Lord Aesir wrote...
Sajuro wrote...
Lord Aesir wrote...
dreman9999 wrote...
Lord Aesir wrote...
dreman9999 wrote...
Lord Aesir wrote...
dreman9999 wrote...*snip*
So how do you get around Vendetta being able to detect indoctrinated individuals? That's the point where it falls down to me. All I've encountered in respose are baseless excuses about partial indoctrination and unreliability of it's detection capability, with zero evidence.
How do people miss the fact that the prothean VI is the same Vi on the prothean crusible project that was stopped because of indoctrinated sleeper agents.
Use some deductive resoning.
How can something that fail to detect something then be dependible to detect something now. And shepard is in the process of indoctrination, which has states, so he would not be detected.
What VI on the Prothean Crucible project? What are you talking about?
The one you find on thessia. I thought you where taking about the same VI...Even then
Vendetta still say the prothean were betryed by indctrinated sleeper agents any way. The fact that everyone is not being lead by the prothean empire now is a clear sign that the VI are not dependible for detecting people ing the prosses of indoctrination.
You're assuming it failed to detect them, or that they didn't go out of their way to avoid being close enough to detect. This is all assuming it was even on the old crucible project. This isn't proof of non reliability.
If they were able to bypass prothean security that was scanning for indoctrination wether they were staying far away or not then the VIs failed in their job to detect indoctrination.
Again, suppositions galore. Was there prothean security scanning for indoctrination? As Javik said, everything was chaos. Even then, perhaps, knowing of such security, they were able to bypass it. This is not indicstion of anything unless you can prove such systems were in place or even that the indoctrinated faction had to be that close to the project to sabotage it.
My other problem with the IT theory is that Shepard apparently makes a jump from partial indoctriation with minimal side effects to full blown hallucinations and mental delusion instantly, entirely unheard of.
My two cents...
If IT is to be used, and that's a sizable "if", it seems to me that Shepard was not indoctrinated in a matter of minutes or seconds, but gradually through the game. We see Shepard fighting the indoctrination attempts most heavily in the last twenty minutes, during a time when she (I play FemShep) is closest in proximity to Harbinger, but that doesn't mean that Harbinger indoctrinated her within minutes. It was a gradual process, possibly spanning across multiple games and dlc, that still has not been completed in the time from when Shepard is lazered up until the end of the game. In the beginning of ME3 indoctrination is characterized by small hallucinations, but at the end it is a real struggle. This implies that the reaper hold is gradually increasing the whole time. Just because the moment that you choose a "blue" or "green" ending is the moment of full indoctrination, doesn't mean that it hasn't been leading up to that for days, or hours, or longer in the Mass Effect Universe.
Secondly, I think you guys are getting really granular in your subjective definitions of "chaos" and not looking at how chaos is defined in the game. There's another thread where a community member does a terrific job of describing the two ways "chaos" is defined in the Mass Effect Universe.
Drake-Shepard writes:
"Javik talks about synthetics surpassing organics, using the same key words; created, creators, chaos. This cannot be a coincidence.
In the quote above, Javik refers to the organics as the chaos.
However, Starchild refers to the reapers as his solution to 'chaos'...He goes on to say the created rebelling against their creators. So we assume here that starchild means that the act of synthetic rebellion is the chaos...So we have 2 ME non-compatible definitions of chaos ????!!
chaos = organics >>>>>>>>> or/and<<<<<<<< chaos = synthetics killing organics for good
or do we..."
So this person's supposition is that the "Starchild" is actually using the word "chaos" in the same way that Javik is and referring to organics, and by eliminating "chaos" the reapers are referring to eliminating "organics" and not to the more altruistic interpretation of ending a cycle of chaos that is spurned by synthetic rebellion. More fodder for IT.
But my point is not that, it is that the game defines chaos in 2 ways:
1) synthetic rebellion against organics is "chaos"
2) organic life is spontaneous and illogical, arbitrary when compared to the advanced programming of AIs, ie chaos.
You guys are debating the semantics of how "chaotic" it got on the ground for the Protheans, meaning did they have a cohesive plan or didn't they, but that's a subjective definition of chaos as we know it in the day to day. Not the same "chaos" they are referring to in ME3.
By definition, just my existence, sitting here typing this message would be consider chaos by virtue of ME3 definition # 2, listed above.
Just some food for thought.
Modifié par AllegedVixEo, 03 avril 2012 - 05:16 .
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