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[TEWR]

the_one_54321 wrote...
Isabela talks about being into both the dudes and the ladies.

At first glance, I thought this post was claiming Isabela wasn't bisexual. I was mistaken, as I read the page it appeared on and understood that it's really talking about Anders, Fenris, and Merrill's bisexuality. Or so I believe. I may still be misunderstanding it even now.

But let's assume I understood correctly, for the sake of my post. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. If I'm right, another post for the discussion!

Fact: Fenris' memory is at best shaky. It stands to reason that he can't remember his preferred sexual orientation -- whether he was straight, gay, or bi -- and is thus open to it all. A rebirth if you will.

We know he engages in sex with Isabela as a casual fling. That establishes that he'll have sex with women at least. We also know that outside of Hawke's eclectic entourage, Fenris is a ghost amongst Kirkwall's society. He says to Varric that he prefers the anonymity he lives in, rather then having any friends.

If he doesn't display how he'll have sex with men as well as women, it's not because he's Hawkesexual only. It's because his persona is that of a recluse with no memory of his past life.

Anders had Karl -- though I have to wonder just why the romance he had with Karl is only conveyed to a Male Hawke. Seems odd. -- so we know that he'll have sex with men.

Not to mention that in Awakening -- as he's the same character -- he mentions he wants a pretty woman by his side. He also seems to have been flirting with Nathaniel Howe in banter in Awakening.

I never saw it that way -- then again, I never really paid much attention to some of the Awakening banter until after DAII came out -- but I think other people saw it that way.

I also got the impression he had a fling with Namaya. He also was happy that a female Templar was always the one sent out to get him, and he would enjoy the glares he got.

Seems that he was established as bisexual fairly well.

Merrill's... well... Merrill. We barely got to know her in Origins, so we couldn't ascertain her sexual orientation. We do know however that marriages and I think romances between a Keeper -- and by extension, a First -- and a hunter are frowned upon, where the hahrens may forbid such a thing from happening.

Not to mention that she's led a very sheltered life -- one being simply "Study! Study!! STUDY!!!" -- and very rarely got to socialize with the clan.

She has very few friends -- Mahariel being the only one I gather. How far the friendship went is left to the players' imagination.

I'll concede that maybe her sexual orientation is left to the player, but I'd also maintain that it's due to us learning more about her since she is no longer burdened by the life that is "Be a Keeper. You're a Keeper. Study, Merrill! Don't daydream about griffons!"

I'd also say that for me, 4 characters open in their sexuality were brought together because of circumstance.

Fenris fled to Kirkwall to escape Danarius. Anders fled to Kirkwall because of the havoc he wrought amidst a Warden camp and to help Karl escape -- after which, he subsequently joined the Mage Underground. Isabela was shipwrecked on the Wounded Coast after her battle with the Qunari Dreadnought. in a hazardous storm. And Merrill's clan chose Sundermount to settle upon, where they eventually lost their halla and Merrill was ousted -- albeit simultaneously a willing leave on her part -- from her clan for what she was doing.

Circumstance brought them together, where they eventually formed friendships with Hawke, the link in the chain that connected them all.

jlb524 wrote...

So someone cannot be

1)  Bisexual
2)  Discreet about their past love life or romantic interests.

Does the same apply to heterosexuls as well?  Like...Alistair?  I don't recall hearing him talk about ladies outside of PC focused stuff.

Well, Alistair was a virgin in all sense of the word. He didn't talk about his past with ladies because he didn't have a past with ladies.

Of a sexual and/or romantic nature at any rate.

Not that you don't have a point. You most certainly do. Not everyone should brag about their sexual conquests. I certainly don't.

======================================================================

Now, I imagine the conversation is also talking about "Should all romances be bi from now on?" as was commonplace on a few threads in the past. Am I correct in thinking that?

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 03 avril 2012 - 05:35 .

[hussey 92]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Deviija wrote...
This confuses me.  In what ways are they placeholders because they are bisexual?

Because they aren't bisexual. They are variables. Gender neutral sexual orientation place-holders. They fill whatever roles the player wants them to fill, in any given playthrough. (with the exception of Isabella, who was obviously bisexual) None of them talk about being bisexual. They just always happen to be hot for Hawke. That's not a character. It's a fill-in-the-blank.

Let me throw the flipside on this and say that if they actually wrote bisexuality into the character (as with Isabela) then I would not be bothered by it.

I noticed in Awakening Anders never talked about being bisexual and he'd hit on female NPC's (Mhairi, Velanna).  But then in DA2 it's revealed (if your a male hawke) his first time was with a guy.  It seemed like they redid his character a bit.

It's cool to have bi and gay characters, but in reality most people are straight

[TEWR]

David Gaider wrote...

This you will get, I think. It's less about having more interaction (as, in terms of overall volume, DA2 companions actually had as much interaction as DAO companions) but rather how it's presented

That was one of my problems with DAII's companion interaction. It just barely worked for me, but I feel more was needed given the timeline of the game as opposed to DAO's.

To elaborate a little: You've basically got a year's worth of interactions with the companions in a game that spans 7 years and is playable for 3.5-4.0 years, spread out to make it seem like it's more then it is.

Not being able to kiss my romance? Or hug them when they need it? Or have sex with them, because I'm bored with current events and the neighbors aren't doing anything interesting? Not being able to talk to them when I want -- if I can't do it where I want?

Kinda makes it seem rather.... incomplete.

Which you address below. And I realize the companion arcs themselves allow for some major development -- though I take issue with how Anders' progressed. Not the evolvement -- or devolvement as the case may be -- itself as I thought it was a neat take on who he was, but rather how it's shown. 

David Gaider wrote...

Receiving "quests" to inform the player that there was new dialogue seems like it had the opposite effect of what was intended-- rather than being a convenience, some people saw it as affecting their agency. They no longer felt like they had chosen to speak to the companion, but rather that the companion had chosen to speak with them... so they could only interact with that companion on their terms. So, fair enough. Most likely what we will do is go back to the old method of letting the player initiate dialogues, and keep any telegraphing of a companion's "availability" to something more subtle (like a change in animations).

Part of that is also having interactions with the companion that are completely separate from the scenes-- so, the ability to ask the follower questions and/or have smaller things that the player can choose to do like kiss a romance or joke with them, etc.

While I know the average fan would always vote for more of everything (insert meme with fan shouting "ALL OF THE DIALOGUES!" here), there is a trade off... and it would probably come at the expense of having less of a companion's interaction done via companion quests as was in DA2 (remember that DA2 had three quests per follower, in which a lot of that companion's development occurred, as opposed to DAO which had one short quest at best). So there's a middle ground where the sweet spot exists, hopefully, that we'll be playing with... but ideally, once we get around the necessary changes to presentation, it will allow us to retain the feeling of agency that some were missing while not reverting to DAO's system in entirety along with the issues it had.

I look forward to new information on this matter.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 03 avril 2012 - 05:51 .

[Maria Caliban]

hussey 92 wrote...


It's cool to have bi and gay characters, but in reality most people are straight

Reality also has more than four possible people to romance.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 03 avril 2012 - 05:43 .

[TEWR]

Maria Caliban wrote...

hussey 92 wrote...


It's cool to have bi and gay characters, but in reality most people are straight

Reality also has more than four possible people to romance.

NO WAI. UR LION.

==============================================================

To be serious, I don't mind what DAII did with the companions. I've already stated my belief on the matter and why it happened storyline wise -- from my perspective.

I do however think that not all romances should be bisexual. While that certainly allows for more options -- and if it continued to happen I wouldn't be upset, though I wouldn't care for the design choice itself -- I do want there to be a balance between the romance types.

Having a predominantly bisexual cast of romances kinda offsets everything.

Now, if the companions will always remain bisexual, there should be two things methinks:

1) NPC romances of a different nature. Gay, straight, or bi. That way, it doesn't seem like Thedas is just a hive-mind of bisexuality. Not that it's a bad thing to be bisexual, but it would personally strain my credulity. I don't mean "PC is married to NPC and they have babies", but rather casual flings that can happen.

Of course, I wouldn't object to the former if it were to happen. But I doubt it would.

2) Better gender differences other then a paltry "He said/She said".

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 03 avril 2012 - 06:00 .

[Yuqi]

More comedic moments between the party members and the protagonist. I really liked how that worked in both DA2 and DLC's. I hope there will be more of it in future projects.

Modifié par Yuqi, 03 avril 2012 - 06:07 .

[esper]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Isabela talks about being into both the dudes and the ladies.

A well written romance that reacts to the players actions will not happen if the player plays a certain way. Even FFVII back on the PS1, before wester RPGs really took off, had that concept down.

Isabella likes to talk about sex. I will like to point out that just because you are bi-sexual you can still be a prude, introvert, and have a whole lot of reason not to share every little person you've been with. I know that I don't talk about my sexuality outside of this circle and that is not because of social stigma, since my circle of friends are fairly open-minded, it is because I'm just don't talk about it.

There are a whole lot of things in dragon age that the companions do react to outside of the pc gender  (which they still react to btw, Anders, Merrill and Isabella doesn't say the exact same thing to the pc if they are a man or a woman. Fenris I've never youtubed for a man). I don't see why checking the genderbox should exclude the pc from content as in da:o. Not being able to go to the mirror or being able to having Morrigan simply becuse I play a woman irritated me, espcially because I didn't like Leliana that way. I don't like Isabella either, but at least I had Merrill.

[PsychoBlonde]

JoeLaTurkeyII wrote...

Cassandra Pentaghast.

She'd totally make sense as a companion, and I actually kinda like her.  I'd also like to see Maraas and maybe Cullen.  Feynriel would be cool if it weren't for the fact that you can kill him (yes? my brain still working?).  Dagna (the enthusiastic magic-studying dwarf girl) would be sweet, especially if we can set her up with Varric.  Or maybe we can meet Bianca.  Also Gamlen's daughter, Charade. It would be very interesting to have a Darkspawn companion of some kind.  It'd also be cool to have a pet that WASN'T a Mabari (or maybe a couple of animals, perhaps belonging to different party members).  I'd love to have a really fearsome elven archer, since we haven't had one of those yet.

I don't think it'd be a bad trend to have minor-ish characters from previous games make a return as companions as long as it makes sense.  I don't want to see previous *companions* come back as companions though, except POSSIBLY Shale if she gets re-dwarfed.

[Green Monster]

I did not like the "fill in the blank sexuality" in DA2. It made conversations awkward and led me to not like/avoid certain NPCs. I'm not opposed to letting players have whatever type of relationship they want but trying to be all things to all people, all the time makes an inferior product.

Here is a suggestion for a different way to manage preferences.
Create a early encounter (like the part of Human origin in DAO in where you can romance the maid or noble) to establish romance preferences (straight, gay, bi or neuter). Use this to customize dialog choices. For example, if someone wants to play a gay character they don't see straight/bi romance options. It is not that they don't exist, they just don't appear based on player preferences. This would not exclude having NPCs with fixed sexual preferences for plot/story purposes but would help create a more enjoyable fantasy world for the player.

[Esbatty]

Flemeth romance!

...

I mean it. Even if it means dying a Morinth-style death ... totally worth it. That or its just Flemeth manipulating the PC. I want it as an option. Seriously.

[nightscrawl]

Dejajeva wrote...

More friendship scenes and options. Especially with girls, if you're a girl. For instance, I loved being besties with Isabella, but I felt like the friendship, even with no romance, was still kind of flirty. Would have been cool to have some girl talk, and not just one line about what sex with whoever I'm having sex with is like randomly.

I certainly agree here. It was quite nice to have those girly conversations with Leliana, for example. Although I think this might be a bit unfair for the guys. What are they going to talk about? Polishing their swords? Certainly not hair and shoes, like Leliana and my Warden did.

Dejajeva wrote...

Love interests/companions without mommy-issues, daddy-issues, mage-issues, slavery-issues, templar-issues, sex-issues, sibling-issues. Listen, I'm all for backstory and deep characters, I mentioned that above. And as much as I love Anders and Fenris the constant. every. damn. conversation. ****ing. got very old very quickly, and sometimes, I just wanted a normal person who didn't have so many issues. Kind of like a male version of Aveline. But the only two normal characters, Aveline and Varric- the ones with the least amount of issues, were non-romanceable. Sometimes I thought- the sarcastic dwarf with too much chest hair is looking mighty fine right about now.

LOL. While I agree for the most part, I think that the presentation of the major companion interaction happening during/after their quests hurt the romances in this regard. By the end of the game, Hawke has known these people for almost seven years, and yet it seems like little relationship development (romance or otherwise) happened during those non-playable three year gaps.

There are scenes where Fenris or Anders would say something to me and I will just at the screen thinking "Don't they know me by now? After all of these years?"

But part of that will be helped by the next issue...

David Gaider wrote...

Dejajeva wrote...
1. I think this goes without saying, as it's pretty obvious it's a pretty standard desire for most of us on here, but in general more interaction with our companions, like in DAo. Companions in DA2 were great, but I felt like it was very...scheduled. I'd like more backstory and more banter.

This you will get, I think. It's less about having more interaction (as, in terms of overall volume, DA2 companions actually had as much interaction as DAO companions) but rather how it's presented.

Receiving "quests" to inform the player that there was new dialogue seems like it had the opposite effect of what was intended-- rather than being a convenience, some people saw it as affecting their agency. They no longer felt like they had chosen to speak to the companion, but rather that the companion had chosen to speak with them... so they could only interact with that companion on their terms. So, fair enough. Most likely what we will do is go back to the old method of letting the player initiate dialogues, and keep any telegraphing of a companion's "availability" to something more subtle (like a change in animations).

Pardon me while I go all fangirly for a moment: YAY!! *clap clap*

David Gaider wrote...

Insofar as the DA2 romances went, my only personal issue is that the Fenris and Anders romances were a little too close in their general tone-- meaning that the same kind of person was apt to like them both (though this is by no means universal, as with most romances). I'd like to have a little more divergence in the "romance type" in the future.

I find it interesting that you would think this, especially having written Fenris. The main, and most striking difference between Anders (alas I've only done girl/friendmance with him thus far) and Fenris (done all combos of girl/boy friend/rival) is that Anders is much more effusive with his affection than Fenris is, which I feel gives their romances a really different tone, even though they are both tinged by their personal issues.

Fenris never says "I love you" to Hawke. He doesn't need to, his feelings are obvious by his other statements. Even his halting statement in party banter after the prison scene in MotA: "Fenris: You frightened me; Hawke: Me?; Fenris: Before we found you, there was a moment when I... Don't do that again." It's easily one of my favorite banters in the entire game. He starts off as very guarded and gradually opens up over the course of the game, even with Hawke as only a friend (non romance). This change does not happen with Anders, who is honest with Hawke and himself about his feelings from the beginning (his personality, even as a carryover from DAA), even while realizing that it will not end well in the long run.

I guess this sort of sounds like I'm explaining your character to you. That's not my intention. My intention is to show how the player's (my own) perspective differs from the writer's (yours). Aside from the fact that they both rant at you about various things, I've never really thought of those two romances as similar, although I do, to your other point, like them both separately on their own merits.

Modifié par nightscrawl, 03 avril 2012 - 09:14 .

[Blastback]

I vote we get Shianni as a companion. Cause she was awesome. Or maybe Fergus Cousland.

[Direwolf0294]

Blastback wrote...

I vote we get Shianni as a companion. Cause she was awesome. Or maybe Fergus Cousland.

Shianni could be a really interesting romance, especially given her back story. 

[whykikyouwhy]

One of the things that I find interesting is that when we perceive bisexuality in characters, we immediate label those characters as bi. At no point in the game does any companion or NPC declare themselves to be or fit any particular label, category, adjective, etc. It's not a topic of conversation. It's not something discussed or inquired after. So for all we know, they may not see themselves along those lines. Just because someone was in a relationship with another person of the same gender does not necessarily mean that (s)he sees his/herself as bisexual. It's up to the individual to define themselves, as they see fit and if (s)he so chooses.

We're left to make assumptions. If Isabela makes references to lovers of both genders, our tendency is to say "ah, yes, bisexual." If Anders admits to (hints at) a relationship with Karl, we feel inclined to think "ah, yes, bisexual." If we do multiple playthroughs and play a Hawke of either gender and romance all of the romancable companions, and can do so successfully, we can nod and say "ah, yes, bisexual." But again, none of those companions ever states that they see themselves as such.

I don't think that perceived bisexuality cheapens the companions, because 1. it's perceived, and 2. they are all much more than their sexual identity/sexuality. Each had a unique backstory, each has quirks and qualities, each has likes and dislikes, etc. Those elements are the focal points of any dialogue because those may be more prevalent in their lives (much moreso than who they happen to bed). Their willingness to embrace a relationship with Hawke regardless of gender does not diminish who they are - it may simply mean that they are responding to the sum of who Hawke is, either regardless or inclusive of his/her gender.

When we look at romance - at the feelings involved, the pursuit of the person of affection, the willingness to move heaven and earth, cherubs singing, etc etc. - it's not really about the person's gender first and foremost (or at all). It's about what that person, that soul, does to us - that spark, that zing, that thrill, that ache. The essence of romance is about the heart, no?

Thedas doesn't so much have a hive-mind as it simply does not have the social constraints, restrictions and prejudices of our world. Huzzah to that! There are enough concerns in Thedas to warrant potential obstacles in couplings - race relations (elves, humans, dwarves, etc) and class relations. Why should Thedas, in general, turn up its collective nose at two women who are involved with each other, or two men who share a tent? Where is the logic, the justification for this sort of tension to exist? 
The ability for all romancable companions to be available to a PC of either gender is a way for us to respond to character type - to the personality of the companion. And yes, while gender is an aspect of personality, there is so much more to it. 

[esper]

whykikyouwhy wrote...

One of the things that I find interesting is that when we perceive bisexuality in characters, we immediate label those characters as bi. At no point in the game does any companion or NPC declare themselves to be or fit any particular label, category, adjective, etc. It's not a topic of conversation. It's not something discussed or inquired after. So for all we know, they may not see themselves along those lines. Just because someone was in a relationship with another person of the same gender does not necessarily mean that (s)he sees his/herself as bisexual. It's up to the individual to define themselves, as they see fit and if (s)he so chooses.

We're left to make assumptions. If Isabela makes references to lovers of both genders, our tendency is to say "ah, yes, bisexual." If Anders admits to (hints at) a relationship with Karl, we feel inclined to think "ah, yes, bisexual." If we do multiple playthroughs and play a Hawke of either gender and romance all of the romancable companions, and can do so successfully, we can nod and say "ah, yes, bisexual." But again, none of those companions ever states that they see themselves as such.

I don't think that perceived bisexuality cheapens the companions, because 1. it's perceived, and 2. they are all much more than their sexual identity/sexuality. Each had a unique backstory, each has quirks and qualities, each has likes and dislikes, etc. Those elements are the focal points of any dialogue because those may be more prevalent in their lives (much moreso than who they happen to bed). Their willingness to embrace a relationship with Hawke regardless of gender does not diminish who they are - it may simply mean that they are responding to the sum of who Hawke is, either regardless or inclusive of his/her gender.

When we look at romance - at the feelings involved, the pursuit of the person of affection, the willingness to move heaven and earth, cherubs singing, etc etc. - it's not really about the person's gender first and foremost (or at all). It's about what that person, that soul, does to us - that spark, that zing, that thrill, that ache. The essence of romance is about the heart, no?

Thedas doesn't so much have a hive-mind as it simply does not have the social constraints, restrictions and prejudices of our world. Huzzah to that! There are enough concerns in Thedas to warrant potential obstacles in couplings - race relations (elves, humans, dwarves, etc) and class relations. Why should Thedas, in general, turn up its collective nose at two women who are involved with each other, or two men who share a tent? Where is the logic, the justification for this sort of tension to exist? 
The ability for all romancable companions to be available to a PC of either gender is a way for us to respond to character type - to the personality of the companion. And yes, while gender is an aspect of personality, there is so much more to it. 

I bow, in deep respect of how well you can say it.

[Rachey187]

I really don't think all characters need to be bisexual. A character is created to be like a human and not all humans are bisexual. I have no problem with the bisexual characters, hell i've romanced a few. I just don't think it's appropriate for them all to be available to everyone. Ok, i'd be annoyed if the only gay option was a whiny brat, but i'd also be sad if characters like Alistair, Morrigan and Sebastian were gay as it goes against everything in their characters...

[AkiKishi]

Rachey187 wrote...

I really don't think all characters need to be bisexual. A character is created to be like a human and not all humans are bisexual. I have no problem with the bisexual characters, hell i've romanced a few. I just don't think it's appropriate for them all to be available to everyone. Ok, i'd be annoyed if the only gay option was a whiny brat, but i'd also be sad if characters like Alistair, Morrigan and Sebastian were gay as it goes against everything in their characters...

The reason to make everyone bisexual has very little to do with the characters.It's about casting as wide a net as possible, while appearing inclusive.
Every character you give a fixed orientation is one removed from the potential pool of LI's.

[LolaLei]

I think it would be nice to have vastly different dialogue between the PC and his/her companions depending on your PC's gender/sexual orientation and their own, mainly for the replayability factor. I like to experiment with my characters and experience all the varying dialogue. For example I made my canon Grey Warden look as much like myself as possible and had her romance Alistair, however my canon Hawke is male and romanced Anders.

[AkiKishi]

LolaLei wrote...

I think it would be nice to have vastly different dialogue between the PC and his/her companions depending on your PC's gender/sexual orientation and their own, mainly for the replayability factor. I like to experiment with my characters and experience all the varying dialogue. For example I made my canon Grey Warden look as much like myself as possible and had her romance Alistair, however my canon Hawke is male and romanced Anders.

I would hope they don't lose sight of the fact that this is a small part of the game and not a dating sim.

[LolaLei]

BobSmith101 wrote...

LolaLei wrote...

I think it would be nice to have vastly different dialogue between the PC and his/her companions depending on your PC's gender/sexual orientation and their own, mainly for the replayability factor. I like to experiment with my characters and experience all the varying dialogue. For example I made my canon Grey Warden look as much like myself as possible and had her romance Alistair, however my canon Hawke is male and romanced Anders.

I would hope they don't lose sight of the fact that this is a small part of the game and not a dating sim.

Lol thats also true, going over kill on the romance would be just as bad as not enough. I guess the trick is to get the balance just right, I think DA:O got it about right, not just in regards to romance but with character interaction, the party banter etc.

I'm also hoping the scenery for DA3 will be prettier than DA2, everything was so grey and brown... which was in keeping with the tone of the game I suppose but it got monotonous after a while, especially with the same old repeating maps and dungeons.

[esper]

Rachey187 wrote...

I really don't think all characters need to be bisexual. A character is created to be like a human and not all humans are bisexual. I have no problem with the bisexual characters, hell i've romanced a few. I just don't think it's appropriate for them all to be available to everyone. Ok, i'd be annoyed if the only gay option was a whiny brat, but i'd also be sad if characters like Alistair, Morrigan and Sebastian were gay as it goes against everything in their characters...

I am going to ask how it would detract from Alistar and Morrigan's characther if they were bi. Would Alistar be less bumbling, suddenly? Morrigan less against love? All the obstacles in the romances have nothing to do with gender. Alistar was him being unused to flirting, not really willing to have sex outside marriage before a certain point, and then the king thing. Morrigans was her aversion towards love and of course the dark ritual.

I don't see how them being open to both genders would detract anything from their characthers.  

[VampOrchid]

esper wrote...

Rachey187 wrote...

I really don't think all characters need to be bisexual. A character is created to be like a human and not all humans are bisexual. I have no problem with the bisexual characters, hell i've romanced a few. I just don't think it's appropriate for them all to be available to everyone. Ok, i'd be annoyed if the only gay option was a whiny brat, but i'd also be sad if characters like Alistair, Morrigan and Sebastian were gay as it goes against everything in their characters...

I am going to ask how it would detract from Alistar and Morrigan's characther if they were bi. Would Alistar be less bumbling, suddenly? Morrigan less against love? All the obstacles in the romances have nothing to do with gender. Alistar was him being unused to flirting, not really willing to have sex outside marriage before a certain point, and then the king thing. Morrigans was her aversion towards love and of course the dark ritual.

I don't see how them being open to both genders would detract anything from their characthers.  

Hmmm I see your point here....

Although I am all for the bi options in the game (even though I don't use it) I can't see Morrigan or Alistair going both ways. Just like if they do put Cullen in, I could't see him swinging either. Anders I saw it, it made sense. It fit his story I guess.

On another note. I would also like to know what happened with the Grey warden and Hawke. I don't need to know great details. Just what the hell happened. Seekers say my Grey warden is gone...no she not, she's queen lol. My amell, I would love to know where she went. My Hawke, if with Anders, well she ran or corse...If with Seb, well I thought there was going to be some major fighting going on with Kirkland and Starhaven...but yeah, maybe they got married and had little sebs...but I will never know...and that saddens me. So having some back stories to our mains would be nice.

Also, darkspawns...so what's going on with them...really.

It would be kind of cool to play a low class mage in Tervinter, trying to make their way up. Or to play a Templar recruit making their way through the ranks....something to that effect.

[SirGladiator]

There isn't anything in Morrigan's character that says she couldn't romance a female, its stated quite clearly that she (and Flemeth) slept with many Templars, and Templars are certainly not a male-only profession, so its far more likely that she's slept with women than that she hasn't. I know she romanced my female Warden anyway, via a mod . It was quite believable and certainly didn't seem against any part of her character.

I like the DA2 method of romance, it doesn't make the characters 'all bisexual', it just makes them all available, that way everybody can romance whoever they like. Its obviously a million times better than the bizarre method of ME3, where female players wanted to romance the same teammates that male players could, so instead they created some non-teammate characters for us, as if the world would end if they simply gave us what we wanted. DA2 is so much nicer, everybody gets to enjoy the romances just exactly the way they want, everybody wins and everybody is happy.

Another important aspect of the romances, is I'd like them to be a bit more challenging. The Isabella romance was much better than the Merrill one in that regard, you really had to do things the right way to achieve it. If Merrill's romance had been a bit more challenging it would've been even better.

So overall I'd say I like the DA2 romance model, hopefully DA3 will build on that and be the best yet!

[Mmw04014]

esper wrote...

Rachey187 wrote...

I really don't think all characters need to be bisexual. A character is created to be like a human and not all humans are bisexual. I have no problem with the bisexual characters, hell i've romanced a few. I just don't think it's appropriate for them all to be available to everyone. Ok, i'd be annoyed if the only gay option was a whiny brat, but i'd also be sad if characters like Alistair, Morrigan and Sebastian were gay as it goes against everything in their characters...

I am going to ask how it would detract from Alistar and Morrigan's characther if they were bi. Would Alistar be less bumbling, suddenly? Morrigan less against love? All the obstacles in the romances have nothing to do with gender. Alistar was him being unused to flirting, not really willing to have sex outside marriage before a certain point, and then the king thing. Morrigans was her aversion towards love and of course the dark ritual.

I don't see how them being open to both genders would detract anything from their characthers.  

It's hard to look back and say "What if they were bi?" because they just aren't. When I think about it, no it wouldn't take away from their overall characters, but, because of hindsight, I do think it would take away from their character because them being straight IS part of their character now.

[Rachey187]

esper wrote...

Rachey187 wrote...

I really don't think all characters need to be bisexual. A character is created to be like a human and not all humans are bisexual. I have no problem with the bisexual characters, hell i've romanced a few. I just don't think it's appropriate for them all to be available to everyone. Ok, i'd be annoyed if the only gay option was a whiny brat, but i'd also be sad if characters like Alistair, Morrigan and Sebastian were gay as it goes against everything in their characters...

I am going to ask how it would detract from Alistar and Morrigan's characther if they were bi. Would Alistar be less bumbling, suddenly? Morrigan less against love? All the obstacles in the romances have nothing to do with gender. Alistar was him being unused to flirting, not really willing to have sex outside marriage before a certain point, and then the king thing. Morrigans was her aversion towards love and of course the dark ritual.

I don't see how them being open to both genders would detract anything from their characthers.  

Being bisexual just doesn't suit Alistair's character... it really just doesn't. It's not a bad thing, i don't understand why it has to be? I did't say it would detract from their characters, it wouldn't, it just wouldn't suit them.
Morrigan i suppose it would suit, but she's like an ice queen, i find it difficult to imagine her romancing anyone. 
I'm not sure where you read me saying it would detract from their characters, but i most certainly didn't. I'm not against bisexuality in any way shape or form... i just don't understand why every character has to be open to everyone, even if it doesn't suit their characters.... It just doesn't make sense and i don't want Bioware to Implement it!