166 réponses à ce sujet

[arthurhallam]

I can't be the only one who checks in on this forum who wants to smash other users in the face whenever they try to derail any discussion of the game with the phrase "space magic"

What's more is how selective you are with what you do & do not consider to be space magic.

For instance, you are all, presumbly, perfectly happy with biotics. You're all, presumbly, happy with the entire premise of the Mass Effect, which isn't just an improbability, but bends the very notion of physics in ways that are simply not & will never be possible. & don't start flinging links to theoretical FTL technologies at me. I know the terrain. 

& you know what, I'm happy to take the leap with all that stuff because that's what Science Fiction demands. 

To top it all off, you have the audacity to disregard as trolls anybody who disagrees with this absurd retake movement.

I never thought this would happen with any creative work that i enjoy, but the fans of this game are actually making me resent the game. 

EDIT: to summarise. the use of the phrase space magic to describe anything that you dislike about the me universe is annoying. 

Modifié par arthurhallam, 27 mars 2012 - 10:30 .

[Nefelius]

OK.

[Warden130]

Space Magic

Jk! Seriously, I agree with everything you have said. Im getting sick of seeing people call something "Space Magic" everytime they can't see an explanation to something is right in front of their eyes. Sometimes you need to think, even just a little bit.

[Peete]

You misunderstand what we mean by 'space magic'. FTL speeds, biotics, the mass effect realys are of course impossible according to the laws of physics. They are fictional and cannot exsist in the real world. But they exsist in Mass Effect.

That's fine. No problem. Their functions are clearly explained and we understand them. However, how do your squad mates in London suddenly get onboard the Normandy? Why is it running away? That is not explained anywhere.
That is space magic.

[Skyhawk02]

Yeah, biotics is the perfect counter when people call the endings space magic. Good Post.

[Hexoskin]

Warden130 wrote...

Space Magic

Jk! Seriously, I agree with everything you have said. Im getting sick of seeing people call something "Space Magic" everytime they can't see an explanation to something is right in front of their eyes. Sometimes you need to think, even just a little bit.

Yes because it's only logical for a machine to fire green energy that fuses synthetic "<DNA>" with organics.

It's called space magic because all of that is introduced in the last5 minutes with no info on it whatsoever.

Modifié par Hexoskin, 27 mars 2012 - 09:53 .

[KingKhan03]

Humour is a way of coping.

[Edje Edgar]

It's called consistency.

[Isichar]

Dont forget lots of speculation. The two go hand in hand

[Adugan]

Nefelius wrote...

OK.

THAT IS NOT OK, HOW DARE YOU SPAM THIS LEGITIMATE DISCUSSION WITH SUCH NOTIONS OF space magic

[Sir Adamus]

Because Biotics, FTL and all that are clearly explained in universe. Why your squadmates are suddenly on the Normandy, why it's running away and why one of the endings involves everyone somehow becoming partially synthetic for no explained reason is space magic, which is not consistent with the rest of the plot, nor with what we were previously told (ie, that it wouldn't just be magic in space).

Modifié par Sir Adamus, 27 mars 2012 - 09:56 .

[Unlimited Pain2]

arthurhallam wrote...

I can't be the only one who checks in on this forum who wants to smash other users in the face whenever they try to derail any discussion of the game with the phrase "space magic"

What's more is how selective you are with what you do & do not consider to be space magic.

For instance, you are all, presumbly, perfectly happy with biotics. You're all, presumbly, happy with the entire premise of the Mass Effect, which isn't just an improbability, but bends the very notion of physics in ways that are simply not & will never be possible. & don't start flinging links to theoretical FTL technologies at me. I know the terrain. 

& you know what, I'm happy to take the leap with all that stuff because that's what Science Fiction demands. 

To top it all off, you have the audacity to disregard as trolls anybody who disagrees with this absurd retake movement.

I never thought this would happen with any creative work that i enjoy, but the fans of this game are actually making me resent the game. 

It's easy to suspend disbelief when a clear set of rules and in-game-logic is set out before you. When the game itself defies its own (fictional) logic or rules with no explanation.... Well that's Space Magic.

[Warden130]

Hexoskin wrote...

Warden130 wrote...

Space Magic

Jk! Seriously, I agree with everything you have said. Im getting sick of seeing people call something "Space Magic" everytime they can't see an explanation to something is right in front of their eyes. Sometimes you need to think, even just a little bit.

Yes because it's only logical for a machine to fire green energy that fuses synthetic "<DNA>" with organics.

About as logical as blue space chicks that live for 1000 years and can get pregrenant from females of other species. (And yes, I know how it works, don't bother explaining it to me) You can't expect everything to be 100% realistic, especially in a Sci Fi.

[randalbattalis]

I don't think you quite understand what people mean when they say the ending is because of space magic.

It's magic because it's an arbitrary solution handed to the player by an all powerful outside force never mentioned anywhere before. The solutions are never brought up as a possible outcome and are completely beyond the ability of anything presented earlier in the story. It's not because it's unexplained but because it's completely out of place and solves every single problem in a simple handwave.

It is literally a space wizard solving the story for us for no reason. Thus space magic.

[Rhyth]

arthurhallam wrote...

I can't be the only one who checks in on this forum who wants to smash other users in the face whenever they try to derail any discussion of the game with the phrase "space magic"

What's more is how selective you are with what you do & do not consider to be space magic.

For instance, you are all, presumbly, perfectly happy with biotics. You're all, presumbly, happy with the entire premise of the Mass Effect, which isn't just an improbability, but bends the very notion of physics in ways that are simply not & will never be possible. & don't start flinging links to theoretical FTL technologies at me. I know the terrain.

Okay, Have you even read or bothered to look at your Codex? It makes things sound possible and sets rules and possibilities in the Mass Effect Universe.

Heres an example with what fans would call space magic: The Mass Relays "DID NOT SUPERNOVA" in the endings but yet they were destroyed. What happens when Mass Relays are destroyed? Supernova!
Heres another example: Joker picks up your dead squadmates on Earth and somehow they come out from the Normandy alive and well on some random planet who knows how they crash landed on.

Are any of those two examples explained by codex or by the rules and posibilities in the Mass Effect Universe?
No -> SPACE MAGIC

& you know what, I'm happy to take the leap with all that stuff because that's what Science Fiction demands. 

To top it all off, you have the audacity to disregard as trolls anybody who disagrees with this absurd retake movement.

I never thought this would happen with any creative work that i enjoy, but the fans of this game are actually making me resent the game. 

Well, if you're happy to take the leap with all the stuff cause that's what you think Science Fiction demands... Okay, good for you.

Modifié par Rhyth, 27 mars 2012 - 10:02 .

[SpiderFan1217]

arthurhallam wrote...

I can't be the only one who checks in on this forum who wants to smash other users in the face whenever they try to derail any discussion of the game with the phrase "space magic"

What's more is how selective you are with what you do & do not consider to be space magic.

For instance, you are all, presumbly, perfectly happy with biotics. You're all, presumbly, happy with the entire premise of the Mass Effect, which isn't just an improbability, but bends the very notion of physics in ways that are simply not & will never be possible. & don't start flinging links to theoretical FTL technologies at me. I know the terrain. 

& you know what, I'm happy to take the leap with all that stuff because that's what Science Fiction demands. 

To top it all off, you have the audacity to disregard as trolls anybody who disagrees with this absurd retake movement.

I never thought this would happen with any creative work that i enjoy, but the fans of this game are actually making me resent the game. 

Quoted for truth.

See Signature.

[Rhyth]

Skyhawk02 wrote...

Yeah, biotics is the perfect counter when people call the endings space magic. Good Post.

Codex Entry - Biotics [Source: Mass Effect Codex]: Biotics is the ability of rare individuals to manipulate dark energy and create mass effect fields through the use of electrical impulses from the brain. Intense training and surgically-implanted amplifiers are necessary for a biotic to produce mass effect fields powerful enough for practical use. The relative strength of biotic abilities varies greatly among species and with each individual.There are three branches of biotics. TELEKINESIS uses mass-lowering fields to levitate or impel objects. Mass-raising KINETIC FIELDS are used to block or pin objects. DISTORTION uses rapidly shifting mass fields to shred objects.Most organic species are capable of developing biotic abilities, though there are risks involved. Biotics are the result of in-utero exposure to element zero. This usually causes fatal cancers in the victim, but in rare cases it coalesces into nodules within the fetus's developing nervous system.

Modifié par Rhyth, 27 mars 2012 - 10:00 .

[AlexXIV]

There is space magic which works in the confines of an established setting and there is space magic that breaks with all and everything. Mind you I can't explain biotics. But it's been there from start. They can do this and that and it never changed. I have not seen a biotic destroying a planet or star system with pure willpower. Not even Jack even though if I trust anyone to pull that off then it be her.

Anyway "changing creation itself" is going too far. Most people believe in evolution and that life does actually have a purpose, if not for the individual then at least in the bigger scale of things. However, building a device that can change creation itself into something new EVERYWHERE in the galaxy or universe is clearly the maximum where you can go with space magic. Even the Force in Star Wars was only a part of the universe and had it's limits. For example creation of life itself was one of the things that was only possible for Sith defying nature itself.

ME3 does not only make the starchild and Shepard bigger than Jesus, they make them bigger than god or anything that could be big enough to create life or the universe. That's why it is BS and why I think people refering to "space magic" have a point in ME3. Even if I usually agree that any kind of advanced tech would seem like magic to people who don't understand the science.

Modifié par AlexXIV, 27 mars 2012 - 09:59 .

[Hexoskin]

Warden130 wrote...

Hexoskin wrote...

Warden130 wrote...

Space Magic

Jk! Seriously, I agree with everything you have said. Im getting sick of seeing people call something "Space Magic" everytime they can't see an explanation to something is right in front of their eyes. Sometimes you need to think, even just a little bit.

Yes because it's only logical for a machine to fire green energy that fuses synthetic "<DNA>" with organics.

About as logical as blue space chicks that live for 1000 years and can get pregrenant from females of other species. (And yes, I know how it works, don't bother explaining it to me) You can't expect everything to be 100% realistic, especially in a Sci Fi.

I updated my original post.

But as someone else said, all the things like blue chicks that live for up to 1000 years etc etc is explained and it's logical to the ME universe. The last 5 minute plotholes/twists are way way way way out of place, don't get explained, and just fail to make any sense whatsoever.

Space magic.

[TeamLexana]

Peete wrote...

You misunderstand what we mean by 'space magic'. FTL speeds, biotics, the mass effect realys are of course impossible according to the laws of physics. They are fictional and cannot exsist in the real world. But they exsist in Mass Effect.

That's fine. No problem. Their functions are clearly explained and we understand them. However, how do your squad mates in London suddenly get onboard the Normandy? Why is it running away? That is not explained anywhere.
That is space magic.

Yup.

[Elyiia]

Space magic: Things that are illogical and/or aren't explained and don't fit in with the ME universe.

[arthurhallam]

no, i understand exactly the different variations of what people mean by space magic.

look, in the responses to this post there are different applications:

"That's fine. No problem. Their functions are clearly explained and we understand them. However, how do your squad mates in London suddenly get onboard the Normandy? Why is it running away? That is not explained anywhere.
That is space magic."

"It's magic because it's an arbitrary solution handed to the player by an all powerful outside force never mentioned anywhere before. The solutions are never brought up as a possible outcome and are completely beyond the ability of anything presented earlier in the story. It's not because it's unexplained but because it's completely out of place and solves every single problem in a simple handwave."

so, on the one hand it refers to "plot holes", which lets face it, are only plot holes if you don't want to creatively interpret the possibilities at the end.

in the other, it's referring to the very specific plot device of the catalyst, which i largely agree with, but i wouldn't call it space magic, i'd just call it narrative magic. people have called it a literal deux ex machina, but i think a better description would be diabolus ex machina. whatever, i don't want to get bogged down in this sh*t.

which brings me back to the central point: people continuously using "space magic" to describe everything that they hate about the game, irrespective of other instances of "space magic" that they're willing to overlook.

[arthurhallam]

Elyiia wrote...

Space magic: Things that are illogical and/or aren't explained and don't fit in with the ME universe.

don't you see the leap to enable any of the world's mechanics to work, if you're being literal about them.

my problem is with the highly specific critical literalism that people use when discussing elements they absolutely reject. 

[NomadDC]

OP, please, GO AWAY. Seriously, chill a bit, than come back.

Mass Effect is explained in game lore. Moreover, in n-dimension theory, Mass Effect is as true as the fact that you are alive and breathe. (In short, theory says, that there is unlimited amount of other "realities"/"universes"/"timelines"/whatever you call it, where different physics laws apply, for example there is reality where gravity doesn't exist). And as I said, Mass Effect is explained pretty well in games lore.

On the other hand, there is no explanation for Space Magic in lore. There is no codex entry about it. And actually that Space Magic doesn't make any sense.

[Warden130]

Hexoskin wrote...

Warden130 wrote...

Hexoskin wrote...

Warden130 wrote...

Space Magic

Jk! Seriously, I agree with everything you have said. Im getting sick of seeing people call something "Space Magic" everytime they can't see an explanation to something is right in front of their eyes. Sometimes you need to think, even just a little bit.

Yes because it's only logical for a machine to fire green energy that fuses synthetic "<DNA>" with organics.

About as logical as blue space chicks that live for 1000 years and can get pregrenant from females of other species. (And yes, I know how it works, don't bother explaining it to me) You can't expect everything to be 100% realistic, especially in a Sci Fi.

I updated my original post.

But as someone else said, all the things like blue chicks that live for up to 1000 years etc etc is explained and it's logical to the ME universe. The last 5 minute plotholes/twists are way way way way out of place, don't get explained, and just fail to make any sense whatsoever.

Space magic.

Just because it isn't in the Codex or isn't explained, doesn't mean it isn't logical to the ME universe. Yes, the ME3 ending was bad. But the Normandy scene aside (Because that really was Space Magic ) I think that the ending (Catalyst included) logically fitted fine in the ME universe.