169 réponses à ce sujet

[aimlessgun]

With the announcement of free DLC to clarify/expand the ending of ME3, you'd think that there wouldn't be this much furor on the internet. After all, we didn't really expect them to totally retcon the ending, to entirely remove Star Child and the Normandy crash and rewrite the whole thing. 

But there is one thing that I think we do want, that is very important for our sense of closure and that Bioware refuses to provide:

We want Bioware to admit that they were wrong, that they screwed up and that the ending was bad. 

We don't want a DLC announcement that hides behind the flimsy shield of 'artistic integrity' and pretends that more 'closure' and 'explanations' will make the ending work. We want a DLC announcement that reads like this:

"We screwed up the ending to ME3, and we're sorry. Unfortunately we cannot allocate the resources to totally retcon the endings, even though we should. We will do the best we can with this free clarification DLC."

Everyone makes mistakes, and humans are pretty good at forgiveness. We want to forgive Bioware. But forgiveness is not possible without confession of guilt. And I think that we're so angry still because Bioware is refusing to 'fess up. 

So anyways that's my theory on why people are still so angry. I know it's a big reason why I'm still upset. If Bioware admits its mistakes, even if they don't retcon the ending, I will be much more at peace with the ending to ME3. 

Modifié par aimlessgun, 06 avril 2012 - 01:38 .

[Cainne Chapel]

I personally think people just want to be angry because they want SOMETHING ANYTHING to be upset or complain about really.

It IS the internet, before the ending furor, it was the holster animation, etc etc.

If someone can find something to complain about, they will

[JBONE27]

That's part of it. I think the other part is the insulting tone that was used in the press release.

[Bcoolpro]

Cainne Chapel wrote...

I personally think people just want to be angry because they want SOMETHING ANYTHING to be upset or complain about really.

It IS the internet, before the ending furor, it was the holster animation, etc etc.

If someone can find something to complain about, they will

Agree to a point... However, I think this kind of reaction was inevitable.  No matter what there was going to be some who felt the ending didn't live up to expectations.  That it didn't match their desires for what the ending should be.  Hindsight is biased and it's too easy to say they should have done this or that. 

[BellatrixLugosi]

Um........admit you guys went overboard with bad user reviews, disingenuous fundraisers to charities, and some death threats first....

[Harbinger of your Destiny]

I don't care if they never apologize just give me a better ending. That's all and all will be forgiven. I will still be wary of future releases but at least I will take a look at them instead of the blanket policy of absolutely nothing from Bioware i have at the moment.

[Han Shot First]

People are still upset because the DLC will only add additional cinematics to the ending. You still get the same disappointing red, blue, or green choice presented to you by the Star Child, with the same disappointing outcomes.

The Red Ending (the only one that actually accomplishes Shepard's mission to destroy the Reapers) also most likely still requires you to betray EDI and the Geth.

[KBomb]

BellatrixLugosi wrote...

Um........admit you guys went overboard with bad user reviews, disingenuous fundraisers to charities, and some death threats first....

lulz Are you being serious with this?

[Harmless Citizen]

That "artistic integrity" just burns me. Really, it does. It doesn't matter to me whether they change, "clarify," or keep the endings (and never has), but every time I hear "vision," "artistic," "integrity" or any combination of those words, it's as if I'm being told that I am too stupid to understand narrative structure, rhetorical analysis, or the inherent fluidity of art. For heaven's sake, come up with a better excuse than that or just say "no."

And as I've harped before, the only thing I'm interested in seeing is BioWare addressing their pre-release statements, which hasn't been done at all.

[RyuujinZERO]

KBomb wrote...

lulz Are you being serious with this?

Are you denying that the statement is true?

[quickitsbob]

I think part of the problem is that bioware did not give this announcement earlier. If they had announced this earlier instead of just having Jessica Merzain giving vauge hints regarding this announcement then a lot of the outcry would have diminished. Its kind of like a forest fire thats gotten too big to contain.

[PiEman]

No, I'd be perfectly happy with more endings.

[Tietj]

Bioware seems a little reticent to admit error. They're still insisting that there are 8,000 or even 10,000 total war assets in the game.

[Cainne Chapel]

honestly even new endings people will STILL find something to **** about.

Personally I dont MIND the current endings, MY main hangup was the lack of closure with crew and allies.

I mean outside of that what more can they do to make the ending more personalized OTHER than reference your crew and ally relationships in an ending epilogue or cinematic?

Hell I'd of been happy if they gave us a DA:O style ending with paragraphs for each companion and/or ally really. THATS what I want for closure, tell me what happened to MY personal crew and relationships.

Other than that I dont knwo what else people expect? I mean eitherway they'll find some complain with a new ending or not.

[pixelface]

people are still angry because they won't face the truth about how their ending was just not good, and therefore they will not do anything to change the roots of the problem.

[Mx_CN3]

BellatrixLugosi wrote...

Um........admit you guys went overboard with bad user reviews, disingenuous fundraisers to charities, and some death threats first....

You are speaking of a rabid minority, a group of people which most of the Retakers also think are idiots.  Most of us eding-haters try to be very civil, and only view these people as hurting our cause.

However, bad user reviews are perfectly warranted.  Didn't like the game?  Give it a bad review.  That's what reviews are for (though 0/5'ing it is ridiculous).

[aimlessgun]

PiEman wrote...

No, I'd be perfectly happy with more endings.

Doing serious work on the ending to the point of having new endings (like a 4th choice with Star Child) is an implicit admission of mistakes, I think. An implicit admission through alternate endings or retcons is definitely the best case scenario 

"Clarification" avoids implicit admission of mistakes. 

Modifié par aimlessgun, 06 avril 2012 - 02:28 .

[Nchopper]

 Cainne Chapel is completely correct and yet it appears to be even more than this. This modern hysteria and hysteria really is what it is, has become completely ridiculous now. Some of the melodramatic nonsense departing the lips of apparent fans is so farcical that if you were an outside observer you wouldn't believe it was the result of a video game's ending. If you have a look around at comment sections and forum posts across the net the same repetitive, regurgitated terms pop up again and again. Closure, closure, closure I doubt many people repeating it even know what they mean by that.

As with most serials in which people invest emotion and time, an end is usually bottom of the list of what people become excited about. While the finales are usually highly anticipated and often the most exciting parts, if it is a series you enjoy the actual culmination of it is a sad event. In the case of ME from the outset of ME3 it was evident that Bioware were pitching towards a melancholic ending and true to the form of the heroic scope, bleak setting and sorrowful music a happy outcome was wishful thinking.

I purposefully kept myself in the dark before and during this game so as to avoid this exact situation in which every game finds itself amidst these days. To be welcomed into the community with shouts and cries of dismay. People howling from every comment section "You shouldn't enjoy this game! You must comform to this sense of importance we have attributed to trivial entertainment media and become outraged at how the developers have slighted us by omitting/comitting/charging/depriving us of XXX!". It is tiresome, predictable and mindbogglingly wasteful. How people can raise themselves into such a situation of angst that they actually actively seek to sabotage their own and others enjoyment merely to be a part of some greater cause is disheartening. What a waste of energy. 

With regard to the ending of course it will not satisfy us fully, the games have been designed around the concept of player power in the direction of our Shepard's development and as such we all had different ideas of how the story should ultimately end. It is far from perfect but Bioware were always going to struggle to wrap up a trilogy in which the adversary was created to be of such omnipotent power that billions of years of failure had preceded Shepard's atempt to thwart them. Opinions are our privelege and people should be encouraged to share them but this childish snowball of negativity and overblown tantrum that has resulted in a petition, an actual petition for christ's sake has gone way beyond the pale and I for one am sincerely ashamed of the way the gaming community handles itself these days. With all the issues plaguing even this insignificant medium, the most rousing topic is your frustration over a story's climax not being oh so perfect is appalling to be frank. Stop cuting your noses off to spite your petty faces. 

 

Modifié par Nchopper, 06 avril 2012 - 02:33 .

[KBomb]

RyuujinZERO wrote...

KBomb wrote...

lulz Are you being serious with this?

Are you denying that the statement is true?

 
What I am saying is that the expectation is ridiculous. Bioware is a corporate entity. They have a very specific team of people who make decisions about Mass Effect 3. If that team makes poor choices and decisions for release of a product that is unsatisfactory, or deliever a product that is an antithesis of what was advertised, of course it would be those people who should apologize for said product. I wouldn't go up to someone who worked in the mailroom at Bioware and ask that they apologize for Mass Effect 3.


Telling fans who are upset at Bioware for the various reasons they have to be dissatisfied “apologize” for a league of people who sent death threats or belligerent posts or reviews is asinine. I never threatened anyone or called anyone a name. I have never sent a death threat, or a threat in any fashion. The poor review I gave was genuine and thorough as to why I was unsatisfied with this product—as were thousands of other people on this forum and abroad.


Disclaimer: I am not saying Bioware should apologize or change the ending. I would like to see them make a statement about the EMS system that wasn't a PR statement, I would like for them to answer why so many of their interviews were a complete opposite representation of the product given. I would like for them to stop using “artistic integrity” as a crutch when dodging legitimate questions and concerns. I don't want an empty apology. The simple truth would do.

[clipped_wolf]

I've heard nothing about new endings, just clarification on the existing endings.

[Terraforming2154]

BellatrixLugosi wrote...

Um........admit you guys went overboard with bad user reviews, disingenuous fundraisers to charities, and some death threats first....

You're lumping bad user reviews in with death threats...?
How can one go "overboard" with bad user reviews, anyway? Is it conspiratorial?  

[InvincibleHero]

Apologize for what you didn't like their ending. Subjective opinion is not fact or denote an error on someone else's part.

[aimlessgun]

Nchopper, I wholeheartedly disagree with everything you said. I will treat videogames as important, regardless of what you say. I will continue to think that the end is self-evidently bad for many good reasons, and not just because of internet groupthink (I also intentionally avoided anything to do with ME3 until finishing the game).

I doubt we can resolve our differences, and I can hardly tell you to be less angry with a straight face

[Tovanus]

Mx_CN3 wrote...

BellatrixLugosi wrote...

Um........admit you guys went overboard with bad user reviews, disingenuous fundraisers to charities, and some death threats first....

You are speaking of a rabid minority, a group of people which most of the Retakers also think are idiots.  Most of us eding-haters try to be very civil, and only view these people as hurting our cause.

However, bad user reviews are perfectly warranted.  Didn't like the game?  Give it a bad review.  That's what reviews are for (though 0/5'ing it is ridiculous).

I never did a user-review myself. However, I don't see any problem with the people who 0/5'd it. or 0/10 or whatever they do on various sites. If you do an ending so bad that it poisons people's view of the entire series, you're just lucky people can't go into negative numbers for reviews. 

Plot based games can get a lot of fan committment. There's a lot of upside to that. It also makes your ending much more important, and there's a huge downside to that if you fail hard at it. As long as people honestly believe the ending ruined the game for them, then the scores are warranted.

[aimlessgun]

InvincibleHero wrote...

Apologize for what you didn't like their ending. Subjective opinion is not fact or denote an error on someone else's part.

I dislike relativitism. You look at all the opinions, take in the available information, but at some point a man has to make a stand and say "this is what is right and what is wrong". 

Modifié par aimlessgun, 06 avril 2012 - 02:35 .