whykikyouwhy wrote...
Ukki wrote...
^ but it already does include racism, the way elves are treated in DA world is a good example. So why not include all for the effect?
I realize that there are fine lines of balance in what negative aspects of existence are included or omitted and vice versa. I hesitate to say that the inclusion of racism in the game makes sense (because racism itself doesn't really make sense) - but the fantasy genre has long carried underlying tones of unease or hatred of one people against/toward another. Elves, dwarves, etc. They are usually lumped into a category of a group that inspires fear. And in many a fantasy world, the human characters often find themselves in an alliance with these groups, and thus, some respect may be formed.
I think this may be the easiest real world negative to cover, within a fantasy realm. And it is, within Dragon Age at least, racism is handled with regard to species and not necessarily in terms of human character ethnicity (though there are some sneers and comments about people from Rivain, Ferelden, etc, the hatred aspect is much more subdued than it would be regarding elves, let's say). The differences between cultures and the concept of the foreign other can be surpassed within a game (said "alliances" above).
Sexism and homophobia might be trickier to tackle (and I hesitate to make that declaration as well). Perhaps because those would have to be applied toward human characters. They would be obstacles very much at the forefront of the PC's story and struggle, moreso than racism when playing an elf or a dwarf might have come into play. As it stands, the PC has enough to work against and claim victory over - there are Blights, numerous enemies, classism. We might make parallels between the mage-hate and homophobia, but again, this is removed from real world concepts because of the inclusion of magic. No one possesses those abilities IRL, so seeing the negative so blatantly evident in the world is not quite as personal.
Again, it's a delicate balance. But I would rather not play in a world that so mirrors the many negatives I see in real life. The Big Bad in games can be representative of so much, and when we have enemies that are mortal themselves, when we have moral gray areas (betrayal, deceit, manipulation and so forth), we have a rich environment and story. I would just like to see that there are some ideals maintained in my fantasy realm - that maybe the people in Thedas aren't so hung up on gender or sexual identity, that the heroes are measured against their wit and might versus who they sleep with.
Aww, you managed to put my thoughts into words so much more eloquently than I ever could have myself. *happy tears*
At the risk of slowly drifting away from my original post about infidelity in RPG romances, here's a few of my thoughts about the topic:
One of the wonderful things about fantasy, high fantasy, low fantasy, urban fantasy as well as, yes, dark fantasy, is that the writer doesn't have to conform to modern ideals if they choose not to, while at the same time having the creative freedom to do so when they want. Being able to chose between, or combine, elements from the middle age society and our modern society (usually using allegories like the ones whykikyouwhy mentioned) has always been one of the strenghts of fantasy. In fantasy (or scifi and horror for that matter), we've always discussed topics that sometimes weren't discussed enough in the mainstream. It's also been known to discuss topics that were forbidden, using subtext and allegories.
That said, there is far too many fantasy writers who rely on tired genre clichés and presumed ideas of what a mideaval setting should look like and be like for its inhabitants. The genre has become stagnated and dull, and the recent wave of "dark, gritty fantasy" is nauseatingly lacking in fresh ideas imo, especially since "dark and gritty" seems to translate directly into "demeaning to women" for many authors.. What I felt was so refreshing about Dragon Age when I first encountered the game was that it, though heavy on some tropes, dared to challenge other tropes as well as explore mature topics in a refreshingly modern way (while still feeling like epic, high fantasy with a dark tint).
I think that what makes Dragon Age special is that the games don't just add dark'n'gritty material in order to be edgy/cool/dark, but in a thougthful way, in order to make the gamer experience something. In Origins, if you play as a city elf, your PC will be met with a very different attitude than the high-born PC. It you play as a mage in DAII, you'll experience a very different attitude than your warrior PC. Usually, playing Dragon Age makes me feel like these story choices are thought provocing and poignant, instead of just making me feel bad because I've experienced something similar in real life.
The interactivity, and the way the gamer is invited to identify with her/his character, makes the experience very different from, say, reading a book. As an example, I think that Richard Morgan's The Steel Remains is one of the best dark fantasy novels I've ever read, and if there was ever a book that really managed to put its point across when it comes to showing the reader how homophobia can break a man/woman, it's that book. It's simply brilliant. But I would never, ever roleplay a game based on the same experience, because it would probably break me as well.
Playing Origins and DAII (as well as ME of course) was incredibly refreshing, not because I saw it as wishfullfilment in any way, but because of how openly the game treated my PC (and in extention, me). I could play a guy romancing Zev and none told me I was abnormal. Women in powerful positions kept showing up (I remember cheering every time a "Ser so-and-so" turned out to be a woman). The story in both games wasn't all happy adventuring fun, and it got really bleak at times, but it was dark and gritty of the right kind imo.
Anyways, hoping that I can get back on track from now on instead of derailing the topic.
Rojahar wrote...
Momiji.mii wrote...
Bioware's way of combining dating sims and RPG is imo brilliant
I wasn't aware Dragon Age was supposed to be a Date Sim - RPG.
I don't know what other people consider it, but that was my first thought when I was told about the concept and decided to check it out. You're free to call it what you want, this is just my words for it.
MILK FOR THE KHORNE FLAKES wrote...
ANDERS [spoiler removed], AND THAT WAS APPLAUDED.
I think this will be the last time I reply to you, but I stated earlier in the thread that I thought this was a great twist to the romance and that I loved Jennifer Hepler's writing. There is good hurt and then there is bad hurt. If you do not see the difference than it's probably better that we agree to disagree about this particular matter.
Modifié par Momiji.mii, 14 avril 2012 - 03:00 .
Hearts are broken enough in RL...
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