140 réponses à ce sujet

[Grasich]

MisterJB wrote...

Heinzmann01 wrote...

The issue with Kai Leng is simply that he can't fight by himself. He always needs a full Cerberus Squad and gun ship to back him up. I think that speaks for itself on who would win such a fight.

Vasir had rocket drones and mercenaries to back her up.

Sure, but they did basically nothing. Vasir is a formidable opponent without any help, Leng is a joke without help.

[MisterJB]

Grasich wrote...
Sure, but they did basically nothing. Vasir is a formidable opponent without any help, Leng is a joke without help.

How much of an opponent Vasir is depends on how good of a player you are. Personally, I had more trouble with the rocket drones.

Unless you are talking about story wise in which case, Kai Leng is, objectivelly, the more formidable opponent.

[Tommytsunami]

Warden130 wrote...

Well Kai Leng did manage to beat Shepard, while Vasir didn't...

Kai Leng DID NOT beat Shepard... his drop ship did. Leng on his own is (at least from the game) is fairly weak. He was all talk. Vasir (while only being in the first half of the Shadow Broker dlc) was much better in my opinion. Even what little screen time she had was more memorable than Leng.

[Homey C-Dawg]

They both ran from Shepard.

Vasir all the way btw.

[Taritu]

Vasir if you didn't read the books, which I didn't. I felt bad about her dying, too. Sort of hated Shepard's speech options on that one. I get why she did what she did, and would have just shipped her off to a hospital while I took out the Shadow Broker. Then the new Shadow Broker would have a Specter asset.

It was also nice to see a Spectre who was a real badass. Jondam Bau was ok, but he shouldn't have needed Shepard's help to deal with one thug.

[Grasich]

Taritu wrote...

Vasir if you didn't read the books, which I didn't. I felt bad about her dying, too. Sort of hated Shepard's speech options on that one. I get why she did what she did, and would have just shipped her off to a hospital while I took out the Shadow Broker. Then the new Shadow Broker would have a Specter asset.

It was also nice to see a Spectre who was a real badass. Jondam Bau was ok, but he shouldn't have needed Shepard's help to deal with one thug.

Agreed! I really wanted the option to keep her alive in return for her helping out Liara as an agent.

[Simotech]

Tela Vasir

I hate Leng >

[ogtrplganggrl]

Vasir hands down!

[Hospitallar]

I'd vote Vasir but people have made points about about cinematic, strengths/weaknesses/contexts/books.

But I'm just saying, if I were TIM and I found out my "best" assassin just failed his mission because of a terminally ill Drell, well, it's time to get a new "best" assassin.

Really enjoyed gutting the Leng, though. Most satisfying renegade option ever.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Vasir was simply a better villain than Kai Leng. She felt like an actual character and a credible threat that opposed Shepard.

[CrazyCatDude]

MisterJB wrote...

Grasich wrote...
Kai Leng wasn't a greater opponent, he was the more apt at using Plot Armor, and cinematics to his advantage.

If we are going to deny a character's strengths or weaknesses by calling it "plot armor", we migh as well do the same for everyone.

Tela Vasir crashed her car, lost gallons of blood was still able to fight. Plot armor.
Tali kills Legion with a simple knife. Cinematics.
Thane kills armored mercs with his bare hands. Cinematics.

Yeah, Kai Leng wasn't an hard boss fight. He was still one of Shepard's greatest nemesis in the entire series.

The thing is, Vasir and Saren both have cut scene immunity in places, without really coming off as having 'plot armor'.  In the fight on Virmire, Saren was a reasonably tough fight, and at a specific point, cut scene immunity gives him the upper hand, but it only lasts a moment, and even though he gets away and Shepard looses a crew member, it never feels cheap.  Sure, people have been telling you Saren's a bad ass for most of the game, but when he shows up, he acts like it.  He takes the high ground, he pins you down with grenades, guns and biotics, and there's an actual emotional investment in the fight, because you've just learned exactly what's at stake, and you have that fantastic dialog exchange before the fight starts.  Similar to the fight in the Councel chambers if you don't talk him into suicide.

Vasir, on the other hand, actually puts Shepard on the freaking deck.  Something I don't think any other boss in the game had done at that point.  Then, she gets away with the Shadow Broker Data.  Yet, it *never* feels cheap.  It never feels like "oh, Vasir has inpenatrible plot armor."  She fights dirty, she fights underhanding, and she fights smart, but there's never a point (at least until the dialog about Cerberus) where it feels like Shepard is afflicted with cut scene stupidity.

In *both* confrontations with Kai Leng, prior to Chronos station, Shepard has nothing but cut scene stupidity.  Two squadmates with me on the Citadel, Kai Leng can't keep the Councellor between himself and all three of us if we spread out.  Oh, and on Thessia, why did I not get a Renegade interrupt to put a bullet in him the *instant* he showed up?  I just stand there talking to TIM long a idiot?  That's why people complain about plot armor.

[Calibrations Expert]

Real Spectre vs. fake ninja

[Lord Stark]

Awww poor Kai Leng, Vasir owns him all across the deck, heaven forbid the Shadow Broker

[Stanley Woo]

No vs. threads here, please.

End of line.

[Wrathra]

Vasir. Loved Vasir. She was an amazing antagonist.