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[Infinityphoenix]

Hi everyone,  I'm writing a research paper on urban geography, and have been able to convince my teacher to write about whether the Consumer (Public Good) or the Producer (The Private Sector) should have the last say in creation of products in the entertainment industry.

I'm going to upload a bunch of questions (25 to be precise), and if I could get posters to methodically go through each question, I would really appreciate it.  I need arguers from both sides, I need to stay neutral in my paper, even though I am a Retaker.  You can answer in as many words as you want, but I will conclude taking info from this topic on Monday, April 9.

Thank you to everyone in advance,



Applying Arestein's Ladder to the Private Sector
[How fans of Mass Effect are making the public think differently of video games]
 

Modifié par Infinityphoenix, 06 avril 2012 - 05:11 .

[Infinityphoenix]

[Section 1 – Prior Gameplay Experience]
1.      Have you completed Mass Effect 3?
 
 
2.      If not, do you know how the trilogy ends?
 
 
3.      Have you played the previous 2 installments of the Mass Effect franchise?
 
 
4.      If you have, which character was your LI in each installment?  Did this affect how you enjoyed the game?
 
 
5.      In Mass Effect 2, presuming you saved every team member during the final chapter, was the overlying stories of the characters the main influence in saving them?
 
 
6.      Did the reactions of renegade choices in the franchise forced you to play one way over the other?
 
 
7.      What are your favorite 3 memories of the story’s franchise? Is there a common theme among them?
 
 
 
Section 2: Bioware and Artistic Integrity
 
1.      Do you believe video games are a form of art? Do you believe art is static or fluid?
 
 
2.      Throughout the third installment, some fans believed that Bioware /EA rewrote specific characters during important sequences. Do you have a similar opinion? If so, which characters do you have a problem with?
 
 
3.      Do you think the Adam and Eve reference at the end of the game made sense, given the theme of co-existence between organic and synthetic organisms?
 
 
4.      Do you think Mass Effect 3 had more humorous moments than previous installments? If so, do you think it was to cut the theme of war and death in the game, or was this an attempt to detract fans from over thinking the ending?
 
 
5.      Given Bioware’s previous experience with incorporating player feedback into the series, do you think changing the ending all together would compromise Bioware / EA’s previous decisions and artistic integrity?
 
 
6.      With the death of well accepted characters in Mass Effect 3 as a part of trying close that character’s story, what makes stranding the crew any different?
 
 
 
7.      Do you think Bioware made the right choice in explaining the antagonist’s role in the series, or should it have been left alone?
 
 
8.      A lot of fans found the ending of Mass Effect 3 to be reminiscent of the ending’s of other franchises. Despite various amounts of plot holes in these franchises, they did well. What makes Mass Effect 3 different?
 
 
 
9.      Bioware used 3-dimensional facial rendering for voice actress Jessica Chobot’s character Diana Allers, but photo-shopped a picture of Miss England 2005 Hammasa Kohistani for the character Tali’Zorah vas Normandy. Do you think Bioware put more emphasis in designing an Easter Egg character over improving characters that were introduced in Mass Effect 2 (such as Thane, Jacob, Miranda and Jack)?  Given IGN’s defense of the game and its endorsements, do you think Jessica’s role had an influence in the site’s score of the game? Do you the upset fans correct in making this presumption, or is it biased by looking for a scapegoat?
Section 3: The Endings
 
1.      Given that the game has been released since March 6 (in North America) have you beaten the game? How many times have you replayed the game?
 
 
2.      What did you think of the ending? What is your position on it? Why do you have that opinion?
 
 
3.      Mass Effect 1 and 2 were both known for their replay-ability value, what about Mass Effect 3? Do you think the ending is the main factor in this inability to replay the game, or do you think it’s because Bioware has been largely quiet about these reactions? Do you think this is why they added multiplayer capabilities?
 
 
 
4.      Some pivotal moments in Mass Effect 3 have fans debating whether or not Bioware is degrading the values and quality of known characters in the franchise. For the most part, fan opinion of Cerberus assassin Kai Leng’s portrayal in Mass Effect 3 has been negative, mostly described by fans as being due to having multiple authors since the character’s introduction in the novels creating inconsistence’s in his personality. Others examples are the pairing of Garrus and Tali if the player does not romance them in the previous installment of the franchise, and Joker (the pilot of the character’s ship) abandoning the fight during its climax. What is your opinion of this? Are these accurate examples?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
5.      At which point do you think the quality of the writing changed the pace and feel of Mass Effect 3?
 
 
6.      Despite the popularity of the Shadow Broker text files in the Mass Effect 2 DLC [Lair of the Shadow Broker], would you pay for a new ending over a free text epilogue of the current endings?
 
7.      Another point that fans argue about is whether the end game sequence of Mass Effect 3 was real or whether it was a dream. What is your opinion of this, where do you stand? Do either have good claims to support, or is this just a part of Bioware desiring speculation amongst fans?  How is this different from the people who support a rewrite of the last sequence?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Section 4: Economic Input
 
1.      Mass Effect 2 was known for having lots of Down-Loadable Content (DLC). Did you buy all of them? If not, which ones did you buy, and what was the reasoning behind buying them?
 
 
 
2.      The Retake Movement has claimed responsibility over the recent decrease in EA stock prices, as well as causing the price of the game to decrease by 25%. In these instances, do you think the stigma against poor writing in entertainment will be a factor in the future aspects of entertainment, or will it be exclusive to the gaming industry?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
3.      Did you buy the “From Ashes” DLC? Given the premise of the plot, do you think the produces alienated themselves from their consumers by making them pay extra for a character that plays a crucial role in the history of the franchise, and have caused another rallying point for players upset about the vagueness of the ending?

Modifié par Infinityphoenix, 06 avril 2012 - 05:14 .

[LilyasAvalon]

Artistic Integrity isn't going to put food on the table or put a roof over your head.

How else are you supposed to better your products if you don't accept the critisism and change your product because that critisism or because of consumer demands?

Now give me a second to fill out the rest...

Modifié par LilyasAvalon, 05 avril 2012 - 05:44 .

[Thornne]

Does the Public Good have the right to affect the Artistic Integrity of the Private Sector Entertainment Industry?

Suggest a more appropriate question might be "Do paying customers have the right to affect the artistic integrity of the private sector entertainment industry?"

I am not sure what "Public Good" means in this context.

[jules_vern18]

Title of thread seems to suggest a false equivalency between the two groups. It's like comparing American Football fans and American Luge Fans in terms of prevalence, voice, or relevance.

Thread content is great, and I would be happy to respond in full if not for early work tomorrow...it's just that it seems like more and more people are assuming that "Retakers" and "Proenders" are opposite sides to a coin...they are not.

No offense meant, OP. Also, just out of curiosity - are you a sociology student?

[Nimrodell]

You should actually use Google docs to create the poll you need for your study, thus making it easier for yourself and for those who are willing to participate in it. And one more word of advice, there are couple of people on BSN who could actually help you in doing this. PM Phaedon or Mesina2 - they are good guys, paragons of BSN, and they might be willing to help you in creating good and effective poll.

[RoboticWater]

-Does the Public Good have the right to affect the Artistic Integrity of the Private Sector Entertainment Industry?

I believe that the consumer has a right to protest and influence the private sector but should not be able to legally demand anything more than what they were promised. It's checks and balances like this one (Producers make what they want and consumers decide whether or not they want it) that helps keep the economy working.

But to answer the question directly, I would say some are and some aren't. Those who peacefully and reasonably ask for a new ending and protest Bioware are completely justified, while those who demand a new ending and attack Bioware aren't justified. To say that Bioware needs to change the ending just because you don't like it is ridiculous. If you do not like a product then move onto one you are more satisfied with. This is the very basis of competition.

I myself do not like the ending and would love to see it changed but I just don't believe that any consumer has a right to demand anything from one company.

Now, there is the matter of the endings not fulfilling promises made by Bioware, though that is an entirely different topic.

[Quietness]

Infinityphoenix wrote...

Does the Public Good have the right to affect the Artistic Integrity of the Private Sector Entertainment Industry?
[Whether or not the fans behind the Retake Mass Effect Movement are Justified]
  
In the medium presented by this game. Yes and it should be taken advantage of. With the advent of patching and DLC content there is no reason not to.

[Section 1 – Prior Gameplay Experience]
1.      Have you completed Mass Effect 3?
 Yes
 
2.      If not, do you know how the trilogy ends?
 --
 
3.      Have you played the previous 2 installments of the Mass Effect franchise?
 Yes
 
4.      If you have, which character was your LI in each installment?  Did this affect how you enjoyed the game?
 Liara,Ash,Garrus,Tali and None i had a lot of saves
 
5.      In Mass Effect 2, presuming you saved every team member during the final chapter, was the overlying stories of the characters the main influence in saving them?
 On my primary character, yes. I drew an emotional connection to each character.
 
6.      Did the reactions of renegade choices in the franchise forced you to play one way over the other?
 In ME3 i was already a massive paragon on main character, there were a very few amount of Renegade i took. Watching some of the video's i dont know if i could bring myself to do some of them lol.
 
7.      What are your favorite 3 memories of the story’s franchise? Is there a common theme among them?
 
 In no particular order
Part of ME2 suicide mission where the whole squad lines up one after another with AR to form a firing line.
ME3 see you on the other side speeches before final push particularly Garrus and Liara
ME1 very end when you think for a moment that Shepard is dead only to come up and over the wreckage
 
Section 2: Bioware and Artistic Integrity
 
1.      Do you believe video games are a form of art? Do you believe art is static or fluid?
 Yes, Fluid
 
2.      Throughout the third installment, some fans believed that Bioware /EA rewrote specific characters during important sequences. Do you have a similar opinion? If so, which characters do you have a problem with?
 The only sudden character change that comes to mind is the final hour (so-to-speak) Shepard, and suddenly losing her backbone.
 
3.      Do you think the Adam and Eve reference at the end of the game made sense, given the theme of co-existence between organic and synthetic organisms?
 No, I get what they  were driving at, they just trampled a lot to do it. The theme also was not provided until the last moments of the trilogy, honestly i personally drew other themes but not the one i was told.
 
4.      Do you think Mass Effect 3 had more humorous moments than previous installments? If so, do you think it was to cut the theme of war and death in the game, or was this an attempt to detract fans from over thinking the ending?
 Maybe a little, but there was a lot of humor in 3. It allows to help cooldown/cut tension.
 
5.      Given Bioware’s previous experience with incorporating player feedback into the series, do you think changing the ending all together would compromise Bioware / EA’s previous decisions and artistic integrity?
 No, it would actually show some. They betrayed a large portion in the narrative and as such betrayed their own integrity.
 
6.      With the death of well accepted characters in Mass Effect 3 as a part of trying close that character’s story, what makes stranding the crew any different?
 This tramples on cannon as provided to us through the codex. If following cannon all the crew on the normandy is dead.
 
 
7.      Do you think Bioware made the right choice in explaining the antagonist’s role in the series, or should it have been left alone?
 Reapers did not need a known purpose. A villian becomes much more campy after their intentions are provided ( in this case i can only think of them as glorified maid/baby sitters)
 
8.      A lot of fans found the ending of Mass Effect 3 to be reminiscent of the ending’s of other franchises. Despite various amounts of plot holes in these franchises, they did well. What makes Mass Effect 3 different?
 The endings from the other games suit those games. They are much shorter more contained stories. 
 
 
9.      Bioware used 3-dimensional facial rendering for voice actress Jessica Chobot’s character Diana Allers, but photo-shopped a picture of Miss England 2005 Hammasa Kohistani for the character Tali’Zorah vas Normandy. Why do you think Bioware didn’t do something similar for a character synonymous with the franchise itself? Given IGN’s defense of the game and its endorsements, do you think Jessica’s role had an influence in the site’s score of the game? Do you the Retake Movement is correct in making this presumption, or is it bias and looking for a scapegoat?

I am sorry but you are grouping everyone under a common banner. I do not know why this choice was made, Bioware felt it was best. I am not going to speculate without proper evidence one way or the other. I know the common theory is to buy off IGN for reviews, but honestly i dont know/care.

Section 3: The Endings
 
1.      Given that the game has been released since March 6 (in North America) have you beaten the game? How many times have you replayed the game?
 Yes and replayed? 0
 
2.      What did you think of the ending? What is your position on it? Why do you have that opinion?
 The ending was bad needless to say. It violates large portions of the narrative, Shepard's role changes from the main character to something more akin to a plot device. The choices all were bad as were the consequences of those choices. There was a massive amount of plot holes that ignores the previous games in the series and the codex. As a piece of interactive storytelling it removed all options from the player's control and forced them down one of 3 paths.
 
3.      Mass Effect 1 and 2 were both known for their replay-ability value, what about Mass Effect 3? Do you think the ending is the main factor in this inability to replay the game, or do you think it’s because Bioware has been largely quiet about these reactions? Do you think this is why they added multiplayer capabilities?
 The endings are the only thing killing Replayability(opinon) The multiplayer is fun, it has the typical addiction feeding factors that most MMO's have (Running the wheel in circles to get better and get possibly better loot etc. etc.)
 
4.      Some pivotal moments in Mass Effect 3 have fans debating whether or not Bioware is degrading the values and quality of known characters in the franchise. For the most part, fan opinion of Cerberus assassin Kai Leng’s portrayal in Mass Effect 3 has been negative, mostly described by fans as being due to having multiple authors since the character’s introduction in the novels creating inconsistence’s in his personality. Others examples are the pairing of Garrus and Tali if the player does not romance them in the previous installment of the franchise, and Joker (the pilot of the character’s ship) abandoning the fight during its climax. What is your opinion of this? Are these accurate examples?
 
 Garrus and Tali i do not believe are good examples, Actually a pairing like that would make a lot of sense considering their involvement in 3 games as crew members. The other examples however are pretty good examples if that is what you are attempting to say. Actually to be honest the game (story wise) was really amazing up until the 5% in my eyes. I could not find fault with much by the way of the characters. Yea the Kai Leng ninja sword thing was annoying at times, but otherwise amazing.
 
5.      At which point do you think the quality of the writing changed the pace and feel of Mass Effect 3?
 The final base with the turret to simply emphasize how nothing happens there, from there it just slowly went down hill once the see you on the otherside speeches were done.
 
6.      Despite the popularity of the Shadow Broker text files in the Mass Effect 2 DLC [Lair of the Shadow Broker], would you pay for a new ending over a free text epilogue of the current endings?
Yes, the LoTSB worked in conjuction with what was already provided, it is not a good replacement for a major item. 

7.      Another point that fans argue about is whether the end game sequence of Mass Effect 3 was real or whether it was a dream. What is your opinion of this, where do you stand? Do either have good claims to support, or is this just a part of Bioware desiring speculation amongst fans?  How is this different from the people who support the Retake Movement (since they chose to ignore the last sequence of the game)?
 
 Again i am starting to wonder what you are attempting to further, as once again you use a single sentence to group a lot of people together. I stand that the ending was bad writing. I would like to think that Bioware nor EA would have the balls to give us a fake ending, watch their fans go crazy , and just keep tight-lipped about another ending. I can see why the theories are popular however, it is people's attempts at explaining the massive plotholes left, i personally do not believe in them.
 
 
Section 4: Economic Input
 
1.      Mass Effect 2 was known for having lots of Down-Loadable Content (DLC). Did you buy all of them? If not, which ones did you buy, and what was the reasoning behind buying them?
 Yes
 
 
2.      The Retake Movement has claimed responsibility over the recent decrease in EA stock prices, as well as causing the price of the game to decrease by 25%. In these instances, do you think the stigma against poor writing in entertainment will be a factor in the future aspects of entertainment, or will it be exclusive to the gaming industry?
 I dont know actually if it was Retake completely. A lot of people are unhappy, i have spent the last 3-4 weeks dealing with a lot of very unhappy customers demanding refunds(at roughly 18-22 hours a day,7 days a week). The pricing drop is a sign that a lot of stores are being stuck with stock that they simply can not sell.  I belive the stock dropping is probably due to the reaction by those that do not like the ending also considering that the summer drought is coming up, and Blizzard's much anticipated Diablo 3.

3.      Did you buy the “From Ashes” DLC? Given the premise of the plot, do you think the produces alienated themselves from their consumers by making them pay extra for a character that plays a crucial role in the history of the franchise, and have caused another rallying point for players in the Retake Movement?
..... Ok once again getting sick of you choosing to group every member into a single category. I own a CE i did not have to buy From Ashes. Had i owned a normal copy and not yet beat the ending im sure i would have bought it without a second thought. Yes people had access to the character but not the mission. I am not sure if it was right or wrong i can see both sides of the coin.

Modifié par Quietness, 05 avril 2012 - 06:16 .

[MPSai]

Have you completed Mass Effect 3?

Yes

Have you played the previous 2 installments of the Mass Effect franchise?

Yes


If you have, which character was your LI in each installment? Did this affect how you enjoyed the game?

Liara in all three installments. Marginally affected my enjoyment, see it more as a subplot or character development.


n Mass Effect 2, presuming you saved every team member during the final chapter, was the overlying stories of the characters the main influence in saving them?

Yes, I did every loyalty mission and took time to know the characters.


Did the reactions of renegade choices in the franchise forced you to play one way over the other

Not really, I always go with my instincts, tend to be either half and half or mostly Paragon with a dash of Renegade.


What are your favorite 3 memories of the story’s franchise? Is there a common theme among them?

I always found the Zhu's Hope mission in ME1 to be pretty memorable. The battle through the Collector Base was heartpounding. Mordin's singing is something I never get tired of. They're not really related.



Section 2: Bioware and Artistic Integrity

Do you believe video games are a form of art? Do you believe art is static or fluid?

Yes. Art is fluid, new forms and techniques develop all the time, but I think art has alot to do with effort and intent at the same time.


Throughout the third installment, some fans believed that Bioware /EA rewrote specific characters during important sequences. Do you have a similar opinion? If so, which characters do you have a problem with?

The only time I had a problem was with Shepard's pathetic and ineffectual behavior at the end of the game, just tiredly listening to the leader of her/his archenemy and deciding it has all the answers.


Do you think the Adam and Eve reference at the end of the game made sense, given the theme of co-existence between organic and synthetic organisms?

No. I thought it was a ham-handed and lazy way to try and make the ending seem deep and didn't really fit the theme or feel of the series.


Do you think Mass Effect 3 had more humorous moments than previous installments? If so, do you think it was to cut the theme of war and death in the game, or was this an attempt to detract fans from over thinking the ending?

Probably not as much as ME2, but not much less either. It did have alot of funny moments and nods to inside jokes, I think this was more being affectionate with the characters than anything else.


Given Bioware’s previous experience with incorporating player feedback into the series, do you think changing the ending all together would compromise Bioware / EA’s previous decisions and artistic integrity?

No. I think not changing it would compromise their artistic integrity. By all accounts it seems like they were working with an incomplete script (since according to Final Hours they didn't even know how the game was going to end as late as November) and had to rush an ending for a deadline. That's just about the exact opposite of artistic integrity.


With the death of well accepted characters in Mass Effect 3 as a part of trying close that character’s story, what makes stranding the crew any different?

The deaths of Mordin, Legion and Thane all had meaning, and the characters were given fitting ends. The stranding of the Normandy is just confusing, tonally weird (seeing as they all appear to be pleased that they're stranded on an unknown, seemingly uninhabited planet with no way to contact the outside world or find out what's happened with the war against the Reapers.) That and it seems like a quick, lazy and rather soulless attempt at an epilogue.



Do you think Bioware made the right choice in explaining the antagonist’s role in the series, or should it have been left alone?

Explaining it would have been fine if the antagonist's motivation had many any sense at all. The given reason is contradicted by the Reapers' behavior throughout all three games.


A lot of fans found the ending of Mass Effect 3 to be reminiscent of the ending’s of other franchises. Despite various amounts of plot holes in these franchises, they did well. What makes Mass Effect 3 different?

Bioware has shown the quality of their writing and their skill at their craft. To see such a shocking drop in quality at what is the most vital part of the story, ending the entire trilogy, is simply baffling as much as it is heartbreaking. That and the ending was a complete shift of tone and genre, introducing not only a new character but a supernatural element into the last 10 minutes of what was until then a rather grounded, techie, Star Trek-esque Sci-Fi.



Bioware used 3-dimensional facial rendering for voice actress Jessica Chobot’s character Diana Allers, but photo-shopped a picture of Miss England 2005 Hammasa Kohistani for the character Tali’Zorah vas Normandy. Why do you think Bioware didn’t do something similar for a character synonymous with the franchise itself? Given IGN’s defense of the game and its endorsements, do you think Jessica’s role had an influence in the site’s score of the game? Do you the Retake Movement is correct in making this presumption, or is it bias and looking for a scapegoat?

The cameo by an IGN correspondent was just unneeded and cheesy. She didn't add anything to the game, and it was nearly breaking the fourth wall. That they cared so little about not only revealing Tali's face, but cementing what an entire species in the series looks like with a quick photo manipulation is just tactless and lazy. I seem to be inspired to use the word "lazy" quite a bit, but that's what it is.

Section 3: The Endings

Given that the game has been released since March 6 (in North America) have you beaten the game? How many times have you replayed the game?

I've only played once so far. I'm planning to eventually play through again after the character face import is fixed.


What did you think of the ending? What is your position on it? Why do you have that opinion?

Abysmal. I have this opinion because I recognize and don't abide by bad writing, especially from talented professionals who I know can do better and who have repeatedly demonstrated they can do better.


Mass Effect 1 and 2 were both known for their replay-ability value, what about Mass Effect 3? Do you think the ending is the main factor in this inability to replay the game, or do you think it’s because Bioware has been largely quiet about these reactions? Do you think this is why they added multiplayer capabilities?

Multiplayer was likely added because multiplayer is a popular element in the highest grossing game series, Call of Duty, right now. That's just the publisher jumping on a bandwagon. It doesn't bother me, even if I think it was unneeded. The ending certainly saps my desire to replay it, this is the first time this has happened to me with any game or game series in my 20 years of gaming.



Some pivotal moments in Mass Effect 3 have fans debating whether or not Bioware is degrading the values and quality of known characters in the franchise. For the most part, fan opinion of Cerberus assassin Kai Leng’s portrayal in Mass Effect 3 has been negative, mostly described by fans as being due to having multiple authors since the character’s introduction in the novels creating inconsistence’s in his personality. Others examples are the pairing of Garrus and Tali if the player does not romance them in the previous installment of the franchise, and Joker (the pilot of the character’s ship) abandoning the fight during its climax. What is your opinion of this? Are these accurate examples?

Kai Leng probably shouldn't have been in the game. I haven't read the novels so I don't know what he's supposed to be like, but I don't really see how "space ninja" could be taken seriously. Especially in a series like Mass Effect. Suddenly having characters with katanas that can pierce the same armor that can protect the wearer in the vacuum of space was extremely distracting and corny. Especially in the same game that introduced a "blade" function for the omni-tool. A device everyone has.

Garrus and Tali hooking up didn't bother me too much, although it did feel thrown in. As for Joker I don't think him fleeing the battle was intentional, but it's another symptom of the ending having little to no thought put into it.

At which point do you think the quality of the writing changed the pace and feel of Mass Effect 3?

The point where the Citadel is moved to the Earth is the first really nonsensical plot point. I suspect it was to condense the fight on Earth and a final confrontation on the Citadel due to time or budget constraints. Or laziness. But the writing had a few problems even before that, the Crucible MacGuffin and the aforementioned Kai Leng to name a couple.


Despite the popularity of the Shadow Broker text files in the Mass Effect 2 DLC [Lair of the Shadow Broker], would you pay for a new ending over a free text epilogue of the current endings?

I would pay for a real, new ending that is of the quality Bioware is known for and that brings the trilogy to the satisfying conclusion it deserves.

Another point that fans argue about is whether the end game sequence of Mass Effect 3 was real or whether it was a dream. What is your opinion of this, where do you stand? Do either have good claims to support, or is this just a part of Bioware desiring speculation amongst fans

I think Indoc Theory works so well it's almost scary, and that it would be a great jumping off point to retcon the current endings and continue on from there in a DLC. But I honestly don't think it was intentional.

Section 4: Economic Input

Mass Effect 2 was known for having lots of Down-Loadable Content (DLC). Did you buy all of them? If not, which ones did you buy, and what was the reasoning behind buying them?

I had all the Cerberus Network ones, and I bought most of the others. I at least had Kasumi, Shadow Broker, Overlord, Arrival, and the appearance pack for Garrus, Thane, and Jack (mostly to give Garrus non-burnt armor.) I bought them because I loved the game and wanted more, none of them disappointed and they were of great quality.


The Retake Movement has claimed responsibility over the recent decrease in EA stock prices, as well as causing the price of the game to decrease by 25%. In these instances, do you think the stigma against poor writing in entertainment will be a factor in the future aspects of entertainment, or will it be exclusive to the gaming industry?

Whose to say, writing definitely doesn't seem to be a major concern in the games industry or Hollywood right now. That's probably why many people prefer a company like Bioware.


Did you buy the “From Ashes” DLC? Given the premise of the plot, do you think the produces alienated themselves from their consumers by making them pay extra for a character that plays a crucial role in the history of the franchise, and have caused another rallying point for players in the Retake Movement?

I had ordered the Collector's Edition before I even knew From Ashes was a thing so I was going to end up with it either way. I did understand people's concern though, considering it was assumed the character would (and he does) have an affect on the series lore. It certainly didn't help, but if this was the biggest problem the game had people would have forgotten about it pretty quick.

Modifié par MPSai, 05 avril 2012 - 06:25 .

[Infinityphoenix]

@Thornne
The Public Good is a hard concept to describe, but it's urban planning defines it as something that becomes known through collaborative planning processes of consensus building, inwhich the planner's task is to ensure that these processes area as inclusive as possible. However, the Public Good is something that is obtainable due to the inaction being an action against consensus. Essentially, the Public Good are the people who volunteer for the process, but the people who do not wish to be included influence the impact of those who volunteer. I'm sorry about if it's confusing, I can try again in the morning if you wish. Under everything, I know the "minority" is just that, a small fraction of the people who bought the game. Bioware/EA says that because we're only a small percentage of it's customer. But the concept of the Public Good states that the people who do argue, either on youtube or BSN or anywhere, should have the most influence to change in the industry.

The title I posted is just a tenative one that my teacher and I based our discussion on.

@jules_verne18
I try not to see that the Retakers and the Proenders as opposites, but rather as equals wanting the same thing; a ending to a great franchise. Their ideals are different, but I need to see why they are both similar and different. Both reject the ending as being a physical part of the game, preferring to head-canon the rest. Whether Sheppard was Indoctrinated or Bioware needed more time to put the ending together, the common goal between these two topics of debate is that the introduction of The Catalyst was a flimsy attempt to end the franchise. Yes, it did have the desired effect in giving the player lots to speculate and discuss about, but it also made it feel incomplete. I've seen people compare the ending to if Fight Club stopped 20 minutes before the ending of the movie. Lots to speculate about, but no definable answers.

I'm a Chemist/Geologist with lots of interest in other fields. Jack of all trades.

@Blahdog
Poor choice in words, will correct. Consumers can't demand from the Producers, and I think that where all the bad publicity about the Retake Movement is coming from. People can't see the difference between asking and telling when money is involved. I'm sorry about that.

@Nimrodell
Thanks! I'll take a look into it tomorrow morning. Thank you for all the good suggestions, I appreciate it.

@LilyasAvalon
I personally think Bioware's inability to have publically released a full statement about the response to the ending sooner than a month after the game was released (in North America) will blow back into the panel's face. Regardless of whether it's the news we want to hear or not, I have a feeling that there will be backlash against their decision. Regardless of whether or not it is art, Bioware has to understand that they need to take both positive and negative reviews. It hurts if the game is a product or an artform.

Thanks for answering the questions, I appreciate it !

@Quietness
Thank you for catching bias in my questions towards one side !  The point of me studying fan reactions is to write why, at the core of it all, why people are upset.  Questions have been corrected.  Thanks for answering .

@MPSai
Thanks for answering .

I know it would easier to go through search engines and study this in what's already on forums and on Youtube, but I'm a Salarian Scientist at heart, I have to get my hands dirty.

Modifié par Infinityphoenix, 05 avril 2012 - 06:41 .

[T_l_M_B_0]

[Section 1 – Prior Gameplay Experience]
1.      Have you completed Mass Effect 3?
Yes, I have
 
2.      If not, do you know how the trilogy ends?
Not applicable.
 
3.      Have you played the previous 2 installments of the Mass Effect franchise?
I have played Mass Effect 2 and watched several playthroughs of Mass Effect 1 on Youtube (due to it not being released on PS3).
 
4.      If you have, which character was your LI in each installment?  Did this affect how you enjoyed the game?
My LI was Ashley throughout each installment. I think it definitely affected how much I enjoyed the game (in a positive way).
 
5.      In Mass Effect 2, presuming you saved every team member during the final chapter, was the overlying stories of the characters the main influence in saving them?
I did save everyone in Mass Effect 2. Partially because of each of their stories, but also because I am a bit of a perfectionist.
 
6.      Did the reactions of renegade choices in the franchise forced you to play one way over the other?
I only ever played Paragon, so I don't have any proper knowledge of Renegade choices.
 
7.      What are your favorite 3 memories of the story’s franchise? Is there a common theme among them?
-Curing the Genophage + Mordin's Sacrifice
-Resolving the Quarian/Geth War 
-The Suicide Run in Mass Effect 2
There may not be a common theme, but all of them are large plot points that are a huge part of the story as a whole.
 
Section 2: Bioware and Artistic Integrity
 
1.      Do you believe video games are a form of art? Do you believe art is static or fluid?
I do believe games are an art, and art is fluid, not static.
 
2.      Throughout the third installment, some fans believed that Bioware /EA rewrote specific characters during important sequences. Do you have a similar opinion? If so, which characters do you have a problem with?
I don't have a similar opinion to this.
 
3.      Do you think the Adam and Eve reference at the end of the game made sense, given the theme of co-existence between organic and synthetic organisms?
No. Nothing about the end sequence made sense. The Adam and Eve thing in the Synthesis ending may have sounded good on paper, but does not fit into the game's established tone.
 
4.      Do you think Mass Effect 3 had more humorous moments than previous installments? If so, do you think it was to cut the theme of war and death in the game, or was this an attempt to detract fans from over thinking the ending?
Yes, it did have more humorous moments in my opinion, but I don't think it had anything to do with the ending. The more humorous moments provided a great distraction from all of the death happening around the galaxy.
 
5.      Given Bioware’s previous experience with incorporating player feedback into the series, do you think changing the ending all together would compromise Bioware / EA’s previous decisions and artistic integrity?
No, it would not comprimise "artistic integrity" no matter how much they believe it will.
 
6.      With the death of well accepted characters in Mass Effect 3 as a part of trying close that character’s story, what makes stranding the crew any different?
Deaths of other main characters made sense. Stranding the crew was just a cheap and worthless way of ending their stories, and the entire stranded crew sequence is physically impossible due to in game lore.
 
7.      Do you think Bioware made the right choice in explaining the antagonist’s role in the series, or should it have been left alone?
Explaining the Reapers role is all well and good, provided it makes sense. I would have been okay if the Reapers were never completely explained as long as it meant we didn't have to listen to nonsense.
 
8.      A lot of fans found the ending of Mass Effect 3 to be reminiscent of the ending’s of other franchises. Despite various amounts of plot holes in these franchises, they did well. What makes Mass Effect 3 different?
I don't know what other franchises are being refered to, so I don't think I an properly equipped to answer this question.
 
9.      Bioware used 3-dimensional facial rendering for voice actress Jessica Chobot’s character Diana Allers, but photo-shopped a picture of Miss England 2005 Hammasa Kohistani for the character Tali’Zorah vas Normandy. Why do you think Bioware didn’t do something similar for a character synonymous with the franchise itself? Given IGN’s defense of the game and its endorsements, do you think Jessica’s role had an influence in the site’s score of the game? Do you the Retake Movement is correct in making this presumption, or is it bias and looking for a scapegoat?
The inclusion of Allers at all shows a blatant attempt to earn better scores and promotion from IGN. The fact that they put so much into Allers (a character that nobody cares about) and so little effort in to Tali (a character that many people love) shows that Bioware no longer is making games for their fans, just the money. If they truly cared for the fans, they would have put effort into Tali's face and the reveal.

Section 3: The Endings
 
1.      Given that the game has been released since March 6 (in North America) have you beaten the game? How many times have you replayed the game?
I have played through the full game twice, and up to the Cerberus HQ again in a third file. 
 
2.      What did you think of the ending? What is your position on it? Why do you have that opinion?
The ending, as it is now, makes no sense and is in all honesty, terrible. However, I am a firm believer in the Indoctrination Theory, so with this taken in to consideration, the ending may be one of the best I have seen (provided IT proves to be true.).
 
3.      Mass Effect 1 and 2 were both known for their replay-ability value, what about Mass Effect 3? Do you think the ending is the main factor in this inability to replay the game, or do you think it’s because Bioware has been largely quiet about these reactions? Do you think this is why they added multiplayer capabilities?
The ending is a huge factor in why I personally haven't replayed the game more. Why put time in to it if none of it matters in the end anyways? The multiplayer may be to add more replayability, but it doesn't distract from the bad ending.
 
4.      Some pivotal moments in Mass Effect 3 have fans debating whether or not Bioware is degrading the values and quality of known characters in the franchise. For the most part, fan opinion of Cerberus assassin Kai Leng’s portrayal in Mass Effect 3 has been negative, mostly described by fans as being due to having multiple authors since the character’s introduction in the novels creating inconsistence’s in his personality. Others examples are the pairing of Garrus and Tali if the player does not romance them in the previous installment of the franchise, and Joker (the pilot of the character’s ship) abandoning the fight during its climax. What is your opinion of this? Are these accurate examples?
 I have no opinion on the Kai Leng example, as I have not read the books. I enjoyed the Garrus+Tali romance bit and thought it played nicely into their stories. Joker abandonning the fight at the end is completely out of character. Joker was going to go down with the ship in the beginning of Mass Effect 2 when the Collecters attacked, and now we are supposed to believe he would just abandon the battle? Not a chance.
 
5.      At which point do you think the quality of the writing changed the pace and feel of Mass Effect 3?
The quality of writing changed immediately after Shepard is hit by Harbinger's blast in from of the beam to the Citadel on Earth.
 
6.      Despite the popularity of the Shadow Broker text files in the Mass Effect 2 DLC [Lair of the Shadow Broker], would you pay for a new ending over a free text epilogue of the current endings?
I would absolutely pay for a new ending instead of having free text based epilogues.

7.      Another point that fans argue about is whether the end game sequence of Mass Effect 3 was real or whether it was a dream. What is your opinion of this, where do you stand? Do either have good claims to support, or is this just a part of Bioware desiring speculation amongst fans?  How is this different from the people who support the Retake Movement (since they chose to ignore the last sequence of the game)?
I support the Indoctrination Theory 100%, and think it is the only possible way that the plot holes introduced in the last moments to be explained. I think the IT and the Retake Movement basically go hand in hand.
 
Section 4: Economic Input
 
1.      Mass Effect 2 was known for having lots of Down-Loadable Content (DLC). Did you buy all of them? If not, which ones did you buy, and what was the reasoning behind buying them?
I bought every DLC. The reasons being that I love the series, and am a bit of a perfectionist.
 
2.      The Retake Movement has claimed responsibility over the recent decrease in EA stock prices, as well as causing the price of the game to decrease by 25%. In these instances, do you think the stigma against poor writing in entertainment will be a factor in the future aspects of entertainment, or will it be exclusive to the gaming industry?
I would hope that poor writing results in negative side effects in any form of entertainment, not just video games.
 
3.      Did you buy the “From Ashes” DLC? Given the premise of the plot, do you think the produces alienated themselves from their consumers by making them pay extra for a character that plays a crucial role in the history of the franchise, and have caused another rallying point for players in the Retake Movement?
I did buy From Ashes. In my opinion, the Retake Movement and the From Ashes DLC are completely unrelated. I think the Retake Movement is a valid cause, but all the ruckus caused over From Ashes is just a big over reaction.  

[LilyasAvalon]

Section 1
1. Yes

2. N/A

3. Yes

4. Kaidan in ME1, Garrus in ME2 and ME3

5. Yes

6. No

7. The ‘boss fight’ against the Saren Husk in ME1, telling TIM that ‘we were doing things my way now’ in ME2, the ending to the Genophage arc (If you cure it). They all gave feelings of victory against the presumably hopelessness.

Section 2
1. Everything in its own right is a form of art and creativity. Art in business however, if a producer expects to make any money off their art, has to be fluid and changing.

2. Characters seemed to change depending on their popularity against the majority of fans. Jacobs’s romance for example was completely written off, and the reason for it was COMPLETELY out of character.

3. Yes, I think it made sense, HOWEVER, that does not mean I think it was done well. The symbolism was POOR and AWFUL in my opinion and seemed to write off Shepard’s importance.

4. ME3 definitely had more humorous moments than ME2 and ME1 in my opinion, but I do think this was to cut the theme of war and death.

5.    No.

6.      
The deaths of characters such as Mordin, Thane,
Legion or Anderson were done beautifully. They sacrificed themselves for the
greater good. Mordin cured the genophage and gave new life to the krogan,
Legion sacrificed himself for his people, Thane sacrificed himself to save a
politicians life so the greater could be saved in the future, and Anderson was
the death of a mentor and a friend because of the betrayal of TIM. In my
opinion, ALL OF THESE characters had REASON for their death. There is NO REASON
why the Normandy was outrunning the blast, or had to get stranded on some random
planet only god knows where.

7.      
They should’ve left it alone, I repeat Vigil’s
words from ME1: ‘In the end, what does it matter?’ I was ALWAYS given the
impression we would not be given a reason for the reapers destruction or their
origins throughout ME1 and ME2. We did not need a reason for fighting them back
then, why should we be given one now? This is about survival, not philosophy.

8.    N/A

9.      
No matter how you look at it, there’s something
fishy about Chobot/Allers inclusion in the game altogether. When Felicia Day
was cast for a role in a DLC for DA2, at least Day had experience with voice
acting and was well received among fans. Chobot had NO previous experience with
voice acting and was NOT requested or wanted by fans AT ALL, so WHY was she
included? As for IGN’s defence, I feel this has MORE to do with how much EA has
paid for advertising. As sad as it is, money does indeed talk.

Modifié par LilyasAvalon, 05 avril 2012 - 06:48 .

[Trikormadenadon]

Section 1

1. Yes.

2. Irrelevant due to yes for 1 above.

3. Yes.

4. Liara in ME1, Miranda in ME2 and Liara again in both LotSB and ME3. Yes, I played through both ME1 and 2 multiple times so I could see all the LI interection scenes.

5. I did save them all but it wasn't the stories that prompted me to do it. I am a completionist so I did all the loyalty missions and all other side missions and I payed attention during the conversations during the final mission so I was able to choose the proper people for the proper jobs and thus they all survived.

6. No. I always play these types of games as good guy first then "bad guy" second.

7. I don't really have a "3 favorite memories" to write about but the memories that stick with me the most are the little things like people commenting on your actions in the background, or newscasts you overhear about things you've done during the game, or squad mate reactions to your actions. To this effect there is a theme, yes.


Section 2

1. I do not believe video games are a form of art. I believe art is fluid.

2. I do not have an opinion on this. I never noticed anything wrong with the writing except where it concerns the ending.

3. No I do not. I was hoping for something a bit deeper than Demonis Ex Machina.

4. No I think the ratio of comedy to serious was about the same as the first two games. I can see how it may seem to have more in ME3 due to the fact that there is more backstory involved however.

5. Since I don't think video games are art this question is not really relevant to me.

6. The difference is that there is no explaination as to HOW they got back to the Normandy or WHY Joker is fleeing since by the laws of physics they would not know the relay was destroyed until about 5 hours after it was destroyed. Not to mention the fact that the relay in the Sol system would not be destroyed until about 5 hours after the signal/light beam was sent so there is no reason anyone would stop fighting or run away...unless they were losing by that time. Either way, too many unanswered questions.

7. I am torn with this one. My logical mind always desires an explanation, however, given the explanation that was presented...no, they should have left it a mystery.

8. The ending as it is does not fit with this story and leaves too many unanswered questions.

9. I never really had an opinion either way about the Diana Allers character. As for Tali, I feel they should have done an in-game rendering, or not show her face at all. I would prefer the former to the latter however.


Section 3

1. I beat it once. I could not get past Tuchanka in 3 separate attempts to play it again.

2. I don't like the ending. The reason I don't like the ending is because I felt like I was gut-punched and about to puke after I saw it. The reason I felt this way is because MY Shepard would not have made any of those 3 choices. it saddened me also that BioWare ignored a truly Paragon ending. A full Paragon, no renegade action Shep would need a 4th option. One that involves stopping the reapers and not committing genocide.

3. I feel the ending is the main reason i don't have any desire to play the game again.

4. I liked all the stuff they did as far as story arcs go with the exception of Kai Leng. I have only played the games so I had no idea who this guy was so to find a trophy that declared him as my greatest enemy was telling me "Hey, My greatest enemy is a lame duck who makes no sense" Was not a good feeling. Personally, I feel that anything that was not in the first 2 games should not have been in the third game. In my opinion, only the stuff in the games should have been canon. The rest, even if offically released with BioWare's approval is just fan fiction in my opinion. i admit, it is a bit narrow minded in this regard but that's how I felt when I saw the trophy pop up.

5. Right after you get go up the elevator to nut town on the Citadel. (After the scene with Anderson.)

6. Most definitely yes.

7. I am quite sure Indoctrination theory was not BioWare's intention from the start, but I feel they should grab hold of it and run for the goal line. I would pay for this.

Section 4

1. I bought them all. I loved them all, even the weapon skins.

2. I certainly hope so, but most liekly will only affect the gaming industry, assuming it affects anything at all.

3. Yes I bought the CE. It was free with the CE but the CE is more expensive so yes, I bought the from Ashes DLC. No I do not think they aliented themselves for doing it that way. javik was not an integral part of the story in my opinion, just a nice addition. I also do not look at it as day 1 DLC either since it is free to those who bought the Collector's edition and it has always been that people who buy the Collector's Edition of games get stuff that people who do not do so do not get unless they pay for it.

[Nostradamoose]

Infinityphoenix wrote...

[Section 1 – Prior Gameplay Experience]
1.      Have you completed Mass Effect 3?
 YES
 
2.      If not, do you know how the trilogy ends?
 N/A
 
3.      Have you played the previous 2 installments of the Mass Effect franchise?
 Yes
 
4.      If you have, which character was your LI in each installment?  Did this affect how you enjoyed the game?
 Tali, / Ashley/ Miranda/ Liara

2: NO
 
5.      In Mass Effect 2, presuming you saved every team member during the final chapter, was the overlying stories of the characters the main influence in saving them?
 Somewhat, but wanting to have a "perfect" score came as well
 
6.      Did the reactions of renegade choices in the franchise forced you to play one way over the other?
 Yep
 
7.      What are your favorite 3 memories of the story’s franchise? Is there a common theme among them?
Genophage cure,
Virmire
Suicide Mission
 

Cold Hard Choice
 
Section 2: Bioware and Artistic Integrity
 
1.      Do you believe video games are a form of art? Do you believe art is static or fluid?
 
 Art, Art has got to be fluid. Could write paragraphs on this, but waay too drunk/ lazy

2.      Throughout the third installment, some fans believed that Bioware /EA rewrote specific characters during important sequences. Do you have a similar opinion? If so, which characters do you have a problem with?
 
 No, although, the replacing characters were... almost always lower grade carbon copies of the "dead" character, which always stays annoying.

3.      Do you think the Adam and Eve reference at the end of the game made sense, given the theme of co-existence between organic and synthetic organisms?
 Eve as Krogan "queen" was already brought back before.

The jungle does not bother me, what bothers me is HOW they got there (IE, it does not make sense)
 
4.      Do you think Mass Effect 3 had more humorous moments than previous installments? If so, do you think it was to cut the theme of war and death in the game, or was this an attempt to detract fans from over thinking the ending?
Less humorous moments, a whole lot less. It fit more the atmosphere, can't say I didn't like it.
 
5.      Given Bioware’s previous experience with incorporating player feedback into the series, do you think changing the ending all together would compromise Bioware / EA’s previous decisions and artistic integrity?
 
Changing 100% the ending is not something I ever wanted although I believed the ending was bad. Bioware's writing staff have got to keep a certain leeway towards fan's criticism, but, somehow, they have got to respect it. 

It does remain a narrative work, but a narrative work they are trying to sell on large scale to a public. BOTH have to be respected.
 
6.      With the death of well accepted characters in Mass Effect 3 as a part of trying close that character’s story, what makes stranding the crew any different?
 Don't care, seriously, it's the how that matter there
 
 
7.      Do you think Bioware made the right choice in explaining the antagonist’s role in the series, or should it have been left alone?
left alone or slightly foreshadowed, but I don't believe they can undo it now. 
 
8.      A lot of fans found the ending of Mass Effect 3 to be reminiscent of the ending’s of other franchises. Despite various amounts of plot holes in these franchises, they did well. What makes Mass Effect 3 different?
 
it's pretty much like the other 2 endings variation to the trilogy, let's not hide ourselves. But however plot-holey those were, they were still coherent in the story (if taken apart from the rest of the lore)

But right now, it's the coherence that hurts bad... And the fact that it was supposed to be a conclusion.
 
 
9.      Bioware used 3-dimensional facial rendering for voice actress Jessica Chobot’s character Diana Allers, but photo-shopped a picture of Miss England 2005 Hammasa Kohistani for the character Tali’Zorah vas Normandy. Why do you think Bioware didn’t do something similar for a character synonymous with the franchise itself? Given IGN’s defense of the game and its endorsements, do you think Jessica’s role had an influence in the site’s score of the game? Do you the Retake Movement is correct in making this presumption, or is it bias and looking for a scapegoat?

Tali did not bother me
Ign defense ; Somewhat, the appearance of impartiality of IGN was not there, while IGN's opionion MIGHT be impartial, there was never any appearance of it due to having a member of the editorial staff so close to the game. (but that's the Law person talking in me).

It is not bias, IGN should have kept their mouth shut, appearance of partiality was too present for them to make ANY valid commentary on this situation,

Section 3: The Endings
 
1.      Given that the game has been released since March 6 (in North America) have you beaten the game? How many times have you replayed the game?
 1 just finished replaying it.
 
2.      What did you think of the ending? What is your position on it? Why do you have that opinion?
 ****, it's incoherent, The transition work is more than lackluster, cracked.com's article 
http://www.cracked.c...-action-movies/ point # 4 is exactly what I have to say.

How the hell can I be teleported from one point to another like that? WTF happened? Why am I laying naked in the streets like that?
AWWWW!!!?
 
3.      Mass Effect 1 and 2 were both known for their replay-ability value, what about Mass Effect 3? Do you think the ending is the main factor in this inability to replay the game, or do you think it’s because Bioware has been largely quiet about these reactions? Do you think this is why they added multiplayer capabilities?
 It's replayable, but hey, after 2 times, it gets old. 

Multiplayer works, and it's fine I am not gonna complain about it.
 
 
4.      Some pivotal moments in Mass Effect 3 have fans debating whether or not Bioware is degrading the values and quality of known characters in the franchise. For the most part, fan opinion of Cerberus assassin Kai Leng’s portrayal in Mass Effect 3 has been negative, mostly described by fans as being due to having multiple authors since the character’s introduction in the novels creating inconsistence’s in his personality. Others examples are the pairing of Garrus and Tali if the player does not romance them in the previous installment of the franchise, and Joker (the pilot of the character’s ship) abandoning the fight during its climax. What is your opinion of this? Are these accurate examples?
 
Kai Leng is an annoyance, but hey, it works

Garrus and tali, well, it's fan feedback. You know fans used to ask to have characters move around the ship on their own and have discussions. That's what they did, so hey! like that.


Normandy leaving the ship : Wtf happened? Refer to previous question (now please, tell me why I'm laying naked in my bed next to a dead body, what the **** happened, you didn't explain me in the cutscene, I SAW NOTHING!!!)
 
 
  
5.      At which point do you think the quality of the writing changed the pace and feel of Mass Effect 3?
 Linearity was a giveaway, as soon as Hackett told me the crucible was not working, then it all went to ****.
 
6.      Despite the popularity of the Shadow Broker text files in the Mass Effect 2 DLC [Lair of the Shadow Broker], would you pay for a new ending over a free text epilogue of the current endings?
 
Pay? no, Enjoy it thoroughly yes

Well... Pay... maybe, but not over 1 or 2 bucks. You know, an actual newspaper's worth. Wouldn't be that happy about paying though.

7.      Another point that fans argue about is whether the end game sequence of Mass Effect 3 was real or whether it was a dream. What is your opinion of this, where do you stand? Do either have good claims to support, or is this just a part of Bioware desiring speculation amongst fans?  How is this different from the people who support the Retake Movement (since they chose to ignore the last sequence of the game)?
 
 (sarcasm) oh come on, everyone knows the indoctrination theory is right, but I prefer to support the Intoxication theory, the ONLY real theory. Hell it's a fact by now (/sarcasm)

Indoctrination theory is grasping at straws. the ending is to be taken at face value, anything else is simply wishfull thinking.

Hanlon,s razor : Bioware dropped the ball on the ending and that's it. The ball is thus in their camp to fix it.
 
 
Section 4: Economic Input
 
1.      Mass Effect 2 was known for having lots of Down-Loadable Content (DLC). Did you buy all of them? If not, which ones did you buy, and what was the reasoning behind buying them?
 Kasumi

Characters are always nice to have. 

Thinking about buying lair of the shadow broker AND arrival. Good comments since I came back on the forums.
 
 
2.      The Retake Movement has claimed responsibility over the recent decrease in EA stock prices, as well as causing the price of the game to decrease by 25%. In these instances, do you think the stigma against poor writing in entertainment will be a factor in the future aspects of entertainment, or will it be exclusive to the gaming industry?
 
 They claimed, doesn't mean it was right though. Stocks don't work that way.

Stocks actually went up since January for EA, soooooooooo....

Price of the game, Blockbusters tend to lower price faster than other games as well.
 
  
3.      Did you buy the “From Ashes” DLC? Given the premise of the plot, do you think the produces alienated themselves from their consumers by making them pay extra for a character that plays a crucial role in the history of the franchise, and have caused another rallying point for players in the Retake Movement?

CE edition, came with it in the box.


But yea, when I heard about it I felt like I was being treated like a milking cow.

[Plageon]

[Section 1 – Prior Gameplay Experience]
1. Have you completed Mass Effect 3?
 YES

2. If not, do you know how the trilogy ends?


3. Have you played the previous 2 installments of the Mass Effect franchise?
YES

4. If you have, which character was your LI in each installment? Did this affect how you enjoyed the game?
1..ASHLEY 2. NONE 3. ASHLEY. IT WAS FUN TO STAY COMMITED TO ONE PERSON.

5. In Mass Effect 2, presuming you saved every team member during the final chapter, was the overlying stories of the characters the main influence in saving them?
YES

6. Did the reactions of renegade choices in the franchise forced you to play one way over the other?
MORE OFTEN THEN NOT YES

7. What are your favorite 3 memories of the story’s franchise? Is there a common theme among them?
KILLING SOVEREIGN, JUMPING TO THE OMEGA 4 RELAY, AND FIGHTING THE REAPERS ABOVE EARTH. i LOVE ME SOME EPIC SPACE BATTLES.


Section 2: Bioware and Artistic Integrity

1. Do you believe video games are a form of art? Do you believe art is static or fluid?
VIDEO GAMES ARE ART, FLUID ART

2. Throughout the third installment, some fans believed that Bioware /EA rewrote specific characters during important sequences. Do you have a similar opinion? If so, which characters do you have a problem with?
NOT REALLY FROM WHAT I NOTICED

3. Do you think the Adam and Eve reference at the end of the game made sense, given the theme of co-existence between organic and synthetic organisms?
NO, THE REFERENCE WAS THROWN IN JUST TO BE THERE, FELT TACKED ON.

4. Do you think Mass Effect 3 had more humorous moments than previous installments? If so, do you think it was to cut the theme of war and death in the game, or was this an attempt to detract fans from over thinking the ending?
THE SECOND GAME HAD MORE HUMOR IMO. 3 HAD MORE LOSS AND SACRIFICE IN IT.

5. Given Bioware’s previous experience with incorporating player feedback into the series, do you think changing the ending all together would compromise Bioware / EA’s previous decisions and artistic integrity?
YES, I DONT WANT THEM TO CHANGE THE ENDING ALL TOGETHER, JUST TO MAKE MORE OPTIONS AND ALLOW THE CHOICES MADE IN THE GAMES TO MATTER IN THE END.

6. With the death of well accepted characters in Mass Effect 3 as a part of trying close that character’s story, what makes stranding the crew any different?
THEY WERE RUNNING AWAY FOR NO REASON, IT WAS A NARRITIVE CHOKE HOLD OF SORTS IN A GAME ALL ABOUT DECISIONS WHY DOES IT HAVE TO END UP IN THE SAME PLACE?


7. Do you think Bioware made the right choice in explaining the antagonist’s role in the series, or should it have been left alone?
THE REAPER ORIGIN WAS FLAWED LOGIC AND AN OBVIOUS LAST SECOND REWRITE BECAUSE OF THE SCRIPT LEAK.

8. A lot of fans found the ending of Mass Effect 3 to be reminiscent of the ending’s of other franchises. Despite various amounts of plot holes in these franchises, they did well. What makes Mass Effect 3 different?
MASS EFFECT IS ABOUT CHOICE, THE DEVS ENDED THE STORY HOW THEY THOUGHT IT SHOULD END, NOT BASED ON HOW SHEPARD, THE PLAYER, OR THE ESTABLISHED UNIVERSE WOULD HAVE ENDED IT.


9. Bioware used 3-dimensional facial rendering for voice actress Jessica Chobot’s character Diana Allers, but photo-shopped a picture of Miss England 2005 Hammasa Kohistani for the character Tali’Zorah vas Normandy. Why do you think Bioware didn’t do something similar for a character synonymous with the franchise itself? Given IGN’s defense of the game and its endorsements, do you think Jessica’s role had an influence in the site’s score of the game? Do you the Retake Movement is correct in making this presumption, or is it bias and looking for a scapegoat?
THIS IS A BIG LET DOWN TO MOST FANS OF THE FRANCHISE FOR SURE. I DO BELEIVE THAT BIG REVIEWERS OFTEN GIVE HYPED FRANCHISES GOOD REVIEWS EVEN IN UNWARRENTED ASPECTS.
Section 3: The Endings

1. Given that the game has been released since March 6 (in North America) have you beaten the game? How many times have you replayed the game?
BEAT IT IN A FEW DAYS. HAVE NOT PLAYED A ME TITLE SINCE.

2. What did you think of the ending? What is your position on it? Why do you have that opinion?
BAD. IT WAS OUT OF LEFT FEILD IN ANOTHER STADIUM. NO MATTER WHAT CHOICES YOU MAKE ALONG THE 3 GAMES EVERYONE ENDS UP AT THE SAME 3 CHOICES. ENDING A B OR C.

3. Mass Effect 1 and 2 were both known for their replay-ability value, what about Mass Effect 3? Do you think the ending is the main factor in this inability to replay the game, or do you think it’s because Bioware has been largely quiet about these reactions? Do you think this is why they added multiplayer capabilities?
THE MULTIPLAYER WAS A FINE ADDITION GIVEN THE WAR STORY OF THE THIRD GAME, I THINK IT WAS ADDED TO ALLOW FANS TO HAVE FUN WITH EACH OTHER. THE ENDING THOUGH KILLS ALL REPLAYABILITY FOR ALL 3 GAMES.

4. Some pivotal moments in Mass Effect 3 have fans debating whether or not Bioware is degrading the values and quality of known characters in the franchise. For the most part, fan opinion of Cerberus assassin Kai Leng’s portrayal in Mass Effect 3 has been negative, mostly described by fans as being due to having multiple authors since the character’s introduction in the novels creating inconsistence’s in his personality. Others examples are the pairing of Garrus and Tali if the player does not romance them in the previous installment of the franchise, and Joker (the pilot of the character’s ship) abandoning the fight during its climax. What is your opinion of this? Are these accurate examples?
JOKERS FLEEING IS THE ONLY ONE THAT SEEMS OUT OF CHARACTER TO ME.

5. At which point do you think the quality of the writing changed the pace and feel of Mass Effect 3?
AS SOON AS STARCHILD APPEARS.

6. Despite the popularity of the Shadow Broker text files in the Mass Effect 2 DLC [Lair of the Shadow Broker], would you pay for a new ending over a free text epilogue of the current endings?
I WOULD PAY FOR A NEW ENDING GLADLY, ONE THAT LET THINGS HAPPEN DIFFERENTLY ALONG SIDE THE ALREADY AVAILABLE ENDINGS.

7. Another point that fans argue about is whether the end game sequence of Mass Effect 3 was real or whether it was a dream. What is your opinion of this, where do you stand? Do either have good claims to support, or is this just a part of Bioware desiring speculation amongst fans? How is this different from the people who support the Retake Movement (since they chose to ignore the last sequence of the game)?
THE INDOCTRINATION THEORY IS A WAY TO UNDUE THE WRONGNESS OF THE GIVEN ENDING AND I CANT BLAME THEM FOR MAKING THIER OWN CANNON. THE RETAKE MOVEMENT, I THINK, WOULD BE OK IF THIS WAS USED TO GIVE US A DLC ENDING.

Section 4: Economic Input

1. Mass Effect 2 was known for having lots of Down-Loadable Content (DLC). Did you buy all of them? If not, which ones did you buy, and what was the reasoning behind buying them?
I BOUGHT THEM ALL, I LOVE MASS EFFECT SO MUCH, BUT I WILL NOT BUY ANYTHING FROM BIOWARE UNLESS THEY ADDRESS THE ENDING IN SOME WAY. MASS EFFECT WAS MY FAVORITE SERIES, BUT NOW IM BACK TO FALLOUT, WHERE YOUR ACTIONS MATTER IN THE END.


2. The Retake Movement has claimed responsibility over the recent decrease in EA stock prices, as well as causing the price of the game to decrease by 25%. In these instances, do you think the stigma against poor writing in entertainment will be a factor in the future aspects of entertainment, or will it be exclusive to the gaming industry?
IT SHOULD BE. THINGS SHOULD BE SOLD FOR WHAT THEY ARE, NOT WHAT THEY CLAIM TO BE.


3. Did you buy the “From Ashes” DLC? Given the premise of the plot, do you think the produces alienated themselves from their consumers by making them pay extra for a character that plays a crucial role in the history of the franchise, and have caused another rallying point for players in the Retake Movement?
I GOT IT IN THE COLLECTERS EDDITION, I DO NOT THINK THAT HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN DLC THOUGH. THE CHARACTER ALTERED MY WHOLE EXPERIENCE OF THE GAME, WITHOUT IT I WOULD DEFINATLEY BE MISSING OUT ON PART OF THE GAME.

[smegmalongbeach]

hope I get these correct

section 1

1- yes

2- n/a

3- yes

4 - liara w/ femshep [main import character 1-3] also tali in me2 [not ME3 yet] with broshep - though both these relationships made the game better. on play throughs I did not romance anyone it did not negatively affect the game

5- yes it did, but I am also a completionist in games

6- yes

7 -there are so many both big and small but some top ones are:
-having both the geth and quarians survive not knowing if it was possible [most satisfiying moment in gaming for me]
-grunt fighting rachnii reaper spawn to his death [I so thought he was dead] and then showing up alive and covered in blood [literally yelled and cheered, I just wanted to run up and tackle him I was so happy]
-saving david archer in the overlord dlc [that just felt good and kinda suprised me]
I guess they kinda have a theme

section 2

1- yes, of course games are art even ones that are not story heavy rpgs, and the second part is situational. in regards to Mass Effect i think it is entirely up to Casey Hudson, if he feels the story is not as powerful without the star child then it should not be changed, if he feels that not having the star child still fits his vision and does not take away from the story then it is his choice to do it. but Mass Effect is his baby and changes should not be forced by fans, EA, or anyone else. even if you dont agree, based on how awesome ME1 and ME2 [not to mention kotor] are and he was the one who brought this whole idea to bioware he can have this one pass, we are not perfect. 

2- no I dont agree with this

3- yes, it is kinda cheesy but it does fit. the cycle is over and the galaxy has a new begining. it kinda reminds me of old sci-fi / b-movie type of a ending

4- no I thought it was more serious than ME1 or ME2 but it still had alot of humor and inside jokes

5- fully changing it - yes, altering it - no * to clarify more, if they fully change it that is realy spitting in the ME teams face and saying that it wasnt even remotely useful and that does comprimise the artistic integrity of the game, if it is altered that is not as bad and could mean many things. it could just mean you messed up on a few facts, you need to explain this part better, can we get another option or two, it needs more dialog. these kinds of constructive critisms are good and dont take away anything from the team or the game they created

6- I feel stranding the crew gives them the chance at a future together in the universe with no relays, sure this does add the tali/garus problem but life is no fun if you cant bend the rules once in awhile and just take things less serious [especially in sci-fi] so you dont have a heart attack at 35

7- either way is fine with me but I lean more towards the mystery of not knowing

8- mass effect fans are more cultish and expected far more in the ending than they were given, other games [not just bioware games] get more slack in their lore and writing because they are... well, not as good and dont invest you into the story as well as Mass Effect in my opinion [this sounds kind of negative but I really think it is true]

9- this question is dumb and biased [in regards to the whole ign thing it really feels like your fishing for a certain answer] - as for talis picture no I dont think that is true and I think tali was not in 3D so it could not be modded into the game, also time restraints, again I think this was something that was added in just for "hard core" fans. personally I would of rather had it stay a mystery and be never revealed. kinda of cooler that way.

section 3

1- yes and currently on my 3rd play through

2- not great, it did have plot holes, but it was not a bad ending either. I thought it fit the games themes well and was deffinatly unexpected. i do feel it should of been fleshed out more and more polished. I really liked the options and what they represented in regards of possible solutions to the technology singularity, but the cinematics being the same was a really bad move. I am also fine with them not showing the state of the universe or the "rebuilding' I agree that it is better left playing out in our imagination rather than a minute long clip or some text boxes.

I really did like the way [intended or not] that in ME1 you are conditioned to think AI is bad with the geth and rouge AI. in ME2 you are introduced to two AI's that are not so bad [legion and edi] while still reinforcing that there are rouge AI's out there causing problems, the over lord DLC touches on bluring these lines too with david archer. then in ME3 you have you opinon on A.I. pushed further, how do you respond to edi's conversations and do you hook up her and joker. this says alot about your opinions on A.I. then how do you resolve the conflict between the geth and the quarians. at this point you should be firmly on one side or the other when it comes to A.I. and now you are prepared to make the choice to decide a new solution to the technological singularity. do you believe that the synthetics wiping out all organics is not a absolute and destroy the reapers breaking the cycle and let the future be left unknown? do you fear the singularity and choose to control the reapers? or do you not see a diffrence in organic and synthetic life and  choose syntesis? regardless of what you pick though you do have to reboot the galaxy to break the cycle. but the galaxy does have a new direction and hope, free of reapers.

3- I have some saves that I am intrested to see the diffrent outcomes that I will play through and I will be playing all 3 for along time to see tali and liara and all the other characters I love in their prime

4- excluding joker in that one scene at the end the rest of the characters stay true to their personalities [including joker]

5- I dont

6- yes

7- I think the ending is real. giving fans a fake ending would be realy messed up on biowares part and I do not think this is their intention. the indoctrination theory I believe is just a way for fans to write off the endings they were given and are unhappy with.

section 4

1 - yes I bought them all

2- people will allways not like creative work. but rely to much on trying to please the fans you get what generic hollywood and network tv have become. I dont see anything changing it has been this way [I think] forever. you will have people who take risks and people who play it safe. neither is wrong or right, both will succeed at times and fail at times. example - you dont care about what people think and do it your way you get clerks w/ the original ending, you try to mix what you like with selling tickets you get clerks 2 [im sure theres the opposite side of this too, I just cant think of one off the top of my head ]

3- I got the N7 edition so I got the DLC that way. No I dont think they did anything wrong with the DLC, the way I saw it was the content was not going to be ready in time to be certified on the disc so it was finished as soon as they got the chance [trusted people at bioware have stated it was still being worked on after the game was finished and I believe them] bioware then added it for fans of the lore and the Mass Effect universe instead of just scrapping it all together because of the dead line. actually a really cool move. would it of been even cooler if it was free? sure, but that is not the world we live in.


Does the Public Good have the right to affect the Artistic Integrity of the Private Sector Entertainment Industry?
[Whether or not the fans behind the Retake Mass Effect Movement are Justified]

of course they have the "right" too but in the end it is the creators choice [unless you consider fan fiction i guess] but if you are a fan of the series and creators it should be handled from a position of respect for them and the work done. not from hate and anger. if it affected you that negatively you should move on or maybe just take a break for a little bit. and if you truely feel you were decieved and lied too then you deffinately should just move on. some of the hate going on can not be healthy for some people. I mean the ending of mass effect fails in comparison to what has happened to the simpsons, you need to beable to move on if it is to hard to see something you love ruined. sad now thinking about the simpsons

Modifié par smegmalongbeach, 05 avril 2012 - 11:21 .

[AwesomeDudex64]

[Section 1 – Prior Gameplay Experience]
1.      Have you completed Mass Effect 3?

Yes
 
2.      If not, do you know how the trilogy ends?
 
 
3.      Have you played the previous 2 installments of the Mass Effect franchise?

 Yes
 
4.      If you have, which character was your LI in each installment?  Did this affect how you enjoyed the game?
 
No LI throughout the trilogy.
 
5.      In Mass Effect 2, presuming you saved every team member during the final chapter, was the overlying stories of the characters the main influence in saving them?

 Not necesarily. I don't like people dying under my command.
 
6.      Did the reactions of renegade choices in the franchise forced you to play one way over the other?

 I took the renegade path for both Mass Effect 1 & 2. However, renegade would doom me in the third installment so I took the paragon path.
 
7.      What are your favorite 3 memories of the story’s franchise? Is there a common theme among them?

 I don't have any favorites really; I like everything as a whole.
 
 
Section 2: Bioware and Artistic Integrity
 
1.      Do you believe video games are a form of art? Do you believe art is static or fluid?

 Yes, fluid.
 
2.      Throughout the third installment, some fans believed that Bioware /EA rewrote specific characters during important sequences. Do you have a similar opinion? If so, which characters do you have a problem with?
 
 
3.      Do you think the Adam and Eve reference at the end of the game made sense, given the theme of co-existence between organic and synthetic organisms?

 No.
 
4.      Do you think Mass Effect 3 had more humorous moments than previous installments? If so, do you think it was to cut the theme of war and death in the game, or was this an attempt to detract fans from over thinking the ending?

I'd say it was about the same as previous installments and I think it was to cut.
 
5.      Given Bioware’s previous experience with incorporating player feedback into the series, do you think changing the ending all together would compromise Bioware / EA’s previous decisions and artistic integrity?

If they don't change it because of "Artistic integrity" they've lost their Actual Integrity.
 
6.      With the death of well accepted characters in Mass Effect 3 as a part of trying close that character’s story, what makes stranding the crew any different?
 
The stranded crew makes no sense at all. Mordin, Thane, and a few others died with good reasons and made things better before dying.
 
 
7.      Do you think Bioware made the right choice in explaining the antagonist’s role in the series, or should it have been left alone?

 Left alone.
 
8.      A lot of fans found the ending of Mass Effect 3 to be reminiscent of the ending’s of other franchises. Despite various amounts of plot holes in these franchises, they did well. What makes Mass Effect 3 different?

 Mass Effect 3's ending feels like it was written by someone else. It does not match the theme of the entire franchise and completely contradicts it.
 
 
9.      Bioware used 3-dimensional facial rendering for voice actress Jessica Chobot’s character Diana Allers, but photo-shopped a picture of Miss England 2005 Hammasa Kohistani for the character Tali’Zorah vas Normandy. Why do you think Bioware didn’t do something similar for a character synonymous with the franchise itself? Given IGN’s defense of the game and its endorsements, do you think Jessica’s role had an influence in the site’s score of the game? Do you the Retake Movement is correct in making this presumption, or is it bias and looking for a scapegoat?

IGN is on EA's payroll so it's likely.










Section 3: The Endings
 
1.      Given that the game has been released since March 6 (in North America) have you beaten the game? How many times have you replayed the game?

 Twice but the first play was rushed.
 
2.      What did you think of the ending? What is your position on it? Why do you have that opinion?

 The ending is an abomination. I think it needs to be fixed because it makes no sense, does not fit within the universe and contradicts everything Mass Effect.
 
3.      Mass Effect 1 and 2 were both known for their replay-ability value, what about Mass Effect 3? Do you think the ending is the main factor in this inability to replay the game, or do you think it’s because Bioware has been largely quiet about these reactions? Do you think this is why they added multiplayer capabilities?
 
The ending kills replayability in my opinion. Why replay when you'll always get the same bad ending? I think multiplayer was added because EA demanded it.
 
 
4.      Some pivotal moments in Mass Effect 3 have fans debating whether or not Bioware is degrading the values and quality of known characters in the franchise. For the most part, fan opinion of Cerberus assassin Kai Leng’s portrayal in Mass Effect 3 has been negative, mostly described by fans as being due to having multiple authors since the character’s introduction in the novels creating inconsistence’s in his personality. Others examples are the pairing of Garrus and Tali if the player does not romance them in the previous installment of the franchise, and Joker (the pilot of the character’s ship) abandoning the fight during its climax. What is your opinion of this? Are these accurate examples?

 I honestly couldn't care less about Kai Leng. He wants to have a sword in Mass Effect's day and age, fine. Tali and Garrus are not good examples because it fits. Also Joker would never abandon Shepard.
 

5.      At which point do you think the quality of the writing changed the pace and feel of Mass Effect 3?
 
Well the reveal of the crucible felt pretty cheap.
 
6.      Despite the popularity of the Shadow Broker text files in the Mass Effect 2 DLC [Lair of the Shadow Broker], would you pay for a new ending over a free text epilogue of the current endings?
 
I would never pay for something that should have came in the game already. If they try to give a epilogue that is purely text I will have to cut ties with Bioware and EA. Text is not how I want my journey to end.

7.      Another point that fans argue about is whether the end game sequence of Mass Effect 3 was real or whether it was a dream. What is your opinion of this, where do you stand? Do either have good claims to support, or is this just a part of Bioware desiring speculation amongst fans?  How is this different from the people who support the Retake Movement (since they chose to ignore the last sequence of the game)?
 
I honestly don't care. I just want a different ending. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Section 4: Economic Input
 
1.      Mass Effect 2 was known for having lots of Down-Loadable Content (DLC). Did you buy all of them? If not, which ones did you buy, and what was the reasoning behind buying them?

 I bought all of them except Genesis since I already had Mass Effect 1.
 
 
2.      The Retake Movement has claimed responsibility over the recent decrease in EA stock prices, as well as causing the price of the game to decrease by 25%. In these instances, do you think the stigma against poor writing in entertainment will be a factor in the future aspects of entertainment, or will it be exclusive to the gaming industry?
 
 Future aspects of entertainment.
 
 
 
 
 
3.      Did you buy the “From Ashes” DLC? Given the premise of the plot, do you think the produces alienated themselves from their consumers by making them pay extra for a character that plays a crucial role in the history of the franchise, and have caused another rallying point for players in the Retake Movement?

I did not purchase 'From Ashes". I felt that it should have been part of the game already. It's crucial because the character is prothean. They've played a huge role in this franchise and it was just a way to milk the loyal fan base.

[LilyasAvalon]

Section 3

1.      
I finished the game about 2 days after I got it.
I’ve replayed it once since, which took 2 weeks, and got through about the
first 3 hours in a 3rd playthrough, before I gave up.

2.      
I thought the endings were just plain insulting
to the fans and EXTREMELY rushed at best. You line the endings up side by side
and they are pretty much the same ending, with maybe one CGI in difference and
of course, the colour.

3.      
What’s the point in going through the journey if
the endings are all similar? I had SEVERAL saves lined up for ME3, but knowing
the endings and outcomes, I can’t be bothered going through ANY of them. I don’t
know why multiplayer was added, but being how simple it is, I doubt that’s why
it was added.

4.      
Yes, they are accurate.

5.      
Just before the fight with Kai Leng.

6.      
YES.

7.      
I do not think the Indoctrination/Hallucination
Theory is canon. Bioware had NO intension of this and it is a fan made theory
created by people to make light of a bad situation.

Section 4

1.      
The only DLC I did not buy was Genesis. Genesis
does not do a good enough job summing up ME1 or it’s decisions. The rest of the
DLCs I bought because the smaller ones, like the Firepower pack or Alt.
appearance packs were relatively cheap. I LOVED the weapons in the Firepower
pack. And I ALWAYS buy story DLC.

2.      
N/A

3.      
From Ashes was included in the CE. I have become
used to the exclusion of characters like this though for DLC, such as Shale and
Sebastian. 

Modifié par LilyasAvalon, 05 avril 2012 - 07:00 .

[Eulalia Danae]

[Section 1 – Prior Gameplay Experience]
1.      Have you completed Mass Effect 3?

Yes, I have.

 
3.      Have you played the previous 2 installments of the Mass Effect franchise?

 I have indeed.
 
4.      If you have, which character was your LI in each installment?  Did this affect how you enjoyed the game?
First Playtrhough: Kaidan (ME1) No one (ME2) Kaidan (ME3)
Second Playthrough: Kaidan (ME1) Thane (ME2)  have not played through ME3 a second time, or even touched it since I finished the endings.
 
I've always enjoyed the romance aspect of the game, as I do in most games that apply it.

5.      In Mass Effect 2, presuming you saved every team member during the final chapter, was the overlying stories of the characters the main influence in saving them?

 I restarted the ending about five tiimes in order to get the combinations just right, because I couldn't stand the thougt of losing any of my companions--at least not when there was a chance to save them. I wanted to see what their stories would be in the next installment of the game, and was hoping for a good ending for them in the long run.
 
6.      Did the reactions of renegade choices in the franchise forced you to play one way over the other?
No.
 
 
7.      What are your favorite 3 memories of the story’s franchise? Is there a common theme among them?

 The last moments of ME2 when shepard mourns who was lost or looks over who was saved --a victory moment in that we survived despite the odds. The ending of ME1, when despite the odds sovereign was defeated.  Thane's beating the crap out of Kai Leng....and managing to stop the assasination, despite the fact that he was on his death bed and odds were against him.

Apparently I really like those happy endings that come about despite the odds.
 
 
Section 2: Bioware and Artistic Integrity
 
1.      Do you believe video games are a form of art? Do you believe art is static or fluid?

Yes, I do. But as an artist myself, I'm not unfamiliar with the artistic process....and I've never ever heard an artist say art was static. We know better.
 
 
2.      Throughout the third installment, some fans believed that Bioware /EA rewrote specific characters during important sequences. Do you have a similar opinion? If so, which characters do you have a problem with?

I didn't feel that way, no, aside from the obvious character change of Shepard in the final moments of the game, when she/he seemed a lifeless puppet pulled along by strings of bad plot. I suppose the final moments of the game rewrote some other characters as well, such as Joker fleeing the scene and so on.
 
3.      Do you think the Adam and Eve reference at the end of the game made sense, given the theme of co-existence between organic and synthetic organisms?

 No I did not. I thought it was cliche, and horribly contrived. Lets be honest here....Joker and Edi would not get out and hug each other and prepare to make babies, they would be trying to contact earth to find out what happened. 
 
4.      Do you think Mass Effect 3 had more humorous moments than previous installments? If so, do you think it was to cut the theme of war and death in the game, or was this an attempt to detract fans from over thinking the ending?

No more than the others, no. I thought there was a good balance of humor in the game, it kept it fresh and interesting, and also worked as a good foil for the dark moments in the game.  And to be honest, if they had the time to distract us from the ending, they would have had time to write a decent ending.
 
 
5.      Given Bioware’s previous experience with incorporating player feedback into the series, do you think changing the ending all together would compromise Bioware / EA’s previous decisions and artistic integrity?

Not at all. I believe there artistic integrity was already compromised by deadlines and budgeting. This could give them a chance to do something bigger. The artistry and all decisions are still in their hands, no one has or will take that away from them.
 
 
6.      With the death of well accepted characters in Mass Effect 3 as a part of trying close that character’s story, what makes stranding the crew any different?

 The character deaths in story were apropriate and gave full respect to the character and their story.
Speculation is not a fitting end for anyone....hell, it's not even speculation, they've been utterly ignored if they and their story no longer matter.
 
 
7.      Do you think Bioware made the right choice in explaining the antagonist’s role in the series, or should it have been left alone?

A good writer could have pulled off either decision. But the explanation they chose was very poor, and didn't feel like it synced in with the reapers from the previous games.
 
 
8.      A lot of fans found the ending of Mass Effect 3 to be reminiscent of the ending’s of other franchises. Despite various amounts of plot holes in these franchises, they did well. What makes Mass Effect 3 different?

The other franchises were built for their endings, they had unified themes, the apropriate genre, and built up towards the ultimate end. Those franchises also did not advtertise themselves as something they weren't.
 
 
 
9.      Bioware used 3-dimensional facial rendering for voice actress Jessica Chobot’s character Diana Allers, but photo-shopped a picture of Miss England 2005 Hammasa Kohistani for the character Tali’Zorah vas Normandy. Why do you think Bioware didn’t do something similar for a character synonymous with the franchise itself? Given IGN’s defense of the game and its endorsements, do you think Jessica’s role had an influence in the site’s score of the game? Do you the Retake Movement is correct in making this presumption, or is it bias and looking for a scapegoat?

It was a picture available only for those who romanced Tali, I would have liked more effort put into it, but it was intended to be a small easter egg of sorts and can't really be compared to the rendering of a full character available in every play through.
I honestly don't care about IGN, they lost any amount of thought I put towards them with their behaviour towards their fans. It would be giving them too much effort to even come up with conspiracy theories.

Section 3: The Endings
 
1.      Given that the game has been released since March 6 (in North America) have you beaten the game? How many times have you replayed the game?

Beaten it, and haven't touched it since.
 
 
2.      What did you think of the ending? What is your position on it? Why do you have that opinion?

The ending was rushed, incomplete, and practically ductaped onto the game. They abandoned core themes, and applied an overarching theme that I actually find incredibly offensive.

 
 
3.      Mass Effect 1 and 2 were both known for their replay-ability value, what about Mass Effect 3? Do you think the ending is the main factor in this inability to replay the game, or do you think it’s because Bioware has been largely quiet about these reactions? Do you think this is why they added multiplayer capabilities?

I think they added multiplayer in order to capitalize on the shooter market. The replayability is entirely wrapped up in the lack of ending options and the fact that absolutely nothing done throughout the game has much effect aside from a few seconds of glowy explosion. That and it makes me sad every time I think of playing.
 
 
 
4.      Some pivotal moments in Mass Effect 3 have fans debating whether or not Bioware is degrading the values and quality of known characters in the franchise. For the most part, fan opinion of Cerberus assassin Kai Leng’s portrayal in Mass Effect 3 has been negative, mostly described by fans as being due to having multiple authors since the character’s introduction in the novels creating inconsistence’s in his personality. Others examples are the pairing of Garrus and Tali if the player does not romance them in the previous installment of the franchise, and Joker (the pilot of the character’s ship) abandoning the fight during its climax. What is your opinion of this? Are these accurate examples?

I liked Garrus and Tali shacking up. I thought it was cute.
Kai Leng was shallow and the cliche asian assassin. I never liked him, but I was content not to be bothered by that, especially since I was able to kill him.
As for Joker, it's an inconsistency that has bothered me, but I consider it wrapped up in the whole ending controversy.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
5.      At which point do you think the quality of the writing changed the pace and feel of Mass Effect 3?

When Shepard went up into the citadel. I did enjoy the last talk with anderson, but the illusive man's rambling was monotonous. Everything that followed the rising platform....eugh.
 
 
6.      Despite the popularity of the Shadow Broker text files in the Mass Effect 2 DLC [Lair of the Shadow Broker], would you pay for a new ending over a free text epilogue of the current endings?

Yes, I would.
 
7.      Another point that fans argue about is whether the end game sequence of Mass Effect 3 was real or whether it was a dream. What is your opinion of this, where do you stand? Do either have good claims to support, or is this just a part of Bioware desiring speculation amongst fans?  How is this different from the people who support the Retake Movement (since they chose to ignore the last sequence of the game)?
 
 
 I won't take a stand until I hear it from Bioware. If Bioware wants to keep this ending....I will pretend it's all a dream, because the ending is just that bad.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Section 4: Economic Input
 
1.      Mass Effect 2 was known for having lots of Down-Loadable Content (DLC). Did you buy all of them? If not, which ones did you buy, and what was the reasoning behind buying them?

I bought all but the shadow broker, whic h I was going to buy, but forgot to.
 
 
 
2.      The Retake Movement has claimed responsibility over the recent decrease in EA stock prices, as well as causing the price of the game to decrease by 25%. In these instances, do you think the stigma against poor writing in entertainment will be a factor in the future aspects of entertainment, or will it be exclusive to the gaming industry?
 
 Poor writing abounds in the entertainment industry, but I hope that this will encourage games to stop cutting corners when it comes to the quality of their narrative.
 
 
 
 
 
3.      Did you buy the “From Ashes” DLC? Given the premise of the plot, do you think the produces alienated themselves from their consumers by making them pay extra for a character that plays a crucial role in the history of the franchise, and have caused another rallying point for players in the Retake Movement?[/quote]

I did, before I fnished the game thinking that I would get to it with my second playthrough....but I haven't been able to play through the game again, and so the DLC remains unplayed. I do think it was another stone thrown at the consumer though, along with the online pass and multiplayer being necessary for the game.

[moater boat]

Section 1
1)Yes
2)N/A
3)Yes
4)Lots of playthroughs, but probably Liara the most
5)No, I just wanted the best ending
6)No played both paragon and renegade, though I tended towards paragon as I enjoy that sort of story more
7) a. Shepard becoming a specter in ME1
     b. Shepard stealing the Normandy to chase Saren
     c. The escape from the collector base at the end of ME2
     common theme? I don't know
Section 2
1) yes, is art. art is fluid
2)no opinion on this
3)No, not at all
4)I think it had less humor
5)No, I don't think it would
6)people dying makes sense. The crew getting stranded is baffling and makes no sense.
7) explaining it was a horrible mistake. The reapers lost their Lovecraftian level of horror
8) that depends on what franchises you are talking about. If you are refering to certain TV shows then I would say it is the fact the TV shows are broken into stand alone episodes that are judged individually, whereas a game, and one could say even a triligoy, must be judged by the entire story. Obviously the ending is a very important part of the story
9) I have no idea why Bioware made Tali's face the way they did. I don't think Jessica Chobot's appearance in the game influenced the review much if at all. I think IGN and media like it are simply non-objective mouthpieces for the gaming industry. I think the retake movement is right to be angry at IGN for an essentially dishonest review, but I think the whole Jessica Chobot part of it should just be forgotten about

Section 3
1)beaten it twice, almost done with a third playthrough
2) It was so bad it retroactively ruined the entire series. Aside from the horrible writing and the plotholes, it completely removed any serious player input. Player input is the hallmark of videogames. In Super Mario Brothers, a game release on NES 27 years ago, the final level, 8-4, had more choices, more options for player input than the the ending of ME3. It doesn't matter what you did in all 3 games before ME3, the ending was predetermined.
3)replayability has been hurt by the ending. It is a struggle for me to replay. The only reason I am doing it is because I hope it will get fixed. I don't think this is why multiplayer was added, though.
4)Kai Lang is lame, happy for Garrus and Tali, don't know wtf is up with joker
5)As soon as it started with the Reaper attack, and didn't mention what happened during the past six months, It was all downhill from there.
6) I would pay for a good ending, grudgingly
7) I think the IT holds some water. I suspect that bioware intended to go that route but ran out of time

Section 4
1)yes
2)I don't even think it will significantly effect the gaming industry
3)day one DLC for what is pretty much a story essential character is BS.

[Thornne]

Infinityphoenix wrote...

@Thornne
The Public Good ... [defined] ...

Ok, got it.  If it is a specific academic term then I expect it makes sense in full context.  I'm just not familiar with that definition and I think laypersons who read the title (like myself) may misunderstand what you mean by it.

[GiarcYekrub]

[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
[Section 1 – Prior Gameplay Experience]
1.      Have you completed Mass Effect 3?
[/quote]
Yes[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
2.      If not, do you know how the trilogy ends?
[/quote]
N/A[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
3.      Have you played the previous 2 installments of the Mass Effect franchise?
[/quote]
Yes
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
4.      If you have, which character was your LI in each installment?  Did this affect how you enjoyed the game?
[/quote]
ManShep Liara/Miranda/N/A
FemShep Liara/Liara&Kelly/Liara
ManShep Ashley/Miranda/Ashley

I enjoyed them all, equally[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
5.      In Mass Effect 2, presuming you saved every team member during the final chapter, was the overlying stories of the characters the main influence in saving them?
[/quote]
No it was to get the perfect ending on ME2[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
6.      Did the reactions of renegade choices in the franchise forced you to play one way over the other?
[/quote]
Made me play multiple times, added plenty of replay value, still can't kill the queen or Wrex in ME1 or Morinth in ME2 regardless of alignment
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
7.      What are your favorite 3 memories of the story’s franchise? Is there a common theme among them?
[/quote]
The Vortex armor convosation outside purgatory
Joke/Shep face off after Thesia
Drugged up volus in ME2
All provoked an emotional response and are often overlooked in favour of the big payoffs which also like Grunt survives[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
Section 2: Bioware and Artistic Integrity
1.      Do you believe video games are a form of art? Do you believe art is static or fluid?
 [/quote]
Art definately, Created by
3D Animators... Artists
3D Graphic designers... Artists
Concept Artists
Voice Actors ... Artists
Composer ... Artist
Writers... Artist
And many more even writing the code is an art form itself, it may not be high brow but it is art.[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
2.      Throughout the third installment, some fans believed that Bioware /EA rewrote specific characters during important sequences. Do you have a similar opinion? If so, which characters do you have a problem with?
[/quote]
Diana Allers looked like DLC added to the game when Javik was cut for time constraints
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
3.      Do you think the Adam and Eve reference at the end of the game made sense, given the theme of co-existence between organic and synthetic organisms?
[/quote]
Eh? Oh EDI and Joker, I didn't pick up on an Adam and Eve reference, but I guess its the end of the trilogy and a new begining for the franchise. (I only got that scene in my synthsis run throughs)
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
4.      Do you think Mass Effect 3 had more humorous moments than previous installments? If so, do you think it was to cut the theme of war and death in the game, or was this an attempt to detract fans from over thinking the ending?
[/quote]
No, I think it had less overall, but I think it was more emotional due to the end of the trilogy.
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
5.      Given Bioware’s previous experience with incorporating player feedback into the series, do you think changing the ending all together would compromise Bioware / EA’s previous decisions and artistic integrity?
 [/quote]
Definately, If it required reinstating the relays and having vastly different end game gallaxies there is no way they could continue the franchise into the future with the only avenue for expansion being prequels(I hat prequels)[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
6.      With the death of well accepted characters in Mass Effect 3 as a part of trying close that character’s story, what makes stranding the crew any different?
[/quote]
They are resourceful crew they repaired the normandy when it crash in hostile conditions on the collector base, there is no reason they can't repair it again
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
7.      Do you think Bioware made the right choice in explaining the antagonist’s role in the series, or should it have been left alone?
[/quote]
Definately, they left it vague but filled in some of the blank spots, It advanced the plot. We don't even know if the the catalyst was an AI it could of been a VI representation of the the Reapers creation like Vigil[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
8.      A lot of fans found the ending of Mass Effect 3 to be reminiscent of the ending’s of other franchises. Despite various amounts of plot holes in these franchises, they did well. What makes Mass Effect 3 different?
 [/quote]
It's not.[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
9.      Bioware used 3-dimensional facial rendering for voice actress Jessica Chobot’s character Diana Allers, but photo-shopped a picture of Miss England 2005 Hammasa Kohistani for the character Tali’Zorah vas Normandy. Why do you think Bioware didn’t do something similar for a character synonymous with the franchise itself?
[/quote]
Cost for something many gamers would never see[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
Given IGN’s defense of the game and its endorsements, do you think Jessica’s role had an influence in the site’s score of the game?
[/quote]
No way, Mass Effect 3 is one of the best games out regardless
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
Do you the upset fans correct in making this presumption, or is it biased by looking for a scapegoat?
[/quote]
Scapegoat
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
Section 3: The Endings
1.      Given that the game has been released since March 6 (in North America) have you beaten the game? How many times have you replayed the game?
 [/quote]
2 Full plays:
Wrex and Ashley alive in both, both picked Synthsis:
Femshep Renagade all characters alive with alternate council imported (mainly paragon playthrough)
Manshep Paragon only Miranda,Kasumi, Morinth alive with original council imported (mainly paragon playthrough)
1 Final mission replay Cerberus HQ onwards to pick control.(Femshep)[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
2.What did you think of the ending? [/quote]
Nothing wrong with anything on the citadel, was wierd the being no final boss, but my dad who never plays video games uses the idea of bosses as one of the reasons video games are childish. The first think I did was tell him that they followed his opinion and didn't have a boss fight and the end instead had a adult conversation.
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
What is your position on it? 
[/quote]
proender[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
Why do you have that opinion?
[/quote]
Its how I expected it to end really, a choice of Kill or dominate/control. Synthsis was a surprise but given how closely Mass Effect 1 follow Matrix Reloaded I shouldn't of been surprised that distributing your code/dna thoughout the matr/galaxy and an truce being achieved was an option
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
3.      Mass Effect 1 and 2 were both known for their replay-ability value, what about Mass Effect 3?
[/quote]
Definately, played twice so far next I want to do an entire trilogy run
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
 Do you think the ending is the main factor in this inability to replay the game, or do you think it’s because Bioware has been largely quiet about these reactions?
[/quote]
N/A
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
Do you think this is why they added multiplayer capabilities?
[/quote]
No, they added it to attract the multiplayer crowd, sell them equiment packs, stop people completing it and selling it secondhand(which happened with ME1 & 2 regardless of percieved replayability some people don't have the time to replay the entire game) Also it adds to the atmosphere of a galaxy at war especially naming the characters
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
4.      Some pivotal moments in Mass Effect 3 have fans debating whether or not Bioware is degrading the values and quality of known characters in the franchise. For the most part, fan opinion of Cerberus assassin Kai Leng’s portrayal in Mass Effect 3 has been negative, mostly described by fans as being due to having multiple authors since the character’s introduction in the novels creating inconsistence’s in his personality. 
[/quote]
Never read the books but hes no longer the man he was he is controlled by the Illusive man, a vision of what shepard might of become if Miranda had got her way
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
Others examples are the pairing of Garrus and Tali if the player does not romance them in the previous installment of the franchise,
[/quote]
Its war, any safe harbour etc...
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
and Joker (the pilot of the character’s ship) abandoning the fight during its climax. What is your opinion of this? 
[/quote]
Well there has to be a reason for that, we didn't see for sheps perspective, like drawing harbinger away from the citadel so shep could activate it, its under Hackets command, so what ever he told them to do.[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
Are these accurate examples?
 [/quote]
I don't have any.[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
5.      At which point do you think the quality of the writing changed the pace and feel of Mass Effect 3?
[/quote]
I don't[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
6.      Despite the popularity of the Shadow Broker text files in the Mass Effect 2 DLC [Lair of the Shadow Broker], would you pay for a new ending over a free text epilogue of the current endings?
[/quote]
I buy all story related content regardless, but I'd think twice if it were a rewrite over and expansion
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
7.      Another point that fans argue about is whether the end game sequence of Mass Effect 3 was real or whether it was a dream. What is your opinion of this, where do you stand? 
[/quote]
Real
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
Do either have good claims to support, or is this just a part of Bioware desiring speculation amongst fans? 
[/quote]
Bioware ain't gonna end the game unconcluded in a dream sequence giving a choice that has no ultimate consequence that'll be ignored in future games, that would cause a bigger outcry
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
How is this different from the people who support a rewrite of the last sequence?
[/quote]
No idea, probally wants the catalyst to spoon feed them, like will relay destruction kill people?
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
Section 4: Economic Input
1.      Mass Effect 2 was known for having lots of Down-Loadable Content (DLC). Did you buy all of them? If not, which ones did you buy, and what was the reasoning behind buying them?
 [/quote]
All Story related ones, no costumes or weapons[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
2.      The Retake Movement has claimed responsibility over the recent decrease in EA stock prices, as well as causing the price of the game to decrease by 25%. In these instances, do you think the stigma against poor writing in entertainment will be a factor in the future aspects of entertainment, or will it be exclusive to the gaming industry?
[/quote]
I don't agree, the price drop always happens to keep the tail going if it drops out the top 10 most retails stop stocking it. I hope the ludicrous retake campain hasn't made it into the mainstream zeitgeist hopefully it'll remain confined to the fringes of fandom
[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
3.      Did you buy the “From Ashes” DLC? 
[/quote]
Day 1 and recommended it to friends who just bought the game since the price cut, who also purchased it[quote]Infinityphoenix wrote...
Given the premise of the plot, do you think the produces alienated themselves from their consumers by making them pay extra for a character that plays a crucial role in the history of the franchise, and have caused another rallying point for players upset about the vagueness of the ending?[/quote]
No Javik is a well written character that provides insight into the previous cycle, the cosmological imperitive is intresting and does make the game better but I paid for it to do that so I am pleased

Modifié par GiarcYekrub, 05 avril 2012 - 08:52 .

[nikki191]

[Section 1 – Prior Gameplay Experience]
1. Have you completed Mass Effect 3?
yes

2. If not, do you know how the trilogy ends?
NA

3. Have you played the previous 2 installments of the Mass Effect franchise?
YES

4. If you have, which character was your LI in each installment? Did this affect how you enjoyed the game?
Liara. not very much

5. In Mass Effect 2, presuming you saved every team member during the final chapter, was the overlying stories of the characters the main influence in saving them?
yes it was

6. Did the reactions of renegade choices in the franchise forced you to play one way over the other?
mostly yes

7. What are your favorite 3 memories of the story’s franchise? Is there a common theme among them?
shooting bottles with garus, the fight up the side of the citadel in ME1, tali drunk. no there isnt


Section 2: Bioware and Artistic Integrity

1. Do you believe video games are a form of art? Do you believe art is static or fluid?
no i believe they do however have artistic elements, art is fluid

2. Throughout the third installment, some fans believed that Bioware /EA rewrote specific characters during important sequences. Do you have a similar opinion? If so, which characters do you have a problem with?
im neutral on this

3. Do you think the Adam and Eve reference at the end of the game made sense, given the theme of co-existence between organic and synthetic organisms?
no i dont think it made sense

4. Do you think Mass Effect 3 had more humorous moments than previous installments? If so, do you think it was to cut the theme of war and death in the game, or was this an attempt to detract fans from over thinking the ending?
it seemed to be an emotional outlet. constant stress or negativity will lessen the themes

5. Given Bioware’s previous experience with incorporating player feedback into the series, do you think changing the ending all together would compromise Bioware / EA’s previous decisions and artistic integrity?
no i dont

6. With the death of well accepted characters in Mass Effect 3 as a part of trying close that character’s story, what makes stranding the crew any different?
because there was no closure it was unexpected thematically different from the rest of the game


7. Do you think Bioware made the right choice in explaining the antagonist’s role in the series, or should it have been left alone?
it should of been left alone

8. A lot of fans found the ending of Mass Effect 3 to be reminiscent of the ending’s of other franchises. Despite various amounts of plot holes in these franchises, they did well. What makes Mass Effect 3 different?
the main differnce with other endings is that they are almost always internally consistant with the logic of the universe, mass effect 3's ending resulted in nothing but confusion and frustration from the jarring change in theme and plot holes that made litterally no sense


9. Bioware used 3-dimensional facial rendering for voice actress Jessica Chobot’s character Diana Allers, but photo-shopped a picture of Miss England 2005 Hammasa Kohistani for the character Tali’Zorah vas Normandy. Why do you think Bioware didn’t do something similar for a character synonymous with the franchise itself? Given IGN’s defense of the game and its endorsements, do you think Jessica’s role had an influence in the site’s score of the game? Do you the upset fans correct in making this presumption, or is it biased by looking for a scapegoat?

honestly i think it was purely a financial choice and they either hoped people wouldnt notice or didnt care they were using stock images in the game.
yes i believe her role in the game influenced IGn's defence of the game and bioware and its review scores
Section 3: The Endings

1. Given that the game has been released since March 6 (in North America) have you beaten the game? How many times have you replayed the game?
yes ive beaten it, tried to replay twice but unable to continue

2. What did you think of the ending? What is your position on it? Why do you have that opinion?
confusing, rushed and nonsensical.i have that opinion because the ending felt thematically different than the rest of the series, it felt wrong and off

3. Mass Effect 1 and 2 were both known for their replay-ability value, what about Mass Effect 3? Do you think the ending is the main factor in this inability to replay the game, or do you think it’s because Bioware has been largely quiet about these reactions? Do you think this is why they added multiplayer capabilities?

i am unable to replay 3 or any other game in the series. the ending of 3 directly changes playability for me as its a case of "why bother nothing you do matters in the end ". biowares reaction has increase how i feel about replayability but its no tthe cause. i dont play multiplayer

4. Some pivotal moments in Mass Effect 3 have fans debating whether or not Bioware is degrading the values and quality of known characters in the franchise. For the most part, fan opinion of Cerberus assassin Kai Leng’s portrayal in Mass Effect 3 has been negative, mostly described by fans as being due to having multiple authors since the character’s introduction in the novels creating inconsistence’s in his personality. Others examples are the pairing of Garrus and Tali if the player does not romance them in the previous installment of the franchise, and Joker (the pilot of the character’s ship) abandoning the fight during its climax. What is your opinion of this? Are these accurate examples?

i dont have any opinion on this









5. At which point do you think the quality of the writing changed the pace and feel of Mass Effect 3?
the moment the laser hit at the end the quality of writing changed, yet the conversation with anderson was usual great writing we have seen

6. Despite the popularity of the Shadow Broker text files in the Mass Effect 2 DLC [Lair of the Shadow Broker], would you pay for a new ending over a free text epilogue of the current endings?

definitely not

7. Another point that fans argue about is whether the end game sequence of Mass Effect 3 was real or whether it was a dream. What is your opinion of this, where do you stand? Do either have good claims to support, or is this just a part of Bioware desiring speculation amongst fans? How is this different from the people who support a rewrite of the last sequence?

there is eveidence that it might of been heading towards a dream sequence but to me it looks like things were cut short to avoid delays












Section 4: Economic Input

1. Mass Effect 2 was known for having lots of Down-Loadable Content (DLC). Did you buy all of them? If not, which ones did you buy, and what was the reasoning behind buying them?



2. The Retake Movement has claimed responsibility over the recent decrease in EA stock prices, as well as causing the price of the game to decrease by 25%. In these instances, do you think the stigma against poor writing in entertainment will be a factor in the future aspects of entertainment, or will it be exclusive to the gaming industry?







3. Did you buy the “From Ashes” DLC? Given the premise of the plot, do you think the produces alienated themselves from their consumers by making them pay extra for a character that plays a crucial role in the history of the franchise, and have caused another rallying point for players upset about the vagueness of the ending?

[StealthTH]

Honestly "Does the Public Good have the right to affect the Artistic Integrity of the Private Sector Entertainment Industry?" is a very loaded question geared towards pushing people a certain direction. Granted most of the community knows the issues at hands, but for an over arching poll question this is terrible.

[Nidowa]

[Section 1 – Prior Gameplay Experience]
1.      Have you completed Mass Effect 3?
 
yes
 
3.      Have you played the previous 2 installments of the Mass Effect franchise?

yes
 
4.      If you have, which character was your LI in each installment?  Did this affect how you enjoyed the game?

in ME1 i romanced Liara, but i did try the Ash romance, and still ejoyed it
in ME2 it was Tali all the way, though i did like Miranda aswell, but i liked tali from the first game
in ME3 i romanced Tali and was very happy with the dologue (bit let down at not seing her face ingame (other then the picture) but i that didnt stop me from enjoying it and i think it was a major plus to the game for me
 
5.     
In Mass Effect 2, presuming you saved every team member during the
final chapter, was the overlying stories of the characters the main
influence in saving them?

Yes, the only characters i didnt like were Jack (realised my mestake in ME3) and Jacob
every other character found some way to make me feel for them, and enjoy their stories and yes that is why i tried my best to save them
 
6.      Did the reactions of renegade choices in the franchise forced you to play one way over the other?

No, i actualy found my shep to be very Gray,
in ME1 i was a good mix of renegade and paragon,
in ME2 i found myself being alot more renegade (except to crew)
and in ME3 i found myself being alot more paragon, but at the same time not taking any s*** from anyone (punching the quarian admeral is a good example) so i ended up with 3/4 paragon
 
7.      What are your favorite 3 memories of the story’s franchise? Is there a common theme among them?
 
first and definatly my favorite, Sovereign's conversation in the first game i love that twist and how menacing that made the reapers
Next would probably be the moment with Garrus, on the citadel, that scene was so well done, and it just felt like 2 best friends hanging out, releaveing stress
and lastly legion in the Rannock campaign, everything about that, from the fighter mission to the ending,
i loved the geth and how they fit in to the story, the idea that the quarians wronged them first and especialy the way legion had to give up his life to help the geth achive true induviduality

common theme, characters, Sovereign's menace, to legions unique views, to garrus and sheps bromance.
the characterisation was amazing
 
 
Section 2: Bioware and Artistic Integrity
 
1.      Do you believe video games are a form of art? Do you believe art is static or fluid?

first part, YES!, second part, fluid, definatly, with the idea of DLC/expansions and patches its definatly an artform that is in a unique place where it can better itself after release
 
2.     
Throughout the third installment, some fans believed that Bioware /EA
rewrote specific characters during important sequences. Do you have a
similar opinion? If so, which characters do you have a problem with?

for the most part no, i think alot of the characters were fine, some felt a bit shallow compaired to the books (Kai Leng) but for the most part i loved it, and almost everyone ending up in a place i was happy with (disregarding the ending of course)
i also feel shep wasnt himself in the ending, no scene has shep ever just said ok il do that, you can always ask why should i, or somthing like it
 
3.     
Do you think the Adam and Eve reference at the end of the game made
sense, given the theme of co-existence between organic and synthetic
organisms?

it made sense in terms of that theme,
in terms of everything else, no it really didnt
 
4.      Do you think Mass Effect 3 had more
humorous moments than previous installments? If so, do you think it was
to cut the theme of war and death in the game, or was this an attempt to
detract fans from over thinking the ending?

i think it had about the same, it also had the same type of humor (the most important part), it wasnt comedy channel humor it was character humor,
i dont think the ending was in mind when the writing of the humor happend, i think they are completly seperate
 
5.      Given
Bioware’s previous experience with incorporating player feedback into
the series, do you think changing the ending all together would
compromise Bioware / EA’s previous decisions and artistic integrity?

no i honestly dont, it would show that they are capable of taking on criticism and bettering their games in every way possible
games are a unique art where the players get much more invested in them then other media, and especialy so when you add entire options based on player imput (garrus and tali romances) (treynor and Cortezs romances) (an entire dlc becuase people wanted to see more of Liara)
 
6.     
With the death of well accepted characters in Mass Effect 3 as a part
of trying close that character’s story, what makes stranding the crew
any different?
 
 becuase every death had perpose, they didnt just die for no reason, hell even the ones that can commit suicide have very strong reasons why,
and there are very few side characters that just die aswell, and of the ones that do just die, well we have already seen a reaction to the fact that Kalreegar just dies, people wernt happy with that
stranding the crew is different because it makes NO SENSE, at all, and there is no reason behind it, there is also no way to stop it, only 2 other character will die nomatter what, and thats legion and Thane,
thane was terminaly ill, and Legion either sacrifices himself to uplift his people or dies trying to prevent shepard from killing his people
there is still choice here though
as there are 2 ways both of them can die, if you dont talk to thane he just dies from his illness rather then Kai Leng

there is no way to stop the randomness of the stranding the crew, it also dosnt make sense how your crew even got on to the normandy what with the shuttle destroyed
 
7.      Do you think Bioware made the
right choice in explaining the antagonist’s role in the series, or
should it have been left alone?
 
no i dont think they did,
part of the menace of the reapers was not knowing why they did, we could make guesses but we could never really know
and that worked and was good
their ending objective made UTTERLY NO SENSE, at least it made no sense for shep to just accept it,
i mean hours earlyer they devoted and entire campaign to showing us that the geth were victims, why do that if your then going to paint them and every other synthetic as bad guys and not even have shep protest
not to mention EDI,

also the only times synthetics were a threat to organics (besides the orignal morning war) was when the reapers were leading/controlling them
so that makes NO SENSE at all
 
8.      A lot of fans found
the ending of Mass Effect 3 to be reminiscent of the ending’s of other
franchises. Despite various amounts of plot holes in these franchises,
they did well. What makes Mass Effect 3 different?
 
 mass effect is all about choice,
its also a trilogy, the other franchises you mean (i assume Deus Ex) revolve around 1 character, and its more a story about morals and its also contained in that one game
in mass effect you are made to care about more then this one character, in fact you are made to esentualy be that character, and for them to be like you, or as you choose them to be, in Deus Ex, the character is mostly already set, and it more about the moral choices and thoes things rather then all the other characters like mass effect
 
9.     
Bioware used 3-dimensional facial rendering for voice actress Jessica
Chobot’s character Diana Allers, but photo-shopped a picture of Miss
England 2005 Hammasa Kohistani for the character Tali’Zorah vas
Normandy. Why do you think Bioware didn’t do something similar for a
character synonymous with the franchise itself? Given IGN’s defense of
the game and its endorsements, do you think Jessica’s role had an
influence in the site’s score of the game? Do you the Retake Movement is
correct in making this presumption, or is it bias and looking for a
scapegoat?
Section 3: The Endings

i do think there is a little bias but we cant proove it so il have to say no
also
im more annoyed they didnt either use Liz Sorka (the voice actor) or just give us an in game model, there was a perfect moment for it on Rannock aswell
i also think Diana Allers was energy waisted, not because she was bad, but becuase we already had a jernalist that would have fit better (and wasnt painfully out of place given the actor), then they could have spent the resourses on makeing her character on somthing else
 
1.     
Given that the game has been released since March 6 (in North America)
have you beaten the game? How many times have you replayed the game?

i have beaten the game once, tho i watched all the endings,
i have started my second playthrough but it took me about 2 weeks to bring myself to do this, and it was only to see the stuff i missed out on from my rushed 'must finish' playthrough
its very hard to be motivated to play again with the ending currently as it is
 
2.      What did you think of the ending? What is your position on it? Why do you have that opinion?

its horrible, utterly horrible, its just, 
it goes against everything the games have set up
the synthetic thing comes out fo left field and we cant even complain about it
oh and the catalyst, that characters existance makes the first game pointless

what did they need Sovereign to watch our civilisation develop when they have the catalyst,
why did sovereign need to send a signel to the citadel to start the invasion if it was part of the catalyst
why did the catalyst simply just modify the signel to fix it and then call the reapers from dark space
why didnt the catalyst just activate the citadel as a relay rather then accepting the keepers couldnt (why did he need the keepers int he first place
why did sovereign need to figh his way to the citadel to activate it
why did saren need to use the conduit to open the citadel arms when clearly the catalyst can do that (he opens the arms more when he lifts you up on the light elevator thing)
and finaly, his existance neuters the reapers, they are now lapdogs of the godchild thing >.>
 
3.     
Mass Effect 1 and 2 were both known for their replay-ability value,
what about Mass Effect 3? Do you think the ending is the main factor in
this inability to replay the game, or do you think it’s because Bioware
has been largely quiet about these reactions? Do you think this is why
they added multiplayer capabilities?
 
 the ending kill replayability, simple as that
i would not have plunged hundreds of hours in to these games knowint it was going to end like that
 
4.      Some
pivotal moments in Mass Effect 3 have fans debating whether or not
Bioware is degrading the values and quality of known characters in the
franchise. For the most part, fan opinion of Cerberus assassin Kai
Leng’s portrayal in Mass Effect 3 has been negative, mostly described by
fans as being due to having multiple authors since the character’s
introduction in the novels creating inconsistence’s in his
personality. Others examples are the pairing of Garrus and Tali if the
player does not romance them in the previous installment of the
franchise, and Joker (the pilot of the character’s ship) abandoning the
fight during its climax. What is your opinion of this? Are these
accurate examples?
 
 the last one, about joker is right,
Kai leng just wasnt explored enough, but for the most part i can accept how he terned out, i just remember him more from the third book
and as for tali and garrus, i hooked up with tali so i didnt get that one, and if i didnt romance either, then so be it, it makes for a funny scene and it also makes sense
 
5.      At which point do you think the quality of the writing changed the pace and feel of Mass Effect 3?

everything after the Cerberus base (except the final talks with companions, that was fine)
 
6.     
Despite the popularity of the Shadow Broker text files in the Mass
Effect 2 DLC [Lair of the Shadow Broker], would you pay for a new ending
over a free text epilogue of the current endings?

yes, i would, but only if it wasnt already planned, then i would expect it free
 
7.     
Another point that fans argue about is whether the end game sequence of
Mass Effect 3 was real or whether it was a dream. What is your opinion
of this, where do you stand? Do either have good claims to support, or
is this just a part of Bioware desiring speculation amongst fans?  How
is this different from the people who support the Retake Movement (since
they chose to ignore the last sequence of the game)?
 
 there is alot of evidence that it was a dream, and i hope it was only becuase it means there is more coming and the horribleness of the ending makes sense
i think there is just enough evidence to go both ways, not enough to be sure, but enough that you cant really discount it
i think it shows how bad the ending is, that people wish for it to be a dream then actualy happen
 
Section 4: Economic Input
 
1.     
Mass Effect 2 was known for having lots of Down-Loadable Content
(DLC). Did you buy all of them? If not, which ones did you buy, and what
was the reasoning behind buying them?
 
 i got them all, and loved them all
 
2.      The
Retake Movement has claimed responsibility over the recent decrease in
EA stock prices, as well as causing the price of the game to decrease by
25%. In these instances, do you think the stigma against poor writing
in entertainment will be a factor in the future aspects of
entertainment, or will it be exclusive to the gaming industry?

i think the decrease in stock and price is more becuase of the amount of people pointing out they outright lied to us, but im sure the horrible ending does add to this
 
3.     
Did you buy the “From Ashes” DLC? Given the premise of the plot, do you
think the produces alienated themselves from their consumers by making
them pay extra for a character that plays a crucial role in the history
of the franchise, and have caused another rallying point for players in
the Retake Movement?


i got the CE so i got the dlc free, but i do think it should have been a part of the full game