162 réponses à ce sujet

[peddroelm]

Manuel La Bor wrote...

Blissey1 wrote...

if you're going to mention armor damage reduction, it would probably also be worth mentioning how the piercing mods/ap ammo work in relation to that and how that impacts weapon types that do not have piercing mods.

I would if I had that info, I've always assumed the "ignores 25% of armored targets defense" means it reduces the flat damage reduction by that much - in the case of gold  taking the armor of 50 and reducing it to 37.5. In the case of AP ammo equipment I don't have the numbers so I have no idea how much they really effect weapons. I leave it up to the reader to make those calls for himself.  

social.bioware.com/unity.freeforumshosting.org/forum/1/topic/347/index/10639449

[Atheosis]

Manuel La Bor wrote...
For example I'll use the viper.
286.7 base damage is pretty damn underwhelming for a sniper rifle, but factor in the headshot bonus and you get 716.5 base damage. What you get is 1254.31 headshot dps with MM enabled. Taking a crap gun on paper and actually making it look useful. Compared to the carnifex the damage/dps is still less, but it's advantages of built in scope and higher spare ammo count now make it a viable choice for some people. 

By the way, I felt like I needed to address this point that you added.  While I'm not sure how you went from 716.5 damage to 1254.31 using Marksman, even if that is accurate it's not enough to one shot an assault trooper at full health on Gold.  Assault Troopers on Gold have 1687 hit points.  Meanwhile a Carnifex should generally be able to pop an assault trooper's top with one shot in Marksman.  So again, the Viper sucks.

[Pizzasoup]

Question for OP: How does factoring in reload times and clip sizes skew these calculations?

[Merkit91]

Talon shoots 8 pellets per shot, or less?

[Eckswhyzed]

Excellent work OP.

Are you sure your numbers for the GPS and Graal are correct? They seem a little high, and I know that they have some weird mechanics when it comes to charged shots and projectiles.

[Atheosis]

Merkit91 wrote...

Talon shoots 8 pellets per shot, or less?

It's eight just like shotguns.

[Atheosis]

Eckswhyzed wrote...

Excellent work OP.

Are you sure your numbers for the GPS and Graal are correct? They seem a little high, and I know that they have some weird mechanics when it comes to charged shots and projectiles.

Both those guns have obscene DPS.  It's well known.

[Merkit91]

Atheosis wrote...

Merkit91 wrote...

Talon shoots 8 pellets per shot, or less?

It's eight just like shotguns.

Then first post should be updated - talon x have 108.1 dmg per pellet since march, 27.
108.1 @ 8 = 864.8 and 864.8 @ 1.875 = 1621.5 dps.

[Eckswhyzed]

Atheosis wrote...

Eckswhyzed wrote...

Excellent work OP.

Are you sure your numbers for the GPS and Graal are correct? They seem a little high, and I know that they have some weird mechanics when it comes to charged shots and projectiles.

Both those guns have obscene DPS.  It's well known.

I guess I need to continue using them then!

[Atheosis]

Eckswhyzed wrote...

Atheosis wrote...

Eckswhyzed wrote...

Excellent work OP.

Are you sure your numbers for the GPS and Graal are correct? They seem a little high, and I know that they have some weird mechanics when it comes to charged shots and projectiles.

Both those guns have obscene DPS.  It's well known.

I guess I need to continue using them then!

I have a funny feeling you were already using them because of how quickly they kill stuff. 

[realgundam]

If haven't been said already:
1) did you apply the weapon bonus from Turian passive first? then - the armor?
2) some guns are better at getting head shots. ie Temples and Phaseton vs Revenat

[Manuel La Bor]

Merkit91 wrote...

Atheosis wrote...

Merkit91 wrote...

Talon shoots 8 pellets per shot, or less?

It's eight just like shotguns.

Then first post should be updated - talon x have 108.1 dmg per pellet since march, 27.
108.1 @ 8 = 864.8 and 864.8 @ 1.875 = 1621.5 dps.

False, unless the old damage chart is 100% incorrect - the old damage per pellet was 90.1 and the total damage was 540.6. That is 6 pellets not 8. The dps I have on the op is still incorrect as far as being up to date and I will change it to reflect that. 

[Manuel La Bor]

Atheosis wrote...

Manuel La Bor wrote...
For example I'll use the viper.
286.7 base damage is pretty damn underwhelming for a sniper rifle, but factor in the headshot bonus and you get 716.5 base damage. What you get is 1254.31 headshot dps with MM enabled. Taking a crap gun on paper and actually making it look useful. Compared to the carnifex the damage/dps is still less, but it's advantages of built in scope and higher spare ammo count now make it a viable choice for some people. 

By the way, I felt like I needed to address this point that you added.  While I'm not sure how you went from 716.5 damage to 1254.31 using Marksman, even if that is accurate it's not enough to one shot an assault trooper at full health on Gold.  Assault Troopers on Gold have 1687 hit points.  Meanwhile a Carnifex should generally be able to pop an assault trooper's top with one shot in Marksman.  So again, the Viper sucks.

You know what I did screw that up and I will change it. 

I got 1254.31 by mixing my equations a bit my mistake.

It should look like this.

The viper has 501.725 dps, multiplied by 2.5 for headshots is ~1504dps

[Manuel La Bor]

realgundam wrote...

If haven't been said already:
1) did you apply the weapon bonus from Turian passive first? then - the armor?
2) some guns are better at getting head shots. ie Temples and Phaseton vs Revenat

I am only using base weapon damage (at lvl 10) to calculate dps. 

Not sure what you are trying to say in the second point.. could you clarify please?

[Manuel La Bor]

Pizzasoup wrote...

Question for OP: How does factoring in reload times and clip sizes skew these calculations?

for sustained dps you are gonna have a bit less than advertised, small clips with obviously gimp your damage output as the reload dead time will kill your damage output and waste valuable marksman duration. The larger your clip the better. The phaeston is actually a good gun as it has a 80 or 90 round clip with lvl 5 mag upgrade, means you can fire for about 6 seconds or so, reload and fire before the MM has finished and retain the firespeed bonus until you run out of bullets or pull your finger off the trigger.

[Cyonan]

Manuel La Bor wrote...

realgundam wrote...

If haven't been said already:
1) did you apply the weapon bonus from Turian passive first? then - the armor?
2) some guns are better at getting head shots. ie Temples and Phaseton vs Revenat

I am only using base weapon damage (at lvl 10) to calculate dps. 

Not sure what you are trying to say in the second point.. could you clarify please?

I think he's just saying that despite, say the Revenant having more dps, scoring headshots with it is going to be a bit harder than on the Phaeston, making your dps a bit lower.

Of course, that's not something stats can account for. The best way to do it is to assume 100% accuracy, and I generally assume 100% bodyshots due to player skill being an unknown.

Additionally, I do have the numbers for sustained dps of every weapon in the game(meaning I took reloads into account) if people are interested. I just don't have them done for Marksman.

[Manuel La Bor]

Cyonan wrote...

Manuel La Bor wrote...

realgundam wrote...

If haven't been said already:
1) did you apply the weapon bonus from Turian passive first? then - the armor?
2) some guns are better at getting head shots. ie Temples and Phaseton vs Revenat

I am only using base weapon damage (at lvl 10) to calculate dps. 

Not sure what you are trying to say in the second point.. could you clarify please?

I think he's just saying that despite, say the Revenant having more dps, scoring headshots with it is going to be a bit harder than on the Phaeston, making your dps a bit lower.

Of course, that's not something stats can account for. The best way to do it is to assume 100% accuracy, and I generally assume 100% bodyshots due to player skill being an unknown.

Additionally, I do have the numbers for sustained dps of every weapon in the game(meaning I took reloads into account) if people are interested. I just don't have them done for Marksman.

Ah, yeah that is very true. Calculating raw dps necessitates assuming 100% accuracy. 

People have to realize that hitting this dps all then time is near impossible unless you have perfect aim. This is more a guideline to think about and help you decide what weapon you take into battle.

To get the numbers for MM a quick way is just to take the dps you've calculated and multiply it by 1.5 since MM gives a 50% fire rate increase when specced correctly. Feel free to post your numbers here and I can put em up on the OP

Modifié par Manuel La Bor, 31 mars 2012 - 11:52 .

[Cyonan]

Manuel La Bor wrote...

Ah, yeah that is very true. Calculating raw dps necessitates assuming 100% accuracy. 

People have to realize that hitting this dps all then time is near impossible unless you have perfect aim. This is more a guideline to think about and help you decide what weapon you take into battle.

To get the numbers for MM a quick way is just to take the dps you've calculated and multiply it by 1.5 since MM gives a 50% fire rate increase when specced correctly. Feel free to post your numbers here and I can put em up on the OP

Indeed, people should note that these stats are always assuming you can't miss, and are constantly either firing or reloading, which doesn't always happen.

I'll post my numbers after I grab something to eat and do some recalculating for Marksman in about an hour or so. It wont quite be 1.5 since MM doesn't speed up reloading, and I don't believe it speeds up refire either.

[Manuel La Bor]

Cyonan wrote...

Manuel La Bor wrote...

Ah, yeah that is very true. Calculating raw dps necessitates assuming 100% accuracy. 

People have to realize that hitting this dps all then time is near impossible unless you have perfect aim. This is more a guideline to think about and help you decide what weapon you take into battle.

To get the numbers for MM a quick way is just to take the dps you've calculated and multiply it by 1.5 since MM gives a 50% fire rate increase when specced correctly. Feel free to post your numbers here and I can put em up on the OP

Indeed, people should note that these stats are always assuming you can't miss, and are constantly either firing or reloading, which doesn't always happen.

I'll post my numbers after I grab something to eat and do some recalculating for Marksman in about an hour or so. It wont quite be 1.5 since MM doesn't speed up reloading, and I don't believe it speeds up refire either.

It does speed up the refire rate, I just don't know by how much. Not very noticable with the shuriken but VERY noticable with the vindicator. 

[Cyonan]

Manuel La Bor wrote...

Cyonan wrote...

Manuel La Bor wrote...

Ah, yeah that is very true. Calculating raw dps necessitates assuming 100% accuracy. 

People have to realize that hitting this dps all then time is near impossible unless you have perfect aim. This is more a guideline to think about and help you decide what weapon you take into battle.

To get the numbers for MM a quick way is just to take the dps you've calculated and multiply it by 1.5 since MM gives a 50% fire rate increase when specced correctly. Feel free to post your numbers here and I can put em up on the OP

Indeed, people should note that these stats are always assuming you can't miss, and are constantly either firing or reloading, which doesn't always happen.

I'll post my numbers after I grab something to eat and do some recalculating for Marksman in about an hour or so. It wont quite be 1.5 since MM doesn't speed up reloading, and I don't believe it speeds up refire either.

It does speed up the refire rate, I just don't know by how much. Not very noticable with the shuriken but VERY noticable with the vindicator. 

So it does.

I wonder if it speeds it up by a flat number and it's just more profound on the Vindicator since it has a smaller refire time.

[Manuel La Bor]

Cyonan wrote...

Manuel La Bor wrote...

Cyonan wrote...

Manuel La Bor wrote...

Ah, yeah that is very true. Calculating raw dps necessitates assuming 100% accuracy. 

People have to realize that hitting this dps all then time is near impossible unless you have perfect aim. This is more a guideline to think about and help you decide what weapon you take into battle.

To get the numbers for MM a quick way is just to take the dps you've calculated and multiply it by 1.5 since MM gives a 50% fire rate increase when specced correctly. Feel free to post your numbers here and I can put em up on the OP

Indeed, people should note that these stats are always assuming you can't miss, and are constantly either firing or reloading, which doesn't always happen.

I'll post my numbers after I grab something to eat and do some recalculating for Marksman in about an hour or so. It wont quite be 1.5 since MM doesn't speed up reloading, and I don't believe it speeds up refire either.

It does speed up the refire rate, I just don't know by how much. Not very noticable with the shuriken but VERY noticable with the vindicator. 

So it does.

I wonder if it speeds it up by a flat number and it's just more profound on the Vindicator since it has a smaller refire time.

I believe you are correct.

[Cyonan]

Well, I didn't account for refire time in my calculations. I can re-do those weapons once we have a solid understanding of how Marksman interacts with min refire time. I also figured out increases based on extended clip or the heat sink for SMGs since that increases dps due to less reloading.

The ranges are the dps values for ranks I - X.

Also remember that not every weapon will need reloading before Marksman wears off.


Assault Rifles

Base Sustained DPS values, unmodded

Avenger 361.55 - 451.47 DPS
GPR 260.05 - 339.30 DPS
Revenant 526.89 - 647.92 DPS
Mattock 538.51 - 630.23 DPS
Vindicator 587.60 - 734.50 DPS
Phaeston 368.40 - 448.02 DPS
Falcon 181.48 - 226.85 DPS
Saber 402.62 - 503.24 DPS

Extended Clip V

Avenger 406.59 - 507.71 DPS 12.46% Increase
GPR 325.15 - 424.24 DPS 25.03% Increase
Revenant 654.27 - 804.56 DPS 24.17% Increase
Mattock 682.95 - 854.05 DPS 35.51% Increase
Vindicator 682.24 - 852.80 DPS 16.11% Increase
Phaeston 423.34 - 514.84 DPS 14.91% Increase
Falcon 255.93 - 319.92 DPS 41.03% Increase
Saber 490.14 - 612.64 DPS 21.74% Increase

Pistols

Base Sustained DPS values, unmodded

Predator 463.54 - 579.42 DPS
Phalanx 401.80 - 502.25 DPS
Carnifex 423.35 - 529.15 DPS
Paladin 500.37 - 625.50 DPS
Scorpion 425.00 - 531.53 DPS
Talon 570.90 - 713.46 DPS
Arc Pistol 362.24 - 455.04 DPS
Eagle 231.08 - 289.40 DPS

Extended Clip V

Predator 503.48 - 693.35 DPS 19.66% Increase
Phalanx 495.55 - 619.44 DPS 23.33% Increase
Carnifex 501.58 - 626.93 DPS 18.48% Increase
Paladin 630.34 - 787.96 DPS 25.97% Increase
Scorpion 525.28 - 656.60 DPS 23.53% Increase
Talon X 692.00 - 864.80 DPS 21.21% Increase
Arc Pistol 472.61 - 593.68 DPS 30.46% Increase
Eagle 288.32 - 361.08 DPS 24.77% Increase


Shotguns

Katana 397.63 - 497.65 DPS
Eviscerator 360.00 - 449.48 DPS
Scimitar 391.76 - 489.15 DPS
GPS 952.27 - 1190.27 DPS
Disciple 333.36 - 416.16 DPS
Graal 704.00 - 880.00 DPS
Wraith 441.53 - 552.04 DPS
Crusader 400.86 - 501.05 DPS


Sub-Machine Guns

Base Sustained DPS values, unmodded

Shuriken 602.00 - 754.29 DPS
Tempest 448.68 - 584.04 DPS
Locust 278.93 - 364.18 DPS
Hornet 812.09 - 1014.39 DPS
Hurricane 579.84 - 724.80 DPS

Extended Clip V

Shuriken 710.08 - 889.71 DPS 17.95% Increase
Tempest 525.40 - 683.91 DPS 17.10% Increase
Locust 326.08 - 425.75 DPS 16.91% Increase
Hornet 998.49 - 1247.22 DPS 22.95% Increase
Hurricane 689.57 - 861.96 DPS 18.92% Increase

Heat Sink V - These are only an average, since the Heat Sink is RNG based.

Shuriken 674.24 - 844.81 DPS 12.00% Increase
Tempest 498.68 - 649.13 DPS 11.14% Increase
Locust 310.53 - 405.44 DPS 11.33% Increase
Hornet 927.30 - 1158.30 DPS 14.19% Increase
Hurricane 652.32 - 815.40 DPS 12.50% Increase

Thermal Clip V + Heat Sink V - These are only an average, since the Heat Sink is RNG based.

Shuriken 763.84 - 957.07 DPS 26.88% Increase
Tempest 562.39 - 732.06 DPS 25.34% Increase
Locust 349.16 - 455.88 DPS 25.18% Increase
Hornet 1094.96 - 1367.73 DPS 34.83% Increase
Hurricane 743.93 - 929.91 DPS 28.30% Increase


Sniper Rifles

Viper 313.51 - 391.82 DPS
Incisor 324.31 - 405.63 DPS
Raptor 579.98 - 724.61 DPS
Black Widow 308.46 - 385.56 DPS
Valiant 444.08 - 555.10 DPS

Modifié par Cyonan, 01 avril 2012 - 01:38 .

[Manuel La Bor]

^^ You have my thanks. This is excellent info. Added to OP

Those numbers are taking Marksman into account or no? - (edit stupid question is stupid)

Modifié par Manuel La Bor, 01 avril 2012 - 02:11 .

[SmokemJags]

Why is there no mention of the Claymore?

[SmokemJags]

mistaken double post

Modifié par SmokemJags, 01 avril 2012 - 02:16 .