129 réponses à ce sujet

[sylnnn]

If anyone played through these games and did NOT think the entire thing was essentially the legend as told by Stargazer when that scene came up....
I just don't know what to say.
I have to have a little faith in the human race.

[LordJeyl]

Because that's how I wanted the great Mass Effect series to end. The same way Dragon Age II ended. It was all a gawddang story.

[eventhewaves]

It's no more or less dissatisfying than everything else we have to work with right now, so... why not?

As far as Buzz Aldrin: Really pissed because they finally got an actual member of the United States space program to appear in one of these games... and it's maudlin, sappy, atrociously-written crap that is a complete afterthought. And this after, say, the first game worked so hard to provide some of that wonder and awe at standing on the surface of the moon looking out at the Earth like Aldrin had done once before...

[sveners]

sylnnn wrote...

If anyone played through these games and did NOT think the entire thing was essentially the legend as told by Stargazer when that scene came up....
I just don't know what to say.
I have to have a little faith in the human race.

Denial is a powerful thing. People don't want to think all their choices over 100+ hours are completely and utterly irrelevant. 

[LegacyOfTheAsh]

sveners wrote...

LegacyOfTheAsh wrote...

Brian: Yes, but, theoretically, if someone watched the events of that simulation from start to finish, only to find out that none of it really happened, I mean you don't think, that would, j-- be just like a giant middle finger to them

Stewie: Well, hopefully, they would have enjoyed the ride.

Brian: I don't know, man. I think you'd ****** a lot of people off that way.
(Brian leaves)

If I knew how to make links, that would the the youtube link at the end of the topic! But I don't, so I didn't 

Lol, funny thing is, I saw this episode right after explaining what happened with the ending to my girlfriend and we both nearly lost it.

[Syokhan]

LordJeyl wrote...

Because that's how I wanted the great Mass Effect series to end. The same way Dragon Age II ended. It was all a gawddang story.

Yeah, except in DAII you know from the very beginning of the game that Varric's telling your story. It's not tacked on at the very end of the game.

[OchreJelly]

I found it a nice gesture that Buzz Aldrin was the voice in that cutscene, but the whole scene was very jarring.

Having someone else appear to tell it as a story in that way casts intrinsic doubts on how much was "real" in context.

[a.m.p]

schnydz wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

schnydz wrote...

I don't see a problem with it. It was a legendary moment. Why not tell stories?

I didn't invest in this trilogy to have it all based on some senile old man's unreliable narration. Period.

Also, "The Shepard".

WHaT! The senile is telling your story. You are a legend. What is the problem? 

Because until that moment, even with everything wrong with the endings that was my story. And then it suddenly became a half-forgotten legend.

[Tank207]

That's what I figured they were going for the first time I saw the ending... and it felt like a huge middle finger in my face.

I get that it's the creator's decision how to end the series, but when you lie about the game's endings before release, and then destroy the entire world the fans have come to love... I don't think you should be surprised when the fans lash out at you, and call you out on your BS.

[jla0644]

This is probably the worst attempted defense of the ending I've seen yet.

[TheShinySword]

I'm just wondering why the stargazer is telling his grandkid about my sex life. Seriously, priorities.

[sveners]

jla0644 wrote...

This is probably the worst attempted defense of the ending I've seen yet.

But is it possible/plausible that it is what BioWare went for? It's not so much a defense for the ending, as it is an explanation for it being what it is.

[schnydz]

The Angry One wrote...

schnydz wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

schnydz wrote...

I don't see a problem with it. It was a legendary moment. Why not tell stories?

I didn't invest in this trilogy to have it all based on some senile old man's unreliable narration. Period.

Also, "The Shepard".

WHaT! The senile is telling your story. You are a legend. What is the problem? 

Our efforts are reduced to a fable told by some old man we don't know and don't care about some time in the future on a planet we're not familiar with to some kid we also don't know.

It cheapens the entire story.

To me the scene says something different. That shep succeeded and life was triumphant and able to continue on. Also, the "tell me another story about shepard" part was also telling. Knowing that there is more to Shepards story.

Doesn't the scene being showed after the credits suggest something as appose to being part of the actual gameplay? Just like movies, the after credits scene allows the viewers a glimpse of what’s to come.

[The Angry One]

sveners wrote...

jla0644 wrote...

This is probably the worst attempted defense of the ending I've seen yet.

But is it possible/plausible that it is what BioWare went for? It's not so much a defense for the ending, as it is an explanation for it being what it is.

If this is what they went for then it proves they are completely out of touch witrh their fans.

... well okay, maybe I'm being too hard. It's not like they could know that BioWare fans overall aren't terribly happy with the idea of their stories being some fable told by a 3rd party OH WAIT THEY TOTALLY DO BECAUSE THAT WAS ONE OF THE MAJOR COMPLAINTS OF DRAGON AGE 2.

[sylnnn]

Tank207 wrote...

That's what I figured they were going for the first time I saw the ending... and it felt like a huge middle finger in my face.

I get that it's the creator's decision how to end the series, but when you lie about the game's endings before release, and then destroy the entire world the fans have come to love... I don't think you should be surprised when the fans lash out at you, and call you out on your BS.

Yep.

[GoblinSapper]

Whole lot of alien sex for a kids story.

My interpretation was that they wrote themselves into a narrative corner.

GoblinSapper wrote...

 Taken from my chat with Forbes, but I wanted to know the thoughts of those on this forum as well.

Narrative corners! I am beginning to believe the endings were written because Bioware had written themselves into a narrative corner. They wanted to end Shepherds story definitively and continue using the universe. The Elephant in the room however is this Big Damn Hero that the players Shepherd represents from ME1-3, a universe shaping messianic figure of legend on par with King Arthur (or even more religious figures, if your so inclined). 

There would be too many variables in every persons shepherd to ever address him, and this figure would loom and overshadow everything the player did. So they needed a world where Shepherd would be a dimly remembered legend or a non-factor. This presented them with some interesting non-choices: prequels, which could potentially snarl existing continuity as well as present a situation where technology and lore in universe had to logically -REGRESS- ((back to no thermal clips!)); or a Far Future where Shepherd is forgotten or legend, which would logically be -far- in advance of current Mass Effect's universe, effectively changing it completly. I believe they felt the only way they could re-use mass effect was to destroy it and bring about the "galactic dark age" (referenced in 'The Final Hours of Mass Effect"). Then, after the Big Damn Timeskip © of 10,000 years to the time of the 'Stargazer' figure, technoligy could have re-evolved or been rediscovered to Mass Effect's scale. 

This also allowed them to handle niggling issues like the Krogan, Geth, and Quarians whose fates might not or could not match what players did in ME3, by essentially whiping the universe clean by making -everyone- extinct or simply 'uncontacted' and isolated off in their own parts of the universe. I expect that if/as Bioware carries the series forward, the next Mass Effect will have entirely new species and civilizations with only faint references to the old ones (as the Protheans were in ME1-3). Thoughts? 

 

http://social.biowar.../index/10521450 

Modifié par GoblinSapper, 28 mars 2012 - 07:19 .

[MrAtomica]

Never trust an unreliable narrator.

If this becomes the type of story they were shooting for, we might as well have never played any of the games at all.

Nothing gives meaning to a journey like the possibility that it was all a fabricated bedtime story.

[sveners]

The Angry One wrote...

sveners wrote...

jla0644 wrote...

This is probably the worst attempted defense of the ending I've seen yet.

But is it possible/plausible that it is what BioWare went for? It's not so much a defense for the ending, as it is an explanation for it being what it is.

If this is what they went for then it proves they are completely out of touch witrh their fans.

... well okay, maybe I'm being too hard. It's not like they could know that BioWare fans overall aren't terribly happy with the idea of their stories being some fable told by a 3rd party OH WAIT THEY TOTALLY DO BECAUSE THAT WAS ONE OF THE MAJOR COMPLAINTS OF DRAGON AGE 2.

Couldn't agree more. Though I did not resent DA2. First visit to these forums was after finishing ME3.

Btw, I think one of your posts put it very succinctly ; Malicious, mean spirited. Or something to that effect.


....Is it a bad thing that I've spent more time on BSN the last 2 weeks than the total time on any forums, ever, before ME3?

[LegacyOfTheAsh]

The reason I don't buy the "It was just a story told by the Stargazer" idea is because the game TELLS you that Shepard has become a legend through his/her actions. It specifically states that you committed actions that then became legend.

[Shazbot 81]

"And then The Shepard rode an elevator down from the docking platform for 2 minutes while an elevator-styled rendition of the mass effect themed played in the back ground." "Then what happened?", asked the grandson. "The Shepard and his companions walked 50 feet and got into another elevator and rode that for another 2 minutes." "Grandpa, why are there so many elevators on the citadel?" "It was a way to hide the loading screens, dear boy."

[a.m.p]

The Angry One wrote...

sveners wrote...

jla0644 wrote...

This is probably the worst attempted defense of the ending I've seen yet.

But is it possible/plausible that it is what BioWare went for? It's not so much a defense for the ending, as it is an explanation for it being what it is.

If this is what they went for then it proves they are completely out of touch witrh their fans.

... well okay, maybe I'm being too hard. It's not like they could know that BioWare fans overall aren't terribly happy with the idea of their stories being some fable told by a 3rd party OH WAIT THEY TOTALLY DO BECAUSE THAT WAS ONE OF THE MAJOR COMPLAINTS OF DRAGON AGE 2.

Except Dragon Age 2 was told by someone who actually knew Hawke.

[lyssalu]

this was something they decided last minute like

there is 0 build up

they were like

you know what would be cool

if this was all a story being told by the first man to walk on the MOON!

d o you know where they got the idea

dragon age II

[Eyelidsz]

Is it not possible the Stargeezer got the story from Liara's time capsule?

Scene still sucked.

[The Angry One]

a.m.p wrote...

Except Dragon Age 2 was told by someone who actually knew Hawke.

Or so he claimed.
But yes, and people still didn't like it. So BioWare decided to make it even worse!