1334 réponses à ce sujet

[Singu]

John Epler wrote...

T-Zero wrote...

That stinks.  The Normandy convo's are really what carried the game for me.  But I can understand; if you have hamburger every day for a week, you really don't want anything but fried chicken after...

Well, the bright side of all that was that I got the opportunity to cut my teeth by doing the cinematic design work for all the non-critical Joker conversations. So it was certainly a positive step in that regard. And the Normandy conversations were great - I was a particular fan of the Garrus work. In the end, I was able to go back and enjoy them properly, but it did take a while. And my perspective was, in the end, still different than someone who didn't work on the game.

I view Joker as a representative for the player, it was such a breath of relief to hear what remarks he had on what's happening in the galaxy. Did you do the scene where he's talking about the Citadel from the bench in the Presidium? You could cut a diamond with that sarcasm, brilliant!!

[jfruelas521]

Aznable Char wrote...

Mev186 wrote...

Stanley Woo wrote...

Danilo Luis wrote...

There's a huge difference between *listen* and give it the proper attention.

If you aren't willing to accept a response that disagrees with you, or aren't wililng to wait for an answer, or you insist that all of your issues must be resolved when you want them to be, then you're no longer making simple requests and giving feedback, are you? At that point, I would say you're making demands because you feel entitled to them, and we treat those very differently than we treat requests. Which is why we encourage people to be civil and patient and reasonable in their posts.

I agree with Mr. Woo here....to a point. Yes, I agree as fans we should wait and see, reserving judgement until we actually can see what Bioware has planned. That being said, I am cpncerned that Bioware does seem to be a bit angry with it's fanbase right now. And while there is some legitimate reason for this, (For example, rabid fanboyim and snide insults to Bioware) I do feel that that the majority of the fanbase does not deserve to be lumped in with the rest, who simply want and hope that Bioware will do what it always does best, tell amazing stories.

I also agree with Mr. Woo (in so far that I understand him) in the sense that complaining about something to be done on our time and on our schedule is not within our realm of discretion nor is it in the realm of our discretion to determine when something is addressed and when it's not .

We are not entitled to their attention or their pity , even , even though I am sure we have a lot of their compassion and understanding .

This is what we are entitled to , however:

Our Money
Our Time
Our Attention
Our Recommendation to Others
Our Opinion of the game outside of BioWare's spheres .

So instead of attempting to gain something that we are not entitled to (BioWare handholding us)
Let's exercise what we are entitled to .

Spend your money wisely on what you want . If the ending is not what you want , be like me and buy games that are applicable to our likes .
Don't want to spend 200 hours only to have an ending the ruins the experience ? Play a different game . Spend some time doing something else .
Don't want to be hooked in by what some might consider false promises ? Don't listen to their announcements or attend their functions or watch give them pagehits or things like that .
Wish someone warned you about spending 60 dollars on something that you hated ? Be like me and talk about it with your friends . I told them about my experience and they decided for themselves not to buy from BioWare
Feel strongly about warning others to beware of this product? There are great opportunities to make videos and speak freely and openly outside of a moderated forum .

So again . Let's not worry about what we cannot have from BioWare . Let's focus on what we are indeed entitled to . Let them work and not be bothered . Let us be not bothered by them and spend our money elsewhere .

Lastly , why am I here ? Because I wanted to tell BioWare that I loved the game so much that I am willing to give them a chance to fix the ending in order to win back my fan loyalty , money , recommendations , time , effort , etc . I want to be proud to campaign for BioWare again just like when i convinced my friend Luke to buy Dragon Age Origins or when I convinced Anthony to invest in ME1 . I want to be able to do that again . So the Retake movement is about a love letter to BioWare saying "BioWare , please win me back"

And yes people can say we're making demands . So let's not . If Mr. Woo seriously does not want us to demand or feel entitled then let's please not demand . Let's calmly exercise what we are really entitled with instead of asking for something that is not ours .

Thank goodness.  A voice of reason.  Everyone please take note.  

[Wabajakka]

I guess you could say we're powerful. Then again, who wouldn't want to stand up for what will be known as one of the greatest gaming franchises of all time? It's unfortunate it had to end the way it did though.

At this point I think we're all just waiting to know whether or not there is going to be part 2 to the ending via DLC. I don't understand why they can't give a straight answer, but I'm sure they have their reasons. So waiting is really all we can do. Just know they won't leave us in the dark forever (I'm sure it hurts them to do so as well) and these things probably take time to plan out.

Fingers crossed for a fix though.

[tateel99]

John Epler wrote...

I don't think name calling and personal attacks help anyone's case, regardless of who they are and who they're referring to. That's as much of a statement as you'll get from me on any articles related to any of this, sorry. It's not really my place - I'm not on the ME team. Now, if you want my opinion on DA related stuff... well, I can't say much there, either. Whoops.

Come on - can't you comment on Mask of the Assassin?

[Sohlito]

JohnnyG wrote...

EvilChani wrote...

Aznable Char wrote...

I also agree with Mr. Woo (in so far that I understand him) in the sense that complaining about something to be done on our time and on our schedule is not within our realm of discretion nor is it in the realm of our discretion to determine when something is addressed and when it's not .

We are not entitled to their attention or their pity , even , even though I am sure we have a lot of their compassion and understanding .

This is what we are entitled to , however:

Our Money
Our Time
Our Attention
Our Recommendation to Others
Our Opinion of the game outside of BioWare's spheres .

So instead of attempting to gain something that we are not entitled to (BioWare handholding us)
Let's exercise what we are entitled to .

Spend your money wisely on what you want . If the ending is not what you want , be like me and buy games that are applicable to our likes .
Don't want to spend 200 hours only to have an ending the ruins the experience ? Play a different game . Spend some time doing something else .
Don't want to be hooked in by what some might consider false promises ? Don't listen to their announcements or attend their functions or watch give them pagehits or things like that .
Wish someone warned you about spending 60 dollars on something that you hated ? Be like me and talk about it with your friends . I told them about my experience and they decided for themselves not to buy from BioWare
Feel strongly about warning others to beware of this product? There are great opportunities to make videos and speak freely and openly outside of a moderated forum .

So again . Let's not worry about what we cannot have from BioWare . Let's focus on what we are indeed entitled to . Let them work and not be bothered . Let us be not bothered by them and spend our money elsewhere .

Lastly , why am I here ? Because I wanted to tell BioWare that I loved the game so much that I am willing to give them a chance to fix the ending in order to win back my fan loyalty , money , recommendations , time , effort , etc . I want to be proud to campaign for BioWare again just like when i convinced my friend Luke to buy Dragon Age Origins or when I convinced Anthony to invest in ME1 . I want to be able to do that again . So the Retake movement is about a love letter to BioWare saying "BioWare , please win me back"

And yes people can say we're making demands . So let's not . If Mr. Woo seriously does not want us to demand or feel entitled then let's please not demand . Let's calmly exercise what we are really entitled with instead of asking for something that is not ours .

^^This. BioWare can do as it pleases right now...fix the ending, don't fix the ending, offer us some DLC that fixes the romances, offer us meaningless crap instead, whatever rows their collective little boat. But the days of me blindly offering them my money (by pre-ordering their games and tripping over my own feet in a hurry to get my hands on any DLC that comes out, or even just buying their games) are done. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. 
This attitude that we, as consumers, should shut the hell up, hand them our money, and accept whatever pile of crap they give us in return without complaint is grating, to say the least. 


So I don't want their pity and I don't want their condescending comments about how we should beg them nicely for a treat in the form of an ending that doesn't blow chunks and ruin the entire ME trilogy so badly that some of us have no desire to even touch ME1 or ME2 again after having played it numerous times. If they want to offer something that turns out to be worth my time and money - and that will make it so that I can actually get through ME3 and feel good when I finish it (as opposed to being so depressed and annoyed that I can't manage to touch any game for over a week) - then I won't write them off entirely (or see them as a money-grubbing company that encourages its employees to lie to and insult those who buy their games) and will give them another chance, albeit a cautious one. If they don't see fit to offer DLC that will fix this game's end, then I will continue to tell everyone I know to avoid ME3 (and ME1 and ME2) like the plague and tell them exactly why they should do that, as well as why they should avoid any BioWare (and EA Games) title that exists. 

+1 to both.

I agree, especially the bold portions. And quoting for the second time because it needs to be read and understood.

[DarkSpider88]

@OP: So when you posted this did you think this would happen?

@Mods: Thanks for taking the time to engage with us. I can only imagine what it would feel like top be on the other end of this whole ME3 issue. As someone else so eloquently put it "We rage because we care."

Really you all should take pride that enough people love the trilogy so much they put together the biggest fan movement in video game history. Maybe not for the reasons you would like but it is still impressive.

Back On Topic: So even though it is Kotaku, how do we move up that list? Did they factor in the cupcakes?

[John Epler]

granyte wrote...
a mods meh not important enough
but as the only guys who post on the forum and interact with the comunauty getting to have an idea of how the comunauty see it should be part of it other wise they can do C&C4 all over again

you know the whole hiring a director and a lead writer who don't like C&C and RTS at all to beggin with to work on the grand-pa of all RTS

You know, remarking that the people who are interacting with you are 'not important enough' is really not the right approach to take. Beyond that, of course, neither of us have 'moderator' as a job title. We're both developers who do the moderation thing on the side, generally in our spare time. I'm a Cinematic Designer and Stan's Quality Assurance.

[JaylaClark]

thoreauscabin wrote...

Are you indefinitely bound to EA? Will there ever be a chance for Bioware to get out of it's clutches?

I hear Bethesda is pretty nice...

Only when Obsidian is writing the game

Obsidian -- from RFED to Fallout New Vegas in just four years. /aside

[Daedalus1773]

Dr_Hello wrote...

Zuka999 wrote...



Could you guys pass on this video to the developers? Its a very good, tastefully done critique of the ending. It sums up everything.

Does this video also explain why the universe is currently expanding? and why life does exist?

42

[Gibb_Shepard]

Stanley Woo wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Ok but why exactly have you done the ending in the worst possible way? The endings of the prequels were great. Why the drastical change? I can't think about it without DA2 comming to mind.

I disagree that the ending was done "in the worst possible way." After all, there have been positive comments and it has spawned a lot of great discussion, theories, and criticism. A "worst possible" ending would not have had that kind of power.

I'm not attacking you or anything, but these theories have spawned from the nonsensical-ness of the ending. They have been made to patch up the plot-holes and inconsistencies the ending has given us. It's not the kind of speculation and theorizing you want from an ending at all.

[wagsnout]

Bedtime now. Thanks to Both Woo and Epler for taking time to answer some question. I know they aren't allowed to say muck but the way things are these days I'll take whatever I can get from Bioware.
Thanks Guys

[John Epler]

Singu wrote...

John Epler wrote...

T-Zero wrote...

That stinks.  The Normandy convo's are really what carried the game for me.  But I can understand; if you have hamburger every day for a week, you really don't want anything but fried chicken after...

Well, the bright side of all that was that I got the opportunity to cut my teeth by doing the cinematic design work for all the non-critical Joker conversations. So it was certainly a positive step in that regard. And the Normandy conversations were great - I was a particular fan of the Garrus work. In the end, I was able to go back and enjoy them properly, but it did take a while. And my perspective was, in the end, still different than someone who didn't work on the game.

I view Joker as a representative for the player, it was such a breath of relief to hear what remarks he had on what's happening in the galaxy. Did you do the scene where he's talking about the Citadel from the bench in the Presidium? You could cut a diamond with that sarcasm, brilliant!!

To clarify, I only did the scenes in ME2. I'm not sure who did them in ME3, but I'll certainly let them know that their work is appreciated.

[Estelindis]

Anyway, on the actual topic, I believe that the power and force of the current ME3 ending-related fan movement is even more of a testament to the strength of Bioware than it is to our own strength. We wouldn't be reacting this passionately if Bioware hadn't done such a great job until (in our opinion) the ending.

[SomeKindaEnigma]

Stanley Woo wrote...

Sywen wrote...

Stanley Woo wrote...

Sywen wrote...

I made my son pay me $50 to play ME1 and bake me a pie.

then you are the kind of father I aspire to be one day.

Mother

Mother. My apologies.

LOL fail Mr. Woo.  Sorry, I'm late, I know 

[FabricatedWookie]

waaait wait, before you go I need a volus team member, I NEED IT. Give daddy his candy!

[T-Zero]

John Epler wrote...

granyte wrote...
a mods meh not important enough
but as the only guys who post on the forum and interact with the comunauty getting to have an idea of how the comunauty see it should be part of it other wise they can do C&C4 all over again

you know the whole hiring a director and a lead writer who don't like C&C and RTS at all to beggin with to work on the grand-pa of all RTS

You know, remarking that the people who are interacting with you are 'not important enough' is really not the right approach to take. Beyond that, of course, neither of us have 'moderator' as a job title. We're both developers who do the moderation thing on the side, generally in our spare time. I'm a Cinematic Designer and Stan's Quality Assurance.

Agreed.  Give respect to get respect.  Also, they're doing this for love of the community, so they're one of us.

Modifié par T-Zero, 29 mars 2012 - 05:07 .

[Isichar]

John Epler wrote...

granyte wrote...
a mods meh not important enough
but as the only guys who post on the forum and interact with the comunauty getting to have an idea of how the comunauty see it should be part of it other wise they can do C&C4 all over again

you know the whole hiring a director and a lead writer who don't like C&C and RTS at all to beggin with to work on the grand-pa of all RTS

You know, remarking that the people who are interacting with you are 'not important enough' is really not the right approach to take. Beyond that, of course, neither of us have 'moderator' as a job title. We're both developers who do the moderation thing on the side, generally in our spare time. I'm a Cinematic Designer and Stan's Quality Assurance.

Out of our way peon, we have business with your master! Jokingjoking!
Regardless of your position it makes a difference to alot of people just knowing someone from bioware is listening. Thats important.

Modifié par Isichar, 29 mars 2012 - 05:06 .

[Byrdman]

Stanley Woo wrote...

Exeider wrote...
I would request that you play ME1 to the end, do every side mission, import to ME 2, recruit everyone, do every side mission, every loyalty mission, then import to ME3, recruit everyone, do every side mission, and get to the end.

in short, I want YOU, Stanley Woo, to drop 100 hours into Mass Effect, and get to the end, and tell me it ISN'T Anti-climactic.

edit: and video tape your reaction, i wanna see this.

-AE

If you are paying for my time to do that, I would be happy to. Failing that, however, you'll have to be happy with me deciding my own priorites and getting to the games when I can. Gotta warn you, though, I'm not cheap and I like pie. Lots of pie.

If you send me a detailed invoice regarding your hourly cost, and favorite type of pie, I'll present my counter offer and we can get this show on the road.  I'm about halfway serious on this one (mostly on the pie, I can't bake for frak).  I'd be interested though if you could prevent an impartial truly none bias opinion of the game if I sponsored you playing through it

[Dr_Hello]

John Epler wrote...

granyte wrote...
a mods meh not important enough
but as the only guys who post on the forum and interact with the comunauty getting to have an idea of how the comunauty see it should be part of it other wise they can do C&C4 all over again

you know the whole hiring a director and a lead writer who don't like C&C and RTS at all to beggin with to work on the grand-pa of all RTS

You know, remarking that the people who are interacting with you are 'not important enough' is really not the right approach to take. Beyond that, of course, neither of us have 'moderator' as a job title. We're both developers who do the moderation thing on the side, generally in our spare time. I'm a Cinematic Designer and Stan's Quality Assurance.

Cinematic designer?! Cool! We have much in common.

[Diablos2525]

John Epler wrote...

granyte wrote...
a mods meh not important enough
but as the only guys who post on the forum and interact with the comunauty getting to have an idea of how the comunauty see it should be part of it other wise they can do C&C4 all over again

you know the whole hiring a director and a lead writer who don't like C&C and RTS at all to beggin with to work on the grand-pa of all RTS

You know, remarking that the people who are interacting with you are 'not important enough' is really not the right approach to take. Beyond that, of course, neither of us have 'moderator' as a job title. We're both developers who do the moderation thing on the side, generally in our spare time. I'm a Cinematic Designer and Stan's Quality Assurance.

Don't take him seriously, he can barely write a coherent sentence.

[Panicomatic]

I really appreciate the open lines of communication. It helps to have some time to at least have open conversation about the game with someone with BioWare.

I think that the biggest factor in the fan outcry is just the pure hype before the game came out. I was literally counting down days to release from the start of 2012. I took time off from work so I could enjoy it without distractions. When I got to the ending, I was just at a loss. I hope the tweets about "if you guys knew what we are planning..." lead into something that really knocks the socks off of my feet. The ending in it current state just frustrates me to a great extent.

[twizbuck]

I'm starting to see a hint of the people the mods have to deal with. Oy.

[Mr.BlazenGlazen]

Oh crap. Was watching Psych and might of missed Epler leaving the thread.

I know you've probably already answered few dozen posts regarding the endings, so I'm going to ask something that doesn't have anything to do from the endings, for now.

You guys planning on creating more hub worlds? I thought someone from bioware said last year that there would be larger hub worlds like Illium and whatnot.

[Singu]

Estelindis wrote...

Anyway, on the actual topic, I believe that the power and force of the current ME3 ending-related fan movement is even more of a testament to the strength of Bioware than it is to our own strength. We wouldn't be reacting this passionately if Bioware hadn't done such a great job until (in our opinion) the ending.

And, they also provide this stage for us to deliver our case. Even though they're our opposition. I know of gamestudios that would shut down a forum like this in a heartbeat with all this critisism of a product that is still being shipped for launch retail. But yeah, the glue that binds us together is obviously our love for the games that Bioware are crafting.

[Dr_Hello]

Estelindis wrote...

Anyway, on the actual topic, I believe that the power and force of the current ME3 ending-related fan movement is even more of a testament to the strength of Bioware than it is to our own strength. We wouldn't be reacting this passionately if Bioware hadn't done such a great job until (in our opinion) the ending.

Indeed, indeed