3841 réponses à ce sujet

[TMZuk]

Shepard108278 wrote...

From Tuchanka with Love wrote...

Synthetics will always destroy organics. The Reapers were needed to keep a balance in the Universe or risk complete destruction. Shepard opens up the door to new options. Shepard picks one of those options. Ending is not a cliche, happy ending. Not hard.

Very well put.

What a load of preposterous nonsense. Like the whole ending.

Blah, blah, blah. "we are your ascension so we slaughter you by the billions, we bomb your worlds into lifeless husks, we make you suffer in a million untold and unimagined ways.... to save you. Doh! If that is "salvation" then spare me, please. And who are the synthetics that should destroy organics? The Geth that just made peace with the Quarians?

It is so farfetched, so full of holes, so utterly ridiculous that it beats the cheapest pulp-novel I have ever read.

[fear_me]

TMZuk wrote...

Shepard108278 wrote...

From Tuchanka with Love wrote...

Synthetics will always destroy organics. The Reapers were needed to keep a balance in the Universe or risk complete destruction. Shepard opens up the door to new options. Shepard picks one of those options. Ending is not a cliche, happy ending. Not hard.

Very well put.

What a load of preposterous nonsense. Like the whole ending.

Blah, blah, blah. "we are your ascension so we slaughter you by the billions, we bomb your worlds into lifeless husks, we make you suffer in a million untold and unimagined ways.... to save you. Doh! If that is "salvation" then spare me, please. And who are the synthetics that should destroy organics? The Geth that just made peace with the Quarians?

It is so farfetched, so full of holes, so utterly ridiculous that it beats the cheapest pulp-novel I have ever read.

I agree 100%. anybody could see that it doesn't make any logical sense. the only ending that does make sense is an indoctrination one but that wasn't the intended "artistic" ending. Why would he want to control reapers when Hackett said earlier in the game that dead reapers is the only way to win this war. otherwise he'd be siding with cerberus and the illusive man. and why would he go synthesis. why would shepard want to rewrite the dna of every living organic being and every geth machine/reaper and somehow merge the organics and machines instantly into a half organic half machine synthesis species by some kind of "space magic". Why would the catalyst, whom supposedly his race  created the mass relays want them all destroyed in every outcome? what does that accomplish exactly?

[Shepard108278]

TMZuk wrote...

Shepard108278 wrote...

From Tuchanka with Love wrote...

Synthetics will always destroy organics. The Reapers were needed to keep a balance in the Universe or risk complete destruction. Shepard opens up the door to new options. Shepard picks one of those options. Ending is not a cliche, happy ending. Not hard.

Very well put.

What a load of preposterous nonsense. Like the whole ending.

Blah, blah, blah. "we are your ascension so we slaughter you by the billions, we bomb your worlds into lifeless husks, we make you suffer in a million untold and unimagined ways.... to save you. Doh! If that is "salvation" then spare me, please. And who are the synthetics that should destroy organics? The Geth that just made peace with the Quarians?

It is so farfetched, so full of holes, so utterly ridiculous that it beats the cheapest pulp-novel I have ever read.

I don't agree. While I disagree with the Starchild I can understand his reasoning just because you can't figure it out doesnt make it bad.

[ShadowBrumby]

Even though I still think that the ending forces Shepard to act Out Of Character and that it disregards the Mass Effect universe's lore that was established by Bioware, I pray that it helps to reveals how they decided on the endings for Mass Effect. However to help sweeten the deal they could add a *complete* N7 Arsenal Pack to it (I feel somewhat cheated how Australia only got 4 out of 6 pieces for the Collectors Edition).

[AndrewLBC]

Like I've mentioned before... it's as if the entire Dev team at Bioware decided to all go on vacation after they finished Thessia and handed over the job of completing the trilogy to the new guy in the office who usually just fetches coffee and has never played either ME1 or ME2.

There is absolutely no way the same brilliant minds who created everything leading up to 'priority earth' all decided one day that it was actually a good idea to abandon the most important aspects of the series 30 minutes before the ending... only to be replaced with garbage like auto-dialogue, a new antagonist, and throwing out the 3 game long goal to destroy the reapers, replacing it with some bullsh*t fed to you by hologram kid.

This video is the best critique I've seen so far.

[fear_me]

AndrewLBC wrote...

Like I've mentioned before... it's as if the entire Dev team at Bioware decided to all go on vacation after they finished Thessia and handed over the job of completing the trilogy to the new guy in the office who usually just fetches coffee and has never played either ME1 or ME2.

There is absolutely no way the same brilliant minds who created everything leading up to 'priority earth' all decided one day that it was actually a good idea to abandon the most important aspects of the series 30 minutes before the ending... only to be replaced with garbage like auto-dialogue, a new antagonist, and throwing out the 3 game long goal to destroy the reapers, replacing it with some bullsh*t fed to you by hologram kid.

This video is the best critique I've seen so far.

thanks for that video.. very well done and it explains what made mass effect series so great and why so many fans are let down by the ending, myself included.

[Sejborg]

TMZuk wrote...

Shepard108278 wrote...

From Tuchanka with Love wrote...

Synthetics will always destroy organics. The Reapers were needed to keep a balance in the Universe or risk complete destruction. Shepard opens up the door to new options. Shepard picks one of those options. Ending is not a cliche, happy ending. Not hard.

Very well put.

What a load of preposterous nonsense. Like the whole ending.

Blah, blah, blah. "we are your ascension so we slaughter you by the billions, we bomb your worlds into lifeless husks, we make you suffer in a million untold and unimagined ways.... to save you. Doh! If that is "salvation" then spare me, please. And who are the synthetics that should destroy organics? The Geth that just made peace with the Quarians?

It is so farfetched, so full of holes, so utterly ridiculous that it beats the cheapest pulp-novel I have ever read.

It wasn't to save "you" as a specific person. But to save the excistence of life. 

The peace between qurian and geth could be seen as an example as to why a new solution is necessary. 

[Grubas]

Sejborg wrote...

TMZuk wrote...

Shepard108278 wrote...

From Tuchanka with Love wrote...

Synthetics will always destroy organics. The Reapers were needed to keep a balance in the Universe or risk complete destruction. Shepard opens up the door to new options. Shepard picks one of those options. Ending is not a cliche, happy ending. Not hard.

Very well put.

What a load of preposterous nonsense. Like the whole ending.

Blah, blah, blah. "we are your ascension so we slaughter you by the billions, we bomb your worlds into lifeless husks, we make you suffer in a million untold and unimagined ways.... to save you. Doh! If that is "salvation" then spare me, please. And who are the synthetics that should destroy organics? The Geth that just made peace with the Quarians?

It is so farfetched, so full of holes, so utterly ridiculous that it beats the cheapest pulp-novel I have ever read.

It wasn't to save "you" as a specific person. But to save the excistence of life. 

The peace between qurian and geth could be seen as an example as to why a new solution is necessary. 

So in all this cycles there never occured the idea that synthetics and nonsynthetics could peacefully coexist? Sounds very unlikely. 
Suddenly the dark energy plot appeals very intresting. Actually it "fits" more into ME then what we got. Doesn't it?

Bioware stick to your own stuff, dont steal from other franchises. I know u can do better then THIS. 

[Sejborg]

Grubas wrote...

Sejborg wrote...

TMZuk wrote...

Shepard108278 wrote...

From Tuchanka with Love wrote...

Synthetics will always destroy organics. The Reapers were needed to keep a balance in the Universe or risk complete destruction. Shepard opens up the door to new options. Shepard picks one of those options. Ending is not a cliche, happy ending. Not hard.

Very well put.

What a load of preposterous nonsense. Like the whole ending.

Blah, blah, blah. "we are your ascension so we slaughter you by the billions, we bomb your worlds into lifeless husks, we make you suffer in a million untold and unimagined ways.... to save you. Doh! If that is "salvation" then spare me, please. And who are the synthetics that should destroy organics? The Geth that just made peace with the Quarians?

It is so farfetched, so full of holes, so utterly ridiculous that it beats the cheapest pulp-novel I have ever read.

It wasn't to save "you" as a specific person. But to save the excistence of life. 

The peace between qurian and geth could be seen as an example as to why a new solution is necessary. 

So in all this cycles there never occured the idea that synthetics and nonsynthetics could peacefully coexist? 

The idea might have occured - who knows? But even so, they still needed the crucible to change the cycle. The crucible was first finished in Shepards cycle. 

Modifié par Sejborg, 21 mai 2012 - 03:48 .

[M8DMAN]

Shepard108278 wrote...

TMZuk wrote...

Shepard108278 wrote...

From Tuchanka with Love wrote...

Synthetics will always destroy organics. The Reapers were needed to keep a balance in the Universe or risk complete destruction. Shepard opens up the door to new options. Shepard picks one of those options. Ending is not a cliche, happy ending. Not hard.

Very well put.

What a load of preposterous nonsense. Like the whole ending.

Blah, blah, blah. "we are your ascension so we slaughter you by the billions, we bomb your worlds into lifeless husks, we make you suffer in a million untold and unimagined ways.... to save you. Doh! If that is "salvation" then spare me, please. And who are the synthetics that should destroy organics? The Geth that just made peace with the Quarians?

It is so farfetched, so full of holes, so utterly ridiculous that it beats the cheapest pulp-novel I have ever read.

I don't agree. While I disagree with the Starchild I can understand his reasoning just because you can't figure it out doesnt make it bad.

I understood it perfectly but I still thought it was ridiculous.

Modifié par M8DMAN, 21 mai 2012 - 05:28 .

[Grubas]

Sejborg wrote...

Grubas wrote...

Sejborg wrote...

TMZuk wrote...

Shepard108278 wrote...

From Tuchanka with Love wrote...

Synthetics will always destroy organics. The Reapers were needed to keep a balance in the Universe or risk complete destruction. Shepard opens up the door to new options. Shepard picks one of those options. Ending is not a cliche, happy ending. Not hard.

Very well put.

What a load of preposterous nonsense. Like the whole ending.

Blah, blah, blah. "we are your ascension so we slaughter you by the billions, we bomb your worlds into lifeless husks, we make you suffer in a million untold and unimagined ways.... to save you. Doh! If that is "salvation" then spare me, please. And who are the synthetics that should destroy organics? The Geth that just made peace with the Quarians?

It is so farfetched, so full of holes, so utterly ridiculous that it beats the cheapest pulp-novel I have ever read.

It wasn't to save "you" as a specific person. But to save the excistence of life. 

The peace between qurian and geth could be seen as an example as to why a new solution is necessary. 

So in all this cycles there never occured the idea that synthetics and nonsynthetics could peacefully coexist? 

The idea might have occured - who knows? But even so, they still needed the crucible to change the cycle. The crucible was first finished in Shepards cycle. 

But the little man say's just "standing in front of him shows that his solution no longer works." How exactly is that a proof? And if his solution no longer works, why do reapers continue harvesting?
What if shepard bleeds to death or falls of the bridge before he can make a final choice?   

[AlanC9]

Grubas wrote...
And if his solution no longer works, why do reapers continue harvesting?

Because he doesn't actually control them. He can't make them do anything without the Crucible.

What if shepard bleeds to death or falls of the bridge before he can make a final choice?   

Then the cycle continues.

[Firmijn]

AlanC9 wrote...

Grubas wrote...
And if his solution no longer works, why do reapers continue harvesting?

Because he doesn't actually control them. He can't make them do anything without the Crucible.

What if shepard bleeds to death or falls of the bridge before he can make a final choice?   

Then the cycle continues.

And you know what? I might rather just see that happen. I'd prefer a downright failure instead of the out of character redbluegreen crap

[Skyrix]

From Tuchanka with Love wrote...

Synthetics will always destroy organics.

No, actually, we know that's not the case. We don't have to look far for the proof, either, since we know of a synthetic life form in the Mass Effect universe that has had the preservation of organic life as its sole focus for tens of millions of years: the Catalyst.

He presupposes that synthetics will always eventually try to wipe the galaxy clean of every last single-celled organisim, and that since there's no way to get them to see reason, he has to do what he can to destroy them before they destroy all organic life. He needs to look in the mirror and see that he is absolutely wrong.

Or (since his methods are unbelieveably moronic) that he's right, but can't see how he's actually gone crazy and became the very thing he had hoped to save the galaxy from, and that in order to fulfill his mission to preserve organic life, he must self-destruct. Just like Saren and The Illusive Man, really. Oh! Was the Catalyst just being indoctrinated by yet another, even more mysterious being?

[MerchantGOL]

TMZuk wrote...

Shepard108278 wrote...

From Tuchanka with Love wrote...

Synthetics will always destroy organics. The Reapers were needed to keep a balance in the Universe or risk complete destruction. Shepard opens up the door to new options. Shepard picks one of those options. Ending is not a cliche, happy ending. Not hard.

Very well put.

What a load of preposterous nonsense. Like the whole ending.

Blah, blah, blah. "we are your ascension so we slaughter you by the billions, we bomb your worlds into lifeless husks, we make you suffer in a million untold and unimagined ways.... to save you. Doh! If that is "salvation" then spare me, please.

their anicheint machines, their logic isn't supposed to make sense to you, they ar elooking at a scale that cuts out indvidual lives. its called a zeroth law rebellion.

And who are the synthetics that should destroy organics? The Geth that just made peace with the Quarians?  

If its not the geth the catalyst thinks it will be some one else. Like it said the Fact that shepard was standing befor it meant that its Cycle was now obsolete.

Modifié par MerchantGOL, 22 mai 2012 - 03:50 .

[ShotgunRollins]

You Guys should create dlc With Aria taking back omega,, venting out, the remanent of the cerverus forces, and wrex, reencontering Aria and helping her , to make a clean house, on omega,while a back storie of said becoming the blue son leader and making a deal with ARIA, SO he does't blow up the whole station. R . My Idiea , L. Rollins

[MerchantGOL]

But the little man say's just "standing in front of him shows that his solution no longer works." How exactly is that a proof?

It shows that the Cycle he created is not perfect, he is not infalible and that shepard had beaten him.

There is nothing the catalyst could do to stop him even if he wanted too.

 

And if his solution no longer works, why do reapers continue harvesting?

Because the reapers are individuals, soldiers, they have aorders that they follow.

[ElChipmunko]

From Tuchanka with Love wrote...

Synthetics will always destroy organics. The Reapers were needed to keep a balance in the Universe or risk complete destruction. Shepard opens up the door to new options. Shepard picks one of those options. Ending is not a cliche, happy ending. Not hard.

I have a few questions.

"Synthetics will always destroy organics."

Why? Evidence?  (I understand the reason given, however, this is still a generalization, and may not hold true if we consider all synthetics might not be alike (e.g. Heretics vs. Geth).

"The Reapers were needed to keep a balance in the Universe or risk complete destruction."

Why were they needed? What other options were considered? Why did the other options (if any) fail?  Why was the destruction of all technologically advanced life considered an acceptable loss in relation to the perceived risk?  Who calculated the risk of complete destruction and what was their basis? 

"Shepard opens up the door to new options."

How?  Why is Shepard special?  (The "what" in this scenario is clear in game, i.e. what allows the door to open).

"Shepard picks one of those options."

Why?  Shouldn't he try to consider additional options? Negotiate?  Ask questions?

"Ending is not a cliche, happy ending."

It isn't exactly original either.  It could also be considered happy from a certain point of view in at least one of the endings.  Also what would be a cliche ending for this game?  Just curious.

"Not Hard."

I dunno, it seems pretty hard to explain in any sort of detail.  I understand the desire for a vague ending, and can appreciate it.  However, at least to me, it seems like in the last few minutes a lot of additions to the mass effect universe were made and the audience was left in the dark.  This was just a little too vague of an ending for me.

That being said, the game was still great, and mad props to the mass effect team!

[Grubas]

MerchantGOL wrote...

But the little man say's just "standing in front of him shows that his solution no longer works." How exactly is that a proof?

It shows that the Cycle he created is not perfect, he is not infalible and that shepard had beaten him.

How?

[MerchantGOL]

Grubas wrote...

MerchantGOL wrote...

But the little man say's just "standing in front of him shows that his solution no longer works." How exactly is that a proof?

It shows that the Cycle he created is not perfect, he is not infalible and that shepard had beaten him.

How?

Becasue shepard was able to create the crucible fight all  the reapers, and other enamys and make it to the finish line.

Compare it to a Safe smith. He says he creates the perfect safe that absolutley no one  can break into, if a  theif then  cracks the safe, it shows his old design is not perfect and he needs to makke a new one.

[Sejborg]

ElChipmunko wrote...

I have a few questions.

"Synthetics will always destroy organics."

Why? Evidence?  (I understand the reason given, however, this is still a generalization, and may not hold true if we consider all synthetics might not be alike (e.g. Heretics vs. Geth).

 

The beginning of the cycles is the evidence. When it all began a synthetic race were about to destroy all life. A solution was fouind, and the cycles began. Heretics, Geth and EDI could not considered back then, because they didn't exist. 

ElChipmunko wrote... 
"The Reapers were needed to keep a balance in the Universe or risk complete destruction."

Why were they needed? What other options were considered? Why did the other options (if any) fail? 
 

 

I think they considered everything. But they obviously failed since they choice destruction of them self.

ElChipmunko wrote...  
Why was the destruction of all technologically advanced life considered an acceptable loss in relation to the perceived risk?  Who calculated the risk of complete destruction and what was their basis?  

  

The civilization that started the cycles calculated the risk. Their math was: destruction of all advanced life - or destruction of all life period. 

ElChipmunko wrote...   
"Shepard opens up the door to new options."

How?  Why is Shepard special?  (The "what" in this scenario is clear in game, i.e. what allows the door to open). 

   

Shepard have made it through. She can activate the crucible. That makes her special. The crucible allows for new options, and Shepard is there to select one. Pretty special I think. 

ElChipmunko wrote...   
"Shepard picks one of those options."

Why?  Shouldn't he try to consider additional options? Negotiate?  Ask questions?

    

I don't know. Maybe.

ElChipmunko wrote...    
"Ending is not a cliche, happy ending."

It isn't exactly original either.  It could also be considered happy from a certain point of view in at least one of the endings.  Also what would be a cliche ending for this game?  Just curious.

 

I think flying towards a sunrise would be a cliche. Not that it couldn't work, but I would concider that a cliche. 

ElChipmunko wrote...  

"Not Hard."

I dunno, it seems pretty hard to explain in any sort of detail.  I understand the desire for a vague ending, and can appreciate it.  However, at least to me, it seems like in the last few minutes a lot of additions to the mass effect universe were made and the audience was left in the dark.  This was just a little too vague of an ending for me.

That being said, the game was still great, and mad props to the mass effect team!

I think you are right. I think the problem is that alot of people couldn't understand what was going on. What was the Catalysts connection to the reapers, what could be done and what couldn't be done, when and why did the cycles and so on.

I think if stuff like that were explained in better detail (or at least if people had the opportunity to have it explained further) then there wouldn't have been such a huge backlash. 

Sadly I think it is too late, to have an expanded ending. I think many people will not accept anything other than indoctrination theory at this point. And making the ending less vague will likely make indoctrination theory very hard to believe in, so they will get even more angry. 

[woxi]

The biggest problem with the endings we have, is that nothing that happens is explained. This is something i want EC to fix. And thank Bioware they are doing just that!

[Iakus]

[quote]Sejborg wrote...

[quote]ElChipmunko wrote...   
"Shepard opens up the door to new options."

How?  Why is Shepard special?  (The "what" in this scenario is clear in game, i.e. what allows the door to open). [/quote]   

Shepard have made it through. She can activate the crucible. That makes her special. The crucible allows for new options, and Shepard is there to select one. Pretty special I think. [/quote]

I think the elevator he Catalyst used to bring Shepard up to him is every bit as special and worthy of making the choice then. 


[quote]ElChipmunko wrote...   
"Shepard picks one of those options."

Why?  Shouldn't he try to consider additional options? Negotiate?  Ask questions?
[/quote]    

I don't know. Maybe.[/quote]

Yes 

[quote]ElChipmunko wrote...    
"Ending is not a cliche, happy ending."

It isn't exactly original either.  It could also be considered happy from a certain point of view in at least one of the endings.  Also what would be a cliche ending for this game?  Just curious.
[/quote] 

I think flying towards a sunrise would be a cliche. Not that it couldn't work, but I would concider that a cliche. 
[/quote]

Ant=d the Noble Sacrifice isn't a cliche?

I'll take happy cliche over depressing cliche any day of the week.

Modifié par iakus, 22 mai 2012 - 01:32 .

[Grubas]

MerchantGOL wrote...

Grubas wrote...

MerchantGOL wrote...

But the little man say's just "standing in front of him shows that his solution no longer works." How exactly is that a proof?

It shows that the Cycle he created is not perfect, he is not infalible and that shepard had beaten him.

How?

Becasue shepard was able to create the crucible fight all  the reapers, and other enamys and make it to the finish line.

Compare it to a Safe smith. He says he creates the perfect safe that absolutley no one  can break into, if a  theif then  cracks the safe, it shows his old design is not perfect and he needs to makke a new one.

I am sorry i don't get this. 
Can u elaborate this a bit more?
 

[DiebytheSword]

Grubas wrote...

MerchantGOL wrote...

Grubas wrote...

MerchantGOL wrote...

But the little man say's just "standing in front of him shows that his solution no longer works." How exactly is that a proof?

It shows that the Cycle he created is not perfect, he is not infalible and that shepard had beaten him.

How?

Becasue shepard was able to create the crucible fight all  the reapers, and other enamys and make it to the finish line.

Compare it to a Safe smith. He says he creates the perfect safe that absolutley no one  can break into, if a  theif then  cracks the safe, it shows his old design is not perfect and he needs to makke a new one.

I am sorry i don't get this. 
Can u elaborate this a bit more?
 

I think what he's trying to say is that the Cycle depends on utter secrecy, and hiding its existence from future cycles.  The Protheans already broke this, and the current civilization will find a way to pass more information to the next cycle, even if it doesn't defeat them now, the Reaper's have a systemic flaw in their plan that will eventually cause it to fail.

Thus a new solution is needed.