494 réponses à ce sujet

[Hexley UK]

The Angry One wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

piemanz wrote...

Glad you liked it OP, but you can't say that around here because apprently it's classed as trolling.

I don't know why I keep expecting someone to make a logical argument for why the ending is as clever as you think it is rather than self-professed martyrdom.

Pro-enders, say they like it then can't/won't explain why (or are unable to coherently) and then wonder why people assume they are trolling......

Pro-ender: "I liked the ending."

Others: "I'm happy for you, can you say why you liked it?"

Pro-ender: "Because it's clever and spiritual. Obviously this went over your head."

Others: "That's not an answer. Why did it go over our heads?"

Pro-ender: "I'M NOT TELLING YOU WHY YOU'D JUST BE MEAN. STOP TRAMPLING ON MY FREEDOMS."

Lol perfect!

[piemanz]

The Angry One wrote...

piemanz wrote...

Glad you liked it OP, but you can't say that around here because apprently it's classed as trolling.

I don't know why I keep expecting someone to make a logical argument for why the ending is as clever as you think it is rather than self-professed martyrdom.

Where have i said you need to be clever?, I'm sure there lots of intelligent people who don't get the ending. But from what i've seen not liking the ending is usually linked to an emotional reaction rather than a well thought out rational reaction.

[Wolven_Soul]

Dava Flava wrote...

Clearly, if I liked the ending and others don't, then they didn't get it like I did. That's not passive aggressive; that's factual.

Well then why don't you tell us exactly what it is that you...got?

[Velocithon]

The Angry One wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

piemanz wrote...

Glad you liked it OP, but you can't say that around here because apprently it's classed as trolling.

I don't know why I keep expecting someone to make a logical argument for why the ending is as clever as you think it is rather than self-professed martyrdom.

Pro-enders, say they like it then can't/won't explain why (or are unable to coherently) and then wonder why people assume they are trolling......

Pro-ender: "I liked the ending."

Others: "I'm happy for you, can you say why you liked it?"

Pro-ender: "Because it's clever and spiritual. Obviously this went over your head."

Others: "That's not an answer. Why did it go over our heads?"

Pro-ender: "I'M NOT TELLING YOU WHY YOU'D JUST BE MEAN. STOP TRAMPLING ON MY FREEDOMS."

QFT

[T-0pel]

Evil Minion wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

Yes the rules of story telling, which this ending completely violates........that fact makes it full of "badness"

No no no there are no rules now apparently, because Evil Minion says so.
It's art! How can you criticise art!

And why should I believe they exist?

Because The Angry One says so?

And I never said you can't criticize "art." Criticize all you want, but's it's all just opinions. Opinions are not facts, no matter how often they're repeated or how strongly you feel about them.

Again, did you read my post about detective stories?

[Eterna]

I'm glad people on this forum are able to have differing opinions. Oh wait....

[Hexley UK]

piemanz wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

piemanz wrote...

Glad you liked it OP, but you can't say that around here because apprently it's classed as trolling.

I don't know why I keep expecting someone to make a logical argument for why the ending is as clever as you think it is rather than self-professed martyrdom.

Where have i said you need to be clever?, I'm sure there lots of intelligent people who don't get the ending. But from what i've seen not liking the ending is usually linked to an emotional reaction rather than a well thought out rational reaction.

I get the ending...it's just complete garbage.

[The Angry One]

piemanz wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

piemanz wrote...

Glad you liked it OP, but you can't say that around here because apprently it's classed as trolling.

I don't know why I keep expecting someone to make a logical argument for why the ending is as clever as you think it is rather than self-professed martyrdom.

Where have i said you need to be clever?, I'm sure there lots of intelligent people who don't get the ending. But from what i've seen not liking the ending is usually linked to an emotional reaction rather than a well thought out rational reaction.

a) That's not what I said.
WHAT. IS. IT. WE. DON'T. GET?
c) There are numerous logical explanations for why the endings make no sense. Refer to my basic list a few pages back.

[sveners]

Eterna5 wrote...

I'm glad people on this forum are able to have differing opinions. Oh wait....

[The Angry One]

Eterna5 wrote...

I'm glad people on this forum are able to have differing opinions. Oh wait....

Stop playing the opinion card.
When someone declares the ending is over our heads, that ceases to be an opinion and becomes a point of debate.

[Reverse Centaur]

Evil Minion wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

Yes the rules of story telling, which this ending completely violates........that fact makes it full of "badness"

No no no there are no rules now apparently, because Evil Minion says so.
It's art! How can you criticise art!

And why should I believe they exist?

Because The Angry One says so?

And I never said you can't criticize "art." Criticize all you want, but's it's all just opinions. Opinions are not facts, no matter how often they're repeated or how strongly you feel about them.

Well said.

[Hexley UK]

Eterna5 wrote...

I'm glad people on this forum are able to have differing opinions. Oh wait....

Yea the problem with that is when 95% hate the ending and only 5% like it your not gonna see much "differing opinions".

[Eterna]

The Angry One wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

I'm glad people on this forum are able to have differing opinions. Oh wait....

Stop playing the opinion card.
When someone declares the ending is over our heads, that ceases to be an opinion and becomes a point of debate.

Be the mature one and move on?

[Saint Op]

yep this is true to form & by the book...
Lets argue about what ,what really means...

retake while it started fine & I can understand what they were going for ...now has several branches that have gone off on their own to do unspeakable things.
They spout the doctrine as if it is fact and it can be no other way...this is our "proof" look...no it is not proof ,it is talking points approved by the mob...they are not "true" nor "unsubjective"...
You cant ask for a opinion & say it is wrong because of my opinion & mine has a video....propaganda films do not make things truth...

[The Angry One]

Eterna5 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

I'm glad people on this forum are able to have differing opinions. Oh wait....

Stop playing the opinion card.
When someone declares the ending is over our heads, that ceases to be an opinion and becomes a point of debate.

Be the mature one and move on?

I enjoy debating, and would genuinely like to know what is it that some pro-enders think "we don't get".
I have yet to recieve an answer.

[ibench1000lbs]

Evil Minion wrote...

Bigdoser wrote...

I really want to know how people liked the ending I really want to understand why. It seems that no one has given me a good answer yet.

*sigh*

It's a matter of taste. If I liked Shakespeare and you didn't, would you want me to "prove" that I liked it and to provide evidence that it was "good?"

If you want me to answer specific questions, I will, but I can't "prove" it was "good."

Furthermore, I liked it because I did. I understand why others didn't. I'm not interested in changing anyone's opinion because I realize that the type of ending ME3 has generally tends not to be popular with Western audiences for various reasons. I will discuss why I liked it, but I will not "debate" it.

Whether or not something is "good" or "bad" is entirely subjectively. You can't "prove" it one way or another. 

No one is wanting to to "prove" the ending is good. What is being exspected of you is to provide premises which support your conclusion of the ending being good. Just as I can provide you with reasons to support my conclusion of the ending being bad. It's like, Philosophy 101- arguments. Come on guys, you seem intelligent enough. Stop trying to avoid explaining yourselves. I'm legitimitely curious as to the reasons why someone thinks it is good. If anyone sent me a PM explaining yourself that would be much appreciated

Dava Flava wrote...

Maybe we should argue the existence of God instead. We might reach consensus quicker.

It's funny you bring that up. A common problem with those arguments is that they are circular.
1. God exists
2. He wrote/influenced the bible
3. Therefore, God exists
Well that isn't going to convince anyone who doesn't already agree with you.
Not asking anyone to "prove" the endings were good. I would like to see your reasons for thinking it is good however.

I hope I didn't offend anyone with this, I don't think I did. The god thing was just an example. My beliefs are irrelevent, so don't attack me on that please.

[Eterna]

Hexley UK wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

I'm glad people on this forum are able to have differing opinions. Oh wait....

Yea the problem with that is when 95% hate the ending and only 5% like it your not gonna see much "differing opinions".

So because the majority dislikes something someone who disagrees is wrong and must be purged by verbal diarrhea? 

[QwibQwibLover]

Okey Okey...... Im a very simple guy. My IQ is below 100 and I like Ice Cream.
So i played this game and didnt get the hole Religious garbage....
Now please tell me what the Storywriters wanted to tell us? Or me?
If everybody thinks this is art and usually art wants to tell or explain us something in a different way.

What was the hole point of the Mass Effect story?

[Reverse Centaur]

Eterna5 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

I'm glad people on this forum are able to have differing opinions. Oh wait....

Stop playing the opinion card.
When someone declares the ending is over our heads, that ceases to be an opinion and becomes a point of debate.

Be the mature one and move on?

Not going to happen.

[Velocithon]

I'll give my take on what pro-enders see:

They see Shepard making the ultimate sacrifice. They see the Relays being destroyed and that all civilizations have to start over again because they weren't ready to truly respect the technology that was given to them (such as by building Geth and exterminating themselves). The destruction of the relays was a new beginning, free from technology. They see the Normandy crash landing and Joker living out his life happily.

What I do think though is the majority of the pro-enders have never played ME1 or ME2. I can totally see how someone not playing those games might like the ending.

However as a ME veteran, all I see are the flaws that have been listed countless times and wish for what should have been.

[Hexley UK]

The Angry One wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

I'm glad people on this forum are able to have differing opinions. Oh wait....

Stop playing the opinion card.
When someone declares the ending is over our heads, that ceases to be an opinion and becomes a point of debate.

Be the mature one and move on?

I enjoy debating, and would genuinely like to know what is it that some pro-enders think "we don't get".
I have yet to recieve an answer.

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say it's because they haven't thought it through properly (or can't) and don't have an answer.

But you knew that anyway.

[Evil Minion]

Quietness wrote...

You do realize you've gone from arguing facts to arguing semantics. You've basically just admitted you have no way to back yourself up....

No, I didn't.

People are claiming their subjective interpretations are objective facts and can be "proven." People have claimed that "art" can be "objectively good" or "objectively bad."

If it's objective, then you should be able to provide physical, repeatable, measurable, empirical evidence of this "fact."

That's what "objective" means.

This is the difference between "science" and "art." Science is objective; "art" is not. Whether something is "good" or "bad" is not "objective" as "goodness" and "badness" have no metric. The existence of hydrogen atoms is objective. Whether ME3 endings are good or bad is not. Gravity is objective. Whether ME3 endings were good or bad is not. That 1+1=2 is objective. Whether ME3 endings are good or bad is not.

[Quietness]

ibench1000lbs wrote...

Evil Minion wrote...

Bigdoser wrote...

I really want to know how people liked the ending I really want to understand why. It seems that no one has given me a good answer yet.

*sigh*

It's a matter of taste. If I liked Shakespeare and you didn't, would you want me to "prove" that I liked it and to provide evidence that it was "good?"

If you want me to answer specific questions, I will, but I can't "prove" it was "good."

Furthermore, I liked it because I did. I understand why others didn't. I'm not interested in changing anyone's opinion because I realize that the type of ending ME3 has generally tends not to be popular with Western audiences for various reasons. I will discuss why I liked it, but I will not "debate" it.

Whether or not something is "good" or "bad" is entirely subjectively. You can't "prove" it one way or another. 

No one is wanting to to "prove" the ending is good. What is being exspected of you is to provide premises which support your conclusion of the ending being good. Just as I can provide you with reasons to support my conclusion of the ending being bad. It's like, Philosophy 101- arguments. Come on guys, you seem intelligent enough. Stop trying to avoid explaining yourselves. I'm legitimitely curious as to the reasons why someone thinks it is good. If anyone sent me a PM explaining yourself that would be much appreciated

Dava Flava wrote...

Maybe we should argue the existence of God instead. We might reach consensus quicker.

It's funny you bring that up. A common problem with those arguments is that they are circular.
1. God exists
2. He wrote/influenced the bible
3. Therefore, God exists
Well that isn't going to convince anyone who doesn't already agree with you.
Not asking anyone to "prove" the endings were good. I would like to see your reasons for thinking it is good however.

I hope I didn't offend anyone with this, I don't think I did. The god thing was just an example. My beliefs are irrelevent, so don't attack me on that please.

Religion into an already heated situation is like throwing gasoline into a fire =/ bad stuff man.

[Caz Tirin]

Evil Minion wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

Yes the rules of story telling, which this ending completely violates........that fact makes it full of "badness"

No no no there are no rules now apparently, because Evil Minion says so.
It's art! How can you criticise art!

And why should I believe they exist?

Because The Angry One says so?

And I never said you can't criticize "art." Criticize all you want, but's it's all just opinions. Opinions are not facts, no matter how often they're repeated or how strongly you feel about them.

Perhaps you should believe they exist because every master writer in history follows them.  Perhaps you should speak to your English teacher on Monday and tell her "There's no such thing as 'Rules of Literature'".  If you do tell her that, please record the reaction.

You might also try googling rules of literature, writing techniques (since they are a product of the rules of literature and also part of what they 40 minute video you didn't watch explains).

Do you know what Narrative Cohesion is?  To give you a hint, it's one of the rules of literature.

[Hexley UK]

Eterna5 wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

I'm glad people on this forum are able to have differing opinions. Oh wait....

Yea the problem with that is when 95% hate the ending and only 5% like it your not gonna see much "differing opinions".

So because the majority dislikes something someone who disagrees is wrong and must be purged by verbal diarrhea? 

Hey if your the only pimp at the policemans ball what do you expect to happen?