91 réponses à ce sujet

[tigrina]

Archonsg wrote...
Write a good tale, make your characters memorable, make us care about them but most of all, make them feel alive. That is the one thing I have come to expect and hope to see in all Bioware games, characters that feel alive and part of the world you allow us to play in.

Quoted for truth. To be totally honest, even when I've played most of the BW games, I didn't expect both the quality and quantity of NPC interaction (even when I have to admit that I really wanted to see more of it, especially endgame). High quality voice acting too, deserving an extra mention.

[orpheus333]

Ferret A Baudoin wrote...
...than speed dial calls to ninja assassins.

You have those on payroll?

[elijah_kaine]

David Gaider wrote...

Varenus Luckmann wrote...
But make no mistake, the game is a gem. There's just very little point in analyzing the things you did right when we can focus on making it better.

You don't think that positive reinforcement can be constructive?

I don't know, man. That's a little sad.

You know, now that I think about it, it might be a pretty good idea to point out or start discussions on what went right with a game, because thats still constructive, and lets the devs know what was good, meaing they will put more of that good stuff in there if there is a lot of evidence to show that "these things were good." (Ugh, sleepy logic, might not be sound.)

It also can help a bit to define why something was good. Becuase it is so very elusive to find that ingrident or that specfic right animation, that pointing it out can help identify it and create it more often. The only problem I think is a thread of that nature might derail back into what was bad about the game, as is human nature. 

[elijah_kaine]

tigrina wrote...

Well, the titles in this forum with "[x] sucks!" can't be called constructive criticism in the slightest imho. Since I usually skip those myself, I can imagine any BW dev doing the forums because, well, in a way enjoy it, skip those too. The version you describe is a lot easier to digest.

/QFT

I have to argree with this. One of the big differences between constructive critism and insuilting critism can be seen in that thread title.

Here's one that always gets on my nerves (so I can't begin to imgaine what the dev's feel about it when they see it.) is in bullet point lists of things that were bad about the game, this quote is very insulting and I see it all the time "The fact that they didn't do [x] is laziness imo." That's the type of thing that makes it hard to justify coming here for feedback.

[Sable Phoenix]

slackbheep wrote...

In the vein of constructive criticism:
Without a doubt my favorite part of DA:O was the story and writing. Battles could have been resolved via a game of Hangman and I still would have forsaken sleep to find out what happens next. I can think of no piece of fiction that has affected me so, since I was a young teen discovering Dragonlance novels, and AD&D. Truth be told, it was about a week after I beat DA:O before I found the energy to play another game.

I can offer no higher reccomendation for a story, than to say it left me so emotionally drained that it was days before I felt myself again. Few literary greats have managed to strike me so.

I had exactly the same response.  The game really demands you invest yourself into it totally, much like Planescape:Torment did.  I would agree and say that this is a sign of greatness, yes?

[slackbheep]

Sable Phoenix wrote...

I had exactly the same response.  The game really demands you invest yourself into it totally, much like Planescape:Torment did.  I would agree and say that this is a sign of greatness, yes?

Very much so, And now that I think about it I know of atleast two other friends who responded to the game in much the same way. To qoute an MSN screenname: "James -Beat Dragon Age. In related news I have experienced a fourty five hour orgasm. I feel so empty ".

Hell, my non-gamer coworker spent 15 minutes this morning talking my ear off about how amazing playing through the City Elf origin story was, after having seen her roommate playing a later game character. Games like Dragon Age do a great deal to elevate the general publics view of gaming as a passtime for us adults.

[Leyla87]

slackbheep wrote...

Sable Phoenix wrote...

I had exactly the same response.  The game really demands you invest yourself into it totally, much like Planescape:Torment did.  I would agree and say that this is a sign of greatness, yes?

Very much so, And now that I think about it I know of atleast two other friends who responded to the game in much the same way. To qoute an MSN screenname: "James -Beat Dragon Age. In related news I have experienced a fourty five hour orgasm. I feel so empty ".

Hell, my non-gamer coworker spent 15 minutes this morning talking my ear off about how amazing playing through the City Elf origin story was, after having seen her roommate playing a later game character. Games like Dragon Age do a great deal to elevate the general publics view of gaming as a passtime for us adults.

And this is exactly why I defend my choice of continuing to play videogames outside of being a teenager. I have a friend who is a couple years older than me with a three year old that says  I should probably look into an "Actual Hobby." 

Dragon Age was a better experience than 95% of the movies that come out these days. And since Bioware does such a great job with their writing and storytelling, I get the same satisfied feeling playing their games that I get while reading a good book.

So thanks, Bioware. Ya'll keep turning out these fantastic games, I'll keep playing them for years to come.

[Setz69]

elijah_kaine wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

Varenus Luckmann wrote...
But make no mistake, the game is a gem. There's just very little point in analyzing the things you did right when we can focus on making it better.

You don't think that positive reinforcement can be constructive?

I don't know, man. That's a little sad.

You know, now that I think about it, it might be a pretty good idea to point out or start discussions on what went right with a game, because thats still constructive, and lets the devs know what was good, meaing they will put more of that good stuff in there if there is a lot of evidence to show that "these things were good." (Ugh, sleepy logic, might not be sound.)

It also can help a bit to define why something was good. Becuase it is so very elusive to find that ingrident or that specfic right animation, that pointing it out can help identify it and create it more often. The only problem I think is a thread of that nature might derail back into what was bad about the game, as is human nature. 

I find thats definitly the best way to do it.

Start out, "I loved the game. The story was amazing, and the characters so detailed and with such great personalities. BUT I think there may a problem with *insert topic*"

This lets the dev's know that you do like their game, and appreciate their work. It also lets them know that you care enough to comment on some things that you think need fixing.

Now starting it out, "COMBAT SUCKS, ITS SOOO HARD. Epic Fail bioware, im never buying another game from you". This shows bioware you don't A) Have any real explanation on why its wrong.  Your a complete ass, and C) You aren't the consumer base they want to focus on. If you don't like their gameplay style, you didn't research how bioware does their games, and If glitches and difficult combat is enough to make you NEVER buy a bioware game again, why would they want to cater to your 'requests'? Every game has glitches, the beauty of bioware is they fix them. I know alot of console/pc games that NEVER get an update. Or maybe one or two in the entire history of the game.

[ChemicalGreen]

Have to agree with previous posters here, the interaction between party members and the story really lift the game head and shoulders above most current cRPGs. I still have a pet peeve though (you saw that coming, right?) and it's the relative incuriosity of your companions. Wynne is the only who asks about your motives for joining the Grey Wardens and allow you to have RP moments regarding your origins. Most the other characters just ignore any past you might have had prior to becoming a Grey Warden. All those discussions with f.ex Zevran about his deeds, and not a single reciprocating inquiry about your own exploits? I know, I know, probably staggering amounts of extra dialogue to write and act, but I can have dreams right?

Here's hoping we get sequal or expac. Soon?

[slackbheep]

Leyla87 wrote...
And this is exactly why I defend my choice of continuing to play videogames outside of being a teenager. I have a friend who is a couple years older than me with a three year old that says  I should probably look into an "Actual Hobby." 

Dragon Age was a better experience than 95% of the movies that come out these days. And since Bioware does such a great job with their writing and storytelling, I get the same satisfied feeling playing their games that I get while reading a good book.

So thanks, Bioware. Ya'll keep turning out these fantastic games, I'll keep playing them for years to come.

Haha, I always loved this arguement. What's an "Actual" hobby? Basketweaving?
I'd say the one with the mewling spawn would have been better off with a hobby~

[Frostaxt]

@ChemicalGreen: Exactly my thoughts. Everyone, besides Wynne and Natascha(my dog´s name), seems to be very self centred.

Btw the fact that Bioware guys(and girls) participate in this forums, even though it´s not always pleasant, shows me, that they really care about their game and customer. Far more than I have seen with other developers. As long as they keep that up, I won´t worry much about the quality of their future games.

P.S.: BG2 bugs. AH Jaheira! I really loved that woman! But I could never finish that damn romance, because it was so buggy. Hmm I may have to replay BG2 to see if she is okay now... on the other side I am finally over her, and I don´t want to relive bad, painful memories! On a side note. I always send Khalid to his death in BG1 to have Jaheira for myself. How come he was always killed again in Irenicus dungeon?

[Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien]

I figured would chime in on this topic, I just finished my third playthrough and even though am still playing on easy I do intend in one of my future playthroughs to up the level back to at least normal (after originally getting my butt chewed on that level when first started) as am learning more and more how to play and planning tactics and what not.

Way I see it there is always going to be some people that absolutely love this game whilst some will hate it, some will hate it to begin with but then begin to love it and vice versa then there are those of us that will find some things niggly but in general love it. The fact is, you can never fully appreciate the sweet without the sour. I myself don't have any real major issues with the game, some tiny niggles but nothing worth noting. I love the world that Bioware has created (just as I did with their previous games), agree with others that this game imho has the best party interaction, it makes the whole 'travelling from a to b' bit fun compared to the usual RPG where everyone is silent as the grave apart from the pitter patter of their feet walking/running along and even during some of the conversations it really does stand above a lot of games recently and even movies.

If you keep putting the effort in to tell a great story woven into a game like this, I will keep playing them. Specially if you keep allowing us to meddle with the toolset ourselves to make our own little stories.

One last thing before I go start/continue playthrough number 4... I don't think there are many companies out there that have made such great party members/NPCs as you guys do.

Keep up the good work, you guys rock.

Enchantment? ENCHANTMENT!

[Acemath]

It's already been said before in this topic:The people who are happy with the game don't always ventilate it,while the people who aren't as happy with it always state their meaning.Not always on a decent manner,especially when remembering the game is "M-rated".Maturity is sometimes lightyears away when you read these boards.



But thanks to bioware i will never play any other game.Or the other companies will learn their lessons and also introduce these kind of great characters in their games.But i don't see THAT happening anytime soon...

[Kalfear]

Forums are literally the worst form of communication between Devs and target audience. This forum a little better then others as you have to own and register game to post here so at least you know those posting have most likely played the product (most likely because I seen a few questionable posts contradicting that statement).



But the BEST way to agther info IMO is ingame polls where you get a pop up asking a question when you log in and you answer accordingly. This keeps the information to the point and on message! Doable in this game as you still connect to Bioware/EA servers (like a MMO).



Anyways, speaking formyself, I make a real effort to expand on my meaning when replying so when a Dev reads my post, they can say "ahhhh, I see where he coming from and why" regarding the topic. Posts that just agree/Disagree with someone and offer up nothing else might be good for ego but really provide no insight IMO.



The devs know the game popular or not by the sales numbers. I read somewhere The Wardens Keep did over 1 million Downloads at $7.50 (canadian) so I think the devs know it was a success with out anyone comeing here and just saying so. More productive message is to come and tell them (in a mature manner) what you would like to see added or changed for future DLC. If they make whats being asked for (with in reason of course) the product will be successful.



Having said all that, I still wish I could have gotten a reply from BIOWARE THEMSELVES on why they did the love scenes the way they did. We all can come up with a million ideas why we think they did it but can never be 100% sure till they come out and actually answer the question themselves.



Anyways, its pretty clear Bioware Edmonton is getting the formula for a successful RPG down pat between Mass Effect and Dragon Age: Origin. KotOR and JE were great games but theywere lacking in areas both ME and DA:O have addressed and improved on. Hopefully Bioware Austin can continue the standard set by Bioware Edmonton, but time will tell on that.

[tigrina]

ChemicalGreen wrote...

Have to agree with previous posters here, the interaction between party members and the story really lift the game head and shoulders above most current cRPGs. I still have a pet peeve though (you saw that coming, right?) and it's the relative incuriosity of your companions. Wynne is the only who asks about your motives for joining the Grey Wardens and allow you to have RP moments regarding your origins. Most the other characters just ignore any past you might have had prior to becoming a Grey Warden. All those discussions with f.ex Zevran about his deeds, and not a single reciprocating inquiry about your own exploits? I know, I know, probably staggering amounts of extra dialogue to write and act, but I can have dreams right?

Here's hoping we get sequal or expac. Soon?

I do like that there are hints to who you were before becoming a Grey Warden, but I also think it is a damn hard thing to do write dialogue the side of the player. Everyone feels differently when playing an Origin, so having some consensus on how this is experienced player side is quite a difficult path to take.

Besides, personally I fill in the gaps in my head. I'm currently running a dwarf commoner game and I just imagined how I would take my romanced one apart and telling him upfront what I did in Orzammar which got me exiled. I actually like it that the game makes you think about it, if you're so inclined.

The one thing this game does is making you think about both companions and the setting a long time, with all its ambiguity. I think that part could be killed if the Makers decide what you can say about it in a dialogue. 

So in short I would also love to see those kind of dialogue options, I'm just afraid it could also kill some RP experience.

[Adria Teksuni]

Bah, don't feel sorry for the devs. They don't have feelings the way you or I have feelings.

[Fishy]

David Gaider wrote...

RunCDFirst wrote...
Actually, it's not their job. They may (and I believe they do) have a community liason or two, but it's certainly not David Gaider's job to come to the forums. Or Sheryl Chee's. Or any of the programmers. A lot of the devs really don't have any responsiblity to answer fans' and forum members' questions or comments. They do, and I'm sure some of their co-workers think they are crazy because of it.

That's correct. It's not our job. Chris Priestly is our community liaison, but even that doesn't make it his job to read through every thread and respond to your concerns (though I'm sure he does his best). Those of us that do come here do it because we enjoy interacting with the community, and because there's definite value to be had in getting some feedback.

That feedback isn't always enjoyable, however. Some people like to write it off as "it's the internet!" but that's a bit of a cop-out. That doesn't mean it's suddenly acceptable to speak to someone in a way that would get you punched in the face if you spoke to them like that in person, and it would take an incredible sense of entitlement to assume that anyone -- whether it's their job or not -- should sit there and listen to their much-vaunted opinion even when they can't be arsed to act in a reasonable fashion. Some people simply can't seperate their behavior from their opinions, and will automatically assume that if somone takes issue with them it must be the latter and not the former.

We do get it, even so. It all comes from a place of passion, but it can be a bit wearying trying to take it all in sometimes no matter how patient you might be. From my experience, it's like this on the forums right after release no matter what game it is. If you have visited the BG2 forums right after release you would have sworn it was the worst game in existence -- funny how people don't remember that after a while.

And that's fine, too. People don't go to the customer service section in a store to tell them how great they think the place is running -- that's just human nature. People come here to vent because they think someone will listen. And they'll vent again and again and again and again... because they're passionate, about RPG's even if not about DA. Understood, but, like I said, sometimes wearying. Sometimes it's just safer to read than to respond, and sometimes it's better just to walk away for a bit.

Anyway, now I've gone and written a long response when I didn't intend to. Ah, well. Return to your regularly scheduled... whatever.

Exactly .. I complain a lot because i'm passionate  .. If i did not care   , i would not even know about this board , play the game once and delete it from my hardrive.

Well i complain ... For instance i'm never going to say that i wasted my money .Because it's untrue.
I waste my money on a game i finish after 7 hours and i'm never going to play again (Uncharted 2 ).
Yes it's was a good game overall .. But nothing like Dragon Age .. A fastfood game like i love to call game.

yet you don't see me on the uncharted 2 forum . Because i don't care about this game enough to post on their forum.

But yet you see me post a lot about how i don't like this and that on dragon age .. But the only game i have played for now a month it's dragon age. Weird.