2037 réponses à ce sujet

[Emphyr]

oops double post after edit ( Sorry) ( Slow internet connection)

Modifié par Emphyr, 17 avril 2012 - 08:32 .

[Pheonix52gx]

Good to see some more development and more users. Also cool that we have a moderator grace us. Thanks for dropping by!

With regards to the z value, that might fix some of the issues we've been having. Thanks woodbyte.

[DaBozUK]

ThinkIntegral wrote...

Yeah on further looks it does look about as close as one can get.  Is it just me or do the height of the eyes seem like they could be a bit lower?  Perhaps no offset bones adjustment?

There will be a point where you are refining to an almost obsessive level.  It might be worth taking a step back after every few mods and come back with fresh eyes.

But screenshots just don't get the point across, it's how the (inferior to ME2) lighting and animation affects the rendering in game that makes or breaks the believability in your Shepard.

[DaBozUK]

Selene Moonsong wrote...

Hmmm... I haven't had that much of an issue going from ME 1 to ME 2 and then ME 2 to ME 3.

Most of the differences I noted were minor. The best thing about the ME 3 import from ME 2 is that when I elect to customize my character, I get to tweak my character image rather than have to re-create her from scratch.

To me the actual difference has been the the quality of the appearance. Each version is a welcome improvement over the previous version, at least from my perspective.

Thanks for visiting the thread anyway, Selene.  Please keep visiting.

If you have any weight to convince a Bioware dev to swing by and see what the clever guys on this thread are doing, that would be great. As you'll see from the first post, there are a lot of malformed ME3 sheps, even though some people are lucky enough to import fine with or without a few tweaks.

[Sable Phoenix]

I just have to say, I've been following what you folks are doing here eagerly, since my one and only Shepard ended up wearing a mouth and eyes that looked totally different than they were supposed to (her nose didn't end up exactly right either, but that's less of a concern), and the face import "fix" patch actually made it worse. I'm very impressed. Thank you for all your hard work. It's incredible that the fans, modding a game that isn't designed to be modded, are accomplishing more than the dev team itself.

Modifié par Sable Phoenix, 17 avril 2012 - 09:02 .

[ThinkIntegral]

DaBozUK wrote...

ThinkIntegral wrote...

Yeah on further looks it does look about as close as one can get.  Is it just me or do the height of the eyes seem like they could be a bit lower?  Perhaps no offset bones adjustment?

There will be a point where you are refining to an almost obsessive level.  It might be worth taking a step back after every few mods and come back with fresh eyes.

But screenshots just don't get the point across, it's how the (inferior to ME2) lighting and animation affects the rendering in game that makes or breaks the believability in your Shepard.

Yeah you make a good point.  I've kind of given up on the eyes, mouth and on the nose.  The way the models render in ME3 is just different from ME2, which means trying to put a full ME2 face on an ME3 face that has more "space", to me at least, doesn't look right.  So I'm just gonna do what Vhalkyrie did, which was make a hybrid.

Thanks for all the work woodbyte, pheonix52gx and anyone else I forgot to mention.  You've all been a big help.

Modifié par ThinkIntegral, 17 avril 2012 - 11:11 .

[Emphyr]

DaBozUK wrote...

There will be a point where you are refining to an almost obsessive level.  It might be worth taking a step back after every few mods and come back with fresh eyes.

But screenshots just don't get the point across, it's how the (inferior to ME2) lighting and animation affects the rendering in game that makes or breaks the believability in your Shepard.

Point 1 taken and i agree.  Point 2  But some also uploaded on Youtube ingame scenes
Hmm i might do a fraps scene also with Me2 Nicole and Me3 after Patch Nicole.

Anyway Take Care.

[DaBozUK]

Emphyr wrote...

DaBozUK wrote...

But screenshots just don't get the point across, it's how the (inferior to ME2) lighting and animation affects the rendering in game that makes or breaks the believability in your Shepard.

Hmm i might do a fraps scene also with Me2 Nicole and Me3 after Patch Nicole.

Yes, there are some good YouTube vids on here already.  I might upload a Fraps comparison of my ME2 vs ME3 if I get the time.

One thing that's always concerned me about mocap animations... if you use a different actor for each game, the performance will not be the same.

For example, Andy Serkis' Golem in Lord of the Rings could never be repeated by another actor.  You would notice that it isn't Golem, but a doppleganger.

Game developers are taking voice acting seriously in their art, but I believe they need to take mocap acting just as seriously now. 

Anyone know if the Shepard body and face mocaps in ME2 are the same person/people in ME3?  I have a feeling it is 1 person for male and female (that opening sequence when Anderson says "the **** you've done" and Shep's reaction is physically identical between male/female sheps).  But is it the same person who did ME2 Shep mocaps?

Modifié par DaBozUK, 17 avril 2012 - 09:29 .

[woodbyte]

Remember this eye shape? 



edit: the one on the right, of course. the other is unmapped.

Modifié par woodbyte, 17 avril 2012 - 09:53 .

[ThinkIntegral]

Looking good woodbyte. Btw, I've been meaning to ask you. If I map two ME3 vertices to one ME2 vertex is that going to collapse the two ME3 vertices to where the ME2 vertex is mapped?

[lillitheris]

DaBozUK wrote...
There will be a point where you are refining to an almost obsessive level.  It might be worth taking a step back after every few mods and come back with fresh eyes.

I think the uncanny valley effect is particularly bad, on top of the normal obsession. The closer you get, the worse it seems

But screenshots just don't get the point across, it's how the (inferior to ME2) lighting and animation affects the rendering in game that makes or breaks the believability in your Shepard.

Definitely. Mars is my testing ground since you get 1. decent lighting, 2. gameplay, and 2. cutscene/dialogue animation with Liara.

[woodbyte]

ThinkIntegral wrote...

Looking good woodbyte. Btw, I've been meaning to ask you. If I map two ME3 vertices to one ME2 vertex is that going to collapse the two ME3 vertices to where the ME2 vertex is mapped?

By default it will adjust those two ME3 vertices so that their center (as a group) is the ME2 vertex position.
But there's a checkbox that changes that, making them collapse instead. (I think its the last checkbox)

I'm having good results with the default behaviour.

[woodbyte]

lillitheris wrote...
(...) Mars is my testing ground since you get 1. decent lighting, 2. gameplay, and 2. cutscene/dialogue animation with Liara.

Great place to test stuff. Got a save just outside the entrance next to the elevator button.

Only problem with that scene is it takes a bit and has lots of unskippable parts, so I usually only test there when testing in the intro seems good (save before opening door for anderson).

Modifié par woodbyte, 17 avril 2012 - 10:23 .

[ThinkIntegral]

woodbyte wrote...

ThinkIntegral wrote...

Looking good woodbyte. Btw, I've been meaning to ask you. If I map two ME3 vertices to one ME2 vertex is that going to collapse the two ME3 vertices to where the ME2 vertex is mapped?

By default it will adjust those two ME3 vertices so that their center (as a group) is the ME2 vertex position.
But there's a checkbox that changes that, making them collapse instead. (I think its the last checkbox)

I'm having good results with the default behaviour.

Thanks that makes sense.  If you get a good eye map let me know. I'm working on one just to try.

[Clarian]

Here's my results from LP 0.1.1, LOD map r16:



Basically: awesome.  The most obvious change is the eyelashes, but there are a lot of other subtle improvements that really come into play when you see it animated.  Even so, it's amazing what a big difference even just the eyelashes make.  Also other things with the eye shape make the "look in her eye" seem a LOT more natural with Lazarus, as you can see.

Woodbyte, the offset bones bug that you fixed helped me a lot.  Before, having offset bones checked really pinched around her mouth and nose in a weird way.  I still think the current one pinches her mouth a bit, but with 0.1.1, it's clearly the better way vs. not having it checked.  I could just widen the mouth in the cc to compensate for that.

But...yeah.  Wow, what a difference.  See how the default one just looks...wrong? And how the Lazarus version looks human, and expressive, and right?

I'd still like to do some touching up in gibbed especially with eyebrow/hair/makeup colors.  And probably a new hairstyle.  (Loved the old tight bun, the granny bun is lame.)  But, finally this is something worth touching up.  Also I haven't tried the process mireisen talked about yet, but I may try that too just to see.

To Bioware: Take a good look at that image.  The one on the left is wrong.  The one on the right is...right.  That's a plain fact.  The eyelashes are supposed to be...like...outside of the head.  That's how eyelashes work.  This is complete and irrefutable proof that your face imports aren't functioning correctly, and it has nothing to do with "improvements" to your engine.  PC users have to jump through some hoops to fix this.  Xbox users have to jump through even more hoops.  Playstation users can't use this fix at all, as I understand it.  That's really not the way things should be.  

Here's what you should do:

(1) Pay Woodbyte and Pheonix a lot of money.

(2) Get this fixed.  You may have worked really hard to get the face imports right, but sometimes one can work really hard on something, and still not accomplish it.  This is one of those times.  However much hard work you may have behind you on this, you have some more ahead of you.

And while you're at it, put the tight bun hairstyle back in the game.  I mean come on, this is the military.

[nwhaxyz]

ME1 face.


ME2 face.


ME3 1.02 face.

I've kinda forgotten. Who said that the face import in ME2, gives a different face from the ME1 one ...

Spoiler: Wasn't that Chris Hu?

Modifié par nwhaxyz, 17 avril 2012 - 11:20 .

[Clarian]

woodbyte wrote...
Remember this eye shape? 

Is this a new mapping version you're working on? Like, post r16?

[ThinkIntegral]

You know what this calls for Clarian don't you? Let's see what she looks like in that oh so infamous pic of yours

[Clarian]

ThinkIntegral wrote...
You know what this calls for Clarian don't you? Let's see what she looks like in that oh so infamous pic of yours

Heheh, yeah...once I've completed all the touch-ups, I may have to do that!

Of course, the visuals overall in ME3 are still uglier than 2, so it's never going to look as good as a screenshot from that game.  But that by itself was never a deal-breaker for me...though the faces not importing correctly, was.

[DaBozUK]

Clarian wrote...

To Bioware: Take a good look at that image.  The one on the left is wrong.  The one on the right is...right.  That's a plain fact.  The eyelashes are supposed to be...like...outside of the head.  That's how eyelashes work.  This is complete and irrefutable proof that your face imports aren't functioning correctly, and it has nothing to do with "improvements" to your engine.  PC users have to jump through some hoops to fix this.  Xbox users have to jump through even more hoops.  Playstation users can't use this fix at all, as I understand it.  That's really not the way things should be.  

Clarian, GREAT work!  The best thing you can do is raise this as a separate thread in the PC Tech Support group, and PM Chris Priestly direct (he does read PMs, he's read and responded to mine).

I also suggest this info be added one of the blogs you guys are running.

[Blastback]

BIIIIIOOOWWWAAAARRREEE!!!

Just needed to get that off my chest.

[DaBozUK]

Woodbyte, Clarian, Vhalkyrie, Pheonix, ThinkIntegral et al. Please can those of you who have access to Lazarus google project, please upload and link to the separate lod_mapping.xml files on the downloads page.

I keep seeing people trying newer mappings, and sometimes see an SVN direct link, but it would be really handy having the latest of each person's efforts (in fact keeping historical versions too).

Having all versions of these branched mapping files shown in one place would be very handy.

An I still want one of you to setup a Paypal account to send my money love.  But in the meantime, just enjoy my appreciation of your efforts instead.

Modifié par DaBozUK, 17 avril 2012 - 12:07 .

[DarthNaga]

I see all these posts referring to "Lazarus project" and people actually creating their old sheps in ME3...is this something that is possible on the XBOX360 version, and if so, how?
Emphyr's post is very similar to how my shep looked before ME3 (mine had heavier makeup but the face was similar) are we able to get these awesome changes into the 360 version?
You guys and gals messing with the code are doing an awesome job!

[woodbyte]

Clarian wrote...

woodbyte wrote...
Remember this eye shape? 

Is this a new mapping version you're working on? Like, post r16?

Still working on it. I'll let you know when its up.

DaBozUK wrote...

Woodbyte, Clarian, Vhalkyrie, Pheonix, ThinkIntegral et al. Please can those of you who have access to Lazarus google project, please upload and link to the separate lod_mapping.xml files on the downloads page.

I keep seeing people trying newer mappings, and sometimes see an SVN direct link, but it would be really handy having the latest of each person's efforts (in fact keeping historical versions too).

Having all versions of these branched mapping files shown in one place would be very handy.

An I still want one of you to setup a Paypal account to send my money love.  But in the meantime, just enjoy my appreciation of your efforts instead.

 

I'm getting around to that.
But I have a feeling a complete FemShep map is just around the corner.

[woodbyte]

 I think the eyes are taken care of:



It's now easy to recognize the ME2 eye shape I used (next to last in slider), and there are no clipping issues that I can detect. The corners of the mouth still need a bit of tweaking (problems not visible in this Shep, but I've tried with a few others and it's noticeable).

Edit #1: In the meantime maybe you want to try it? (map link)
Make sure you're running the last version.

Edit #2: Another screen from different angle.

Modifié par woodbyte, 17 avril 2012 - 12:54 .