1291 réponses à ce sujet

[totalrecall87]

Well said!

[Dridengx]

I completely disagree

[Mev186]

Dridengx wrote...

I completely disagree

How so ? 

[krukow]

THIS.

I don't care about a fake future universe that I have never and will never meet. I care about the characters I've gotten to know over three games and the galaxy they inhabit. And I could not save any of it. I didn't even have the option.

That's why the ending ruins this game.

[Aweus]

Dridengx wrote...

I completely disagree

TLDR

[HenchxNarf]

xsdob wrote...

sometimes I wonder why I even come here anymore. OP's thread is sad, it ignores the goal of stopping the reapers and selfishly focuses on just shepard living and not on the future controlled by a genocidal machine race. The fact that so many other people agree is even worse, it tells of a group of fans who claim to be mature on one side but resort to tantrum throwing that everything didn't end well for us, but might end well for the future, which should be the focus of winning a war.

Things turning out well in the imediate is of little concern, how things turn out for the future is more important.

You know what, screw this, any thread I see the angry one in, I'm just gonna turn around and ignore that thread even exist anymore.

That's how you should treat them anyway. All they do is flamebait those with different opinions, and they all but admitted it as well.

I disagree so much with this post. As you said, xsdob, it's very selfish. War doesn't matter to them.  All they want is their blue/Quarian/Turian babies, and eff the rest of the galaxy.

[Wrathra]

Yes! This.

[AtreiyaN7]

It's very short-sighted to say that the future doesn't matter when it did matter and does matter. Why did Garrus, Wrex, Tali, etc. help you in the first place? Because they saw the danger of the Reapers. They didn't up and decide to help Shepard because he/she was such an awesome person that they wanted to hang out with him/her. Those friendships develop naturally during the course of Shepard's fight to stop the Reapers, but those people initially stay with Shepard because they want to make really sure that there's a future for themselves and their people.

I certainly didn't fight against Sovereign or the Collectors because I loved Kaidan or because I developed a deep and abiding friendship with Garrus. I was fighting for something bigger than any of that. My friends and LIs inspired loyalty and feelings of camaraderie and were an important part of the journey. They gave me a reason to keep going in what seemed like a futile fight to be sure, but it was ultimately about finding a way to break the cycle and to make certain that there would be a future for others - even if that didn't include my Shepard or my friends.

If you're a determined pessimist, then of course you believe that there's no future or hope and that everything you love is gone, in which case so be it. Some of us just don't see it that way and have an optimistic outlook as far as that goes.

Modifié par AtreiyaN7, 01 avril 2012 - 02:55 .

[HerceN]

Well said, completely agree.

[aliengmr1]

RyuGuitarFreak wrote...

THIS.

That's what I always think when I listen or read to "oh, but there are so much possibilities for the future". SO WHAT? So what of what's next? There are no mass relays! There's no galactic communication, exploration, WHO CARES. All those possibilities and the Mass Effect universe as we have known...NO MORE. FOREVER.

The point is, it's because of reaper technology that we've got to have this story. I know that the plot and lore always played with the concept of abandoning reaper technology, we could see it coming but it's because of it that we have Mass Effect. Abandoning it, is abandoning Mass Effect.

I am ok with hijacking the mass relays from the Reapers. Trophies of war.

[Niniva]

Agreed.

[Isichar]

HenchxNarf wrote...

xsdob wrote...

sometimes I wonder why I even come here anymore. OP's thread is sad, it ignores the goal of stopping the reapers and selfishly focuses on just shepard living and not on the future controlled by a genocidal machine race. The fact that so many other people agree is even worse, it tells of a group of fans who claim to be mature on one side but resort to tantrum throwing that everything didn't end well for us, but might end well for the future, which should be the focus of winning a war.

Things turning out well in the imediate is of little concern, how things turn out for the future is more important.

You know what, screw this, any thread I see the angry one in, I'm just gonna turn around and ignore that thread even exist anymore.

That's how you should treat them anyway. All they do is flamebait those with different opinions, and they all but admitted it as well.

I disagree so much with this post. As you said, xsdob, it's very selfish. War doesn't matter to them.  All they want is their blue/Quarian/Turian babies, and eff the rest of the galaxy.

Right its also selfish to ask for any form of logic? oh right screw logic its ART

[The Angry One]

HenchxNarf wrote...

xsdob wrote...

sometimes I wonder why I even come here anymore. OP's thread is sad, it ignores the goal of stopping the reapers and selfishly focuses on just shepard living and not on the future controlled by a genocidal machine race. The fact that so many other people agree is even worse, it tells of a group of fans who claim to be mature on one side but resort to tantrum throwing that everything didn't end well for us, but might end well for the future, which should be the focus of winning a war.

Things turning out well in the imediate is of little concern, how things turn out for the future is more important.

You know what, screw this, any thread I see the angry one in, I'm just gonna turn around and ignore that thread even exist anymore.

That's how you should treat them anyway. All they do is flamebait those with different opinions, and they all but admitted it as well.

I disagree so much with this post. As you said, xsdob, it's very selfish. War doesn't matter to them.  All they want is their blue/Quarian/Turian babies, and eff the rest of the galaxy.

Really, it gratifies me so much to know that you haven't read a word I said.

[wathc me tyep]

Too ****ing bad. It's not about you, it's about the galaxy.

[HenchxNarf]

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

It's very short-sighted to say that the future doesn't matter when it did matter and does matter. Why did Garrus, Wrex, Tali, etc. help you in the first place? Because they saw the danger of the Reapers. They didn't up and decide to help Shepard because he/she was such an awesome person that they wanted to hang out with you. Those friendships develop naturally during the course of Shepard's fight to stop the Reapers, but those people initially stay with Shepard because they want to make really sure that there's a future for themselves and their people.

I certainly didn't fight against Sovereign or the Collectors because I loved Kaidan or because I developed a deep and abiding friendship with Garrus. I was fighting for something bigger than any of that. My friends and LIs inspired loyalty and feelings of camaraderie and were an important part of the journey. They gave me a reason to keep going in what seemed like a futile fight to be sure, but it was ultimately about finding a way to break the cycle and to make certain that there would be a future for others - even if that didn't include my Shepard or my friends.

If you're a determined pessimist, then of course you believe that there's no future or hope and that everything you love is gone, in which case so be it. Some of us just don't see it that way and have an optimistic outlook as far as that goes.

Agreed! And well said, too.

[Aweus]

HenchxNarf wrote...

xsdob wrote...

sometimes I wonder why I even come here anymore. OP's thread is sad, it ignores the goal of stopping the reapers and selfishly focuses on just shepard living and not on the future controlled by a genocidal machine race. The fact that so many other people agree is even worse, it tells of a group of fans who claim to be mature on one side but resort to tantrum throwing that everything didn't end well for us, but might end well for the future, which should be the focus of winning a war.

Things turning out well in the imediate is of little concern, how things turn out for the future is more important.

You know what, screw this, any thread I see the angry one in, I'm just gonna turn around and ignore that thread even exist anymore.

That's how you should treat them anyway. All they do is flamebait those with different opinions, and they all but admitted it as well.

And all you do is post together with Dridengx everywhere you move. Only one thing I still cant figure out is if you are a one person with two accounts or two people sitting next to each other to combine the force for maximum troll overdrive.

[Zardoc]

wathc me tyep wrote...

Too ****ing bad. It's not about you, it's about the galaxy.

Maybe BioWare shouldn't have made a game with character driven narrative then, if they only intended to wrap up the narrative of one character, that most people didn't even care about all that much.


I can assure you that the majority of people that played Mass Effect and liked it did so because of the characters, not because of the original (lol) plot.

Modifié par Zardoc, 01 avril 2012 - 02:57 .

[Dridengx]

.

xsdob wrote...

sometimes I wonder why I even come here anymore. OP's thread is sad, it ignores the goal of stopping the reapers and selfishly focuses on just shepard living and not on the future controlled by a genocidal machine race. The fact that so many other people agree is even worse, it tells of a group of fans who claim to be mature on one side but resort to tantrum throwing that everything didn't end well for us, but might end well for the future, which should be the focus of winning a war.

Things turning out well in the imediate is of little concern, how things turn out for the future is more important.

You know what, screw this, any thread I see the angry one in, I'm just gonna turn around and ignore that thread even exist anymore.

Brilliant post! I agree! it gets so sad I laugh because if you take it seriously you lose brain cells

Modifié par Dridengx, 01 avril 2012 - 02:57 .

[Quietness]

HenchxNarf wrote...

xsdob wrote...

sometimes I wonder why I even come here anymore. OP's thread is sad, it ignores the goal of stopping the reapers and selfishly focuses on just shepard living and not on the future controlled by a genocidal machine race. The fact that so many other people agree is even worse, it tells of a group of fans who claim to be mature on one side but resort to tantrum throwing that everything didn't end well for us, but might end well for the future, which should be the focus of winning a war.

Things turning out well in the imediate is of little concern, how things turn out for the future is more important.

You know what, screw this, any thread I see the angry one in, I'm just gonna turn around and ignore that thread even exist anymore.

That's how you should treat them anyway. All they do is flamebait those with different opinions, and they all but admitted it as well.

I disagree so much with this post. As you said, xsdob, it's very selfish. War doesn't matter to them.  All they want is their blue/Quarian/Turian babies, and eff the rest of the galaxy.

Oh what do you know, you both come into a topic at the same time, this will be fun.

So what reason am i given to care about something that is outside of the scope to care about? While yes, Shep living and what you have stated would be nice for one of the endings, thats just one of that there should be.

We're talking about squadmates, people who you have been taught to actually care about for the last 3 games. Dooming them to possible death (among other terrible things as presented by the grimdark ending) sits well with you? 

How is possibly wiping out all life in an instant any better than simply accepting the cycle? 

[The Angry One]

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

It's very short-sighted to say that the future doesn't matter when it did matter and does matter. Why did Garrus, Wrex, Tali, etc. help you in the first place? Because they saw the danger of the Reapers. They didn't up and decide to help Shepard because he/she was such an awesome person that they wanted to hang out with you. Those friendships develop naturally during the course of Shepard's fight to stop the Reapers, but those people initially stay with Shepard because they want to make really sure that there's a future for themselves and their people.

Well yes. Themselves and their people. This is the future the endings take away completely.

I certainly didn't fight against Sovereign or the Collectors because I loved Kaidan or because I developed a deep and abiding friendship with Garrus. I was fighting for something bigger than any of that. My friends and LIs inspired loyalty and feelings of camaraderie and were an important part of the journey. They gave me a reason to keep going in what seemed like a futile fight to be sure, but it was ultimately about finding a way to break the cycle and to make certain that there would be a future for others - even if that didn't include my Shepard or my friends.

If you're not fighting for your friends and your people, then who are you fighting for? Somebody in the distant future? Human nature does not work that way. We fight for what we know, not for what might become.

If you're a determined pessimist, then of course you believe that there's no future or hope and that everything you love is gone, in which case so be it. Some of us just don't see it that way and have an optimistic outlook as far as that goes.

If you choose to manufacture a better reality, more power to you. But that just proves how bleak and pointless the ending is, because the ending as given shows no future for the characters were grew to care about. None.

[tybbiesniffer]

I agree with you. I care about the current story being finished (i.e. what happens to everyone/everything?) not what possibility it opens for the future.

What bothers me even more is that they never even bothered to put the repercussions of our final choice in the game. It's not there. All we have is conjecture about what should happen from what we've seen in dlc from a previous game (oh, and the whole"galactic dark age" thing...again not in the game). Really? The galaxy is destroyed and that doesn't even deserve a mention in the game? Not even a text scroll? It's so.....unfinished.

[ericjdev]

Ditto

[The Angry One]

Quietness wrote...

Oh what do you know, you both come into a topic at the same time, this will be fun.

And then they say we're a hive-mind.

[WastelanderTim]

HenchxNarf wrote...

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

It's very short-sighted to say that the future doesn't matter when it did matter and does matter. Why did Garrus, Wrex, Tali, etc. help you in the first place? Because they saw the danger of the Reapers. They didn't up and decide to help Shepard because he/she was such an awesome person that they wanted to hang out with you. Those friendships develop naturally during the course of Shepard's fight to stop the Reapers, but those people initially stay with Shepard because they want to make really sure that there's a future for themselves and their people.

I certainly didn't fight against Sovereign or the Collectors because I loved Kaidan or because I developed a deep and abiding friendship with Garrus. I was fighting for something bigger than any of that. My friends and LIs inspired loyalty and feelings of camaraderie and were an important part of the journey. They gave me a reason to keep going in what seemed like a futile fight to be sure, but it was ultimately about finding a way to break the cycle and to make certain that there would be a future for others - even if that didn't include my Shepard or my friends.

If you're a determined pessimist, then of course you believe that there's no future or hope and that everything you love is gone, in which case so be it. Some of us just don't see it that way and have an optimistic outlook as far as that goes.

Agreed! And well said, too.

I disagree

[Persephone]

This is a beautiful, understamdable sentiment.

While I DO care about the cycle being broken in the long run, I understand how being attached and invested in the galaxy as it was presented throughout the trilogy leaves you embittered, saddened and disappointed. Loghain says "The currency of war is life. You pay it and hope that the outcome is worthwhile." Now what defines worthwhile varies from person to person. I went into ME3 knowing that a happy ending was unlikely. I did not even want one. And ME3 delivered on the sacrifice, emotional breakdown and tragedy front. I do miss that...glimmer of hope sometimes though. The confirmation that seeing Shepard going through hell meant a better life for those he/she was trying so hard to protect. Now, I appreciate realistic outcomes, hence me not wanting a fluffy ending negating all the anguish that came before.

I am torn. Torn between the battle scarred, bittersweet outcome I was hoping for and did not get and the desire to see just what these endings meant exactly. Maybe Bioware's content initiatives will shed light on that, I don't know. All I know is that, after finishing ME3 again tonight... I am sitting here, tears still streaming down my face as I think of those final hours on earth, all those sacrifices by people Shepard cared about....and then...a vacuum. I could fill it with my own interpretation and I often do. But now, as I think of Shepard saying Goodbye to Kaidan and her remembering Thane, Mordin, Legion and all the psychological anguish she went through,,,, I feel disheartened. Saddened. I also feel amazed at a game affecting me emotionally on such a level. It hasn't happened before, I will admit that. Not even Gabriel Knight II or DAII (Shush!) got to me like this.

What lies in store now? Only Bioware knows that at this point. I do not want retcons or blue babies. I do want my efforts to mean something to those Shepard held dear though. In my heart of hearts I want this. I feel a sense of accomplishment, knowing that Liah Shepard's sacrifice preserved something. Anything worth living for. But the idea that nobody she cared about made it out alive of that hellhole of a war sure is a thorn in my sentimental heart. At the end of the day, pragmatism and logic carry a lot of weight. Yet, as a human being, I cannot help but agonize over all of these losses, efforts and triumphs fading into oblivion because....why? Because life sucks and that's how it is? 

Concluding I'll quote a fave book of mine, Margaret George's "The Memoir's Of Cleopatra":

"You must bear losses like a soldier, bravely and without complaint. And just when the day seems lost, grab your shield for another stand, another thrust forward. THAT is the juncture separating heroes from the merely strong." (Gaius Julius Caesar)

My Shepard's motto, plain and simple. I just hope that that last stand, that final thrust forward meant...something. Anything.