306 réponses à ce sujet

[kbct]

taelus.calimshan wrote...

Alright, sorry to be absent so long, but apparently all I missed was a lot of Halo 4 discussion. Speaking of...can we move that elsewhere? Much appreciated.

To AJ's commentary (which I'm omitting because of length) about the development cycle and such that followed:

I understand that the Retake movement has absolutely altered their plans for DLC release. We know this is at least true of the new multiplayer character options that were leaked the first week the game was out. Also, it's true that BioWare is, to some extent, at the mercy of EA's decisions, but they still make most decisions internally. They don't have to check everything with EA for approval, though it's entirely possible that something as big as a recreation of the endings might have to be approved from a budget perspective.

All of that said, I don't think any of this speaks poorly of the Retake group. I think the issue of the movement's validity and it's effect are essentially orthogonal. The movement has the right to make demands of the creator of a product they've purchased, particularly when that product advertised one set of features and provided another. Again, I absolutely agree that some of the things happening DLC wise and in other areas for BioWare are a direct consequence of the Retake movement, but I don't agree that these effects make the actions of the Retake group "entitled".

I hope that makes more sense.

By the way, thanks for reposting the AJ commentary. I think this forum should read his stuff as well.

[Tirigon]

Farbautisonn wrote...

Tirigon wrote...
Of course.
i said before I dont mind them helping charities. I just find it dishonest to say they do it without wanting to profit from it.

-Well. They were being blamed for being "entitled brats" and all sorts of other crap. They needed to refute that. So they did something nice and innovative. It worked. Im sure most of them are doing it for altruistic reasons and because they got sick of being called things.

And showing oneself as altruistic, thus getting rid of bad PR, is profiteering, in my opinion.

[Faust1979]

Don't these people have real lives to worry about? they must lead great lives if their top priority is a video game it's sad

[Dridengx]

Faust1979 wrote...

Don't these people have real lives to worry about? they must lead great lives if their top priority is a video game it's sad

I wouldn't want to know but check this thread out

www.gamefaqs.com/boards/995452-mass-effect-3/62450055


got to love the comments

[OmegaXI]

Dridengx wrote...

Faust1979 wrote...

Don't these people have real lives to worry about? they must lead great lives if their top priority is a video game it's sad

I wouldn't want to know but check this thread out

www.gamefaqs.com/boards/995452-mass-effect-3/62450055


got to love the comments

 good old game faqs

[Faust1979]

Dridengx wrote...

Faust1979 wrote...

Don't these people have real lives to worry about? they must lead great lives if their top priority is a video game it's sad

I wouldn't want to know but check this thread out

www.gamefaqs.com/boards/995452-mass-effect-3/62450055


got to love the comments

wow I hope that guy is making it up lol

[Mr Indivisible]

I'm not sure where these 'Shepard deserves better fans' banners came from (then again, not sure where any of the originated) but I must say, I think he/she has some damn good fans.

I can't help but think its a shot aimed at the Retake movement, which personally shows a huge level of fandom for Shepard. If they were not some of the most dedicated fans ever, this ending would have been a footnote, and everyone would forget and move on.

Charities, protests, and real caring for the characters and universe brought this out. Perhaps it means 'bioware deserves better fans' not shepard, because his/hers are pretty amazing. I hope this new charity raises as much as the last, without the politicing.

[UniqueName001]

UnstableMongoose wrote...

... "your poorly-organized charity event got Child's Play into serious legal trouble and enough people demanded charity refunds that it nearly suspended CP's Paypal account"...

I think it got buried in the... spam....above so I'd like to ask again, please provide the source for this?

UnstableMongoose wrote...

Your donations were returned because enough of your supporters sent refund requests to the CP Paypal that it was in serious danger of being suspended.

This... isn't true at all.  Some people apparently asked for their donations to be returned.  The rest of the donations remain with Child's Play.  I have no information that Paypal was threatening any action against Child's Play.  I'd again like to see your source for this.

UnstableMongoose wrote...

Furthermore, you are not a charitable organization. You are an organization that exists to put economic pressure on a game company in order to change their policy. This is all well and good, and more power to you for doing so, but CP's 401©(3) status is threatened by taking donations of that nature--hence, your $80,000 were an extraordinary risk to take, because the source of the money threatened the future millions that CP has the potential to raise by making them an unwilling pawn in a corporate struggle.

This might be an actual concern if the money was at any time in the possession of a third party.  It was not.  The charity drive created a direct paypal transaction between the donator and Child's Play.  There was no third party.  There was a website that kept track of the number of people donating, and how much had been donated, but the transactions were with Child's Play and no one else.  This was explicitly stated on the charity website and in the forum thread.

I'd like to point out that we followed exactly the recommendations provided in the Child's Play fundraising guide, which is available on their website.  At no time did Child's Play make any statements that the charity drive was acting outside of proper channels.  At no time did they state that their relationship with Paypal was in jeopardy.  If you have a source for any of these statements, please provide it.

Modifié par UniqueName001, 05 avril 2012 - 05:05 .

[MikoDoll]

Here's how I think this needs to go down:

People who donate NEED to before paying be expected to comply with some form of agreement that says they understand that they are not getting their money back. Most organizations or websites that provide a service know well enough to have terms people need to read through before they sign. A few trollish ****s who "want their money back" probably will be unable to do so and things can procede forward.

Modifié par MikoDoll, 05 avril 2012 - 05:07 .

[UniqueName001]

Mr Indivisible wrote...

I'm not sure where these 'Shepard deserves better fans' banners came from (then again, not sure where any of the originated) but I must say, I think he/she has some damn good fans.

I can't help but think its a shot aimed at the Retake movement, which personally shows a huge level of fandom for Shepard. If they were not some of the most dedicated fans ever, this ending would have been a footnote, and everyone would forget and move on.

Charities, protests, and real caring for the characters and universe brought this out. Perhaps it means 'bioware deserves better fans' not shepard, because his/hers are pretty amazing. I hope this new charity raises as much as the last, without the politicing.

There is no doubt that those banners are targetting the retake people.  If the people displaying those banners weren't such a tiny minority on the forums, I might even feel insulted by them:P

[Viyu]

MikoDoll wrote...

Here's how I think this needs to go down:

People who donate NEED to before paying be expected to comply with some form of agreement that says they understand that they are not getting their money back. Most organizations or websites that provide a service know well enough to have terms people need to read through before they sign. A few trollish ****s who "want their money back" probably will be unable to do so and things can procede forward.

You know, I would think that'd be pretty standard by now, especially anywhere money is involved. And also, I think that if they plan on doing something big at PAX, they should pick a gathering spot and inform Retake protesters of the plan when they get there so Bioware doesn't concoct any more PR countermeasures. I think it was very smart of him of the Retake organizers to be vague about what they intend to do there. However, that vaguness might be indicitave of having no real plan or goal in mind, which can be worrysome, on the flip side.

Modifié par Viyu, 05 avril 2012 - 05:12 .

[Capone666]

Viyu wrote...

MikoDoll wrote...

Here's how I think this needs to go down:

People who donate NEED to before paying be expected to comply with some form of agreement that says they understand that they are not getting their money back. Most organizations or websites that provide a service know well enough to have terms people need to read through before they sign. A few trollish ****s who "want their money back" probably will be unable to do so and things can procede forward.

You know, I would think that'd be pretty standard by now, especially anywhere money is involved. And also, I think that if they plan on doing something big at PAX, they should pick a gathering spot and inform Retake protesters of the plan when they get there so Bioware doesn't concoct any more PR countermeasures. I think it was very smart of him of the Retake organizers to be vague about what they intend to do there. However, that vaguness might be indicitave of having no real plan or goal in mind, which can be worrysome, on the flip side.

interesting

[Kaloneous]

I'll just leave this here.
http://www.cinemable...ct-3-41139.html

An interesting read that shows that some people have gotten it completely wrong about donators asking for their money back. the Retake campaign did its best and Child's Play ended the charity for different more understandable reasons.

[Farbautisonn]

Tirigon wrote...

Farbautisonn wrote...

Tirigon wrote...
Of course.
i said before I dont mind them helping charities. I just find it dishonest to say they do it without wanting to profit from it.

-Well. They were being blamed for being "entitled brats" and all sorts of other crap. They needed to refute that. So they did something nice and innovative. It worked. Im sure most of them are doing it for altruistic reasons and because they got sick of being called things.

And showing oneself as altruistic, thus getting rid of bad PR, is profiteering, in my opinion.

-Thats your opinion, and your opinion is subjective. Since you are quick to condemn the Retake group, but apparenly accept if not outright condone that cooperations use Charitiy offensively (As Bioware did when they donated 1k to an anti-bullying charity during the Hepler debacle), it does make your critizism come out a bit.... hollow.

[Tazzmission]

Kalms wrote...

Tazzmission wrote...

i would love to go to pax and bust up the take back movement

Is that a threat of violence? This forum is getting worse by the minute.

nope nothing threatning about it 



its a figure of speech 

Modifié par Tazzmission, 05 avril 2012 - 07:36 .

[Kalms]

Tazzmission wrote...

Kalms wrote...

Tazzmission wrote...

i would love to go to pax and bust up the take back movement

Is that a threat of violence? This forum is getting worse by the minute.

nope nothing threatning about it 



its a figure of speech 

Right.

[PnXMarcin1PL]

slyguy200 wrote...

PnXMarcin1PL wrote...

Im wondering how much of this "charity" goes into organisers pockets...
anyway good luck guys

dude why don't you take some time to reseach that claim, after all of this attention surounding the charity was shown i think he would have been found out by now.<_<

Fcuk your research. It's not right when people who want better ending for a game shield themselves with charity. I can bet my life on it that 80% of those players dont give a damn about charity and never cared about it. If you dont like my opinion deal with it, otherwise we have a problem. Im pissed off enough already and not by your "funny" post. <_<

Modifié par PnXMarcin1PL, 05 avril 2012 - 08:21 .

[Farbautisonn]

PnXMarcin1PL wrote...
Fcuk your research. It's not right when people who want better ending for a game shield themselves with charity. I can bet my life on it that 80% of those players dont give a damn about charity and never cared about it. If you dont like my opinion deal with it, otherwise we have a problem. Im pissed off enough already and not by your "funny" post. <_<

-And yet when everyone else does it, "normal people" who donated 20 to charity and then spend 300 on a steak dinner for the family, or the cooperation that bleeds its clients and its labour force dry and donates a pittance to charities, or the politician that does it to prove he is a "nice guy", its ok.

Right.

[DayusMakhina]

Farbautisonn wrote...

PnXMarcin1PL wrote...
Fcuk your research. It's not right when people who want better ending for a game shield themselves with charity. I can bet my life on it that 80% of those players dont give a damn about charity and never cared about it. If you dont like my opinion deal with it, otherwise we have a problem. Im pissed off enough already and not by your "funny" post. <_<

-And yet when everyone else does it, "normal people" who donated 20 to charity and then spend 300 on a steak dinner for the family, or the cooperation that bleeds its clients and its labour force dry and donates a pittance to charities, or the politician that does it to prove he is a "nice guy", its ok.

Right.

Not at all.

Just because others do it doesn't mean it's right that they do it either, but equally just because they manage to get away with doing it doesn't mean you should attempt to do the same too. It's not a valid justification in any way and is akin to a schoolkid's response of "well he did it first!" when being told off by a teacher.

I respect Retake's attempts to petition about something they care about, I certainly respected Operation Cupcake, which was somewhat of a novel and ingenious way to protest that garnered the positive PR it deserved, but they need to leave charities out of it because it is just wrong.

Modifié par DayusMakhina, 05 avril 2012 - 08:49 .

[PnXMarcin1PL]

Farbautisonn wrote...

PnXMarcin1PL wrote...
Fcuk your research. It's not right when people who want better ending for a game shield themselves with charity. I can bet my life on it that 80% of those players dont give a damn about charity and never cared about it. If you dont like my opinion deal with it, otherwise we have a problem. Im pissed off enough already and not by your "funny" post. <_<

-And yet when everyone else does it, "normal people" who donated 20 to charity and then spend 300 on a steak dinner for the family, or the cooperation that bleeds its clients and its labour force dry and donates a pittance to charities, or the politician that does it to prove he is a "nice guy", its ok.

Right.

Right, you're putting words into me that I havent even said and dont agree with them. Politicians are the biggest fcuktards and everyone knows it. So, riiiight... better luck next time... 

Modifié par PnXMarcin1PL, 05 avril 2012 - 08:59 .

[Farbautisonn]

DayusMakhina wrote...

Not at all.

Just because others do it doesn't mean it's right that they do it either, but equally just because they manage to get away with doing it doesn't mean you should attempt to do the same too. It's not a valid justification in any way and is akin to a schoolkid's response of "well he did it first!" when being told off by a teacher.

I respect Retake's attempts to petition about something they care about, I certainly respected Operation Cupcake, which was somewhat of a novel and ingenious way to protest that garnered the positive PR it deserved, but they need to leave charities out of it because it is just wrong.

-Aw... isnt that saved...

Wrong analogy is wrong by the way. I see zero hinderence or moral issues with private citizens or activists using the same tools as cooperations and politicians has used for decades. Noone is hurt, charities make out and the "battlefield" is even once again. If you have some personal issue with it, then be consistanct and speak out against the politicians and cooperations (including bioware) who use charity as a tool as well (as they did when they donated 1k to an anti-bullying charity during the Hepler debacle). However I didnt see many outbursts and voices of indignation then. Certainly not from the "usual suspects" in this thread.

Charities depend on donations and their percieved image as do gooders. They lend some of their "holier than thou" aura to their donators for the absolution these buy. Its not a perfect system. But it works.

[Farbautisonn]

PnXMarcin1PL wrote...

Right, you're putting words into me that I havent even said and dont agree with them. Politicians are the biggest fcuktards and everyone knows it. So, riiiight... better luck next time... 

-And yet they rule your nation, your world and most aspects of it. So. You allow "****tards" to dictate your life. Grats.

[Fox Shepard]

If we are still talking about this that means BioWare has to notice that there are still a significant amount of unhappy fans. The more publicity the better. Some people in this thread need to take a serious look at what they type before they post. I'm not saying 'if you don't have anything nice to say then don't say anything at all', but what I am saying is to phrase things like you would as if you were talking to a person, not like you're a pretentious douche.

[PnXMarcin1PL]

Farbautisonn wrote...

PnXMarcin1PL wrote...

Right, you're putting words into me that I havent even said and dont agree with them. Politicians are the biggest fcuktards and everyone knows it. So, riiiight... better luck next time... 

-And yet they rule your nation, your world and most aspects of it. So. You allow "****tards" to dictate your life. Grats.

And yet you allow it too. Oh the irony of a differently intellingent person trying to insult someone who didnt insult him... Go ahead post more, Im not even going to waste my time here.  Oh and don't shake because of an forum argument, I'm leaving.

Modifié par PnXMarcin1PL, 05 avril 2012 - 09:18 .

[Farbautisonn]

PnXMarcin1PL wrote...
And yet you allow it too. Oh the irony of a differently intellingent person trying to insult someone who didnt insult him... Go ahead post more, Im not even going to waste my time here. 

-Allow it? Hell no. I endorse it. I built the foundation of my career supporting it. I worked Spin for people in power. I made a nice living doing it. So nice infact, that I have been able to go private sector.

I love politicians. They arent "tards" they are humans that chose to lead. Some do it for power. Some do it out of genuine interest and care for the people they represent. Some burn with near religious zeal for their constituents. But not of them are saints and all of them are subject to the whims of their electorate and their customers.

And thats where I come in. Im intelligent and skilled enough to see through spin and propaganda in my private life and I put my vote and my efforts behind those that I like and those I think could/can/do make a difference. For a fee ofcourse. .