Viper. But it only fires for half as long.

Modifié par JaegerBane, 30 mars 2012 - 04:17 .

[Athenau]

Besides, it reloads no faster than the Viper. But it only fires for half as long.

The Valiant fires almost 50% faster and does almost 50% more damage per shot than the Viper. Counting reloads, the effective ROF is ~.99 rounds per second for the Viper and ~1.10 rounds per second for the Valiant. The Valiant is just better in every way than the Viper other than the weight.

[geckosentme]

JaegerBane wrote...


Whatever. The Hurricane is a fantastic piece of kit but its the only N7 weapon I carry, and that's purely because its the only specialist close-range weapon in the game that doesn't weigh the same as an adult polar bear.

Hurricane is nice, but I abandoned it in favor of the reliable old Tempest SMG once I picked it up as it can be made even lighter and doesn't suffer 1/10th of the barrel pull.  Throw the 2x scope on it and you have a descent ranged pistol.

[incinerator950]

geckosentme wrote...

JaegerBane wrote...


Whatever. The Hurricane is a fantastic piece of kit but its the only N7 weapon I carry, and that's purely because its the only specialist close-range weapon in the game that doesn't weigh the same as an adult polar bear.

Hurricane is nice, but I abandoned it in favor of the reliable old Tempest SMG once I picked it up as it can be made even lighter and doesn't suffer 1/10th of the barrel pull.  Throw the 2x scope on it and you have a descent ranged pistol.

I find the Hurricane to be a capable Squadmate weapon.  Sadly because of the PR and Hurricane, I never actually use Squadmate secondary weapons.

[Richard 060]

Is it time for me to bang on about the virtues of the N7 Valiant yet again?

A sniper rifle with low recoil, three shots before reload, and shoots perfectly well from the hip?


Hells yes - it's like Duck Season all over again...

[I Tsunayoshi I]

The Eagle shouldnt be compared to SMG's. Its more like having a pistol sized AR than an SMG and is fairly effective if you dont try to treat it like its just another Avenger.

I thought it was terrible myself before actually putting it to work when I first booted up an Adept. After seeing the full auto and being able to get the advantage of being able to gun as well as a combat class early on, I came to love it as a starting weapon until I got the capable Paladin.

[vadrillan]

The Spamming Troll wrote...
 i know right. i thought that was really dumb. i missed it with my adept, played a vangaurd thinking this will rock for a chngeing vangaurd, but its as heavy as a normal shotgun. theres no point to it at all, unless you want 2 shotguns.

why dont the trick another gun into thinking its something else. like the scorpion or even the falcon. id LOVE carrying the talon, carnifax, and scorpion, but NOPE, they are all pistols. too bad for me and using cool guns.

The thing is the Talon isn't just a shotgun that weighs as much as a shotgun, but in the pistol slot. That's what I originally thought and ditched it because of it.
It's much more accurate than all the shotties, while still doing good dmg. I slap a scope on it and it's good for 1-shotting unprotected enemies at a surprising distance, where the Disciple would take 2. And the RoF is a vast improvement too.

[Urazz]

incinerator950 wrote...

I dunno why, but the Alamar promotional items are above par. Armor can be discarded, but the Chakram Launcher is overpowered more then most weapons, and it doesn't weigh a ton.

Not so much on Insanity in my opinion.  The chargeup time makes you too exposed for my tastes.  I much prefer the Falcon instead for an assault rifle with the same purpose.

[JaegerBane]

Athenau wrote...

Besides, it reloads no faster than the Viper. But it only fires for half as long.

The
Valiant fires almost 50% faster and does almost 50% more damage per
shot than the Viper. Counting reloads, the effective ROF is ~.99 rounds
per second for the Viper and ~1.10 rounds per second for the Valiant.
The Valiant is just better in every way than the Viper other than the
weight.

That's very interesting stuff, Athenau. I personally never saw such superior performance from the Valiant in my (admittedly very brief) comparisons of the two rifles, but I was thinking that I needed to re-test the two after starting to suspect that there was no smoke without fire on the amount of respect the Valiant gets on these boards (including regular comparisons to the Black Widow, even, where the rough assesment is that it makes up in accuracy what it lacks in damage).

Definitely going to try this out again.

geckosentme wrote...

Hurricane is nice, but I abandoned it in favor of the reliable old Tempest SMG once I picked it up as it can be made even lighter and doesn't suffer 1/10th of the barrel pull.  Throw the 2x scope on it and you have a descent ranged pistol.

I think I switched back from the Tempest to the Hurricane largely because the performance at close range using the Hurricane is so good its' almost equivalent to the Scimitar, provided you learn to handle the recoil. Its moved back into being my own personal SMG of choice - while its far less use at range, I already have the Particle rifle for full-auto fire at that range.

(The fact it looks awesome and sounds like an anti-aircraft gun is just extra gravy)

Modifié par JaegerBane, 01 avril 2012 - 01:12 .

[JaegerBane]

vadrillan wrote...

The thing is the Talon isn't just a shotgun that weighs as much as a shotgun, but in the pistol slot. That's what I originally thought and ditched it because of it.
It's much more accurate than all the shotties, while still doing good dmg. I slap a scope on it and it's good for 1-shotting unprotected enemies at a surprising distance, where the Disciple would take 2. And the RoF is a vast improvement too.

Sort of. The accuracy isn't that much of a boost as you can achieve the effect on the shotguns using a smart choke. Considering the Talon really needs a clip boost mod to allow it to function as a proper shotgun, you haven't really made a net upgrade here.

I just don't see what it offers over the Paladin in terms of performance. The Paladin seems to match it in terms of rate of fire, clip and stopping power but has significantly better range and accuracy, and works *far* better with a scope if you're going for long-range shooting.

[JaegerBane]

Sora Kitano wrote...

The Eagle shouldnt be compared to SMG's. Its more like having a pistol sized AR than an SMG and is fairly effective if you dont try to treat it like its just another Avenger.

I thought it was terrible myself before actually putting it to work when I first booted up an Adept. After seeing the full auto and being able to get the advantage of being able to gun as well as a combat class early on, I came to love it as a starting weapon until I got the capable Paladin.

Perhaps. I think the problem it has is that there's not really any need to carry an assault rifle in the pistol slot. Things like the Avenger and Vindi are light enough to carry regardless of what type of play you're focusing on and really, the heavy pistol slot is the only slot that you can carry a lightweight sniping/anti-armour weapon in... you really need that slot for a Carnifex or Paladin if you're going towards a balanced arsenal and you don't want to have to lug a sniper or battle rifle around.

[Athenau]

I played around with the Talon and was unimpressed. The accuracy was a bit better than the accurate shotguns with a maxed smart choke (Evi, Wraith, Disciple) when zoomed in, but it was garbage unzoomed. One of the big benefits of shotguns is that their accuracy isn't affected at all by movement and firing from the hip.

TBH, I'd much rather take an actual shotgun and use my pistol slot for an actual pistol when I need the extra range.

Modifié par Athenau, 01 avril 2012 - 01:40 .

[JaegerBane]

Athenau wrote...
TBH, I'd much rather take an actual shotgun and use my pistol slot for an actual pistol when I need the extra range.

I think thats my stance on the matter - back in ME2 I could have seen the point behind doing this sort of thing but now that any class can pick any weapon, I don't see what benefit anyone gains from trying to masquerade one weapon for another unless you're obsessed with carrying multiple weapons of the same type.

That said, I have quite a soft spot for the Eagle, which isn't really a heavy pistol at all.

[Tehzim]

Saber is decent but I prefer the Mattock's higher ROF. Mostly because I'm not that good of a shot. I also use the Vindicator a lot because of it's weight: damage ratio.

[vadrillan]

JaegerBane wrote...
Sort of. The accuracy isn't that much of a boost as you can achieve the effect on the shotguns using a smart choke. Considering the Talon really needs a clip boost mod to allow it to function as a proper shotgun, you haven't really made a net upgrade here.

I just don't see what it offers over the Paladin in terms of performance. The Paladin seems to match it in terms of rate of fire, clip and stopping power but has significantly better range and accuracy, and works *far* better with a scope if you're going for long-range shooting.

1) 4 shots is plenty ( a lot of the shotties have less)
2) the Paladin is a different beast, of course it has great single shot power and is better at longer range, it also doesn't fire multiple pellets and has less spare ammo
3) the Talon doesn't cost 200k (yes this is an issue for 1st playthroughs)

[JaegerBane]

vadrillan wrote...
1) 4 shots is plenty ( a lot of the shotties have less)

And those shotties typically have vastly increased power to compensate.

2) the Paladin is a different beast, of course it has great single shot power and is better at longer range, it also doesn't fire multiple pellets and has less spare ammo

The multple pellets thing isn't really an inherent advantage - its spread is too tight for you to be realistically improving your hit ratio on that element alone.

And, of course, while it may be a different beast, the Paladin is also competing for the same slot. With roughly 1/4 of the weight. Less spare ammo and superficial differences in shot type don't really even out advantages like far less effect on cooldown and much more flexible range.

3) the Talon doesn't cost 200k (yes this is an issue for 1st playthroughs)

200k isn't realistically that much to save up. On my first playthrough I wasted a ton of cash upgrading weapons I never subsequently used and yet I easily had enough money by the time I did Priority: Tuchanka.

[vadrillan]

It is a different gun despite sharing the same slot, and you clearly like it (as do I) but there really is little point contrasting the two. It can be used with another weapon while retaining +200% so that's not an issue either. Also, why is your Paladin so much lighter than it should be?

With the multiple pellets and an ammo power, close range non-boss mobs are covered as well as any shotgun (more power is useless if 1 shot is all it takes); at longer range (longer than shotgun w/choke range) you can still do respectable damage (1-shotting unprotected enemies)
I don't consider that less flexible than the Paladin.

Yes, 200k isn't much. Thing is it's not the only thing to buy (other Spectre weapons, armours and yes the upgrading other weapons) and the Carnifex does a good impression of the Paladin for much less.

Anyway, this was never a what's the "best" weapon in each slot. The Talon is different and for a couple of my classes I love it. So there

[Raizo]

I think it looks cool, I haven't actually used it myself but I did give it to James Vega in the final mission and he seemed to be nuking everything in sight with it. If I had gotten it earlier in the game I would have been more inclined to experiment with it but going into the last levels wanted gear I was familiar with and I knew was dependable.

Modifié par Raizo, 01 avril 2012 - 07:24 .

[Firesteel]

I started using the Valiant and haven't looked back, to me it's basically a lighter BW that carries more ammo.

The eagle (IMO) is a mini assault rifle that can do incredible damage with ammo powers.

The Crusader, while heavy, is a very good general purpose shotgun for my vanguard, with extra ammo, it is the only gun I need, plus it looks boss.

The hurricane is great for squadmates because they don't suffer from accuracy problems. I haven't used it for the recoil, but I probably will once I get my other guns to a lower weight.

The Valkyrie is fun, but means you can't use 4 guns as a soldier and have a reasonable cooldown.

I don't think the N7 weapons were designed to be ultra powerful, though the valiant comes pretty close. They were designed to be unique alternatives, even on insanity, though I think the soldier is the only one able to make each one completely viable all the time, with a few exceptions, because of ammo powers.