94 réponses à ce sujet

[rma2110]

Are you sure he is a living being? Could be an AI. How was that thing able to read Shepard's mind anyway? You'd think someone so advanced would have chosen an avatar with more gravitas. Hackett, Anderson, Liara. Nope we get a seven year old that died in the first 4 minutes of the game.

[Leonia]

So what do you suggest we should call him?

[Jadebaby]

Would you like to touch my Spooooooooooooon?

Well too bad, there is none.

[Wolfva2]

Cazlee wrote...

People give him a lot of crap, but I'm wondering if the three choices are actually his idea or if he's just explaining how the crucible works.

I figure it's explaining how the machine works.  After all, it's basically a giant gun.  And how many functions does a gun have?  Even a full auto only has 3...single fire, 3 rd burst, full auto.  In this case, the gun could destroy all synths, control all synths, or synth all life.  I still think they could have done better, but really, how many ways could the game have ended?  Especially with only 1 giant 'reaper ending' device?

Now, had the device fired and turned all the reapers into chibi sailor moons...THAT would be space magic!

Hmmm...maybe that's what happens in the ME anime.....<shudder>

Or it coulda been a giant pokeball, absorbing all the reapers into it so Shepard could challenge Ashe to a pokeduel!

[Icinix]

...next you'll tell us we can't call Tim Tim.

[Quinnzel]

There is no Star Child, only Zuul

[Wolfva2]

rma2110 wrote...

Are you sure he is a living being? Could be an AI. How was that thing able to read Shepard's mind anyway? You'd think someone so advanced would have chosen an avatar with more gravitas. Hackett, Anderson, Liara. Nope we get a seven year old that died in the first 4 minutes of the game.

I think it was a program of some sort, the collected memories of an old race that took the image of the boy instead of using it's own image.  I mean, what if it looked like Cthulu?  Would Shepard listen to it?  

Why use the boy?  He watched the boy die, and there was nothing he could do to save him.  With all the people dying around him, that was the only child.  That stays with you.  When we are confronted with a mental trauma (and I think giant sentient spaceships laying waste your planet fits) your brain struggles to understand it; we understand via symbols.  In Shepard's case, his brain used the child as the symbol for all the people who died; his dreams of the kid running and him not able to catch him and keep him safe.  A psychiatrist could explain it MUCH better then me.  I do know that other officers I've talked to over the years who've worked accidents where children died remember them much more clearly then accidents where adults died.  Of course, this is taking it from the point of view of Shepard being a real person really going through all these traumas as opposed to just a game piece.

[Norrax]

Wolfva2 wrote...

Sorry, this is a pet peeve of mine.  People keep talking about the 'star child', and kvetching about the 'magic kid' and yadda yadda yadda.  For Niven's sake people!  Have none of you read actual science fiction?  Because so many of ya'll are talking high fantasy and NOT scifi.

Let's take the catalyst.  Was he some super powerful alien kid?  NO.  It was an extremely OLD (old is kinda sorta the opposite condition of young...which is what a child would be) being from a MUCH more advanced race.  It appears to Shepard as a child because THATS what super advanced energy beings who have evolved past the constraints of flesh do.  They appear to the hero in HUMAN FORM.  In this case, a child that Shepard feels guilt over not saving ("But I didn't waaaaant my Shepard to feel guilt over a kids death!  I wanted him to be a child eatin pedophile! " Well sorry, but you're playing a set character, you have much leeway in how he's played, but there are some things that you can't change.  You can't make him a dope smoking peace lovin hippy who sits in engineering playing a guitar while chantin "Make peace not war maaaaan", you can't make him a wookie, and you can't make him not feel guilt over the kid.  Sorry charlie.)  This is an edifice used in many sci fi books and shows.  Even the origenal Star Trek utilized it with several advanced races...the Organians (who were energy spheres), the Andramadens (little insect like creatures that took on humanoid forms), etc.  Even that episode with the foppish 18th century nobleman who actually WAS a starchild.

So, you have an advanced race that creates synthetics only for them to go to war.  Not much is known about this, but the end result is part of that race creates the Reapers and starts a cycle to destroy space faring races before they build synthetics that will kill off all biologics.  Does that makes sense?  Nope.  Guess what?  Earlier the reapers said we wouldn't understand their motivations and waddayaknow!  Bioware didn't lie about that!  <LOL>  So anyways, catalyst creates the reapers, and the cycle.  But, in case biologic life evolves to the point where it can create synthetics without them killing everyone, it creates what will be called the Promethean device.  As is noted in game, every cycle they build a little more of the machine before losing to the reapers.  Now, for the first time, the machine is completed and the catalyst is confronted by a human who may have helped create a synth that rejected killing everyone  (EDI) and may (or may not depending on your playthrough) helped the Geth.  (Reminder:  The Geth didnt' want to destroy the Quarians, and only did so because the Quarians kept attacking THEM; in the first war when they retreated from the planet, the Geth stopped pursuit, so the Quarians actually created a synth race that just wanted to live in peace.)  The machine could have been a failsafe to end the cycle when the cycle was no longer needed to maintain life in the universe.

That's just my opinion.  It doesn't discredit or devalue anyone elses opinion.  If you want to scream and holler about how stupid I am, then take a deep breath, count to 10, cry me a river, build a bridge, and get over it.  I'm not saying this is a good way to have written the ending; it's somewhat cliqued after all.  The endings could definately have been better, so this isn't a defense either.  It's simply me saying, "Stop calling it a danged starchild already!"  Sheesh, Bioware made enough mistakes to harp on, no need to twist this construct into something dumber then it already is just so you have something else to complain about.  

TLDR obvious troll is obvious

[Kalas82]

Wolfva2 wrote...

Yes, it's just a name given out of spite, to denigrate. It's also a horribly inaccurate describer. There are plenty of people who have talked about it being an actual 'star child' using 'magic' to 'grant a wish', and they're not being denigrating. That's the problem, there are so many theories and opinions on the issue, and so many people think that their opinion is the only valid one, and that everyone else is arguing from their theory, a theory which they like because it lets them heap even more hatred upon the game. Thing about disdain is it isn't very good constructive criticism.

Yeah...right and your argument is what? 
 "You cannot comprehend" ...rigggght.
So creating some bull**** story-plot devices and then telling everyone "you just don`t understand" or "it`s art" makes this plot-devices work? On which planet? I gotta stay faaar away from this planet....you know what that`s called on my planet?-> bad writing.



Is it space-god-kid? Yea...kinda...does it weave space magic...yea kinda...does the crucible or the catalyst make any sense at all...nah not realy...but hey there`s space god, who can alter everything in the universe...bumping a sci-fi-sticker on it and sayin it is just incredible evolved and a super-ai-beeing doesn`t make the statement "space-god-kid" less valid, quite the opposite.
The actual ME-caon didn`t involve any beeing powerful enough to give dead things DNA or to alter all DNA within the whole galaxy...or killing 1 type of creature in the entire universe. Throwing that in, just as the game ends, doesn`t make it work within the caon...it`s "magic".
And that`s my opinion...so you criticing my opinion does make your post what? Good criticism? I think not.
If you can`t get the sarcasm behind the "kid" part or the "space-magic" i think no one can help you honestly.

[rma2110]

Still, as a narrative I don't think it works. This is literature not real life. The audience cared more about refund guy than little bobby whatshisface. Sovereign, Saren, and even Harbinger had more emotional impact. How is the catalyst reading Shepard's mind anyway?

I think having the catalyst appearing as Shepard himself would have worked better. Today's audiences are more cynical and emotional manipulation like poor little nameless dead kid doesn't work.

Modifié par rma2110, 28 mars 2012 - 11:49 .

[Total Biscuit]

The more I think about, the more I prefer to call it Space Hitler.

[DJBare]

I prefer casper the ghost myself, I could not take him seriously anyway.

[TarielMaeda]

It's like the ending to Contact where the aliens showed up as the main character's father to mess with her.

Modifié par TarielMaeda, 28 mars 2012 - 11:57 .

[MattFini]

Wolfva2 wrote...

Sorry, this is a pet peeve of mine.  People keep talking about the 'star child', and kvetching about the 'magic kid' and yadda yadda yadda.  For Niven's sake people!  Have none of you read actual science fiction?  Because so many of ya'll are talking high fantasy and NOT scifi.

Let's take the catalyst.  Was he some super powerful alien kid?  NO.  It was an extremely OLD (old is kinda sorta the opposite condition of young...which is what a child would be) being from a MUCH more advanced race.  It appears to Shepard as a child because THATS what super advanced energy beings who have evolved past the constraints of flesh do.  They appear to the hero in HUMAN FORM.  In this case, a child that Shepard feels guilt over not saving ("But I didn't waaaaant my Shepard to feel guilt over a kids death!  I wanted him to be a child eatin pedophile! " Well sorry, but you're playing a set character, you have much leeway in how he's played, but there are some things that you can't change.  You can't make him a dope smoking peace lovin hippy who sits in engineering playing a guitar while chantin "Make peace not war maaaaan", you can't make him a wookie, and you can't make him not feel guilt over the kid.  Sorry charlie.)  This is an edifice used in many sci fi books and shows.  Even the origenal Star Trek utilized it with several advanced races...the Organians (who were energy spheres), the Andramadens (little insect like creatures that took on humanoid forms), etc.  Even that episode with the foppish 18th century nobleman who actually WAS a starchild.

So, you have an advanced race that creates synthetics only for them to go to war.  Not much is known about this, but the end result is part of that race creates the Reapers and starts a cycle to destroy space faring races before they build synthetics that will kill off all biologics.  Does that makes sense?  Nope.  Guess what?  Earlier the reapers said we wouldn't understand their motivations and waddayaknow!  Bioware didn't lie about that!  <LOL>  So anyways, catalyst creates the reapers, and the cycle.  But, in case biologic life evolves to the point where it can create synthetics without them killing everyone, it creates what will be called the Promethean device.  As is noted in game, every cycle they build a little more of the machine before losing to the reapers.  Now, for the first time, the machine is completed and the catalyst is confronted by a human who may have helped create a synth that rejected killing everyone  (EDI) and may (or may not depending on your playthrough) helped the Geth.  (Reminder:  The Geth didnt' want to destroy the Quarians, and only did so because the Quarians kept attacking THEM; in the first war when they retreated from the planet, the Geth stopped pursuit, so the Quarians actually created a synth race that just wanted to live in peace.)  The machine could have been a failsafe to end the cycle when the cycle was no longer needed to maintain life in the universe.

That's just my opinion.  It doesn't discredit or devalue anyone elses opinion.  If you want to scream and holler about how stupid I am, then take a deep breath, count to 10, cry me a river, build a bridge, and get over it.  I'm not saying this is a good way to have written the ending; it's somewhat cliqued after all.  The endings could definately have been better, so this isn't a defense either.  It's simply me saying, "Stop calling it a danged starchild already!"  Sheesh, Bioware made enough mistakes to harp on, no need to twist this construct into something dumber then it already is just so you have something else to complain about.  

"Ancient AI" doesn't quite have the same ring to it. 

Modifié par MattFini, 28 mars 2012 - 11:59 .

[FatalX7.0]

ragewin wrote...

I just think it was a name people gave him dude.

I thought Bioware has called it a Star Child too.

[Nefelius]

Yeah, OP, i think you're right.
I prefer to call him 'The Space Idiot".

[rexx1888]

i shouldnt have to guess any of that stuff just because im a sci fi nerd, but besides the point.

the point is, its way easier to say star kid than it is to say super old ai that isnt the reapers but made the reapers and appears in kid form... c, c the difference there... star kid, or super long sentence :|

[bryan12112]

Mandemon wrote...

Star Child uses Space Magic.

It's super effective!

Wolfva2 is SPECULATING

Brilliant!

[FabricatedWookie]

"Star Child" is a well deserved moniker.

[wright1978]

As Dave Lister would say

'Mr. Catalyst' isn't even his name. His name's 'Starchild'; or 'spacebrat';
or 'ghostboy'; or 'space idiot'. And if you want to be really
mega-polite to him, -- we're talking mega-mega-polite -- in those
rare and exceptional circumstances, you can call him A*****e.

[CroGamer002]

bryan12112 wrote...

Mandemon wrote...

Star Child uses Space Magic.

It's super effective!

Wolfva2 is SPECULATING

Brilliant!

No.

It's perfect.

[FOX216BC]

Isn't he also called the "god child".
I simply call it cancer

[DocDoomII]

I heard the Architect from Matrix is calling him "Mini Me"

[ZtalkerRM]

FOX216BC wrote...

Isn't he also called the "god child".
I simply call it cancer

I've lost alot of loved ones to cancer, I personally dislike the analogy. No offense taken though.

However, cancer can sometimes be cured, thus saving people's lifes.
This god child has already ensured ME will drift towards the casual gamer base and lose it's 'hardcore' support. No cure there. Downfall op the ME universe is already there.

In any case, maybe we should give him a more proper name.
He's someone who sincerely thinks he's right about everything and forces other people to make the choices he wants (which is quite contradictory, since it isn't a choice anymore).

I think George W will do.
Or maybe he could be used for a birth control add..

Modifié par ZtalkerRM, 28 mars 2012 - 12:19 .

[garf]

I prefer mini-Monty Hall and his three coloured doors leading to the same "Prize"