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Difference in Gameplay Mechanics between Gold, Silver and Bronze


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#1
Lynx7725

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Didn't see any documentation on the difference in gameplay difficulties. Thought worthwhile to write it down so that people know what they are getting into.

I personally have bias against Gold, but this is an info thread. Please try to keep it objective and clean. 

What stays the same across all levels
  • Weapon damage stays consistent as an absolute number throughout the three difficulties. The same Revenant you're totting around will do the same damage to the enemy no matter the difficulty. This means weapon damage does NOT scale.
  • Player class abilities stays consistent throughout the three difficulties. They do not scale unless otherwise indicated below. As a lot of class abilities are based on % increase of weapon or power base damage, that just means your class ability to kill things decreases as you go up in difficulty.
  • Powers (Biotic and Tech) that has a number assoicated with the damage does not change across difficulties. This is not referring to Biotic/ Tech Explosion/ Burst, but the base power. <-- not 100% sure.
  • Biotic Explosion damage stays consistent as a percentage throughout the three difficulties. The same Warp-Throw Biotic Explosion will do the same percentage damage to the same mob no matter the difficulty. This means Biotic Explosion scales.
  • Tech Burst damage also stays consistent as a percentage. However, for Tech Bursts based around Incinerate and Cyro, you have to kill the mob so the consistent damage number of the base Tech Power becomes more of an issue. Overload-ED combos need not kill and is such more aligned with Botic Explosions.
  • Mob protection types does not change across difficulties. If a mob in Bronze does not have shields, it won't have shields in Gold. The strength of the protection (e.g., shield strength) may change but the prescence/ abscence does not.
  • The protection offered by armour against Biotics does not appear to change across difficulties.
What changes
  • Enemy HP and Shields changes across difficulties, in some cases dramatically. For exact values, please refer to Tangster's excellent thread linked in my sig. This can be tweaked by Bioware as needed. Effect: Tougher Mobs.
  • Additional Enemy behaviour may change across difficulties. E.g., Geth Hunter speed is increased for Silver and above. What exactly can change is not known. This can be tweaked by Bioware as needed. Effect: Mobs have different behaviour on different level. Typically, higher levels have nastier behaviour/ ability.
  • "Armour Gate": Enemy with armour gets better armour protection as you scale up. Armour subtracts a fix amount from weapon damage to a minimum of 5 damage. This is currently believed to be 50 at Gold, 30 at Silver and 15 at Bronze. Bioware probably can adjust this as they see fit. Effect: This means automatic weapons tend to have lesser ability to harm armoured opponents in higher levels.
  • Related: AP mod, specifically, the Piercing effect reduces armour by percentage. That means the effect scales with difficulty, and becomes increasingly important in higher levels. This is not the same as the Penetration effect, which governs how much cover you can shoot through to hit an enemy. Effect: pack those AP mods, guys.
  • "Shield Gate": Enemy with Shields gets some damage reduction when the shields are depleted. Hits that deplete the shield will lose a certain percentage of damage before the remaining is rolled over into the next level. It is known to be 100% in Gold, 75% in Silver and 50% in Bronze. Effect: High powered weapons cannot one-shot-kill (OSK) shielded enemies on Gold. The shield must be depleted first.
  • Also, enemy shield/ barrier recharge rates are improved; not sure if player shield/ barrier recharge rates are improved. Effect: You have less time after a shield/ barrier comes down to kill a mob. If you let an enemy disappear behind cover, his shields may regenerate to give you a new set of problems. This is particularly severe in Gold, as the mobs have more shields, more HP, faster recharge rates, and "shield gate". Combined together, it takes significantly more firepower to drop something that's shielded.
  • Mob spawns per Wave/ Map is also substantially upped in higher difficulties. Where you might get one Boss in certain waves, you will have multiples (2 or more in Silver, reputedly 4 or more in Gold). Mid-tier bosses will also spawn more per spawn. Frequency of spawn is unknown if affected.
  • To elaborate on the Mob Spawn further, each wave apparently gets a budget to spend on mobs; each mob cost the same across difficulties, but as noted earlier, each mob typically has more HP or shields as the difficulty increases. This wave budget also correspondingly increases as the difficulty ups; the minimum in Gold exceeds the maximum in Bronze. Effect: More mobs, more tough mobs.
  • There appears to be a limit on number of mobs and number of boss mobs. However, this is at the moment speculation and observed behaviour, not hard known design parameters. Maximum number in a spawn may be 8, but number of spawns per wave, when the spawn recur, whether difficulty adjusts these rates, etc. are all unknown.
  • Reloads of Ammo and Grenades from boxes are lower as you go up higher in difficulty. Effect: less ammo to work with.
  • Reloads of Ammo across Waves also are lower as you go up higher in difficulty. Effect: harder to replenish expended ammo.
  • Health replenishment across Waves may not be full as you go up higher in difficulty. In Gold, health do not fully replenish between Waves. Effect: easier to die as time goes on.
All I can think of at the moment. Let me know if more things pop up, I'll edit this post.

Modifié par Lynx7725, 03 avril 2012 - 10:53 .


#2
Phatose

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You should probably clarify about Mobs. There are 2 settings on each mob/wave: How many total will spawn that wave, and how many can be active at once.

All combos are percentage based, according to the bioware devs. And tech burst doesn't require a lethal attack - fire explosion and cryo explosion do, but the electric tech combo does not.

#3
Lynx7725

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Updated on the Tech Bursts.

Can expand on the Mobs item? I've never been able to track the total number of mobs per wave, and for objective waves it's constant spawning, so I'm not sure how that works out.

One thing is I'm not sure if the constant spawning is triggered when the first wave falls below a certain number, or when the first wave is destroyed, or just by timer. Certainly there are times when the waves pile up and become unmanageable. But if it's triggered by first wave size, then it might make sense to have suppression rather than killing while someone caps the objectives.

#4
HolyAvenger

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With regards to boss spawns...I believe here's a cap on number of enemies per wave and number of enemies active at a time i.e. Gold with Reapers will spawn X Banshees total, but Y at a time.

X could be 2, 4 or 6 whereas Y will be 1, 2 or 4...

Modifié par HolyAvenger, 02 avril 2012 - 04:48 .


#5
RiflemanUK

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Lynx7725 wrote...

Updated on the Tech Bursts.

Can expand on the Mobs item? I've never been able to track the total number of mobs per wave, and for objective waves it's constant spawning, so I'm not sure how that works out.


This is the rage of points for each difficulty, with the lowest and highest figures being used as the budget as the waves progress.

Image IPB

And this is how much each unit costs.

Image IPB

For Cerberus there is also these squads which costs nothing but I'm still looking for what controls these.

Image IPB

Modifié par RiflemanUK, 02 avril 2012 - 04:56 .


#6
Lynx7725

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RiflemanUK: OOOh that's interesting. Let me crunch through some implications. It's very good intel. For one, it tells us that they make the budget for each wave bigger, but doesn't discount each mob. Makes it more consistent. But a wave of 6 to 18 Banshees is.. horrifying. To hear from your speakers...

#7
S9ilent

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Shield gate is 100 75 50 (In the game play mechanics thread http://social.biowar...2648/1#10321708)



I *think* armour is 50 35 15 but I can't seem to find the page any more (50 is correct thou) (Also I don't think anyone refers to it is the armour gate usually it's just damage reduction/armour piercing. Only shields refer to "gates")



Depending on race, wave level, and difficulty the enemies spawn differently. There are a few different rules to this. (Everything is per unit type)
1. Maximum *finite* alive at any one time.
2. Maximum *finite* spawns per level
3. Maximum *infinite* alive at any one time.
e.g.
On bronze, there will be a max of 1 atlas on a wave
on silver you might get 2 atlas' at a time (up to a maximum of 4)
on gold you will get 1 infinite atlas, +1 finite atlas (with 4 more reinforcing it)

Side note, these are not accurate numbers and just guess work, but from the games I've played this seems to be true. I have not tested whether or not atlas are truly infinite on gold (I suspect I will not be able to destroy them quick enough..)

#8
RiflemanUK

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It's more because the points range is so small on bronze there isn't enough points left for another atlas after you take out the first one and some of the smaller mobs that got in the way.

At least I assume so.

The only thing I found for max number of enemies was 8 and I think it's pretty consistent across the difficulty levels with mobs spawning out of sight as soon as one is killed, things like swarmers are counted as "pets" so shouldn't add to the max enemies.

Modifié par RiflemanUK, 02 avril 2012 - 05:05 .


#9
HolyAvenger

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Yes but Wave 10 on Gold will never spawn 18 Banshees. How are the numbers of each unit type controlled?


Edit: Ah I see.

Modifié par HolyAvenger, 02 avril 2012 - 05:05 .


#10
Lynx7725

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Just random thought.. the limit is probably a console's maximum number of objects it can handle. So a Wave will have a budget, determine its first wave (piling up to the maximum number). In Bronze one wave is typically going to be it, but Gold's bigger budget almost certainly impiles multiple waves.

I believe as you kill the number of mobs, the system will buy one more mob into a waiting pool, and at a certain point (maybe the maximum the console can support) it'll release the number as a spawn into an uncapped spawn point.

There's probably additional constraints on number of mooks, mid bosses and bosses per pool.

That nasty implication? If RiflemanUK can find the numbers in a config file, that means Bioware can tweak it any time. That's probably where the reported constant husks wave come from -- hacked copy. If Gold suddenly become overwhelming, someone's probably tweaked the budget...

#11
RiflemanUK

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Yeah I assume if you changed the cost of husks or increased the max amount of enemies that would be where the unlimited waves would come from.

MP really needs to force server-side settings.

#12
TANK 2old2play

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Fighting Cerberus on all maps on gold i can say that the movement speed of troops is a lot higher even from silver.

Also someone noticed that between rounds your health doesn't fully regen on gold.

#13
Lynx7725

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Oh right, health doesn't regen fully between rounds and ammo from ammo bins are lower too. I'll update that later (also to act as a bumper. :) )

#14
Iodine

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Edit: Horribly beaten on WaveCost, combatzone mechanics, and wavepoint ranges typing it all out, damn you and your efficient screenshots. The rest of it was just excessive detail about individual wave's spawns and objectives/combatzone stuff I didn't feel like filtering out, and someone else can do it more concisely. :V

Modifié par Iodine, 02 avril 2012 - 05:47 .


#15
Rite All Wrong

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Lynx7725 wrote...
But a wave of 6 to 18 Banshees is.. horrifying...


Haha, that would be so epic.

Player1: "Banshees from LZ"
Player2: "Sh**! How many?"
Player2: "Dude, how many?"
Player1 " Hang on, I'm counting"


Anyway: The ammount of granades per box seems to change. Not sure how exactly though. In games where I'm the only one using them I tend to get a complete refill on bronze, while it's usually 1 per box on higher difficulties. It might also take longer to refill but that just might be me needing them more.

Modifié par Rite All Wrong, 02 avril 2012 - 05:38 .


#16
Rite All Wrong

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Sorry about this, inteded to edit.

Modifié par Rite All Wrong, 02 avril 2012 - 05:37 .


#17
Lynx7725

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Updated first post with info from the thread.

Rite All Wrong: Eh, if the guy is still counting.. should really just pull a Cobra out and start shooting. Going to be Turkey Shoot. :)

#18
Lynx7725

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Hah bumpity excuse. BTW I shouldn't need to tell people that things like headshot bonus, class bonus that are based off weapon damage does not change? To be honest, that just means class abilities don't really scale with difficulty.

#19
Klokos

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Regarding shields : enemies start regenerating them faster on higher difficulties, I don't know if it really matter.

#20
Corzair

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Klokos wrote...

Regarding shields : enemies start regenerating them faster on higher difficulties, I don't know if it really matter.


It does when you're using a sniper rifle (Specially on Gold). 

#21
Lynx7725

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Updated with the Shield Recharge rate. I'll bump it once more tomorrow, then let this thread die. No interest means no point.. those who want to read can follow the link in my sig.

#22
Lynx7725

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Last bumpity. Updated with AP mod information. Piercing is percentage based, so it scales with difficulty. AR with AP mod becomes more interesting at high level, since at level V they reduce the armor effectiveness by 65%. Suddenly that Armour Gate of 50 becomes 17.

With AP mod, even a Geth Pulse Rifle X at 27.4 points per round is doing 10 per round.. and at 500 RPM, that's emptying a clip of 90 (Mag V) in about 10 secs for 900 points of damage. Of course, that's IF you can hold it steady enough to deliver all of it into the target zone.

#23
S9ilent

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The following thread has more info (super info thread??)
http://social.biowar...ndex/10712294/1
The armour damage reduction on that thread says it is actually 50 30 15 (not 50 35 15 as I previously thought)

#24
Lynx7725

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Yeah I drew some info from there too. This thread is more specifically to highlight the difference in levels though, consolidating it.

Will update the values, thing is this is basically adjustable by Bioware on the fly.. I think I'm just happy that BW didn't decide to double the values for Gold. That'd render even more guns useless.

Come to think of it Armour also protects against Tech and Biotics, right?

#25
David Chiou

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Lynx really did a good job summarizing this! Good observation!