733 réponses à ce sujet

[-REDACTED-]

Isn't there already a thread for this? Like specifically this one posted two hours before this thread:
social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/10715611

[rex285]

One Word: YES

[Militarized]

-REDACTED- wrote...

Isn't there already a thread for this? Like specifically this one posted two hours before this thread:
social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/10715611

It's so good it gets 2 threads.  

[Mushufasa1512]

Seeing as how i opened this up at 2 00 in the morning and saw it was 40 minutes, I had no intentin of watching the whole thing. 5 minutes in i realized i was going to be sitting through all of it. This is by far the best video I think i've seen on the topic.

Modifié par Mushufasa1512, 28 mars 2012 - 06:58 .

[foxlockbox]

Great nod at redlettermedia, even better breakdown of Mass Effect.

[Xandurpein]

FemmeShep wrote...

This is so true. Star Wars was never about the force, Darth Vader, or the Emperor. Sure that was apart of the world, and the complex mythology. But the story was ultimately about Luke, Han, Leia and the relationships they built with one another. Literally, that was the core of the movies. That's what made them so incredible. The journey would have been nothing without them.

While I completely agree with what you say about Mass Effect, I have to say that in my opnion you missed what Star Wars was about. Star Wars was about Luke and Darth Vader, the relationship between a son and an abusive father, and how the son had to stop hating his father, or he'll just become a copy of him. George Lucas has pretty much admitted that this is taken from his own relationship with his dad. That's the reason why the scenes with Luke and Darth Vader/The Emperor are so much stronger in "Revenge of the Jedi" than everything else in the movie. So you are right about it being about characters, not the force, bit it's still not quite the way you said it, or so I believe.

Modifié par Xandurpein, 28 mars 2012 - 07:01 .

[ticklefist]

Yougottawanna is a champion.

[UKillMeLongTime]

really a great video


and you can fix it bw and in doing so you will get GOTY noms and wins. Right now....no it has no chance at it

[UKillMeLongTime]

Militarized wrote...

-REDACTED- wrote...

Isn't there already a thread for this? Like specifically this one posted two hours before this thread:
social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/10715611

It's so good it gets 2 threads.  

How about 15 of them so its all they can see on page one and not 'miss' it

[Harbinger of your Destiny]

On clarification..if you have to explain a joke, the joke doesn't work. Same goes for an ending.

[Dreogan]

Not to be too nitpicky, but the loss of narrative cohesion is a terrible thing because it ended up breaking the suspension of disbelief. I really can't see any fiction failing as fiction without violating that central tenet.

I do agree the ending is trash, but he stopped just before he could sink the knife into the heart of the problem. A good video, but I wish he went just a little deeper.

Modifié par Dreogan, 28 mars 2012 - 07:06 .

[Xandurpein]

It's also interesting to see how many people who have been delivering very good constructive critizism of the Mass Effect 3 ending and how it lost narrative focus, coming from a literature background. I'm willing to bet that none of those Game critics who gave ME3 top scores have a literature background. They know games, and in games the ending is usually just a cool cutscene.

[FatalX7.0]

-REDACTED- wrote...

Isn't there already a thread for this? Like specifically this one posted two hours before this thread:
social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/10715611

ITT:

People think everyone pays attention to every thread on the forum, all the time, no matter when, or is on the forum when said threads are around, or has time to read them, or, blahahladsjfgs.

Modifié par FatalX7.0, 28 mars 2012 - 07:06 .

[FemmeShep]

Xandurpein wrote...

FemmeShep wrote...

This is so true. Star Wars was never about the force, Darth Vader, or the Emperor. Sure that was apart of the world, and the complex mythology. But the story was ultimately about Luke, Han, Leia and the relationships they built with one another. Literally, that was the core of the movies. That's what made them so incredible. The journey would have been nothing without them.

While I completely agree with what you say about Mass Effect, I have to say that in my opnion you missed what Star Wars was about. Star Wars was about Luke and Darth Vader, the relationship between a son and an abusive father, and how the son had to stop hating his father, or he'll just become a copy of him. George Lucas has pretty much admitted that this is taken from his own relationship with his dad. That's the reason why the scenes with Luke and Darth Vader/The Emperor are so much stronger in "Revenge of the Jedi" than everything else in the movie. So you are right about it being about characters, not the force, bit it's still not quite the way you said it, or so I believe.

I agree that's a portion of the plot. But that again goes back to what I said about it being about Luke and the relationship's he has. The story was about the characters, not about the fight between the empire and the rebels. That's not to say they weren't important to the story. It was the backdrop (the conflict) in which our characters journey took place.

But the world/mythology conflict of Star Wars is what made the world of Star Wars unique. But it's not what made the plot/story good. It's not what it was ultimately about. And that's why the prequels were so awful (they completely abandoned characters). 

So all I'm saying is, like Star Wars, Mass Effect was (the characters) Shepard's story, and the relationship he/she had with others. I could go into a long rant about the other plot/themes it was about as well.

But the conflict (the reapers/catalyst) were just that, the conflict. They were not what the entire plot was about, and the ending should not have been 99% that. 

Modifié par FemmeShep, 28 mars 2012 - 07:13 .

[MentalKase]

The best youtube answer for the only problem of Mass Effect 3.

[TheSneric]

awesome video!

[Janus382]

Probably the best ending video I've ever seen. He seriously nailed Every. Single. Problem. Clearly, concisely, and with humor.

Thank you for bringing this to my attention!

[Militarized]

Harbinger of your Destiny wrote...

On clarification..if you have to explain a joke, the joke doesn't work. Same goes for an ending.

Maybe clarification is 

"SURPRISE! TROLOLOL?" 

I can dream... 

[cyric085]

a plinkett ripoff, but well done

[Dendio1]

Thankss OP, the video was great. Basically The Narrative cohesion got so messed up in the final 10 mins that its unbelievable. The way I see it its indoc theory or bust. Either its all fake or the ending is simply unbelievable.

I wonder about the game simply ending with shepard aboard the crucible dying next to anderson. That would be depressing because for all my shepards talk of happy endings and plans after the war, his end would be inevitable. His supporting cast spaning 3 games lays beyond his reach as he dies aboard the citadel. It would be depressing, but it would be feasable.

The current ending is just too unrealistic..I dont buy into instantly turning the galaxy into hybrids. I dont buy the star kid and I dont believe shepard magically disintegrates, but then gains control of the reapers. I dont believe joker can magically land on jungle Island. Indoctrination theory or bust

Modifié par Dendio1, 28 mars 2012 - 07:14 .

[MustacheManatee]

Well thought out, and presented. I absolutely agree with everything in this video. I especially enjoy the long, lingering shots of Shepard shooting the starchild with the magical gun that never runs out of ammo. Thanks for this OP!

[BloodySunset__]

MentalKase wrote...

The best youtube answer for the only problem of Mass Effect 3.

Well, to me one of the biggest problems. The auto dialogue and "kasumi dlc" style character conversations are up there for me.

[cgvhjb]

admcmei wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

Isichar wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

Isichar wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

But he's wrong. Lots of Stories end on unexplained cliffhangers.

He's wrong about a lot of other things that just really come down to opinion. I don't know why you guys think he's so great. He has some points, but mostly it's just personal bias.

Thats exactly what i view about your opinions

How very insightful and intelligent. 

Yep all i heard was "Hes wrong and i disagree, its opinion" mind telling us why hes wrong?

I told you why, plenty of stories end on cliffhangers. 

Yeah, except it's not what the guy's saying. He's saying (rightfully) that they changed the whole focus of the story in 14 lines of dialogue.

You so did not actually watch this whole video, stop trying to pretend you did. There's no way you viewed this if you're response to a deliberate 40 min breakdown of the endings issues ranging from Socrates to Star Trek is "other games have cliffhangers too". That response in no way invalidates or even addresses any of the myriad concerns brought up in this video, it really doesn't.

In fact the commentator in that video specifically addresses this (you would know this if you actually watched the video...) in that cliffhangers are a deliberate plot device used at the end of a story and leave an auidence guessing on what happens next based on the information provided for a specific purpose. Mass Effect 3's ending is just so full of plot holes and lacking in any and all closure at all that tha audience HAS to guess what happens next since nothing was ever really wrapped up in a satisfactory manner so they have is conjecture of what this tangled mess of storytelling really means, see the difference?

Personally I especially like at the end of this review when the commentator points out some of Bioware's comments about the ending needing "clarification" and why that's a very terrible idea and why the game NEEDS a whole new ending to move past this debacle and be salvaged at all. So very true.

Modifié par cgvhjb, 28 mars 2012 - 07:15 .

[mxfox408]

wow awesome video, he sounds kind of like seth rogan

[Dreogan]

Xandurpein wrote...

It's also interesting to see how many people who have been delivering very good constructive critizism of the Mass Effect 3 ending and how it lost narrative focus, coming from a literature background. I'm willing to bet that none of those Game critics who gave ME3 top scores have a literature background. They know games, and in games the ending is usually just a cool cutscene.

I haven't earned my narrow glasses yet, but if someone like me (who has read no more than a dozen books on storytelling theory) can point out the most glaring storytelling issues with the ending but the professional reviews don't even see a problem? Or worse, give Bioware a blank check for "art"? 

I honestly don't have much hope for the gaming press. The audience is outgrowing them. I hope.