423 réponses à ce sujet

[shnellegaming]

I actually don't mind the relay network getting blown up.  I think civilization has the technology and know-how to build its own mass relays after a decade or so.  Id like to know this for a fact though instead of just guessing.

My problem is that there is too much evidence pointing to the fact that Earth and all other planets inside a Relay system are doomed.

Yes you say it could be some kind of other energy but we dont know for sure.  The only thing we have to compare it to is the Arrival DLC.  So saying, "well I think they didn't blow up." isn't good enough for me.  I have to have irrefutable proof that Earth will be ok, and all those other star systems will be ok.  And when I say ok, I mean in the scope of the people living there CURRENTLY.  They will recover and be able to start rebuilding and not be in under chaos, starvation and despair.

That is what my Shepard gave her life for.  If those people and squadmates aren't ok then her death was meaningless.

Modifié par shnellegaming, 05 avril 2012 - 05:36 .

[Funkdrspot]

I guess I'll come back tomorrow to answer some more but just off what I skimmed, 9/10ths seem to want to refer back to the codex/arrival/alpha relay despite that whole issue already having been addressed and those same people seem to conveniently gloss over the fact that there are 3 different 'destroy' endings that CLEARLY show the crucible turning earth into a fireball, destroying a few things, then destroying JUST the reapers.

I would have expected better than the same ol circular logic of pointing back to the codex which will OBVIOUSLY not have some asterisk or contingent about a 'what if' on alternatives for blowing up a mass relay when a mass relay has only been blown up once this cycle and a crucible has NEVER ever been used in countless cycles.

And I don't know why is being brought up. None of you guys talking now were saying that about the relays, FTL travel, element zero, biotics or tons of other stuff that are impossible under our current understanding of physics. Yet when the ending doesn't end the way you want: "DUR HUR SPACE MAGIC ITS NOT POSSIBLE BY CURRENT PHYSICS!"

Modifié par Funkdrspot, 05 avril 2012 - 06:06 .

[Area42T]

Lots of Speculation for Everyone!

[SilentK]

shnellegaming wrote...

I actually don't mind the relay network getting blown up.  I think civilization has the technology and know-how to build its own mass relays after a decade or so.  Id like to know this for a fact though instead of just guessing.

My problem is that there is too much evidence pointing to the fact that Earth and all other planets inside a Relay system are doomed.

Yes you say it could be some kind of other energy but we dont know for sure.  The only thing we have to compare it to is the Arrival DLC.  So saying, "well I think they didn't blow up." isn't good enough for me.  I have to have irrefutable proof that Earth will be ok, and all those other star systems will be ok.  And when I say ok, I mean in the scope of the people living there CURRENTLY.  They will recover and be able to start rebuilding and not be in under chaos, starvation and despair.

That is what my Shepard gave her life for.  If those people and squadmates aren't ok then her death was meaningless.

Well, earth was at the heart of the battle. I guess that being the location for a major galactic war could make it a bit crazy. Hmm... I don't think earth will come out looking pretty but it seems like the reapers targeted major cities first. There should be some corners of the earth that perhaps made it. But yes, humanity probably has it better on some garden colony planet than earth itself. I'm not too concerned about the loss of the relays either, it wasn't all tech that disappered. There are still machines and knowledge. And there will be some contingency planfor the growing of food and such. When going to earth you found that datapad with the plan on how to best evacuate people. Some little comitte has had it as their major assignment to make sure that that knowledge is stored and easily accessed. Today we have a bank for seeds and crops, I am sure that they will have things planned as well. 

I wasn't expecting to see a big epilouge on what happened with everyone afterwards. It would have been nice, but they didn't do it for DAII so I was not holding my breath. But I still felt like this was a victory for my FemShep. Took the destroy-ending with her. She would have soldiered on, even if she was the only one left. Not having her team alive would not change anything. It would make her few last hours grimmer, but she would have done it none the less. Just like she left Kaidan on Horizon, perhaps she could have gone back to the alliance at that point. But she stayed with Cerberus in order to attack them beyond the Omega 4-relay. I don't feel that it would have been a waste if her team wasn't alive in the end. It would be sad, but her goal was always to save humanity in some way. And that she achieved. Now, if there was any way to get her back to her love, I would happily take it, I would jump through all the hoopes. But not having it, doesn't devalue saving all organic life out there.

[ZajoE38]

It is simple - mass relays didn't blow up like the Alpha relay. They just crumbled and released harmless energy from Crucible. Though if it's harmless depends on how well was it built (EMS).

And second thing - mass relays network can be built again and maybe even fast. Don't ask how, if you don't know it you are not up for the ME. One hint - Reapers and/or Citadel conduit

[KingKhan03]

ZajoE38 wrote...

It is simple - mass relays didn't blow up like the Alpha relay. They just crumbled and released harmless energy from Crucible. Though if it's harmless depends on how well was it built (EMS).

And second thing - mass relays network can be built again and maybe even fast. Don't ask how, if you don't know it you are not up for the ME. One hint - Reapers and/or Citadel conduit

True but it would probably take some time and resources which may be a little depleted right now seeing as though the giant fleet suffered heavy losses and fought a giant reaper war.

[Meltemph]

The relays blowing up and being able to break-up part of the normandy, going at minimum FTL speeds... Well I shouldn't have to explain WHY that would implicate that every world that experienced that wave, should be stripped clean like a massive explosion.

Am I the only one who noticed this? Or was bothered by this?

[yukon fire]

Personally I'd be more worried about that 40km long space station (the citadel) breaking up over earth, something similar killed the dinos

[yukon fire]

Meltemph wrote...

The relays blowing up and being able to break-up part of the normandy, going at minimum FTL speeds... Well I shouldn't have to explain WHY that would implicate that every world that experienced that wave, should be stripped clean like a massive explosion.

Am I the only one who noticed this? Or was bothered by this?

There is no doubt that there has to be serious force behind that wave

[Meltemph]

yukon fire wrote...

Personally I'd be more worried about that 40km long space station (the citadel) breaking up over earth, something similar killed the dinos

I dunno, I'd say a wave moving at FTL speeds that could push something going as fast as the normandy, kinda spells doom for most of the planets in the galaxy, unless magically, that force explosion only effected teh normandy. 

[yukon fire]

Meltemph wrote...

yukon fire wrote...

Personally I'd be more worried about that 40km long space station (the citadel) breaking up over earth, something similar killed the dinos

I dunno, I'd say a wave moving at FTL speeds that could push something going as fast as the normandy, kinda spells doom for most of the planets in the galaxy, unless magically, that force explosion only effected teh normandy. 

Its gonna be a bad day for someone somewhere

Just like that captain was telling his marines not to "eyeball it" on the citadel in me2

[IanPolaris]

ZajoE38 wrote...

It is simple - mass relays didn't blow up like the Alpha relay. They just crumbled and released harmless energy from Crucible. Though if it's harmless depends on how well was it built (EMS).

And second thing - mass relays network can be built again and maybe even fast. Don't ask how, if you don't know it you are not up for the ME. One hint - Reapers and/or Citadel conduit

Not available.  The citadel is either under Reaper control (control ending) or destroyed which means there is NO Mass Relay Hub and NO working examples of functional mass relays available.

Please don't tell us to "know" the ME universe until you do the homework yourself.  The fact is the Protheans were far more technologically advanced than any civilization in this cycle and even they just BARELY were able to make a simple small-scale (and limited) prototype on Illos ... and that was only possible because they could connect it directly to the heart of the relay network.  After ME3 (unless you think it's all in Shepard's head which I am inclined to think), the races don't even have that and don't have anywhere near the resources needed to maintain the technology they have let alone develope new ones (like mass relays).

-Polaris

[Big_Choppa]

No hope? Yeah, that's why.

[Zolt51]

yukon fire wrote...

Personally I'd be more worried about that 40km long space station (the citadel) breaking up over earth, something similar killed the dinos

Already discussed multiple times. Why do you think it will fall down, and what will be the impact velocity if it does? Even an approximate figure is ok.

[ZajoE38]

We need to realize, that by winning the war with Reapers, it's not important what will happen in next weeks, months, years, decades. But in thousands and millions of years. The ending represented the bigger picture. And ok if someone still don't understand - dead Reapers will be salvaged, their technology will benefit in rebuilding the galaxy and mass relay network. We can for example use their advanced FTL, allowing us to travel fast enough to reach Illium from Earth in a lifespan. Meaning that rebuilding relays won't take millennium but maybe a century of few. Should Normandy has active stasis pods, there is even chance for crew to leave that planet I know this is speculations and Bioware will never release content in that far future in ME universe, so we will never know what will happen, but it is very likely that it will end up like this.

[IanPolaris]

Zolt51 wrote...

yukon fire wrote...

Personally I'd be more worried about that 40km long space station (the citadel) breaking up over earth, something similar killed the dinos

Already discussed multiple times. Why do you think it will fall down, and what will be the impact velocity if it does? Even an approximate figure is ok.

Remember the citedal itself is a giant mass-relay and thus a giant mass effect engine.  Having it explode in low earth orbit.....problematic.

Consider that if the shockwave is strong enough to disable the Normandy moving away from it at FTL, then what it does to the fleet in the Sol System and earth itself is again....problematic.

-Polaris

[IanPolaris]

ZajoE38 wrote...

We need to realize, that by winning the war with Reapers, it's not important what will happen in next weeks, months, years, decades. But in thousands and millions of years. The ending represented the bigger picture. And ok if someone still don't understand - dead Reapers will be salvaged, their technology will benefit in rebuilding the galaxy and mass relay network. We can for example use their advanced FTL, allowing us to travel fast enough to reach Illium from Earth in a lifespan. Meaning that rebuilding relays won't take millennium but maybe a century of few. Should Normandy has active stasis pods, there is even chance for crew to leave that planet I know this is speculations and Bioware will never release content in that far future in ME universe, so we will never know what will happen, but it is very likely that it will end up like this.

To quote Jack, [deleted] that!  I am a fan of the Mass Effect universe as it is.  Destroying the mass relay network destroys that universe.  It feels like a big smelly middle finger erected by Bioware to it's customers.

-Polaris

[s.nebulous]

The relays, if anything, hindered the races coming up with their own means of long distance FTL travel. They will eventually either replicate the technology, or design completely new means of travel. But with the mass relays there is no incentive to produce these new propulsion techniques. 
Even the current non mass relay FTL, allows the exploration and exploitation of an entire star cluster.

Modifié par s.nebulous, 05 avril 2012 - 08:25 .

[yukon fire]

Zolt51 wrote...

yukon fire wrote...

Personally I'd be more worried about that 40km long space station (the citadel) breaking up over earth, something similar killed the dinos

Already discussed multiple times. Why do you think it will fall down, and what will be the impact velocity if it does? Even an approximate figure is ok.

Well when things blow up parts tend to go in all directions, being just above earth does not give alot of room for even one of those five arms to miss. You only need one to make a bad day for earth.  

[Zolt51]

IanPolaris wrote...

Remember the citedal itself is a giant mass-relay and thus a giant mass effect engine.  Having it explode in low earth orbit.....problematic.

Consider that if the shockwave is strong enough to disable the Normandy moving away from it at FTL, then what it does to the fleet in the Sol System and earth itself is again....problematic.

-Polaris

That shockwave is ALREADY shown explicitly to pass over the earth without causing major damage  (except if you have low EMS). What more do you want? The real question in my opinion is why it damages the Normandy.

What we are discussing here is the risk of impact with earth, I just want the previous poster to clarify and argument his position.

[IanPolaris]

Zolt51 wrote...

IanPolaris wrote...

Remember the citedal itself is a giant mass-relay and thus a giant mass effect engine.  Having it explode in low earth orbit.....problematic.

Consider that if the shockwave is strong enough to disable the Normandy moving away from it at FTL, then what it does to the fleet in the Sol System and earth itself is again....problematic.

-Polaris

That shockwave is ALREADY shown explicitly to pass over the earth without causing major damage  (except if you have low EMS). What more do you want? The real question in my opinion is why it damages the Normandy.

What we are discussing here is the risk of impact with earth, I just want the previous poster to clarify and argument his position.

Then it's a plothole.  If the shockwave didn't damage Big Ben, then it shouldn't be any threat to the Normady.

You don't get to weasel out of this one.

-Polaris

[Zolt51]

yukon fire wrote...

Well when things blow up parts tend to go in all directions, being just above earth does not give alot of room for even one of those five arms to miss. You only need one to make a bad day for earth.  

The parts are not shown to move away from each other at high speed. It is not a given at all that the change in velocity due to the explosion will be enough to send major parts on a collision course. Maybe they will be on a decaying orbit, but there could still be years, or decades before any impact. Whether the citadel was in a stable orbit to begin with, THAT is the big question in my opinion.

Hell, I'm not sure, but the pieces might even clump back together eventually under their own gravity.

[IanPolaris]

s.nebulous wrote...

The relays, if anything, hindered the races coming up with their own means of long distance FTL travel. They will eventually either replicate the technology, or design completely new means of travel. But with the mass relays there is no incentive to produce these new propulsion techniques. 
Even the current non mass relay FTL, allows the exploration and exploitation of an entire star cluster.

That is only true in the very, very long term and even then assuming that the races actually suvive the subsequent dark age (which is not a given especially given the problematic nature of the RGB relay explosions), it won't be the Mass Effect universe any more.  It will be a completely different fictional world.

No thanks.

-Polaris

[Zolt51]

IanPolaris wrote...

Then it's a plothole.  If the shockwave didn't damage Big Ben, then it shouldn't be any threat to the Normady.

You don't get to weasel out of this one.

-Polaris

Yes, that one is a plot hole and I perfectly agree. Only possible explanation is that the Normandy is in the middle of a mass relay jump, and it's the concentrated "beam" they're trying to escape. But what are they doing there, *that* is an even bigger plot hole. That normandy scene is the only part of the ending I really have problem with. The rest I can just roll with it.

Saying that the citadel will impact and destroy all life on earth on the other hand. *that* is pure groundless speculation.

Modifié par Zolt51, 05 avril 2012 - 08:35 .

[s.nebulous]

Does the Normandy still have the reaper IFF installed? The normandy getting damaged does not bother me as much, as it seems almost nitpicking. But I have a hard time coming up with why it was flying away from the battle. That too me is more of a plot hole, though intentional I guess.