1536 réponses à ce sujet

[LolaLei]

Hehehe "suck my toes" - well, Orlesians like cheese right? :-P

[Wulfram]

Maria Caliban wrote...

As opposed to a modern, Western existence or as opposed to a mud farmer in Orlais? Because I can't see any society in Thedas as being better than my real life, but I imagine the qunari way of life might be better for the average person in Dragon Age.

The Qunari seem to take away everything I find valuable about life - and everything I value about myself.

I suppose you could defend them in a utilitarian "Brave New World" fashion - a slave who lacks the capacity to comprehend anything better for themselves might be considered happy.  But that still seems utterly abhorrent to me.

At least as an Orlesian mud farmer I'm allowed to resent those noble bastards.

[SamaraDraven]

Maria Caliban wrote...

LolaLei wrote...

Being a mud farmer in Orlais could be a fine existence... Y'know, what with the naked mud wrestling 'n' all. Gotta love those debauched Orlesians!

The last time I was at a county fair, there was a a competition where they greased up pigs, put them in a muddy stall, and guys ran around trying to catch them.

I imagine that's family entertainment all over Orlais.

LOL! The image that presents! Oh Maker! My sides! They hurt. I'd visit Orlais for that.

[SamaraDraven]

LolaLei wrote...

Hehehe "suck my toes" - well, Orlesians like cheese right? :-P

They do!

[Dunquixote]

Wulfram wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

As opposed to a modern, Western existence or as opposed to a mud farmer in Orlais? Because I can't see any society in Thedas as being better than my real life, but I imagine the qunari way of life might be better for the average person in Dragon Age.

The Qunari seem to take away everything I find valuable about life - and everything I value about myself.

I suppose you could defend them in a utilitarian "Brave New World" fashion - a slave who lacks the capacity to comprehend anything better for themselves might be considered happy.  But that still seems utterly abhorrent to me.

At least as an Orlesian mud farmer I'm allowed to resent those noble bastards.

Nice analogy!  I know what you mean, having read that book in high school.  I wish I had kept my copy of it (even though I didn't like it). 

[ladyshamen]

Dunquixote wrote...

I want a cat equivalent of a mabari for a companion (and cat shapeshift forms and hunter pet).   <3

I second this!

[WhiteKnyght]

David Gaider wrote...

berelinde wrote...
It might be more accurate to say that people dislike characters who consider their personal values to be superior to those others possess, particularly if they seek to impose those values on the PC. The difference is subtle, but very, very important.

Actually, I don't think that's accurate. The only character so far who's felt this way was Sten. Characters like Leliana and Sebastian expressed their thoughts on religion/spirituality but rarely proselytized. In fact, Sebastian was written to go out of his way to be accommodating... and yet it seems that some people have an allergic reaction to even the mention of religious views, and will interpret them as proselytization even when they're not intended as such. Which is good to recognize, I think, and it means that characters that we intend to be broadly sympathetic shouldn't be religious.

Mind you, we don't need all characters to be sympathetic. Some players are just gonna get upset, yo. Let 'em.

Sebastian's only real character flaw is his temper. Anders kills Elthina and if Hawke doesn't do as he commands, he threatens to raze Kirkwall to the ground in response. Other than that, he's surprisingly tolerant and agreeable despite his near devout beliefs. Even to Merrill, a blood mage.

Leliana has no real character flaws. Other than her checkered past she's a really good character.

I'll probably get a bit of flaming for this, but the only real difference between a religious person and an athiest is that one believes in a higher power and the other doesn't. Both live by standards and ethics that they believe to be correct.

[Dunquixote]

I agree completely with you there.

[Fallstar]

 1)  -  Bring back a couple of fan favourites as companions or significant, well placed cameos. And I mean actual fan favourites, as whilst Oghren has his following for sure and is a laugh, I think calling him a fan favourite in Awakening was probably misleading.

2) - Have more well developed inter-companion relationships. By this I mean relationships which don't necessarily involve the player character - going back to the banter style conversations from Origins, which I personally thought were fantastic, would be a great start. Perhaps even have romances between companions that the player can help cultivate a la Aveline.

3) - Have a single gathering place for all companions. The atmosphere at the party camp was extemely well done. The music, the way you could go and have a chat with whoever you liked, whenever you liked, the background - all this made the party camp one of my favourite locations in Origins. It promoted a sense of fellowship with your companions, and scenes involving all of the companions in the party camp were very well done; the Shriek attack was great fun, and Leliana's song was another one of those moments that really gave you a sense of being 'in it together' with your companions. This was lacking in DA:2, I personally didn't really feel any attachment to any of the companions besides Anders and Varric. As an aside, the tavern setting with Varric was great, perhaps some form of tavern could be a gathering point for your companions in DA:3 whilst you are in a city.

4) - Morrigan please. 'nuff said.

[Dunquixote]

It would make sense, from what Sandal has said in Hawke's estate if you keep clicking on him, and from playing Witch Hunt, that eventually, even if it isn't the next Dragon Age, the whole Dark Ritual and the results (besides the Warden surviving) will have to be addressed.

[nightscrawl]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Anders criticizes Merrill for her Dalish views, and tries to impose his Andrastian views on her. He expects her to see spirits and demons as two seperate classes of denizens of the Fade, as "Children of the Maker," while she doesn't share that view because she's Dalish.

I've never seen Anders as Andrastian, more like agnostic, even reluctantly so because he has to believe some of it due to his own experiences as a mage.

It doesn't help that the actual game world enforces all of these views, rather than making them only about faith. The demons ARE shown as "breaking down into different sins" as Anders mentions to Merrill, in the mortal world as well as the fade; we as players have seen it on multiple occasions. Andraste's ashes DO have mystical healing powers. And what are we supposed to take away from Corypheus's dialogue in Legacy (unless you just dismiss him as crazy) other than to think that the Black City really did/does exist?

Dunquixote wrote...

Blood magic being "evil" depends on the user's intentions with it, and the summoning demons part, except for the fact it can backfire on you like it did with Uldred, it pretty much can looked at almost like a different type of warlock like in wow. Or am I making a bad comparison, after all they're two different games.

I'll just quote David Gaider from PAX East here...

It's not corruption in the way that the blight is a corruption... A lot of it is opinion and fear, [of] the things that a Blood Mage is capable of. Which, as we're moving forward, we'd like to show that a little bit more, especially the mind control. And it is based on people who have that kind of power, the ability to influence other people's minds, the temptation to misuse it is a corruption. That kind of power is corrupting, right? That's the danger, not a physical "I suddenly turn to the dark side and my eyes have gone black" kind of corruption.

Also, your comparison with WoW warlocks is not the best. Warlock demons are pulled from the Nether to be the minions of the warlock who summons them. This is the reason they all have their own names that cannot be changed. By contrast, any mage in Thedas who thinks he can control a demon is an idiot. There is a distinction to be made between true control and the illusion of control that a demon lets you have. Demons have their own agendas, and their first act is to manipulate a person into bargaining with them to get something they want, like Lady Harimann, so the demon can get what it wants: more power and a foothold in the mortal world.

As Merrill says, there is "nothing inherently evil about blood magic, it's magic, like any other." The real danger of blood magic is the corrupting influence it has, much like Fenris tries to explain: "I have no doubt that some are good and noble men, strong enough to resist temptation. But how many temptations do you wish offer a man before he will give in?"

[Dunquixote]

Thanks for the clarification. I still have a lot to learn in comparison to everyone else in the topic. >< I've been doing as much reading as I can and forming my opinions and perception as I keep learning something new or finding corrections to some assumptions I had made. I have only played a limited amount of games from a limited number genres that there are, so that might be why that why I'm trying to emphasize or explain a point I'm making, that it ends up being a not very good one.  Oh, and sorry for sounding like an idiot lol.

Modifié par Dunquixote, 25 avril 2012 - 11:16 .

[nightscrawl]

Dunquixote wrote...

Oh, and sorry for sounding like an idiot lol.

Er, by that line I didn't mean that you were an idiot. There are mages in Thedas that think they can control demons (though technically I don't suppose Corypheus can be called such), like Warden Janeka in Legacy. They're the idiots XD.

Now, between games, is a good time to be getting into the lore. It's quite fun!

Modifié par nightscrawl, 26 avril 2012 - 01:30 .

[Dunquixote]

Then, I better get more serious into that then. Fortunately, I just need to have another playthrough of DA II, get and read the novels, and whatever else I'm missing, and then I'll be good on this particular game's lore. WoW on the other hand, I don't think I'll ever be able to catch up on that. I should've done that right when I first started playing in "vanilla."  I've stopped playing for the time being until I'm done with college.  For now, I'll stick with Dragon Age to keep me occupied and happy.

Modifié par Dunquixote, 26 avril 2012 - 01:57 .

[VampOrchid]

You know what we need. A "Judas" type character that can be a companion. You know the "OMG I so never saw that coming!"

We had it with Jowan in DAO, if you played as a mage, and it was right at the beginning. And we saw it if you played as a Dwarven Noble and kind of if you played as a Human noble. We need another Kreia moment. A companion that seems all for you, agrees with you most of the time, but sees some of your faults and suggests ways to correct this.

But hey, don't make this "Judas" be Cullen if he's actually added. It would make a lot of us gals sad sad pandas lol

[Dunquixote]

Is there a reason that's labeled as Judas? I have never heard that term before.

Speaking of the dwarf noble origin, my favorite female dwarf noble wants an opportunity for vengeance on Frandlin Ivo down since Gorim didn't kill him. That sonuvab. Ivo... <.< I still either cry or start calling him unladylike names each time I play my female dwarf nobles.  Although, when I played each origin for the first time, I was surprised with what happened, the dwarf noble one was the one that surprised me the most.  The Cousland story even in the first playthrough, I already could guess what happens, just not what leads to it.  The magi one -- I didn't know what to expect since that origin was the first one I ever played. 

Modifié par Dunquixote, 26 avril 2012 - 03:30 .

[berelinde]

Dunquixote wrote...

Is there a reason that's labeled as Judas? I have never heard that term before.

Judas Iscariot

Ah, the heartache! Also, fan rage. I kind of like that sick gut-wrenching twist when you realize that your game self has just been betrayed, but some people take it pretty hard.

Modifié par berelinde, 26 avril 2012 - 03:35 .

[John Epler]

The best Judas characters, of course, are the ones where their betrayal actually makes a sort of sense. If you can see their point and even sympathize - well, it makes it rather more difficult to accept that betrayal because part of you knows that, just maybe, they may be right. A little harder to do in interactive media, of course, but if a character honestly and truly feels you've gone too far and betrays you for that reason... well, that always hits close to home, at least if they have a point.

[Dunquixote]

Ah. Thank you. :-) I guess it's pretty obvious I lack knowledge on religion. I understand concepts when it's implied as a theme in a story, but specifics such as certain passages or names, my mind falls blank.

Yeah, it may seem weird to the people that don't play video games like we do, but me, I always love a moving storyline. The dwarf noble one made me forget that I'm just the one giving the orders. I really grew attached to my dwarf in my first playthrough. Even though I liked playing the mage class and my character right away, I never had felt the same attachment even now that I've played so many mages and am writing a story on one of my current mages.

John Epler wrote...

The best Judas characters, of course,
are the ones where their betrayal actually makes a sort of sense. If you
can see their point and even sympathize - well, it makes it rather more
difficult to accept that betrayal because part of you knows that, just
maybe, they may be right. A little harder to do in interactive media, of
course, but if a character honestly and truly feels you've gone too far
and betrays you for that reason... well, that always hits close to
home, at least if they have a point.

Hmm....  I never thought of that.  Wow.  Even when I was typing the top of this post, I was still fuming about my poor dwarf and thinking evil ways to get back at Ivo.  But, if the dragonage.wikia or wherever I read it was correct about the possibility of the Ivo house being blackmailed by Bhelin, then yeah, it does make sense; as disgruntled as I am about it.  Ah, I should've also thought of that since Harrowmont's cousin was blackmailed about something else, though not to the same extreme as with Ivo.  I need to now think what I'd do in his shoes...  If he doesn't deserve to be killed, then maybe a kick in the balls will do him so good.

Modifié par Dunquixote, 26 avril 2012 - 03:49 .

[VampOrchid]

John Epler wrote...

The best Judas characters, of course, are the ones where their betrayal actually makes a sort of sense. If you can see their point and even sympathize - well, it makes it rather more difficult to accept that betrayal because part of you knows that, just maybe, they may be right. A little harder to do in interactive media, of course, but if a character honestly and truly feels you've gone too far and betrays you for that reason... well, that always hits close to home, at least if they have a point.

Exactly. That thing that makes you self doubt, that's when you know you hit a home run with the fans. The aha moment. Where you have to look back on everything you thought you believed in this game and wonder...hmmm maybe I was wrong

[Dunquixote]

I don't know how long it was since I played my dwarf noble; sometimes it seems just like yesterday, the way I'm fuming thinking about that nug humper, Ivo. There's other days it seems like it's been a long time though where I think, "I guess I didn't explore all of the possibilities of what led the guy to betray her."

With that having been said, does that mean the Couslands were planning to betray the Howes (or was it Ferelden -- I forgot what Nathaniel said in Awakening) to the Orlesians?

Modifié par Dunquixote, 26 avril 2012 - 03:55 .

[Maria Caliban]

Alister is the closest thing to a Judas I've experienced a BioWare game.

I've never played through the Dwarven Noble origin. Neither Howe nor Jowen were personal betrayals. Though Howe was likely a Judas to the elder Couslands. Sun Li betrays you in JE but 1) he's a mentor, not a close companion, and 2) the voice acting meant I never trusted him in the first place.

I think there's a betrayal in BG 2, but apparently I lost whatever companion betrays you long before the story has them do so. I've only read about it online.

[Dunquixote]

I guess Bhelen, himself and not just his cronies would, for me be the best "Judas." I do wish he could've done it through more legit and moral ways, but hey, it makes it more realistic to how things were in the medieval ages and in later periods too, I think [I may be a history major, but I'm not knowledgeable on the medieval times]. I did agree with the political ideology, but not his methods. I can't bring myself to put him on the throne though anymore.

[Wulfram]

John Epler wrote...

The best Judas characters, of course, are the ones where their betrayal actually makes a sort of sense. If you can see their point and even sympathize - well, it makes it rather more difficult to accept that betrayal because part of you knows that, just maybe, they may be right. A little harder to do in interactive media, of course, but if a character honestly and truly feels you've gone too far and betrays you for that reason... well, that always hits close to home, at least if they have a point.

Except if you do it that way, I don't know if they really count as a "Judas".  Actually, I often feel the moments where companions stand up to the PC tend to show them at their very best.

[Darth Krytie]

I don't know if it's been mentioned. It's a long thread. I'd like if there was a choice between two characters again, but have it be more...at the beginning? We had to choose between Anders/Sebastian and Alistair/Loghain so late in the game that there wasn't really a big deal with just restarting and ending the game a tad differently without playing the game over again.

I'd love if you had to choose between two people relatively at the start...and have it mean something depending on who you choose. Like..have it matter who is in your party at x many points during the game.

That'd be really cool, I think.